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Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: 360view] #2829125
10/05/20 10:54 PM
10/05/20 10:54 PM
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If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
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Are there any reports of COVID-19 being just a 72hr Chinese Flu?

I know this has been a very unpredictable pathogen, with millions of cases, but never heard it described that it is quick.


Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: 360view] #2829326
10/06/20 02:47 PM
10/06/20 02:47 PM
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Coronavirus “common cold” infections lessen severe Covid-19, but do not prevent infection.

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2020-10-previous-infection-coronaviruses-lessen-severity.html

Sample quote

In this study, the researchers looked at electronic medical record data from individuals who had a respiratory panel test (CRP-PCR) result between May 18, 2015 and March 11, 2020. The CRP-PCR detects diverse respiratory pathogens including the endemic "common cold" coronaviruses. They also examined data from individuals who were tested for SARS-CoV-2 between March 12, 2020 and June 12, 2020. After adjusting for age, gender, body mass index, and diabetes mellitus diagnosis, COVID-19 hospitalized patients who had a previous positive CRP-PCR test result for a coronoavirus had significantly lower odds of being admitted to the intensive care unit (ICU), and lower trending odds of requiring mechanical ventilation during COVID. The probability of survival was also significantly higher in COVID-19 hospitalized patients with a previous positive test result for a "common cold" coronoavirus. However, a previous positive test result for a coronavirus did not prevent someone from getting infected with SARS-CoV-2.

End quote

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: jcc] #2829341
10/06/20 03:31 PM
10/06/20 03:31 PM
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I have never read of a confirmed Covid-19 case where the active virus was gone in 72 hours.

I think the typical times are:
3 to 7 days after initial virus entry into the body until any symptom is felt in “severe” cases.
7 to 21 days until virus replication stops, or death of the patient.
In some patients virus replication went on longer than 60 days.

It might be more accurate to refer to Covid-19 as the
“Bat Cold” that typically lasts 14 to 28 days and kills on average 5 out of every 1000 persons infected.

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: 360view] #2829355
10/06/20 04:01 PM
10/06/20 04:01 PM
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Argument that Amazon’s experience during Covid-19 tells something valuable about “lockdowns”.
Add to this Sweden’s experience.

https://www.realclearmarkets.com/ar...ut_lockdowns_being_necessary_579797.html

Sample quote

On October 1, Amazon disclosed that only 19,816 of its U.S. employees “have tested positive or been presumed positive for COVID-19.”

19,816 may sound like a big number, but it is only 1.44 percent of Amazon’s 1.372 million U.S. employees.

2.18 percent of all Americans have been infected, according to the Center for Disease Control and Prevention.

This means that Americans, many of whom during the lockdowns have not worked or have worked alone at home, have been at least 51.3 percent more likely to become infected than Amazon and Whole Foods employees who interact with customers, suppliers, and co-workers in grocery stores, work side by side in fulfillment centers, and visit customers in office buildings, hospitals, apartment buildings, and everywhere else while making deliveries.

End quote

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: 360view] #2829439
10/06/20 05:57 PM
10/06/20 05:57 PM
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A history of herd immunity
David Jones & Stefan Helmreich
Published: September 19, 2020

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)31924-3/fulltext

As many countries around the world recognised the magnitude of the COVID-19 pandemic in March, 2020, some seemed to put their faith in herd immunity. UK pandemic adviser Graham Medley, for example, said that “We are going to have to generate what we call herd immunity”, which would require “a nice big epidemic”. When the idea received furious criticism, British officials denied that herd immunity had ever been part of their plan. A run at herd immunity in Sweden prompted mathematician Marcus Carlsson to object: “we are being herded like a flock of sheep toward disaster”. In August, WHO's Michael Ryan warned journalists “we are nowhere close to the levels of immunity required to stop this disease transmitting. We need to focus on what we can actually do now to suppress transmission and not live in hope of herd immunity being our salvation.” That did not end the debate. In late August sources revealed that the White House might be pondering a policy of herd immunity. Officials issued a prompt denial. The appeal of herd immunity is easy to understand: if it is reached, an epidemic ends. But the illness and death such an approach would require have prompted a strong backlash. The language of herd immunity is part of the problem. A herd usually describes domesticated animals, especially livestock. Herd animals like cows, goats, or sheep are sacrificed for human consumption. Few humans want to be part of that kind of herd.

How did herd immunity enter the language of public health? The phrase seems to have first appeared in the work of American livestock veterinarians concerned about “contagious abortion”—epidemics of spontaneous miscarriage—in cattle and sheep. By the 1910s, it had become the leading contagious threat to cattle in the USA. Farmers destroyed or sold affected cows. Kansas veterinarian George Potter realised that this was the wrong approach. Writing with Adolph Eichhorn in 1916 in the Journal of the American Veterinary Medical Association, he envisioned “herd immunity”. As he wrote in 1918, “Abortion disease may be likened to a fire, which, if new fuel is not constantly added, soon dies down. Herd immunity is developed, therefore, by retaining the immune cows, raising the calves, and avoiding the introduction of foreign cattle.”

Potter's concept reached the UK in 1917 and 1920 in summaries in Veterinary Review and Scottish Agriculture. It arrived at a crucial moment. Armies and navies struggled against infections throughout World War 1. Medical professionals worked to identify and treat pathogens, and also to understand their population ecology. How did pathogen virulence and population resistance drive the rise and fall of epidemic waves? In The Lancet in July, 1919, bacteriologist W W C Topley described experimental epidemics he created in groups of mice. Unless there was a steady influx of susceptible mice, the rising prevalence of immune individuals would end an epidemic. In a 1923 article in the Journal of Hygiene, he and G S Wilson described this phenomenon as “herd immunity”.

The idea moved into medicine. In 1922, Topley suggested a parallel between outbreaks in mice and children: “Such a likeness would seem to exist in the case of epidemic diseases affecting children of school age.” He also wondered whether measures already “in vogue in dealing with epidemics among live-stock, where methods of segregation are so much more easily enforced than among human populations”, might inform decisions about school closings amid epidemics.

Topley's musings soon found their test. In 1923 Sheldon Dudley, professor of pathology at the Royal Naval Medical School, became aware of epidemics of diphtheria at the Royal Hospital School in Greenwich. The school provided laboratory-like conditions, with a homogeneous group of male students, in good physical shape, who entered in batches several times a year, where they slept in dormitories of 70 to 126 beds. Dudley studied these students and complemented his data with studies from the Grand Fleet during the war and from the training ship HMS Impregnable (grievously susceptible, it turned out, to epidemics).

Dudley published reports for the Medical Research Council on diphtheria and scarlet fever, droplet infections, and diphtheria immunisations. He believed that Topley's analysis of “experimental epidemics among communities of mice provides at more than one point striking parallels to the observed phenomena among the boys at Greenwich”. In a 1924 article in The Lancet, Dudley applied “herd immunity” to humans. In a 1929 article, “Human Adaptation to the Parasitic Environment”, he wrote, “I will now consider the community, or the herd…Nations may be divided into urban or rural herds. Or we can contrast the shoregoing herd with the sailor herd, or herds dwelling in hospitals can be compared with those who live in mental hospitals.”

Dudley's glide from animal to human drew on established British traditions of animal symbolism. As historian Harriet Ritvo argues in The Animal Estate, animals have long served in England as figures for representing national types, lineages, and identities. When Dudley, as surgeon, researcher, and medical administrator, wrote of the “English herd”, he tacitly invoked his own role in a project of national stewardship. Dudley's language, however, did give some readers pause. He prefaced his 1934 report, Active Immunization Against Diphtheria, with photographs of “The human herd” (Greenwich boys at dinner) and “The bacterial herd” (colonies of diphtheria on culture media). As a commentator in The Lancet noted, “Anyone with a modern sense of social progress might well wonder whether the phrase ‘the human herd’ is here used in a scientific or in ironical sense, but perhaps in this case the meanings are not far apart.” Such musings notwithstanding, “herd immunity” became a fixture of epidemiology by the 1930s. Discussions of herd immunity for influenza, polio, smallpox, and typhoid appeared in textbooks, journals, and public health reports in England, Australia, and the USA. The idea also intersected with eugenic notions of racial difference at a time when eugenic racism was ascendant in the UK and the USA. An author of a 1931 Lancet piece wondered whether specific groups, for instance the Maori, had “racial herd-immunity”.

The early researchers never settled on a clear definition. Dudley preferred a focus on what share of a herd had acquired resistance from natural exposure or immunisation. Topley elaborated a more expansive concept. As he explained in the Journal of the Royal Army Medical Corps in 1935, herd immunity encompassed not just the distribution of immunity, but also the social factors determining the herd's exposure. The “English herd”—those living in England—had herd immunity to plague, malaria, and typhus because they no longer lived in close association with the requisite vectors.

Herd immunity took on fresh prominence in the 1950s and 1960s as new vaccines raised crucial questions for public health policy. What share of a population had to be vaccinated to control or eradicate a disease? The idea surged again after 1990 as public health officials worked to achieve sufficient levels of vaccine coverage. But the language of “herd immunity” continued to resonate with visions of people being treated as animals to be domesticated and culled—anxieties reflected in dystopian fiction about farmed humans, from H G Wells' Time Machine to David Mitchell's Cloud Atlas. The association between livestock and sacrifice could have contributed to the objections in March to policies that would have asked many people to be sickened or killed by SARS-CoV-2 in pursuit of herd immunity.

The phrase, however, has not disappeared. Publics face the same problem with COVID-19 in 2020 that Dudley faced with diphtheria in the 1920s: whether a contagious droplet infection can be controlled, without a vaccine or therapeutic, through social distancing and hygiene alone. Studies in June and July cast doubt on prospects for herd immunity: despite months of exposure, antibody surveys found a low seroprevalence, less than 10%, in cities in Spain and Switzerland. Commentators in The Lancet concluded that “In light of these findings, any proposed approach to achieve herd immunity through natural infection is not only highly unethical, but also unachievable”. Sceptics raised other concerns, observing that other coronaviruses induce only transient antibody defences. Defenders of herd immunity, however, have persisted. Some argue that antibodies are not essential because SARS-CoV-2 might induce durable T-cell immunity. Others speculate that if the most susceptible members of a community are infected first, then herd immunity might be achieved after exposure of just 20% of the population.


With potential vaccines still likely to be many months away, and with lockdowns and social distancing causing social and economic disruption, there are no ideal options. British public health expert Raj Bhopal likened the situation to being in zugzwang, “a position in chess where every move is disadvantageous where we must examine every plan, however unpalatable”. He sought to overcome the animal connotations of “herd immunity” by encouraging the use of “population immunity” instead. Changing the label of herd immunity might remove the connotations but not fix the problem. Without a vaccine, many people would have to die from COVID-19 before population immunity is achieved.

COVID-19 mortality in the UK and the USA has already taken a disproportionate toll on poor and minority groups, a reflection of systemic racism and poverty. At one urgent care centre in a largely Latino, working-class neighbourhood in New York City—named, remarkably, Corona—68·4% of antibody tests came back positive. But it remains unclear whether these antibodies will protect individuals or generate herd immunity. Until there exist vaccines that can do both of those things, societies will need to continue to try to control the spread of the virus at the local level through public health measures and community action, to protect the most vulnerable people, and to support public health and medical systems. We should not simply put our faith in the immunity of our herd.

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: Wheeler] #2829444
10/06/20 06:00 PM
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"A 'herd mentality' can’t stop the COVID-19 pandemic. Neither can a weak vaccine."
Debates over herd immunity and natural infection arise with every outbreak. Effective vaccination always wins.
BY NSIKAN AKPAN - PUBLISHED OCTOBER 2, 2020

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/...annot-stop-coronavirus-weak-vaccine-cvd/

EARLY DISEASE FIGHTERS, such as Edward Jenner, Louis Pasteur, and William Farr, suspected if enough people were vaccinated, it could eradicate a disease. At the dawn of the 20th century, veterinarians more interested in livestock than people seized on the idea and coined the term “herd immunity.” By the 1920s, clever studies with hundreds of thousands of mice vaulted the idea into the mainstream, stirring optimism that making a fraction of a population immune could forestall a devastating outbreak.

But even the trailblazers researching herd immunity were mystified by how to deploy it in practice. This conundrum has featured in battles against many modern plagues—such as smallpox, polio, and measles. And now it is part of the debate as the COVID-19 pandemic continues to flourish around much of the world.

Some prominent leaders wonder if herd immunity created as people are naturally infected with SARS-CoV-2 coronavirus would be enough to restore society to working order. For evidence, they point to hard-hit epicenters such as New York City, where approximately 20 percent of the residents have been infected and the caseload has been low and steady for months. This sustained recovery must be due to herd protection, they argue.

But based on simple math, past experiences with outbreaks, and emerging evidence from the ongoing pandemic, this claim is a fantasy.

“If we had reached sufficient herd immunity in New York, you would expect incidents to continue going down, not to be holding steady,” says Virginia Pitzer, an epidemiologist at the Yale School of Public Health who specializes in the mathematical modeling of how diseases spread.

The reality is that most of the world—including 90 percent of the United States—remains susceptible to infection by the coronavirus virus, despite the global toll so far. Banking on natural infection to control the outbreak would lead to months, if not years, of a dismaying cycle in which cases subside and then surge. Even if such community-mediated protection were established, it would be constantly eroded by the birth of children and the real possibility that immunity in those previously infected would wane.

Only two infectious diseases have ever been eradicated: the human scourge of smallpox and the cattle-borne germ rinderpest. All other known afflictions—including such Old World pestilences as rabies, leprosy, and bubonic plague—have either been managed through human intervention or remain uncontrolled.

“It's very unlikely that we're going to see elimination of COVID-19 altogether from the population simply through the buildup of natural immunity,” says Pitzer. But if we add a highly effective vaccine on top of that, Pitzer says, “then it is theoretically possible that we could eliminate the virus” or at least control it.

A 237-page report from the National Academy of Medicine, published October 2, lays out how to distribute such a vaccine in an equitable manner—while also showing how hard this process will be. A crucial step will be communicating how good the vaccine needs to be to stop transmission. While major health agencies, including the U.S. Food and Drug Administration and the World Health Organization, say a COVID-19 vaccine should be at least 50-percent effective to be approved, this benchmark would actually be too low to establish protective herd immunity.

“It doesn't mean that a vaccine that's below this certain threshold will not be useful,” says Bruce Y. Lee, professor and executive director of Public Health Computational and Operations Research (PHICOR) at the City University of New York School of Public Health. “But if you want to be in a situation where you don't have to do social distancing and these other things anymore, then the vaccine really needs to be over 80 percent efficacy.”

What we mean when we talk about herd immunity

Herd immunity’s prominence in fighting epidemics can trace its origins to the 1920s and the University of Manchester in England. Inside a lab there, about 15,000 mice per year scurried through what looked like moon bases in miniature. Intricate residential pods—each about a foot wide—were connected by cylindrical tunnels, allowing the rodents to move freely around the Lilliputian cities.

But occasionally, the mouse cities would experience epidemics—ones started intentionally by the project’s leaders, William Whiteman Carlton Topley and Graham Selby Wilson. Members of one city would be exposed to lethal bacteria, while those in a separate city would receive doses of a vaccine along with the dangerous germ. The duo’s findings—published in 1923—demonstrated that immunity in a portion of a population could slow an outbreak and protect otherwise susceptible individuals.

“They called it experimental epidemiology,” says Paul Fine, a professor of communicable disease epidemiology at the London School of Hygiene & Tropical Medicine, who has written extensively about the origins of herd immunity. Topley and Wilson—along with some help from their contemporaries—helped popularize the idea, particularly through a textbook that’s still used by students to this day.

Yet when most people discuss herd immunity today, they’re really talking about what’s known as the “herd threshold theorem.” It’s what scientists are referencing when they say 75 percent of the population needs to be immune against COVID-19 to stop disease transmission, and it’s surprisingly simple to calculate.

Say a germ lands in foreign world, where an entire population is susceptible. And say it becomes clear that one infected person will transmit it to four others on average—a value known as the germ’s basic reproduction number, represented by an R with a subscript zero and thus called R-naught. To flatten the outbreak’s growth, you want a situation where the afflicted can infect just one person out of four.

“Well, that would be a circumstance where three out of the four were immune. He sneezed in four faces, but three of those individuals were immune,” Fine says. Three out of four is three-quarters, meaning a 75-percent threshold is needed to reach herd immunity.

Different viruses have their own reproduction numbers, so each has its own herd immunity threshold. Try the math again for measles, where one case can infect 18 susceptible people, and you get 94 percent. Polio has an R-naught of seven, so its threshold is 85 percent. These percentages serve as the targets for mass vaccination. Achieve them, and enough people in your community will be protected so that an outsider carrying the germ won’t be able to trigger a sustained outbreak.

While the underpinnings for the threshold theorem arose in the early 20th century, British epidemiologist George Macdonald was the first to incorporate the reproduction number, while studying malaria in Africa in the 1950s. It would be on this continent that a blind spot caused by strictly adhering to the concept would soon be discovered.

Why mass vaccination alone couldn’t beat smallpox

As a 16-year-old volunteer firefighter with the U.S. Forest Service, William Foege learned a key principle that would ultimately save millions of people from the scourge of smallpox: “Separate the fuel from the flames, and the fire stops,” Foege writes in his memoir House on Fire.

This mantra stuck with Foege after he joined the agency now known as the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention in 1962, and he was eventually stationed in Nigeria as an Epidemic Intelligence Service officer.

Three years earlier, the United Nations, World Health Assembly, and the WHO had launched a global eradication campaign against smallpox. The mass vaccination program quickly squelched the disease in Europe and North America, but nearly a decade later, the disease remained endemic in much of Africa, Asia, and South America, with tens of thousands of cases still reported each year. The virus kept finding hideouts—both in rural areas and high-density cities where it could fester—and ultimately threaten disease-free areas given that the vaccine’s immunity only lasted five years.

The tide turned on December 4, 1966, when a missionary in the southeastern Nigerian region of Ogoja radioed Foege to warn of a new possible outbreak. Trekking 90 miles by motorbike, Foege and his smallpox unit confirmed four cases in one village—but immediately faced a dilemma. Standard protocol called for vaccinating everyone in all the villages within a certain radius, but the team didn’t have enough doses. They would need to improvise.

“If we were smallpox viruses bent on immortality, what would we do to extend our family tree?” Foege writes. “The answer of course was to find the nearest susceptible person in which to continue reproduction.”

They opted to track down and vaccinate the individuals most likely to come in contact with the known cases. Dubbed “ring vaccination” or “surveillance-containment,” this strategy helped clear the final strongholds of smallpox over the next eight years.

It did it by addressing a wrinkle in the herd threshold theorem. That basic equation assumes everyone in a population is equally in contact with one another and spews an infectious virus in the same way.

“The real world violates these assumptions,” says Jeffrey Shaman, an epidemiologist at Columbia University's Mailman School of Public Health. Just look at COVID-19. Young adults drive the bulk of the spread in part because they come into contact with more people. (Millennials and Gen Z are spreading coronavirus—but not because of parties and bars.)

This uneven risk of infection—or heterogeneity—creates hot and cool spots of viral spread. If a public health team can cut off the heavy transmitters, they can control an outbreak with fewer doses of a vaccine. That’s a huge advantage—especially when an epidemic nears elimination and mass vaccination becomes less cost effective.

By 1971, an epidemiologist named John Fox began formulating herd immunity models that would better incorporate heterogeneity, and decades later it is still standard practice for public health researchers. The practice is similar to how firefighters clear trees, shrubs, and other flammable debris to encircle a raging wildfire, and it explains why health care workers, first responders, and people in hot spots such as jails will likely be first to receive an approved COVID-19 vaccine.

“By removing the fuel one step ahead of the virus, we had built a fire line,” writes Foege, who went on to serve as CDC director in 1977, the same year smallpox was eradicated from Africa. He is now the co-chair of the panel behind the National Academies report and a distinguished professor emeritus of international health at Emory University in Atlanta.

“The philosophy of science is to break down the walls of ignorance,” Foege said at a October 2 news conference that unveiled the report. “The philosophy behind medicine is to use that truth for every individual patient, but the philosophy behind public health is to use that truth for everyone.”

But his revelation about fire lines also means fewer people overall need to become immune to tamp down on transmission—relative to what’s predicted by the theorem threshold and mass vaccination goals. Today, this idea has inadvertently propelled a misconception that a lower threshold can be achieved through natural infection to safely thwart COVID-19.

Our future with COVID-19 depends on us

On August 14, Tom Britton, a mathematician at Stockholm University in Sweden, and two other scientists released a model in Science that estimates how social activity might influence the herd immunity threshold. They started with the valid assumption that millennials and Gen Z mix more than older people, and so will more readily spread the virus. Britton’s team landed on a herd threshold of 43 percent—much lower than the 60 to 75 percent you get using the classic equation.

“We don't claim that the number from our model applies in reality,” Britton cautions, adding that the model merely shows the degree to which disease-induced immunity can play a role. “We don't want our paper to have the consequence that people feel relaxed and say, Let's skip restrictions and wait for herd immunity.”

Another limitation of heterogeneity modeling, Columbia University’s Shaman says, is that no one really knows how germs spread among people on the street, so it’s difficult to tell what these reduced thresholds mean for real life.

“[Heterogeneity] is also constantly changing through time because of the measures we put in place. The telecommuting, the closing of schools, the wearing of masks are disrupting all the normal interactions that the virus feeds off,” Shaman says. “That completely changes the landscape.”

Moreover, recent studies of explosive COVID-19 outbreaks in two different regions suggest the classic herd theorem might be valid. In Qatar, the herd immunity threshold appears to have been achieved in about 10 working-class communities.

“So 60 percent of the population of Qatar is migrant workers. Almost all men and South Asian,” says Shaman. “They live in dormitory-style housing. They eat in cafeteria-style settings. They're just about as homogenized, in the sense of their interactions, as you could possibly get.”

In July, researchers began surveying these populations for antibodies, a sign of past infection. They found that 60 to 70 percent of these craft and manual workers—who tend to be young adults—had caught COVID-19 and become immune. Cases in the country have remained low even though officials reopened its borders this summer.

A separate study reported that the Brazilian city of Manaus reached the threshold and dampened its outbreak this summer after coronavirus infected 44 to 66 percent of its population. But a fresh bout of cases raises questions about whether the city truly achieved community protection—or worse, if immunity against the coronavirus wanes.

If the latter, the virus will bounce back even if places reach the herd immunity threshold through natural routes. This vulnerability would be reinforced by children, who are born without immune defenses and thus are susceptible to catching and spreading the disease. Another concern for waning immunity would be frequent reinfections that result in severe symptoms, Shaman says.

“This would suggest we're not going to be done with this any time soon, and that prior exposure doesn't lessen your chance of winding up in the hospital,” he says. Though one severe reinfection has been reported worldwide, there’s no evidence yet this is happening on a broad scale.

If society wants to overcome these bleak possibilities and return to life without social distancing and mask wearing, it needs a vaccine that provides a sufficient amount of what’s known as sterilizing immunity, meaning the drug blocks coronavirus transmission.

“I would say the sweet spot is 80 percent,” says CUNY’s Lee, who co-authored a research paper in July about efficacy goals for the COVID-19 vaccine. The bare minimum standard of 50 percent, set by the FDA and WHO, would only protect half the population if everyone is vaccinated. That falls well below the theorem threshold for COVID-19 of 60 to 75 percent. Such a scenario would be akin to the seasonal influenza vaccine, for which transmission efficacy tends to range between 20 to 60 percent. Mass vaccination doesn’t stop the flu, though it does reduce the disease burden on society.

“We have to make it clear to everyone that the first vaccine to reach the market may not achieve those efficacy levels,” Lee says. “It's not that easy to get an efficacy that high for a respiratory virus.”

That’s because current guidance says vaccine frontrunners can be approved even if they only provide “functional immunity,” which mainly confers protection against the symptoms of the disease.

The ongoing COVID-19 vaccine trials are not designed to estimate the impact the vaccine candidates would have on transmission, write the authors of the National Academy of Medicine report, adding that we may not learn this impact until well after an FDA approval. As they explain, the first priority is to stop the most vulnerable people from dying, especially older people with pre-existing conditions and our limited cohort of frontline health-care specialists and first responders.

“So much of the focus has been on the return to normal,” Lee says, “and we can't have that type of expectation.”

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: Wheeler] #2829446
10/06/20 06:02 PM
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"Herd immunity and COVID-19 (coronavirus): What you need to know"
Understand what's known about herd immunity and what it means for coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19).

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases...rd-immunity-and-coronavirus/art-20486808

Curious as to whether herd immunity against the coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19) might slow the spread of the disease? Understand how herd immunity works and what experts are saying about its potential impact on the COVID-19 pandemic.

Why is herd immunity important?

Herd immunity occurs when a large portion of a community (the herd) becomes immune to a disease, making the spread of disease from person to person unlikely. As a result, the whole community becomes protected — not just those who are immune.

Often, a percentage of the population must be capable of getting a disease in order for it to spread. This is called a threshold proportion. If the proportion of the population that is immune to the disease is greater than this threshold, the spread of the disease will decline. This is known as the herd immunity threshold.

What percentage of a community needs to be immune in order to achieve herd immunity? It varies from disease to disease. The more contagious a disease is, the greater the proportion of the population that needs to be immune to the disease to stop its spread. For example, the measles is a highly contagious illness. It's estimated that 94% of the population must be immune to interrupt the chain of transmission.

How is herd immunity achieved?

There are two paths to herd immunity for COVID-19 — vaccines and infection.

(1) Vaccines

A vaccine for the virus that causes COVID-19 would be an ideal approach to achieving herd immunity. Vaccines create immunity without causing illness or resulting complications. Herd immunity makes it possible to protect the population from a disease, including those who can't be vaccinated, such as newborns or those who have compromised immune systems. Using the concept of herd immunity, vaccines have successfully controlled deadly contagious diseases such as smallpox, polio, diphtheria, rubella and many others.

Reaching herd immunity through vaccination sometimes has drawbacks, though. Protection from some vaccines can wane over time, requiring revaccination. Sometimes people don't get all of the shots that they need to be completely protected from a disease.

In addition, some people may object to vaccines because of religious objections, fears about the possible risks or skepticism about the benefits. People who object to vaccines often live in the same neighborhoods or attend the same religious services or schools. If the proportion of vaccinated people in a community falls below the herd immunity threshold, exposure to a contagious disease could result in the disease quickly spreading. Measles has recently resurged in several parts of the world with relatively low vaccination rates, including the United States. Opposition to vaccines can pose a real challenge to herd immunity.

(2) Natural infection

Herd immunity can also be reached when a sufficient number of people in the population have recovered from a disease and have developed antibodies against future infection. For example, those who survived the 1918 flu (influenza) pandemic were later immune to infection with the H1N1 flu, a subtype of influenza A. During the 2009-10 flu season, H1N1 caused the respiratory infection in humans that was commonly referred to as swine flu.

However, there are some major problems with relying on community infection to create herd immunity to the virus that causes COVID-19. First, it isn't yet clear if infection with the COVID-19 virus makes a person immune to future infection.

Research suggests that after infection with some coronaviruses, reinfection with the same virus — though usually mild and only happening in a fraction of people — is possible after a period of months or years. Further research is needed to determine the protective effect of antibodies to the virus in those who have been infected.

Even if infection with the COVID-19 virus creates long-lasting immunity, a large number of people would have to become infected to reach the herd immunity threshold. Experts estimate that in the U.S., 70% of the population — more than 200 million people — would have to recover from COVID-19 to halt the epidemic. If many people become sick with COVID-19 at once, the health care system could quickly become overwhelmed. This amount of infection could also lead to serious complications and millions of deaths, especially among older people and those who have chronic conditions.

How can you slow the transmission of COVID-19?

Until a COVID-19 vaccine is developed, it's crucial to slow the spread of the COVID-19 virus and protect individuals at increased risk of severe illness, including older adults and people of any age with underlying health conditions.

To reduce the risk of infection:

* Avoid large events and mass gatherings.
* Avoid close contact (within about 6 feet, or 2 meters) with anyone who is sick or has symptoms.
* Stay home as much as possible and keep distance between yourself and others (within about 6 feet, or 2 meters) if COVID-19 is spreading in your community, especially if you have a higher risk of serious illness. Keep in mind some people may have the COVID-19 virus and spread it to others, even if they don't have symptoms or don't know they have COVID-19.
* Wash your hands often with soap and water for at least 20 seconds, or use an alcohol-based hand sanitizer that contains at least 60% alcohol.
* Wear a cloth face covering in public spaces, such as the grocery store, where it's difficult to avoid close contact with others, especially if you're in an area with ongoing community spread. Only use nonmedical cloth masks — surgical masks and N95 respirators should be reserved for health care providers.
* Cover your mouth and nose with your elbow or a tissue when you cough or sneeze. Throw away the used tissue.
* Avoid touching your eyes, nose and mouth.
* Avoid sharing dishes, glasses, bedding and other household items if you're sick.
* Clean and disinfect high-touch surfaces, such as doorknobs, light switches, electronics and counters, daily.
* Stay home from work, school and public areas if you're sick, unless you're going to get medical care. Avoid public transportation, taxis and ride-sharing if you're sick.

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: Wheeler] #2829644
10/07/20 08:40 AM
10/07/20 08:40 AM
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For those not inclined to decipher entirely the above two IMO informative dissertations, this is my main takeaway:

"They opted to track down and vaccinate the individuals most likely to come in contact with the known cases. Dubbed “ring vaccination” or “surveillance-containment,” this strategy helped clear the final strongholds of smallpox over the next eight years.

It did it by addressing a wrinkle in the herd threshold theorem. That basic equation assumes everyone in a population is equally in contact with one another and spews an infectious virus in the same way."

Meaning the "wrinkle" is about an invalid assumption, and a component in why the opinions in our country to this pandemic are so divided, as nobody knows exactly where the "ring" is.


Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: 360view] #2829645
10/07/20 08:41 AM
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FDA demands Moderna and Pfizer Covid-19 vaccines be delayed two additional months

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2020-10-agency-months-safety-covid-vaccine.html

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: 360view] #2830119
10/07/20 08:17 PM
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British re-examine the assumptions they made at beginning of pandemic.
Numbers confirm that school closures save no net lives.

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2020-10-advice-uk-school-closures.html

Sample quote

The new analysis confirms that information used by the SAGE advisory committee to advise on lockdown showed that school closures would result in more overall COVID-19 deaths than no school closures, and that social distancing in the over 70s only would be more effective in reducing COVID-19 deaths than general social distancing.

End quote

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: 360view] #2830212
10/08/20 07:03 AM
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One of the discoverers of the HIV virus, Dr Robert Gallo,
suggests getting FluMist influenza spray vaccine this year
because it is a “live attenuated virus vaccine”
like Measles vaccine, Polio vaccine or BCG vaccine.
He says that those who get FluMist sprayed up their nose might gain somewhat more protection against Covid-19.

https://www.npr.org/sections/health...-flu-vaccine-help-you-fight-off-covid-19

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: 360view] #2830402
10/08/20 02:23 PM
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Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: 360view] #2830410
10/08/20 02:41 PM
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In most recent nationwide Covid-19 test of 36,061 people
77 % who tested positive were without any symptoms.

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2020-10-symptoms-covid-poor-marker-infection.html

Sample quote

The research included data from a representative population sample of 36,061 people who were tested between 26 April and the 27 June 2020 and provided information of whether they had any symptoms.

The data showed 115 (0.32%) people out of the total 36,061 people in the pilot study had a positive test result.
Focusing on those with COVID-19 specific symptoms (cough, and/or fever, and/or loss of taste/smell),
there were 158 (0.43%) with such symptoms on the day of the test.

Of the 115 with a positive result, there were 16 (13.9%) reporting symptoms and in contrast, 99 (86.1%) did not report any specific symptoms on the day of the test.

The study also includes data on people reporting a wider range of symptoms such as fatigue and shortness of breath.
Of the sample who tested positive, 27 (23.5%) were symptomatic and 88 (76.5%) were asymptomatic on the day of the test.

End quote

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: 360view] #2830694
10/09/20 10:39 AM
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Similar to the disease Lupus,
severe Covid-19 may involve “mistaken” antibodies

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2020-10-autoimmune-like-antibody-response-linked-severe.html

Sample quote

In a recently published paper, my colleagues and I have identified extrafollicular B cell signatures in cases of severe COVID-19 similar to those we saw in active lupus. We showed that early on in the response to infection, patients with severe disease undergo a rapid activation of this fast-track pathway for antibody production. These patients produce high levels of viral-specific antibodies, some which are capable of neutralizing the virus. However, in addition to those protective antibodies, some that we saw look suspiciously like the ones found in autoimmune disorders such lupus.

In the end, patients with these autoimmune-like B cell responses fare poorly, with high incidences of systemic organ failure and death.

End quote

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: 360view] #2831191
10/10/20 03:50 PM
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Map shows time lapse of Covid-19 spread across USA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hqfaf9Q-RGc

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: 360view] #2831525
10/11/20 01:43 PM
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Large outbreaks of Covid-19 continue at USA Veterans Affairs owned veterans nursing homes

https://abcnews.go.com/US/dozens-covid-19-cases-reported-veterans-care-centers/story?id=73537122

Sample quote

The Sitter & Barfoot Veterans Care Center in Richmond has 49 cases impacting 39 residents and 10 staff, the Virginia Department of Veterans Services said Friday.
...snip
The Virginia Veterans Care Center in Roanoke has 62 COVID-19 cases among 43 residents and 19 staff, the department said.
...snip
Over 65,000 U.S. veterans have been diagnosed with COVID-19 and at least 3,601 have died, according to Veterans Affairs.

End quote

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: 360view] #2831577
10/11/20 03:33 PM
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I think the best world wide view is the FT website: https://www.ft.com/content/a2901ce8-5eb7-4633-b89c-cbdf5b386938

Very interesting to see how the virus has spread around the world. Europe got hit hard at the beginning and then the cases dropped way off. India started off very slow but it just keeps building there month after month. Poor countries are struggling with the virus while rich countries are shutting it down.

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: AndyF] #2831582
10/11/20 03:43 PM
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That is a good graph layout.

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: 360view] #2831592
10/11/20 03:54 PM
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FT comparison of US States or Countries is good too

https://ig.ft.com/coronavirus-chart...ale=1&perMillion=1&values=deaths

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: 360view] #2831791
10/12/20 07:42 AM
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Hong Kong researchers demonstrate that the already available and cheap ulcer drug “Tritec”
ranitidine bismuth citrate
may have potential as an effective Covid-19 fighter.

https://news.yahoo.com/hong-kong-scientists-anti-microbe-042106404.html

Sample quote

Using Syrian hamsters as tests subjects, they found that one of the drugs,
ranitidine bismuth citrate (RBC),
was "a potent anti-SARS-CoV-2 agent".

"RBC is able to lower the viral load in the lung of the infected hamster by tenfold,"
Hong Kong University researcher Runming Wang told reporters on Monday as the team presented their study.

End quote

More technical information:

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41564-020-00802-x

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