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So i did a thing today. The Imperial will thank me. #2830955
10/09/20 09:53 PM
10/09/20 09:53 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,067
Irving, TX
feets Offline OP
Senior Management
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Senior Management

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,067
Irving, TX
I did some pretty heavy soul searching on the Imperial engine project. My nerdy side had taken over and I got all caught up in making the engine as efficient as possible. Efficient engine means torque. It also means better fuel economy. Big torque also means lively performance and more fun to drive but focusing on that trades off horsepower. Digging back into my fuel and mileage records from the 2012 Power Tour (Dallas to Detroit and back) I saw that I was only getting 12 mpg.

I'd told myself a while back this was likely to be my last old school engine build. The new stuff is just too efficient and easy to get power out of. That's doubly true when you think of these old big blocks with what are essentially small block heads on them. Looking back at my engine builds I realized that I had done some fun stuff but never really built an engine with good parts. They'd always been a hodge podge of used factory bits with cams and other stuff bolted to them.

As for the car, it's only value is the engine. Without a 440/727/8.75 this car is little more than demo derby material. It's an organ donor on wheels.

Only after hours of soul searching and long deep conversation with close friends did the real me resurface.


The Imperial is going back on the road with 543 cubic inches of RB power. It's too late to talk me back from the edge. The money is spent. I'm going back to my happy place which is just a wee bit on the other side of bonkers. I was only fooling myself with all that adult supervision talk.

I ordered a 440 Source 543 kit with 10:1 compression on 88 CC heads. I'll call Comp and discuss a new cam for this build. The old Edelbrock heads that helped the 440 and TT440 will become the bottleneck in the build. Torque will be fierce but there's no way these heads will support over 600 hp naturally aspirated. The heads will likely limit rpm to something around 5500 before they strangle things. That's fine because piston speed will be excessive with the 4.5" stroke.

I'm not going all out. This will still be a relatively mild mannered build compatible with power brakes and a stock-ish converter. However, with the inches I can get away with a bit more cam.

The Headman headers I was looking at are going to be too small so I'll likely have to call TTI for something that fits properly and can handle the flow. There's plenty of room under the car for 3" exhaust.

It will be fun getting back to my maniacal side with something as absurd as an early 70s land yacht. Imagine the look on Mr Mustang's face when this old dinosaur picks on him. It's the Imperial! I'll be ahead of him and behind him at the same time. biggrin

I might be able to squeeze out 10 mpg if I behave myself. The OD would still be handy but could lead to bad ideas. The Imp was not designed for high speeds but it would certainly be capable. I'm not always on my best behavior as witnessed by my jaunt to the high side of 160 mph in the half-pint AMG this week.


We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind.
- Stu Harmon
Re: So i did a thing today. The Imperial will thank me. [Re: feets] #2830962
10/09/20 10:01 PM
10/09/20 10:01 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 20,158
Park Forest, IL
slantzilla Offline
Too Many Posts
slantzilla  Offline
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Posts: 20,158
Park Forest, IL
Sounds like a great project!


"Everybody funny, now you funny too."
Re: So i did a thing today. The Imperial will thank me. [Re: slantzilla] #2830982
10/09/20 11:08 PM
10/09/20 11:08 PM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 4,707
Star Idaho
6
67vertman Offline
master
67vertman  Offline
master
6

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Posts: 4,707
Star Idaho
Good deal Feets! You are going to love the Old school feel of an RB big block!


My Monster are real!

Living within your means makes life pretty easy.
Re: So i did a thing today. The Imperial will thank me. [Re: 67vertman] #2830988
10/09/20 11:25 PM
10/09/20 11:25 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 43,511
Round Lake Beach, Illinoisy
Rhinodart Offline
Rhinotruck
Rhinodart  Offline
Rhinotruck

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Posts: 43,511
Round Lake Beach, Illinoisy
Good to hear! Why not twin turbo's...LOL


The funny thing about science is that if you change one miniscule parameter you change the entire outcome to the way you want it.

JB Rhinehart, Realist

A-Body's RULE!
Re: So i did a thing today. The Imperial will thank me. [Re: Rhinodart] #2830990
10/09/20 11:31 PM
10/09/20 11:31 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,067
Irving, TX
feets Offline OP
Senior Management
feets  Offline OP
Senior Management

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Irving, TX
Originally Posted by Rhinodart
Good to hear! Why not twin turbo's...LOL


You don't know how many times I've heard that already. biggrin

I've got to keep a hint of normalcy to this thing and get it going again. There's another project waiting on me and I really want to start on it.


We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind.
- Stu Harmon
Re: So i did a thing today. The Imperial will thank me. [Re: feets] #2831002
10/10/20 01:50 AM
10/10/20 01:50 AM
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,998
Salem
Grizzly Offline
Moparts Proctologist
Grizzly  Offline
Moparts Proctologist

Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,998
Salem
Overdrive, period.

If a 5000+ pound 488 cu in 2wd V10 with 3.54's can get 15 mpg on the highway, so should the 440. twocents


Mo' Farts

Moderated by "tbagger".
Re: So i did a thing today. The Imperial will thank me. [Re: Grizzly] #2831018
10/10/20 07:11 AM
10/10/20 07:11 AM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,162
USA
3
360view Offline
Moparts resident spammer
360view  Offline
Moparts resident spammer
3

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Posts: 8,162
USA
Originally Posted by Grizzly
Overdrive, period.

If a 5000+ pound 488 cu in 2wd V10 with 3.54's can get 15 mpg on the highway, so should the 440. twocents


Overdrive, Diff ratio, Low rolling resistance tires, Air Fuel ratio higher than 14.7, or alternatively custom controlled EGR,
can raise the fuel economy of a “Torque Monster” engine choice.

Nearly invisible aerodynamic tweaks underneath the car can help MPG too.

Re: So i did a thing today. The Imperial will thank me. [Re: 360view] #2831029
10/10/20 08:14 AM
10/10/20 08:14 AM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
GoodysGotaCuda Offline
5.7L Hemi, 6spd
GoodysGotaCuda  Offline
5.7L Hemi, 6spd

Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
EFI + OD will seal the deal!


1972 Barracuda - 5.7L Hemi, T56 Magnum 6spd - https://www.facebook.com/GoodysGotaHemi
2020 RAM 1500
[img]https://i.imgur.com/v9yezP9.jpg[/img]
Re: So i did a thing today. The Imperial will thank me. [Re: GoodysGotaCuda] #2831038
10/10/20 08:58 AM
10/10/20 08:58 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,067
Irving, TX
feets Offline OP
Senior Management
feets  Offline OP
Senior Management

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,067
Irving, TX
Originally Posted by GoodysGotaCuda
EFI + OD will seal the deal!


I'm going to mock up the factory intake, carb, and air cleaner for measurements. If the intake off the hot rod will fit it'll go on. The Holley Quadrajet Sniper won't feed this thing.


We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind.
- Stu Harmon
Re: So i did a thing today. The Imperial will thank me. [Re: feets] #2831051
10/10/20 09:33 AM
10/10/20 09:33 AM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 6,558
Downtown Roebuck Ont
Twostick Offline
Still wishing...
Twostick  Offline
Still wishing...

Joined: May 2003
Posts: 6,558
Downtown Roebuck Ont
The Sniper Xflow is good for 800 hp. The Quadrajet one claims 650 hp.

Kevin

Re: So i did a thing today. The Imperial will thank me. [Re: Twostick] #2831096
10/10/20 11:49 AM
10/10/20 11:49 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,067
Irving, TX
feets Offline OP
Senior Management
feets  Offline OP
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Posts: 28,067
Irving, TX
Originally Posted by Twostick
The Sniper Xflow is good for 800 hp. The Quadrajet one claims 650 hp.

Kevin


According to the Holley site the Q-jet only holds 500.


We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind.
- Stu Harmon
Re: So i did a thing today. The Imperial will thank me. [Re: feets] #2831244
10/10/20 05:37 PM
10/10/20 05:37 PM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 6,558
Downtown Roebuck Ont
Twostick Offline
Still wishing...
Twostick  Offline
Still wishing...

Joined: May 2003
Posts: 6,558
Downtown Roebuck Ont
Originally Posted by feets
Originally Posted by Twostick
The Sniper Xflow is good for 800 hp. The Quadrajet one claims 650 hp.

Kevin


According to the Holley site the Q-jet only holds 500.


I saw it on a chart from their website which of course I can't find now... lol

Is there a reason you were going with the spread bore? The 4150 series seems to start at 650 hp and goes north from there.

Kevin

Re: So i did a thing today. The Imperial will thank me. [Re: Twostick] #2831247
10/10/20 05:45 PM
10/10/20 05:45 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,067
Irving, TX
feets Offline OP
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feets  Offline OP
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Irving, TX
Originally Posted by Twostick
Originally Posted by feets
Originally Posted by Twostick
The Sniper Xflow is good for 800 hp. The Quadrajet one claims 650 hp.

Kevin


According to the Holley site the Q-jet only holds 500.


I saw it on a chart from their website which of course I can't find now... lol

Is there a reason you were going with the spread bore? The 4150 series seems to start at 650 hp and goes north from there.

Kevin


I wanted the sound of a TQ at full song. biggrin

No other reason.


We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind.
- Stu Harmon
Re: So i did a thing today. The Imperial will thank me. [Re: feets] #2831258
10/10/20 06:02 PM
10/10/20 06:02 PM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 6,558
Downtown Roebuck Ont
Twostick Offline
Still wishing...
Twostick  Offline
Still wishing...

Joined: May 2003
Posts: 6,558
Downtown Roebuck Ont
Originally Posted by feets
Originally Posted by Twostick
Originally Posted by feets
Originally Posted by Twostick
The Sniper Xflow is good for 800 hp. The Quadrajet one claims 650 hp.

Kevin


According to the Holley site the Q-jet only holds 500.


I saw it on a chart from their website which of course I can't find now... lol

Is there a reason you were going with the spread bore? The 4150 series seems to start at 650 hp and goes north from there.

Kevin


I wanted the sound of a TQ at full song. biggrin

No other reason.


The 2x4 system should be close. laugh2

Kevin

Re: So i did a thing today. The Imperial will thank me. [Re: feets] #2831296
10/10/20 07:31 PM
10/10/20 07:31 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 30,989
Oregon
A
AndyF Offline
I Win
AndyF  Offline
I Win
A

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 30,989
Oregon
Originally Posted by feets
Originally Posted by GoodysGotaCuda
EFI + OD will seal the deal!


I'm going to mock up the factory intake, carb, and air cleaner for measurements. If the intake off the hot rod will fit it'll go on. The Holley Quadrajet Sniper won't feed this thing.


You will most likely be fighting hood clearance the whole time. Probably need to use a Holley Strip Dominator intake with a Sniper XFlow to feed that engine.

Re: So i did a thing today. The Imperial will thank me. [Re: AndyF] #2831310
10/10/20 08:07 PM
10/10/20 08:07 PM
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,145
M
McCandlessboy Offline
super stock
McCandlessboy  Offline
super stock
M

Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,145
What year imperial?

Re: So i did a thing today. The Imperial will thank me. [Re: McCandlessboy] #2831325
10/10/20 08:24 PM
10/10/20 08:24 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,808
Between Houston & Galveston TX
SattyNoCar Offline
Smarter than no class Flappergass by a mile
SattyNoCar  Offline
Smarter than no class Flappergass by a mile

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,808
Between Houston & Galveston TX
Originally Posted by McCandlessboy
What year imperial?


Pretty sure it's a '72. work


John

The dream is dead, long live the dream.......😥
Re: So i did a thing today. The Imperial will thank me. [Re: SattyNoCar] #2831331
10/10/20 08:34 PM
10/10/20 08:34 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 20,726
A collage of whims
topside Offline
Too Many Posts
topside  Offline
Too Many Posts

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Posts: 20,726
A collage of whims
It'll be the only Imperial that needs Drag Radials !

Re: So i did a thing today. The Imperial will thank me. [Re: topside] #2831338
10/10/20 08:57 PM
10/10/20 08:57 PM
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,402
Central Pa
M
moparjim79 Offline
pro stock
moparjim79  Offline
pro stock
M

Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,402
Central Pa
Was waiting to see what you would do, hoping you would go stroker. Glad you did. It won't be the first time someone's proves it can be done on the street when it doesn't make sense on paper..

I know you'll nail it!

Re: So i did a thing today. The Imperial will thank me. [Re: moparjim79] #2831357
10/10/20 10:07 PM
10/10/20 10:07 PM
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,145
M
McCandlessboy Offline
super stock
McCandlessboy  Offline
super stock
M

Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,145
Really cool if it's a 72. I have 2 73's and we're going to do a budget build for a magazine with one of them. Looking forward to your build!

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