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Re: Cluster Gear
[Re: 70sixpkrt]
#2731098
01/08/20 02:15 PM
01/08/20 02:15 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 25,726
Rio Linda, CA
John_Kunkel
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 25,726
Rio Linda, CA
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"Metal spalling is a process of metallic surface failure in which the metal is broken down into small flakes (spalls) from a larger solid body. This process occurs for many reasons, such as when another material impacts it at a high speed resulting in chipping the material, or due to corrosion, weathering, cavitation or excessive rolling pressure."
The INTERNET, the MISinformation superhighway
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Re: Cluster Gear
[Re: John_Kunkel]
#2731124
01/08/20 03:09 PM
01/08/20 03:09 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,679
South San Francisco, Ca
70sixpkrt
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,679
South San Francisco, Ca
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"Metal spalling is a process of metallic surface failure in which the metal is broken down into small flakes (spalls) from a larger solid body. This process occurs for many reasons, such as when another material impacts it at a high speed resulting in chipping the material, or due to corrosion, weathering, cavitation or excessive rolling pressure." Can you please put that in layman's language? Are you saying normal wear and tear since I used to race and bang the gears?
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Re: Cluster Gear
[Re: 70sixpkrt]
#2731129
01/08/20 03:26 PM
01/08/20 03:26 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,711
Moved to N.E. Tennessee
GomangoCuda
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,711
Moved to N.E. Tennessee
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"Metal spalling is a process of metallic surface failure in which the metal is broken down into small flakes (spalls) from a larger solid body. This process occurs for many reasons, such as when another material impacts it at a high speed resulting in chipping the material, or due to corrosion, weathering, cavitation or excessive rolling pressure." Can you please put that in layman's language? Are you saying normal wear and tear since I used to race and bang the gears? It's broke
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice, there is.
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Re: Cluster Gear
[Re: 70sixpkrt]
#2731138
01/08/20 03:56 PM
01/08/20 03:56 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,097
Bend,OR USA
Cab_Burge
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,097
Bend,OR USA
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It's worn out  Not unusual if it was ran low on lube or had sit a long time  I've seen that on the tip of a output shaft, I ended up having a old time aircraft machinest weld it up with stelite rod and turn it back down to size and ran it Not sure if that is the solution for that gear or not, probably not 
Last edited by Cab_Burge; 01/08/20 03:57 PM.
Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
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Re: Cluster Gear
[Re: GomangoCuda]
#2731286
01/08/20 11:10 PM
01/08/20 11:10 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,679
South San Francisco, Ca
70sixpkrt
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,679
South San Francisco, Ca
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I think if it was mine I would call Brewers and ask if anyone has a sleave to repair that. Already did. No. Brewers and Passon Perf doesn't have any. I'm looking for a new one and nobody has any.
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Re: Cluster Gear
[Re: 70sixpkrt]
#2731304
01/09/20 01:56 AM
01/09/20 01:56 AM
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,264
New York, USA
Chargerfan68
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,264
New York, USA
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I think if it was mine I would call Brewers and ask if anyone has a sleave to repair that. Already did. No. Brewers and Passon Perf doesn't have any. I'm looking for a new one and nobody has any. Try Brian at SK speed in Lindenhurst, NY. You might be very surprised. 
1.50 60Ft. , 10.75@ 127MPH Hauling 3900 LBS.
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Re: Cluster Gear
[Re: GomangoCuda]
#2731334
01/09/20 08:55 AM
01/09/20 08:55 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,137
East Aurora (Buffalo) NY
RoadRunner
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,137
East Aurora (Buffalo) NY
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I think if it was mine I would call Brewers and ask if anyone has a sleave to repair that. You may have to go to a precision machine shop in your area to look at it. I wonder if you could take a cut out in the bearing to remove the damage and go with slightly larger rolling elements. I'd worry about a sleeve on the inside as it may weaken the tube some. Though looking at the pictures, there is a lot of meat there. So a sleeve properly installed could work. But I think that repair is beyond most automotive restoration and machine shops. I think you are into high end industrial repair shops. Hopefully the cost doesn't outweigh the replacement.
68 Road Runner (383/4speed, post car w/decor pkg) - Major Project
69 Road Runner w/472 Hemi & 4 speed.
70 Challenger R/T SE EF8 w/ V9J, U - A32 - Major Project
2023 Ford Mach 1
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Re: Cluster Gear
[Re: Chargerfan68]
#2731363
01/09/20 10:39 AM
01/09/20 10:39 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,679
South San Francisco, Ca
70sixpkrt
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,679
South San Francisco, Ca
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I think if it was mine I would call Brewers and ask if anyone has a sleave to repair that. Already did. No. Brewers and Passon Perf doesn't have any. I'm looking for a new one and nobody has any. Try Brian at SK speed in Lindenhurst, NY. You might be very surprised. Will call. Thanks. No dice on SK speed. Brian is a lot of knowledge. He said to put it back together until I find one. There were no problems except for a little popping out of first gear. That's not related to the cluster gear.
Last edited by 70sixpkRT; 01/09/20 12:31 PM.
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Re: Cluster Gear
[Re: 70sixpkrt]
#2731425
01/09/20 02:03 PM
01/09/20 02:03 PM
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,264
New York, USA
Chargerfan68
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,264
New York, USA
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I think if it was mine I would call Brewers and ask if anyone has a sleave to repair that. Already did. No. Brewers and Passon Perf doesn't have any. I'm looking for a new one and nobody has any. Try Brian at SK speed in Lindenhurst, NY. You might be very surprised. Will call. Thanks. No dice on SK speed. Brian is a lot of knowledge. He said to put it back together until I find one. There were no problems except for a little popping out of first gear. That's not related to the cluster gear. Well, it was worth a shot. I got a bunch of Nos 833 stuff from him over the years and his collection was staggering. The popping out of gear is most likely angle worn dog teeth on the gear, as he probably told you. Did you ask if he had an nos 1 st gear?
1.50 60Ft. , 10.75@ 127MPH Hauling 3900 LBS.
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Re: Cluster Gear
[Re: Stanton]
#2731430
01/09/20 02:11 PM
01/09/20 02:11 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,097
Bend,OR USA
Cab_Burge
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,097
Bend,OR USA
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Here's a thought ... install a bronze bushing in there (just that one location - not the whole cluster) and run thinner lube in the trans. No way in the world would I even think of putting needle bearings in the cluster gear against a bronze bushing, no way  I don't know what exactly the heat treat is on those gears and the other gears in the NP833 but I'll bet they are really hard, same thing on the needles bearings and roller bearings I would look into seeing if there is a material good enough to make a repair insert( that would have to be press in with the proper interference fit to keep it from spinning when hot) in it though  OP, your pursuing the best bet,, a new NOS gear  What does the cluster gear shaft look like on that end?
Last edited by Cab_Burge; 01/09/20 02:12 PM.
Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
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Re: Cluster Gear
[Re: Cab_Burge]
#2731442
01/09/20 02:28 PM
01/09/20 02:28 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 25,726
Rio Linda, CA
John_Kunkel
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 25,726
Rio Linda, CA
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I think a bronze bushing is the most practical solution, not needle bearings on the bronze bushing but a bushing directly on the shaft. The gears are case hardened so boring the gear would involve grinding rather than boring with a tool bit.
The INTERNET, the MISinformation superhighway
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Re: Cluster Gear
[Re: John_Kunkel]
#2731452
01/09/20 02:44 PM
01/09/20 02:44 PM
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,853
Ontario, Canada
Stanton
Don't question me!
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Don't question me!
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,853
Ontario, Canada
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No way in the world would I even think of putting needle bearings in the cluster gear against a bronze bushing, no way WHERE did I say anything about needle bearings ?!?!? Install a bronze bushing in that one location INSTEAD OF needle bearings - it saves the cluster at least !!
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Re: Cluster Gear
[Re: Cab_Burge]
#2731464
01/09/20 03:16 PM
01/09/20 03:16 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,679
South San Francisco, Ca
70sixpkrt
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,679
South San Francisco, Ca
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Here's a thought ... install a bronze bushing in there (just that one location - not the whole cluster) and run thinner lube in the trans. No way in the world would I even think of putting needle bearings in the cluster gear against a bronze bushing, no way I don't know what exactly the heat treat is on those gears and the other gears in the NP833 but I'll bet they are really hard, same thing on the needles bearings and roller bearings I would look into seeing if there is a material good enough to make a repair insert( that would have to be press in with the proper interference fit to keep it from spinning when hot) in it though OP, your pursuing the best bet,, a new NOS gear What does the cluster gear shaft look like on that end? The gear shaft does not too bad. Just some wear. I ordered a new shaft anyway. The tranny has a new 1st, 2nd, and 3rd gear in it already from my last rebuilt 15 years ago. They look excellent. He said the popping/sliding out of 1st is probably something else. I also have a new 1-2 hub assembly. It's going to be put back together with the new shaft and 1-2 hub assembly and wait until I find a cluster gear.
Last edited by 70sixpkRT; 01/09/20 03:23 PM.
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