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Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: 360view] #2761744
04/08/20 10:13 PM
04/08/20 10:13 PM
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Jefferson State
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Re: the mutations. This may be why there have been reports of various types of damaged human parts and systems.

From The Lancet

Quote : Not only capable of causing pneumonia, COVID-19 may also cause damage to other organs such as the heart, the liver, and the kidneys, as well as to organ systems such as the blood and the immune system.
Patients eventually die of multiple organ failure, shock, acute respiratory distress syndrome, heart failure, arrhythmias, and renal failure.
We should therefore pay attention to potential multi-organ injuries and the protection and prevention thereof in the treatment of COVID-19.

This is why a one shoe fits all approach to treatment of infection symptoms does not work. As above, stay in, wait for a safe and effective vaccine. Keep in mind the more people (currently 430k+) that get infected the more opportunity for mutations. The tide is turning, lets not let it get out of hand by going back to "usual" activities, The Doctors will ultimately figure it out, hopefully before it mutated to where they need to start over. It's like catching a rat, got to get it cornered.

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: srt] #2761760
04/08/20 11:15 PM
04/08/20 11:15 PM
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Crook County, ILL
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Sure, everyone will just stay locked up in their homes until a vaccine is available hopefully by this time next year, and with the economy shut down.
No problem!

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: Mastershake340] #2761765
04/08/20 11:47 PM
04/08/20 11:47 PM
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Jefferson State
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Typical polar opposite.
Many people will be able to return to work. Some will work from home, some will have the anti-bodies from infection they knew or did not know they had, others may be in low exposure areas. Who wants to throw reasonableness and caution to the wind and volunteer to go back to how things were, lets say, during the period of thanksgiving through the holidays up to about the superbowl? We simply can't pack stadiums, race tracks, fairgrounds, shopping malls, etc. by , lets say Easter. Any volunteers? Even rather mundane activities of going to family gatherings, your doctor or dentist appointments, take in a movie, or go to a casino may cost one their lives. Or, if enough venture out and the virus takes off again (and mutates). Once the huge amount of active infections get throttled back can society dabble with a new normality. Some people lay pretty much low to begin with. Think of the elderly in the rest homes and the visitor or employee of the place that brings the illness in. I bet there is more screening of workers in the future. Could a contractor or steel building, bridge, water or wastewater construction project proceed if infection spread within the ranks of the workers, factory, assembly line work, stock market floor?
I believe the 1918 pandemic ran 3 years and killed 50m in the world 657k in the US, at that time the population of the US was 103m now its 331m. One can do the math. It's time to get back to work, likely in a new way.

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: srt] #2761770
04/09/20 12:22 AM
04/09/20 12:22 AM
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Posts: 1,235
Phoenix, AZ
Jjs72D Offline
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So what? Hide in your house forever?
No. I'm not sick, nobody that I know is sick. I'm not a smoker, I have normal blood pressure, I'm not 70 years old. My parents are in their 80s and they are not worried, My dad is a retired Pharmacist too. He isn't buying into the hype because he isn't swayed by false stats and doomsayers.
For some, a life indoors seems to suit them just fine. That is not the case for most others outside of this forum.

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: Jjs72D] #2761773
04/09/20 12:36 AM
04/09/20 12:36 AM
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Romeo MI
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So you wont stay inside like order to .. you would prefer to go out and infect others even tho you
feel fine
wave

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: Jjs72D] #2761774
04/09/20 12:51 AM
04/09/20 12:51 AM
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Jefferson State
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That's laughable. Many people live pretty much social distanced day in and day out. My day consisted of shop work in the morning, then after 11 am lunch, garden, red diesel run for tractors and heating, mowing lawns until 6 with a walk behind until 6pm.
Note the numbers in my post, and compare them to 1918. I can't imagine they had good distribution of information back then or a good understanding of virus life cycle. I also imagine it mutated and perhaps re-infection occurred. I've walked through historic cemetery's, it is mind boggling to see entire family plots filled in 1, 2 or 3 years with people of all ages.
There is a good chance the toll would be incomprehensible (and include my and your family and friends) should no shut down have occurred.
IIrc, any self employed can continue their work with their family members in their facilities. Problem is most people have become dependent on other people to give them a livelihood. Here many businesses are deemed essential and almost all are looking for employees. It's a little unsettling but low odds of getting the virus here as there are few (3) infected. I see the county where Phoenix lies has 1,559 coronavirus cases with 37 deaths (in 4.5m? people) w/o sheltering wouldn't that number be much bigger?

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: MR_P_BODY] #2761776
04/09/20 01:00 AM
04/09/20 01:00 AM
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 1,235
Phoenix, AZ
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Originally Posted by MR_P_BODY
So you wont stay inside like order to .. you would prefer to go out and infect others even tho you
feel fine
wave


You can't infect people if YOU are not infected. How long do you think an infection hangs around waiting to show itself? I've been working from home for over three weeks and my health has not changed at all, same with the Wife.

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: Jjs72D] #2761778
04/09/20 01:07 AM
04/09/20 01:07 AM
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Jefferson State
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I would take that as a blessing. Testing many, many people is an alternative to Social Distancing. For whatever reason Testing is just now gaining steam.

Quote From the Los Angles Times today:

"The country first fell behind when a test designed by scientists at the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention was found in early February to be flawed. Federal officials then prevented universities, hospitals, companies and local public health labs from designing their own alternative tests. Those rules, set by the Food and Drug Administration, stayed in place until frustration boiled over and officials began to reverse them on Feb. 29."

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: srt] #2761779
04/09/20 01:25 AM
04/09/20 01:25 AM
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Romeo MI
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I'm glad you find this humorous.. where I live there's 20k cases and 1000 dead and still on the rise..
I'm in my shop every day working on my stuff and I'd love to be out in my hot rod but
I'm still at home.. I guess I will just wait
wave

Last edited by MR_P_BODY; 04/09/20 01:26 AM.
Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: 360view] #2761796
04/09/20 08:11 AM
04/09/20 08:11 AM
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USA
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The original idea of
“Shelter in place”
Was to reduce the peak number of infected people, or
“Flatten the curve”
So that the hospitals would not run out of ventilators for the sickest of the sick, which assumes that ventilators would “save” large numbers of people.

Now we know that 90% put on ventilators still die, just after 10 to 20 days of “near torture”.

Now we also suspect that there may be better survival just with oxygen or a C-Pap style mask.

So should we continue to “shelter in place” and “social distancing ?

To me the only reason is
“waiting for the discovery of a combination of drugs that REALLY helps the most critically ill not die.

This also includes getting those newly discovered drugs to each hospital.

If we are unlucky and do not discover those drug combinations soon,
we ought to let the young go back to work
and tell just the old to shelter in place voluntarily.

I am not against letting the old “just take their chances” on dying.

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: 360view] #2761801
04/09/20 08:41 AM
04/09/20 08:41 AM
Joined: Jan 2005
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Crook County, ILL
Mastershake340 Offline
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I found this interview with 2 health experts and a famous economist to be very interesting. It’s 1-1/2 hours so not a quick view, but interesting and enlightening perspectives if you have the time
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=A7GtUE5sx-Y
From my personal experience I can already see the strain on people I know after only a month. On a teleconference yesterday and other interactions I can tell one of the guys in my team is starting to lose it. And another was definitely under some duress.
My back is already hurting me from sitting in an inadequate chair 8+ hours a day. I dragged a kitchen chair upstairs and put some pillows on it to help, and it’s the best I’m going to get, but wish I was back in my ergonomic chair at the office.
At some point soon, a plan needs to be made to get life somewhat back to normal, indefinite lock up is not realistic.

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: 360view] #2761805
04/09/20 08:46 AM
04/09/20 08:46 AM
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Western Md.
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Not quite sure where I stand on this...On one hand I've been sheltering in place and doing what was recommended for 29 days...

On the other hand I tend to think that those who have contracted Covid 19 and survived may have developed antibodies that will help them through future disease's...

I don't get sick...I've never had a flu vaccination...I don't catch "colds"...I take no medicine for anything...Never have...

I have manageable allergies in the spring and fall that require no medication...Outside of the occasional Advil after a long day of hard work I take no pills...

I've done what was asked due to those around me that may not be as fortunate...but it's getting old...

I have worked from home for about 4 years so nothing there has changed...Used to run the news and TV in the background but not anymore.

The only trips "out" have been to the market and to Lowe's for materials to work on the house and yard...

The only two things I have found that actually "help" get through this is to turn off the TV and go outside and work on something...

None of the rest of it matters at that point...


...FAFO...
Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: 360view] #2761820
04/09/20 09:36 AM
04/09/20 09:36 AM
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USA
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Trial of IV Zinc

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2020-04-world-first-trial-benefit-intravenous-zinc.html

Sample quote

Dr. Patel said studies have shown that zinc is very effective at slowing the rate that similar viruses such as SARS (Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome) and common cold (a type of coronavirus) replicate in the body.

"Our published studies have also shown that high doses of zinc can protect vital organs such as the heart, kidneys and liver against the damage caused by a lack of oxygen," Dr. Patel said.

The clinical trial has been fast-tracked to test whether receiving a daily injection of zinc chloride will benefit patients with coronavirus.

End quote

I used the over the counter zinc nasal spray “snot” Zicam for colds and thought it helped.
It was taken off the market when a small percentage of users temporarily lost their sense of smell.

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/31388177/...cause-loss-smell-fda-warns/#.Xo8lSC8pChA

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: 360view] #2761821
04/09/20 09:37 AM
04/09/20 09:37 AM
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Omega 3 fish oil also aids organs in low oxygen levels.

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: Mastershake340] #2761824
04/09/20 10:01 AM
04/09/20 10:01 AM
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in a cattle trailer down by th...
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in a cattle trailer down by th...
You know you could order a chair online and have it shipped to your house. No need to suffer with a crappy chair.


"Follow me the wise man said, but he walked behind"


'92 D250 Club Cab CTD, 47RH conversion, pump tweaks, injectors, rear disc and hydroboost conversion.
'74 W200 Crew Cab 360, NV4500, D44, D60 and NP205 divorced transfer case. Rear disc and hydroboost coming soon!
2019 1500 Long Horn Crew Cab 4WD, 5.7 Hemi.
Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: not_a_charger] #2761826
04/09/20 10:05 AM
04/09/20 10:05 AM

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Originally Posted by not_a_charger

And here's an example of COVID-19 driven LEO overreach by local cops, and against a former State Trooper, no less.


I think the cops were technically right at the beginning of this stupidity. The state parks around me are closed, this park was likely posted because it was clearly empty. Depends on the state as many of them specifically allow outdoor exorcise under the stay at home order. I think the cops were also clearly bored out of their mind as 3 cops in 2 cruisers responded.

I also think "over reach" is an under statement. 3 cops can't eject one adult and one child from a park? Toss him the cruiser for declining to show his papers? Maybe radio the supervisor before doing that instead of after? Is it really that hard for the cops to be happy they don't have actual crimes to deal with?

Moving on to a couple life after c-19 musings:

Post 911 airport security changed big time and many of those changes filtered down to government buildings. Some of it clearly beyond what a typical person would consider likely. I mean does the carry on luggage scanner actually have the ability to detect explosives in my shoes? Makes me wonder what sort of medical screening will become common place at TSA check points.

I've long been an advocate of work at home, aka telecommuting, in part because I did it for many years. Maybe this event will be a wake up call to the way companies do business now that they've been forced to foray in to it. Office buildings are a necessity when all you've got is typewriters, pneumatic message tubes and flip chart presentations. In the age of email, power point, webinars and video conferencing not so much. I have no doubt that there are large number of people in their underwear doing the exact same thing they were doing in their office and embracing not sitting in traffic for an hour to do it.

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: skicker] #2761828
04/09/20 10:15 AM
04/09/20 10:15 AM
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Spahn Ranch
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I guess it's somewhat understandable how some people living outside the areas that have been hardest hit can be skeptical of all the COVID-19 hysteria. Maybe this animated graph below will help put things into perspective for those that can't see why this is such a big deal. Look how fast our numbers rose from the second week of March until now. eek

Animated timeline graph of COVID-19 cases by country

The undeniable fact is the number of cases we have now dwarfs those in other countries including China by exponentially large margins. Our new infection and death rates continue to rise daily at an unchecked rate.

And it's no longer just cities that are taking the brunt of the epidemic as our rural areas are starting to see a sharp rise in cases. Many of those smaller hospitals are not equipped to handle an outbreak like this so it's probably going to start looking real bad in some outlying areas should people keep ignoring the warnings to stay home.

Perhaps the thing to be aware of is that despite having almost half a million confirmed cases of the virus and a resultant death toll that literally doubles every day we currently still have no nationally coordinated response to the outbreak. You may not think we need one but one can argue that's part of the reason we are in the position we are right now. We are certainly capable of doing whatever would be necessary to turn things around but for whatever reason it hasn't happened. Take that for what it's worth.

The standard argument is that we are not a country like China that is 'governed' a harsh, communist regime whose leaders control the population like puppets. However, acting in a singular-minded way they were able to mitigate the spread of the virus effectively. Not so much here. We foolishly continue to doubt the severity of the pandemic, deny scientific facts and blame anyone else but ourselves. shruggy


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Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: RMCHRGR] #2761831
04/09/20 10:27 AM
04/09/20 10:27 AM
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Jefferson State
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Great! We're the top of the heap. Wrong heap.

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: RMCHRGR] #2761844
04/09/20 11:06 AM
04/09/20 11:06 AM
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USA
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According to the intelligence agency in Taiwan, COVID cases on the mainland are at least three times higher than official reports.

USA spy network in mainland China was nearly wiped out a few years ago.
There is an eye opening Wall Street Journal article on it. Iran is involved in this.

More than 17 years ago Taiwan spies showed CIA detailed plans of all of USA nuclear warhead designs and said they had got them from their spy work in mainland China.

Re: The official Coronavirus thread [Re: 360view] #2761860
04/09/20 11:25 AM
04/09/20 11:25 AM
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USA
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