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Race timing #2741353
02/09/20 08:05 PM
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RustyM Offline OP
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Msd dist/ 511/ carb - run the fast springs for timing all in early or lock out the dist. - race only car.
Thanks

Re: Race timing [Re: RustyM] #2741391
02/09/20 09:28 PM
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Race only, I'd say lock it out and forget it. If all you're concerned with is wot, locked out seems like the ticket to me.


1966 Satellie.. 12.55 @107.75. 906 heads. 3780 lbs.
Re: Race timing [Re: RustyM] #2741401
02/09/20 09:51 PM
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Originally Posted by RustyM
Msd dist/ 511/ carb - run the fast springs for timing all in early or lock out the dist. - race only car.
Thanks


If you lock it out and your box retards with RPM you'll be losing power from retarded timing with RPM.


Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
Re: Race timing [Re: RustyM] #2741410
02/09/20 10:13 PM
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I use the weakest springs and the black stop in all my motors, race or street up


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: Race timing [Re: Cab_Burge] #2741432
02/09/20 11:03 PM
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msd has a kit for locking out!

Re: Race timing [Re: madscientist] #2741538
02/10/20 12:32 PM
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RustyM Offline OP
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I've read some articles on the timing retard issues, not sure which boxes do it though- this one is a msd 6al.

Last edited by RustyM; 02/10/20 12:34 PM.
Re: Race timing [Re: dart9ss] #2741578
02/10/20 02:46 PM
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If you don't have a separate starter switch to spin the motor over before turning on the ignition or a ECIU that won't allow the coil to fire until the crankshaft has spun over several times before firing the plugs good luck on getting any motor started that has a lock out distributor with more than 24 degrees total timing scope


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: Race timing [Re: RustyM] #2741582
02/10/20 02:49 PM
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I remember hearing that at a Mopar drag racing seminar that retarding the timing 4 degrees in high gear would help the car go faster and quicker, I've never had the parts needed to do that shruggy
Maybe with the MSD grid I can do some testing with that to find out wrench luck


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: Race timing [Re: madscientist] #2741584
02/10/20 03:09 PM
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Yep called slew rate and mine looses about 1 degree every 1000 rpm's towards max...........


72 Dart 470 n/a BB stroker street car `THUMPER`...Check me out on FB Dominic Thumper for videos and lots of carb pics......760-900-3895.....
Re: Race timing [Re: Cab_Burge] #2741585
02/10/20 03:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Cab_Burge
I remember hearing that at a Mopar drag racing seminar that retarding the timing 4 degrees in high gear would help the car go faster and quicker, I've never had the parts needed to do that shruggy
Maybe with the MSD grid I can do some testing with that to find out wrench luck


I know it works with good quench and 67 heads, and even better with nitrous... Back in the no money days we would stack 2 cheater plates and pull 7 degrees out, car hauled A in high gear. Hitting the timing retard was like another bottle.

Re: Race timing [Re: Thumperdart] #2741597
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Originally Posted by Thumperdart
Yep called slew rate and mine looses about 1 degree every 1000 rpm's towards max...........


Which box are you using Dom?


Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
Re: Race timing [Re: RustyM] #2741603
02/10/20 03:47 PM
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I have done them both ways, not much difference IMO. My cuda has it locked out w/ a crank trigger. No start retard, cranks fine at 34°. It's an 11:1 compression 575" hemi.
My road runner has the lightest springs and is set at 38°. It cranks w/ less than 38°, but as soon as it fires...it's at 38°. Ran it for years w/ a 14:1 446" wedge and locked out timing.
Never really had any starting issues, but I have big cables and high torque mini starters on both cars.


CHIP
'70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60
'69 road runner, 440-6, 18 spline 4 speed, Dana 60
'71 Demon, 340, low gear 904, 8.75
'73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75
'90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt
'06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
Re: Race timing [Re: madscientist] #2741606
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OLD 6200 MSD 6 series w/no chip...........


72 Dart 470 n/a BB stroker street car `THUMPER`...Check me out on FB Dominic Thumper for videos and lots of carb pics......760-900-3895.....
Re: Race timing [Re: Thumperdart] #2741620
02/10/20 04:26 PM
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Big cam = lock it out. Sooo much better idle quality and response. Nice clean idle in gear @ 800RPM. It's a PIA chasing the adjustments with the timing moving around when it has a 15* curve and it's all in at 1500. If it's all in at 1500, why not just lock it and have the clean idle. Any retard needed, do it electronically.


If the results don't match the theory, change the theory.
Re: Race timing [Re: Thumperdart] #2741628
02/10/20 04:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Thumperdart
OLD 6200 MSD 6 series w/no chip...........



Thanks for the info Dom.


Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
Re: Race timing [Re: Cab_Burge] #2742007
02/11/20 04:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Cab_Burge
If you don't have a separate starter switch to spin the motor over before turning on the ignition or a ECIU that won't allow the coil to fire until the crankshaft has spun over several times before firing the plugs good luck on getting any motor started that has a lock out distributor with more than 24 degrees total timing scope


Mine starts at 34 degrees no issue, 15-1, ignition on. Actually starts better with ignition on. 1 revolution and it's running. No crank, crank, crank.

Last edited by dvw; 02/11/20 09:45 PM.
Re: Race timing [Re: dvw] #2742068
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Does your ECU allow the motor to spin over before allowing the ignition to fire the plugs?


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: Race timing [Re: CMcAllister] #2742084
02/11/20 09:07 PM
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Originally Posted by CMcAllister
Big cam = lock it out. Sooo much better idle quality and response. Nice clean idle in gear @ 800RPM. It's a PIA chasing the adjustments with the timing moving around when it has a 15* curve and it's all in at 1500. If it's all in at 1500, why not just lock it and have the clean idle. Any retard needed, do it electronically.


Interesting thread , mine is locked out as well, MSD digital 6 box has a start retard built into the box, zero issues.

Im curious, what MSD electronics would hook up to the MSD digital 6 box w/ crank trigger to enable electronic timing control from inside the car?

Re: Race timing [Re: RustyM] #2742115
02/11/20 10:51 PM
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This is another good reason to switch over to EFI. A Holley Sniper comes out of the box with start retard, high speed retard (or advance if you want), adjustable timing curve or locked timing, etc. Whatever you want to do with the timing curve you can. Even change timing based on air temp or engine temp. And you get built in data logging. With a MSD distributor you have to keep adding boxes or pills or modules to do everything.

Re: Race timing [Re: AndyF] #2742132
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We are hoping to use one on an upcoming build and i'm excited about the tuning possibilities .
On these class/index cars that don't allow them,,, well, gotta do it the old fashioned way- grin.

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