Re: new SFT for the 511
[Re: mopar dave]
#2781584
06/05/20 01:31 AM
06/05/20 01:31 AM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,097 Bend,OR USA
Cab_Burge
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,097
Bend,OR USA
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My old pump gas Duster (511 C .I.) had a Comp Cams solid roller ground for Benshoff (SP?) racing in WI, it was 260@.050 with .420 lobe lift on the intake and 266 @.050 on the exhaust with .409 lobe lift(EDITED ground on a 108 LSA in at 107 ILC)with 1.65 H.S. roller rocker, that cam pulled really hard up past 7800 RPM in second gear before I got scared and shifted it. I shifted it between 7000 and 7300 RPM all the time, it ran really good and was easy on parts That cam with the low deck six pack made peak torque at 4500 RPM and peak HP at 500 RPM but ran faster at the track shifting at or above 7000 RPM 290@.050 sounds like Pro Stock hemi cams
Last edited by Cab_Burge; 06/07/20 04:56 PM.
Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
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Re: new SFT for the 511
[Re: mopar dave]
#2781638
06/05/20 10:39 AM
06/05/20 10:39 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 17,838 S.E. Michigan
ZIPPY
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I Live Here
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Posts: 17,838
S.E. Michigan
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We never seem to hear of anyone using a Comp .650 ft, or anything like a (seemingly fairly comparable? Although I know Herb would vehemently disagree) old MP .620 in a 500+ ci combination with more modern heads.....but I'd like to. Just to see what happens. Maybe that's an awful combination? As much as it'd be interesting to see, I'd never suggest someone else be the guinea pig.
Oddly though many folks with those sort of combinations seem to love the old MP .590 But that's almost a no brainer as it seems to fall right into the duration ballpark alot of us are thinking will definitely work.
Good luck in your quest. Dwayne won't steer you wrong and he is just cool to talk to.
Rich H.
Esse Quam Videri
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Re: new SFT for the 511
[Re: ZIPPY]
#2781681
06/05/20 12:11 PM
06/05/20 12:11 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 30,989 Oregon
AndyF
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I Win
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Posts: 30,989
Oregon
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We never seem to hear of anyone using a Comp .650 ft, or anything like a (seemingly fairly comparable? Although I know Herb would vehemently disagree) old MP .620 in a 500+ ci combination with more modern heads.....but I'd like to. Just to see what happens. Maybe that's an awful combination? As much as it'd be interesting to see, I'd never suggest someone else be the guinea pig.
Oddly though many folks with those sort of combinations seem to love the old MP .590 But that's almost a no brainer as it seems to fall right into the duration ballpark alot of us are thinking will definitely work.
The old Comp 650 was designed by Herb for the cast iron heads that he was using back in the day. I seem to remember a long time ago that people tried using that cam when they switched to Indy heads and the results were not good. I ran into a little bit of the same issue with the Trick Flow heads on my 470 low deck. The TF heads flow so well at low lift that if you put too big of a cam in there it really kills the power. Dwayne and I talked that combo over a few times. I tried smaller cams and bigger cams in that engine and eventually we found the "just right" size. Too small worked better than too large for sure. Too large on the cam would kill the power down low but not add much up top. Too small added power down low but limited it up top. Just right would pull hard all the way. The difference between too big and just right wasn't very much. The guy at Bullet was convinced that a 270 cam would work great in my 470 but it was a real dog. The cam that worked the best was 264/268 so not a lot of difference in numbers, but the difference on the dyno was very significant. The cam that was too small was 261. So it was just a few degrees difference plus the shape of the lobe. Dwayne figured out which was the best lobe shape for the TF heads. I roughly knew the correct duration but he figured out the lobe shape which was the key.
Last edited by AndyF; 06/05/20 12:15 PM.
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Re: new SFT for the 511
[Re: AndyF]
#2781708
06/05/20 12:36 PM
06/05/20 12:36 PM
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 8,031 Mt Morris Michigan
mopar dave
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 8,031
Mt Morris Michigan
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Interesting to read. Andy your 470 ran best with the 264/268, 4* difference in lobes. My 511 and the new 267/271 also 4* difference and a few degrees more and not out of line with the few extra cubes should really shine. Tim over at Bullet is not the designer of this cam, It is a Harold Brookshire design. Tim said it was an old xs series Winston cup cam. It should do well, but will see.
Last edited by mopar dave; 06/05/20 12:41 PM.
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Re: new SFT for the 511
[Re: mopar dave]
#2781729
06/05/20 01:34 PM
06/05/20 01:34 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,923 NC
440Jim
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I Live Here
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NC
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Looking at 2 different cams to go with 2 different cam matching theories. First theory is that first 330ft at track are the most important, so I would think a torquer cam would be best, so here it is. Ultradyne 294/298 267/271 650/620 108 lash .016/.016(@.200 lift 185/188) my current cam is 180/186@.200 My second theory is why would low end grunt matter because the vert stalls at 5400 and never drops below 6000 going down the track. So, here's that cam, Comp 324/324 290/290 650/650 108 lash .028/.026 (@.200 lift 200/200). I was told this is an old HM cam. Street/strip deal. The 290 sounds way over cammed with 12.5:1 . Jim who goes real fast on flat tappets says nothing over 270@50 or its over cammed with 12.5:1 and i'm sure he's correct in this. Just thought I might get a few opinions on this as i'm really sold on the NF904 cam. You are looking at specs that not everyone thinks about, and I agree. "(@.200 lift 185/188) my current cam is 180/186@.200"Like I told you before, I like that Ultradyne for your application. But ft you decide you want "Theory 2"; a better Comp Cam than that old 0.650"/0.650" is their more recent 0.650"/0.630" version: Comp Cam link at SummitComp Cam link at Comp's web siteFrom my measurements, it is about 197/200 deg at 0.200" lobe lift. (for comparison) But with 279/287 deg at 0.050"; I think that came needs more CR than you have for best results. I ran it with 13.5 CR back in the day. The older 0.650/0.650 is about 200/200 at 0.200" lobe lift.
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Re: new SFT for the 511
[Re: mopar dave]
#2781750
06/05/20 02:02 PM
06/05/20 02:02 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,923 NC
440Jim
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,923
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Thanks Jim. I think Andy mentioned that cam in his book as being a good cam too. Do you think it hurts it at all being on a 110? IMO, once you get enough duration, like the MM 305S-10, the 110 LSA works fine.
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Re: new SFT for the 511
[Re: mopar dave]
#2781805
06/05/20 04:35 PM
06/05/20 04:35 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,923 NC
440Jim
I Live Here
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I Live Here
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... I’m using a 1.6 rocker on that too. Remember, the Ultradyne NF lobe profile will need good springs with 1.6 rockers (especially the heavier intake valve). I also like the solid lifters with the EDM oil hole when running stiffer springs and trying to go high 6000's rpm with flat tappets. (Durability).
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Re: new SFT for the 511
[Re: mopar dave]
#2781953
06/05/20 11:02 PM
06/05/20 11:02 PM
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Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 19,317 State of confusion
Thumperdart
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I Live Here
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 19,317
State of confusion
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I agree, just want to throw that out there because they were so addiment it was a badass cam in just about anything. I just got out of that over cam issue and i'm not falling back in any time soon. If my 511 was 14:1 compression, I may have given it a try just for giggles. They claimed it is a Herb McCandless design. I don't think it takes a cam over 270@50 to make good power in a 511. Sure would like to know the magic number thou. And again I disagree about a 500+ci motor not needing more duration and although a Chevy my customers 11.7.1 comp. 572 pump gas Chevelle goes 8.40's n/a at 3450 lbs with a .750-.800 lift 282-293 cam. But this is how we ALL learn and maybe your motor doesn't want a bigger/more duration cam but I doubt it....
72 Dart 470 n/a BB stroker street car `THUMPER`...Check me out on FB Dominic Thumper for videos and lots of carb pics......760-900-3895.....
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Re: new SFT for the 511
[Re: mopar dave]
#2782106
06/06/20 01:01 PM
06/06/20 01:01 PM
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Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 19,317 State of confusion
Thumperdart
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I Live Here
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 19,317
State of confusion
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And again, my crappy RPM's happily accept and fly imo with a .680.660 276-281 Solid Isky roller......
72 Dart 470 n/a BB stroker street car `THUMPER`...Check me out on FB Dominic Thumper for videos and lots of carb pics......760-900-3895.....
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Re: new SFT for the 511
[Re: mopar dave]
#2782357
06/07/20 11:46 AM
06/07/20 11:46 AM
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Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 19,317 State of confusion
Thumperdart
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 19,317
State of confusion
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There is a fine line between velocity and volume so in my world and in your case I'd cam it up, loosen the vert and leave as high/hard as the tires will take......
72 Dart 470 n/a BB stroker street car `THUMPER`...Check me out on FB Dominic Thumper for videos and lots of carb pics......760-900-3895.....
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Re: new SFT for the 511
[Re: mopar dave]
#2878217
01/22/21 08:37 AM
01/22/21 08:37 AM
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 287 PA
Harry's Taxi 2
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 287
PA
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Here's a little informative update to this older thread. ALWAYS verify your cam specs! i didn't and wasted 2 seasons of testing other areas in my pursuit of the 8's with a flat tappet and std port heads.
Out of 5 cams from 4 different companies, 2 were what they were supposed to be.....and not just a degree or so off. One was 8 degree's less on the intake lobe, the other 2 were around 5 degrees less on the intakes.
i sent one cam back and they said it checked correctly......and when "it" or a cam came back, it did. Guess it just needed a little travel time to stretch those lobes out.
This is in a block with corrected and bushed lifter bores, checked on multiple cylinders.
Last edited by Harry's Taxi 2; 01/22/21 08:42 AM.
'86 Maple Grove KOS Mopar low qualifier......true street legal with no power adders.
NOS-used when losing since 1940.
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Re: new SFT for the 511
[Re: Harry's Taxi 2]
#2878227
01/22/21 09:16 AM
01/22/21 09:16 AM
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Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 570 UK
rb446
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 570
UK
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I ran the McAndless CC 290@.050 .650/.650 sft cam in my stock 9.5>9.7:1CR 440 6pk bottom end with around 260cfm 906's and it made 525+fwhp from weight/mph with a Team G, 850DP and 2" f/wells back in the day.... it ran real good, ticked over@900rpm etc. and pulled its heart out top end. So how much hp was I out do you guys think not being@ 13:1CR....just as a question to ask in this thread if you don't mind.
Last edited by rb446; 01/22/21 09:46 AM.
1969 'Cuda 446ci, best 9.96@133.9 in 1990 1971 340 'Cuda, best 11.01@122.8 in 1987
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