Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 2 of 2 1 2
Re: Installing the Borgeson/Bergman kit. With pics! [Re: Fasbird] #2689076
08/18/19 01:15 PM
08/18/19 01:15 PM
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 350
Mequon, WI
G
gzig5 Offline
enthusiast
gzig5  Offline
enthusiast
G

Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 350
Mequon, WI
Originally Posted by Fasbird
When I worked as a wrench for Dodge, we sometimes would get different type of feedback noises off pressure hoses, whether it was A/C or P/S. The fix from Ma Chrysler was to put a 2-piece counter weight on the hose to change the dynamics. Maybe you can try a weight like the ones they have for kitchen faucet hoses that pull the hose back into place? Bolt it around the P/S pressure hose. Worth a try to unbolt from the sink to try it out, eh?

.


That's a good idea and very easy to try. The same concept could work if the harmonic is exciting a resonant frequency in the steering column by clamping a weight on the steering shaft. Works like a resonator in an exhaust system does to change the natural harmonic frequency of the system.

Re: Installing the Borgeson/Bergman kit. With pics! [Re: Fasbird] #2689122
08/18/19 04:30 PM
08/18/19 04:30 PM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,161
Los Angeles, CA
JF_Moparts Offline OP
super stock
JF_Moparts  Offline OP
super stock

Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,161
Los Angeles, CA
Originally Posted by Fasbird
When I worked as a wrench for Dodge, we sometimes would get different type of feedback noises off pressure hoses, whether it was A/C or P/S. The fix from Ma Chrysler was to put a 2-piece counter weight on the hose to change the dynamics. Maybe you can try a weight like the ones they have for kitchen faucet hoses that pull the hose back into place? Bolt it around the P/S pressure hose. Worth a try to unbolt from the sink to try it out, eh?

.


Yep, I'm gonna try something like this.

Re: Installing the Borgeson/Bergman kit. With pics! [Re: JF_Moparts] #2689134
08/18/19 05:27 PM
08/18/19 05:27 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,586
Tampa, FL
tpabayflyer Offline
pro stock
tpabayflyer  Offline
pro stock

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,586
Tampa, FL
Well this is sure an interesting thread! I was planning on getting the Borgeson box so I am
watching this closely to see how this plays out..... that sound is very annoying and not something I could live with
With my restoration......


71 Challenger 528 Hemi project
09 Gr Cherokee 5.7 hemi in da house!!
Re: Installing the Borgeson/Bergman kit. With pics! [Re: tpabayflyer] #2689248
08/18/19 11:14 PM
08/18/19 11:14 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 18,493
Granite Bay CA
Kern Dog Offline
Striving for excellence
Kern Dog  Offline
Striving for excellence

Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 18,493
Granite Bay CA
A "restoration" wouldn't have a non factory steering box in it.

Re: Installing the Borgeson/Bergman kit. With pics! [Re: Kern Dog] #2692672
08/29/19 05:22 PM
08/29/19 05:22 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,586
Tampa, FL
tpabayflyer Offline
pro stock
tpabayflyer  Offline
pro stock

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,586
Tampa, FL
Uh... ok...... how about “Restomod”? Are we good now? Now back to our thread....... I have noticed that some of the stock power steering hoses are Quite large in diameter and maybe this has a quieting or damping effect? I may run this issue by Amazon Hose and rubber here in Tampa and see if they know what the deal is....... TBF


71 Challenger 528 Hemi project
09 Gr Cherokee 5.7 hemi in da house!!
Re: Installing the Borgeson/Bergman kit. With pics! [Re: tpabayflyer] #2692675
08/29/19 05:35 PM
08/29/19 05:35 PM
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 6,175
nowhere
S
Sniper Offline
master
Sniper  Offline
master
S

Joined: May 2019
Posts: 6,175
nowhere
Larger hose is usually the return, low pressure high volume.

Re: Installing the Borgeson/Bergman kit. With pics! [Re: gzig5] #2750993
03/11/20 12:58 PM
03/11/20 12:58 PM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 936
O
OLD318 Offline
super stock
OLD318  Offline
super stock
O

Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 936
Originally Posted by gzig5
That hiss is disappointing. I was very interested in it until I saw the reports of the noise. I can't see spending that amount and having to live with that noise. I thought Bergman said that they fixed that issue?


WRONG!

This is just a personal opinion having attempted to deal with this... and ultimately failed!
I believe the hiss is caused by the design of the coupling.
Its metal to metal where it connects to the spline on the box
I don't believe the use of the setscrew helps this either.

If you don't buy this theory,
WIth the car idling in Neutral, put your stethoscope right on the end of the coupling past the set screw but not on the box...
You'll hear the same sound you hear in your passenger compartment just amplified...

This is just my opinion (I showed to several engineering friends of mine)
Their opinion was unanimous....
The coupler, while well meaning is a hack.

Yes, it "fits" but…. I personally feel it needs to be re-engineered to muffle out the sound where it connects to the spline
and it should use a roll pin just like factory....

WARNING: Don't buy his pump expecting it to fix anything.. it doesn't.
He's basically offering it as a try and see... (think about that for a second)
(in reality this entire setup is a try and see!)

If you switch to his pump pay very close attention to your mounting brackets..
If you have the 70-71 oval pump your brackets will NOT fit the newer style pump (although the look like they do!)
and everyone and his brother tells you they interchange....True, bolt holes all line up and as a result
the brackets bolt right up but watch the clearance on the front big bracket
to the housing of the pump...it will interfere when you tighten it completely down....

You will only discover this after you've removed your pump,
bought his, bolted it all together and then bam... you can't use it!

He may try to sell you a new bracket to mount your pump with....
Then you will discover (the hard way) two things

1) that the return outlet is larger than the stock outlet and in a different place.
So you will have to get a larger diameter return hose than your stock..
Hint: if you have a stock PS pump and return hose your stock clamps wont work either

2) The location of the return outlet is different on his pump vs your stock pump
so your return hose will not be in the same location
This will rear its ugly head only AFTER you bolt the new pump in and try to tighten the belt...

My recommendation... if it's hissing in your passenger compartment.
Remove everything, return it immediately, and get [ball][/b] of your money back.
Don't settle for this...

Again this is a personal opinion based on painful experience with this setup.
Rightly or wrongly this is NOT an engineered system for a MOPAR
It is a collection of parts that "fit"
It well meaning and well intentioned
and I deeply appreciate Mr. Bergman for attempting to address
what I think is absolutely the worst thing about old Mopars (the pinky power steering)

I give him further kudos as he did STAND behind his warranty
and did not hide behind it like so many other parts people do...

But... for the $$$$ I said forget it...
I say that with the utmost disappointment.. Because I personally wanted this to work BAD!!!!!
I did everything I could. ….

Hope this helps





a

Last edited by OLD318; 05/06/20 11:46 AM.
Re: Installing the Borgeson/Bergman kit. With pics! [Re: OLD318] #2751150
03/12/20 06:19 AM
03/12/20 06:19 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 17,916
Akron, Ohio
ProSport Offline
I Live Here
ProSport  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 17,916
Akron, Ohio
I have a different setup, but for what it's worth, I just converted my '70 Challenger to a coilover front suspension with a power steering rack and a GM Type2 power steering pump. When steering back and forth in the garage my steering column had an annoying vibration along with that hissing sound. Turns out the pump was making slightly too much pressure for the Ford style rack.
I installed a power steering pressure regulator inline with the feed and return lines(the excess fluid goes right into the return line so no extra heat is added to the pump) and now my steering is silent and I can adjust the feel of the system to my liking around town and on the highway.
I have no idea if this will help you or not but it's a thought.

The regulator is Heidt's part number PS-101 and all my lines are 6an. I also ran the return line through a small fluid cooler. It was installed from the beginning, before the regulator was added.


1970 Challenger, all aluminum 528 Hemi, HDK suspension, Tremec 5 speed manual
Re: Installing the Borgeson/Bergman kit. With pics! [Re: ProSport] #2895917
03/05/21 02:14 AM
03/05/21 02:14 AM
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 153
Missouri
70X Offline
member
70X  Offline
member

Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 153
Missouri
Does anyone know if the hissing problem has been fixed? Just seen about these boxes but don't think I can handle the hissing sound.

Re: Installing the Borgeson/Bergman kit. With pics! [Re: 70X] #2896129
03/05/21 04:29 PM
03/05/21 04:29 PM
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 6,175
nowhere
S
Sniper Offline
master
Sniper  Offline
master
S

Joined: May 2019
Posts: 6,175
nowhere
Originally Posted by 70X
Does anyone know if the hissing problem has been fixed? Just seen about these boxes but don't think I can handle the hissing sound.


Read the post directly above yours

Re: Installing the Borgeson/Bergman kit. With pics! [Re: Sniper] #2897192
03/08/21 06:56 PM
03/08/21 06:56 PM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,009
Howell, Michigan
H
Hemidavey Offline
super stock
Hemidavey  Offline
super stock
H

Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,009
Howell, Michigan
We had the same problem after converting a Ford Falcon using the Borgesson kit. Steering was nice but the noise is loud! Borgesson admitted there was a problem and offered NO solution or refund. Basically told us too bad! They really don't care!

Re: Installing the Borgeson/Bergman kit. With pics! [Re: Hemidavey] #2899383
03/15/21 02:47 PM
03/15/21 02:47 PM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 936
O
OLD318 Offline
super stock
OLD318  Offline
super stock
O

Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 936
I hear and feel your frustration... I've been there.
But they do have a warranty and they stood behind it when I had my issues..(which are identical to yours)
You should remind them of that and ask nicely for a full refund...

Re: Installing the Borgeson/Bergman kit. With pics! [Re: OLD318] #2899538
03/15/21 11:17 PM
03/15/21 11:17 PM
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 232
Alberta Canada
PossessedDuster Offline
enthusiast
PossessedDuster  Offline
enthusiast

Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 232
Alberta Canada
I fought with Borgeson about my box as well for the hissing. I went back and forth they blamed Bergman's coupler for the noise as their coupler has some rubber/RTV in it that they claim solves this. Obviously Bergman autocraft called this B.S when I showed him the response I got.

In the end Bergman got Borgeson to take the box back for warranty. They "repaired" it but didn't detail as to what. I haven't been out with the car yet but from driveway tests it seems to be solved so far.

Re: Installing the Borgeson/Bergman kit. With pics! [Re: Kern Dog] #2901943
03/23/21 10:42 AM
03/23/21 10:42 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,444
So Cal
autoxcuda Offline
Too Many Posts
autoxcuda  Offline
Too Many Posts

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,444
So Cal
Originally Posted by Frankenduster
Thank you for the report. I see that you have the TRW pump. I wonder how it compares to a Saginaw pump?
I thought I recall reading that the Saginaw pumps used in V8 cars made over 1150 psi while the slant six versions were around 850 ?
I want to do this swap as well but if/when I do, I'm planning on going back to the standard ratio idler and Pitman arms. I too have a Firm Feel Stage 3 with the Fast Ratio arms.


That’s a Saginaw pump. Early style with oval can.

Page 2 of 2 1 2






Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1