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Re: Need some opinions on which torque converter [Re: gregsdart] #2709418
10/23/19 09:40 AM
10/23/19 09:40 AM
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So. Burlington, Vt.
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fast68plymouth Offline
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Quote
PS forgot that these numbers were with the Dyno's 1-3/4" test headers, went to put our 2" headers on and ran into fitment problems with the dyno
so that may account for choking the engine somewhat.


The 1-3/4” header did two things.
It boosted the low end TQ substantially, and killed off a fair amount of top end power....... compared to something like a header with 2” primary tubes and 3.5” collectors.
If you’re going to run 2” headers in the car........ you won’t have that 620tq@2800.


68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123
Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
Re: Need some opinions on which torque converter [Re: gregsdart] #2709419
10/23/19 09:42 AM
10/23/19 09:42 AM
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Ohio
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jlatessa Offline OP
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Thanks Greg, I am leaning towards that solution after listening to the various advice.
We have that convertor behind our 70 Charger and are very pleased with it (a stock one).

The 446 in the Dodge has a purple 484 in it which although we are pleased with the performance,
465 HP, six pack, 10.25 CR, it is a very rough and tumble low RPM engine because of all
the overlap on that cam.

I think the 505 will have better low RPM manners and with that amount of torque
and 99% street driving, I think we'll do OK with an 11" that has good innards and a plate.

Thanks all, and I'm still listening...….

Joe

Re: Need some opinions on which torque converter [Re: fast68plymouth] #2709422
10/23/19 09:46 AM
10/23/19 09:46 AM
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jlatessa Offline OP
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Yes Fast, I realize that, and a 2", 3-1/2" header is what's going on it.

You smart guys sure complicate things and I appreciate it.

It's a balancing act , I know, that's why I'm still listening.

Joe

Re: Need some opinions on which torque converter [Re: jlatessa] #2709427
10/23/19 10:04 AM
10/23/19 10:04 AM
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So. Burlington, Vt.
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fast68plymouth Offline
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MP 484 cam....... 68* overlap @ advertised duration
20* overlap @.050

New bullet roller ....... 72.5* overlap@ advertised(.020) duration
40.5* overlap @.050


68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123
Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
Re: Need some opinions on which torque converter [Re: jlatessa] #2709434
10/23/19 10:20 AM
10/23/19 10:20 AM
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Benton, IL.
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DaveRS23 Offline
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I have fought this fight. Wanted a tight street converter for my 540 Hemi so that the tranny didn't feel like a slush box on the street. Started with PTC which has been my go-to converter builder for the last few converters and have always been happy with them. Until this last go around wanting a tight converter for a very torquey street engine. They tried twice. Flash was mid to upper 4k. Driving around was not crisp at all, just was way too spongy.

Called Lenny at UCC. First, he told me that the 9" was really too small for what I wanted, but that the 11" stuff was getting difficult to find and very expensive. I told him that I had some motor home converters laying around but he said that there were no parts for them, so...........

I sent the converter to him, he made a few adjustments and made a few suggestions on my end such as a fluid change. And it is much better now. Flash is about 4k and it is much crisper around town. Frankly, I would like it to be a bit snappier down low, but it is not bad like it is. My car likes to idle about 950 and he helped that, too.

And one last thing, check the snout on what ever converter you get. The last two that I have gotten have been a little bit too big to seat in the crank and I had to dress them down a bit. I only figured that out a few years ago after fighting converter bolts that wouldn't stay tight.

twocents


Master, again and still
Re: Need some opinions on which torque converter [Re: DaveRS23] #2709441
10/23/19 10:54 AM
10/23/19 10:54 AM
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jlatessa Offline OP
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Thanks for the heads-up on the snout , Dave.

How did you check it, by feel, bluing or measuring?

Joe

Re: Need some opinions on which torque converter [Re: DaveRS23] #2709443
10/23/19 10:57 AM
10/23/19 10:57 AM
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It's sounding more and more like an 11" converter isn't the way to go here, IMO. Perhaps a "tight" 10" that can provide reasonable stall w/o being too slushy? Wonder what Paul at Turbo Action would recommend...

Two 9.5" experiences: In my car, Dynamic (Lupo) nailed it IMO. In Mike Hynes' car (heaver, torque curve much lower, less gear, etc.) his custom-built Dynamic was a big miss. His car felt much better when he went to a bigger converter to tighten things up, and it picked up MPH on the track, too.

Re: Need some opinions on which torque converter [Re: jlatessa] #2709450
10/23/19 11:01 AM
10/23/19 11:01 AM
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Clanton Offline
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Originally Posted by jlatessa
Thanks for the heads-up on the snout , Dave.

How did you check it, by feel, bluing or measuring?

Joe

I measured from the pump drive down to the inside of the pilot then pump drive down to ring gear then ring gear to pilot outside with the vert on a counter top.I think .020 was min spec.
ps;measure from the bolt lug to the top of the pilot with a straight edge on the vert for pilot ht.[about .625"]

Last edited by Clanton; 10/23/19 11:45 AM.

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Re: Need some opinions on which torque converter [Re: BradH] #2709454
10/23/19 11:05 AM
10/23/19 11:05 AM
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jlatessa Offline OP
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Another question; "tight" meaning less span between the upper and lower lock-up specs?

So maybe for us, like 2800-3200?

Thanks, Joe

Re: Need some opinions on which torque converter [Re: Clanton] #2709458
10/23/19 11:11 AM
10/23/19 11:11 AM
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So. Burlington, Vt.
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fast68plymouth Offline
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If I were buying it, I wouldn’t really want them to try and “match” the converter to the combo.

The conversation would be more like, “make me a 10” unit as tight as possible”.


68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123
Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
Re: Need some opinions on which torque converter [Re: jlatessa] #2709460
10/23/19 11:15 AM
10/23/19 11:15 AM
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Val-haul-ass... eventually
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Originally Posted by jlatessa
Another question; "tight" meaning less span between the upper and lower lock-up specs?

So maybe for us, like 2800-3200?

Thanks, Joe

Well, it's kind of subjective. "Tight" to me means it still drives nicely on the street and responds well to part throttle below the flash stall speed. "Loose" to me means the car feels "slushy" and doesn't respond well to the throttle below the flash stall, even if it locks up well at WOT. It's a streetability thing, I suppose.... and probably a tough thing to achieve for builders of fairly high-stall street/strip converters.

Re: Need some opinions on which torque converter [Re: fast68plymouth] #2709461
10/23/19 11:16 AM
10/23/19 11:16 AM
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jlatessa Offline OP
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Thanks, Fast, I think we're getting closer here.

Joe

Re: Need some opinions on which torque converter [Re: jlatessa] #2709473
10/23/19 11:41 AM
10/23/19 11:41 AM
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FWIW, my last three converters as the car evolved:
1. Coan 11" Pro Street spec'd for about 3000 stall (pretty close in my car); only had about 4% slippage, but Coan rated it for max of 500 HP, IIRC. Worked fine when car was low-to-mid 12s, then lost its sh!t when I put in a new engine that pushed the car well into the 11s

2. J.W. 10" 3800 (they offered a 3800 and a 3400 version); flashed about 4000, but slippage was 12% and it didn't drive well on the street... very "slushy"

3. Dynamic 9.5" advertised as 4200, IIRC; flashes to about 4500 in my car and slippage is about 8%; drives much better on the street than the J.W., and picked up .2 and 2 MPH as well because it didn't slip as much

4. Dynamic sold my friend Mike on a 9.5" for his car (the one I described in my previous response) and his experience w/ it was a lot like mine w/ the J.W. He switched to something much less track-oriented and was much happier.

"You pays your money and takes your chances".

Re: Need some opinions on which torque converter [Re: BradH] #2709487
10/23/19 12:08 PM
10/23/19 12:08 PM
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Cab_Burge Offline
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I had Chris at Continental (SP?) Converter make me a street and strip 10.0 inch converter based off of the dyno sheets for my first 505 C.I. pump gas low deck stroker motor with a set of ported big valve 906 heads and a stock 440 type six pack set up , it had 9.25 to 1 compression and made 612 HP at 5500 RPM with 644 Ft. Lbs. at 4500 RPM. boogie
That converter would push the front tires through the staging lights at 2300 RPM foot stalling it in low gear(2.77 ratio), it would flash around 4400 RPM in high gear, I ran that converter on the street and strip for several years before breaking it beyond repair whiney I replaced it with Turbo Action race 8.0 inch made for a SS/AH car that had not been ran, that converter at the track ran .2 quicker and 2.0 MPH faster in the 1/8 mile than the 10 inch did shockand it drove a bunch better on he street. up
It would foot stall over 3400 RPM in low gear and flash stall right at 5200 RPM in high gear at a slow roll up It drove really nice on the street at light part throttle and loosen up with more throttle workI wouldn't hesitate to have Paul at T/A make me another one just like that up twocents
Converters are not a science that all converter makers have down pat yet whiney work Some are way better on getting them right than others shruggy work Not all of us like the same things, just like camshafts, carbs and intakes, huh Brad devil stirthepot grin

Last edited by Cab_Burge; 10/23/19 12:11 PM.

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Re: Need some opinions on which torque converter [Re: Cab_Burge] #2709522
10/23/19 01:40 PM
10/23/19 01:40 PM
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have one built for the car, you will be much happier.

http://www.tcsperformance.com/performance_converters/

Re: Need some opinions on which torque converter [Re: jlatessa] #2709643
10/23/19 08:17 PM
10/23/19 08:17 PM
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Benton, IL.
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DaveRS23 Offline
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My conversation with Lenny at UCC was that I wanted as tight a converter as I could get given the limitations of a 9" converter dealing with gobs of torque. He said this is as tight as he can get a 9".

He also recommended that I run the thicker John Deere Hy-Gard rather than ATF. And not the generic brands of hydrostat fluids either. It seems that the Hy-Gard has the standard and then has a low viscosity version. Most generic brands tend to be the thinner viscosity. And, of course more viscosity helps tighten up the converter. I also run a big tranny cooler to help all it can. Hy-Gard is roughly equivalent to 10w30 oil. I have thought about trying some 50 or 60 weight oil mixed with the tranny fluid, but I just haven't gotten around to it. I do have some ATF in there just to give it some color, making it easier to see on the stick.

As for the snout, I just lightly touched up the snout and crank until it would go together.


Master, again and still
Re: Need some opinions on which torque converter [Re: DaveRS23] #2709739
10/24/19 09:41 AM
10/24/19 09:41 AM
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Posts: 14,479
So. Burlington, Vt.
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fast68plymouth Offline
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Quote
He said this is as tight as he can get a 9".


Which is why I’d be talking with someone about a little bigger unit.
9.5” or 10”......... probably a 10”.


68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123
Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
Re: Need some opinions on which torque converter [Re: fast68plymouth] #2710282
10/26/19 11:56 PM
10/26/19 11:56 PM
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Balt. Md
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383man Offline
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My 9.5 Dynamic works nicely in my 63 behind my 493. It drives great all the time as I can cruise the back roads at 2200 rpm and I don't notice any slippage just like when I drive the highway at 60 mph it just drives great all the time. It flashes to about 4000 or so at the track and works ok for my mild street car. I can hit it at any rpm when driving it and its always right there and just never seems to sound like its slipping any to me at any speed I drive. Its been in my car since 2006 as it was actually built for my old 440 but I am very pleased with it. Ron

Last edited by 383man; 10/26/19 11:56 PM.
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