Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 2 of 3 1 2 3
Re: Closer Towers - Line Spacing [Re: hemirdrnnr] #2706149
10/12/19 09:56 AM
10/12/19 09:56 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,245
Fragged State of Skuldruggery
S
srt Offline
master
srt  Offline
master
S

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,245
Fragged State of Skuldruggery
68 hours shutoff wind gusts hit 10mph (Beufort Wind Scale 7-10 - Leaves and small twigs constantly moving, light flags extended). PG&E Trucks running in tandem all over looking for wind and or leaves touching lines (public outrage?). Inconvenient yet with 6000w generator we were o.k. with some inconvenience.
Pretty sure this was retribution from PGE to Politicians. i.e. get the public annoyed to contact elected people. Seems to me it's the Insurance companies suing PGE not the rate payers.
Out of this, I hope PGE is dismembered and become public utilities. Separate Natural Gas, Hydro, Geo, High Voltage Lines, Distribution Lines and at least 5 or 6 different elect companies with overlapping territories so that consumers have a provider choice. Time the quarterly profits are taken out of what rate payers pay. i.e. lets see we can get larger bonuses and more investors if we cut gas line maitenience and cut tree trimming, transformer and line replacement budgets.

Re: CA PSPS Power Outage [Re: a12rag] #2706152
10/12/19 10:04 AM
10/12/19 10:04 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,245
Fragged State of Skuldruggery
S
srt Offline
master
srt  Offline
master
S

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,245
Fragged State of Skuldruggery
Originally Posted by a12rag
OOPS - sorry, one more thought . . . for those looking to plug in a portable generator and keep the fridge/freezer going, etc . . . . PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE - ENSURE YOU TURN YOUR MAIN BREAKER OFF !!!! . . . do not back feed into the grid !!!

I'd like to add. Get a permit and the proper interlock kit. Good Idea to also run separate ground from generator if required.
Trying to remember everything, or if helping hands appear, can prove fatal. Lawyers appear.

Re: CA PSPS Power Outage [Re: srt] #2706159
10/12/19 10:22 AM
10/12/19 10:22 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,245
Fragged State of Skuldruggery
S
srt Offline
master
srt  Offline
master
S

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,245
Fragged State of Skuldruggery
I had to string the posts to help others understand.
Neglect by the company is high on the list. Their infrastructure has been in place for years. As people developed further and further into rural areas, PGE Infrastructure was there. They looked at the cheapest way to push further into the undeveloped land. i.e. I have underground from a pole along an arterial road. The guy across road ran 3/4 mile overhead line (pge maintains). any falling trees, or breaks in conductors results in our power being cut off. reason: the new service would have had to install 1 more pole as the shutoff of their lines *requires* our transformer to be de-energized. 1 more pole would have allowed the switch to de-energize their lines and leave our transformer in service.
Another issue is long term neglect of maintaining their easements clear of tree growth. The greenies cannot stop PGE from maintaining their easements. PGE has environmental clearance specialists. Clearing easements costs $, trees grow.
Bottom line the company has become profit driven and is neglecting their responsibilities. The public has become their pawns. Insurance companies (profit driven owners of skyscrapers and fancy carpets) don't want to lose their profits.
Re: solar the only way to own solar is to generate and store (batteries) power you need. Lesser systems to heat water, pump water and maybe run appliances during the day are also workable. Anything grid tied is a looser. PGE buys the power you generate at a far lower rate than what they charge owners of homes with panels the effectively *give* pge power and it's associated infrastructure (panels and interconnect) paid for by the homeowner.

Re: CA PSPS Power Outage [Re: Sunroofcuda] #2706188
10/12/19 12:02 PM
10/12/19 12:02 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 20,465
Rio Linda, CA
John_Kunkel Offline
Too Many Posts
John_Kunkel  Offline
Too Many Posts

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 20,465
Rio Linda, CA
Originally Posted by Sunroofcuda

Classes were canceled. Frozen foods melted.


Including ice cream. Oh, the humanity !!! runaway


I'm supposed to respect my elders, but its getting harder and harder for me to find one now.
Re: CA PSPS Power Outage [Re: John_Kunkel] #2706190
10/12/19 12:06 PM
10/12/19 12:06 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 14,929
PA.
pittsburghracer Offline
"Little"John
pittsburghracer  Offline
"Little"John

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 14,929
PA.
Ohhh my God, people will be pooping in the streets.


1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
6.143@110.85 mph
9.73@135.05 mph shifting at 6700 RPM
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27

Livin and lovin life one day at a time




Re: CA PSPS Power Outage [Re: pittsburghracer] #2706269
10/12/19 07:46 PM
10/12/19 07:46 PM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 10,963
in a cattle trailer down by th...
G
Guitar Jones Offline
I Live Here
Guitar Jones  Offline
I Live Here
G

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 10,963
in a cattle trailer down by th...
Wish they would walk the mile to do it in front of Nancy's house.


I never learned to count my blessings, I choose instead to live inside my disasters.

The Scamp is sold, now just two old trucks and one new one.
'92 D250 Club Cab CTD, 47RH conversion, pump tweaks, injectors, rear disc and hydroboost conversion.
'74 W200 Crew Cab 360, NP435, D44, D60 and NP205 divorced transfer case. Magnum 5.2 MPI and NV4500 coming soon.
2019 1500 Long Horn Crew Cab 4WD, 5.7 Hemi!
Re: CA PSPS Power Outage [Re: Guitar Jones] #2706298
10/12/19 10:57 PM
10/12/19 10:57 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,245
Fragged State of Skuldruggery
S
srt Offline
master
srt  Offline
master
S

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,245
Fragged State of Skuldruggery
Another interesting fact about PG&E
Company handed outt $234m in bonuses to employees after bankruptcy court o.k.'d and new ceo gets $2.5m each year for 3 yr contract.
Now they are asking for up to $16M bonuses for executives that the bankruptcy Judge is holding up.
These actions really show a company destine to fail. I can imagine the thought process goes something like this: Lets see, while we're in bankruptcy lets keep spending extra money on ourselves to pad our already high pay rates and salaries, full of overtime and benefits, and then shut off power to millions of people, write off our losses (energy sales, lots of staff time and overtime looking for rustling leaves, pull and replace fuses, drive all our shiny new trucks in tandem, while we sit at home and 'monitor' the situation). Yea, let's do that. realcrazy

Re: Closer Towers - Line Spacing [Re: 360view] #2706355
10/13/19 09:10 AM
10/13/19 09:10 AM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,130
USA
3
360view Offline
master
360view  Offline
master
3

Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,130
USA
In the 1990s this “expert group”

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_Electric_Reliability_Corporation

Warned that the “grid” had been getting better decade by decade,
but that if some of the ideas being proposed
by people inexperienced in power systems came about
the stability of the grid could be “impaired.”

Took about 25 years, didn’t it?

It will probably get even worse in CA over the next ten years or more.

Maybe CA would straighten up quicker if it was expelled from the Western Group?

Notice TX has its own grid.

Re: Closer Towers - Line Spacing [Re: 360view] #2706373
10/13/19 10:31 AM
10/13/19 10:31 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,245
Fragged State of Skuldruggery
S
srt Offline
master
srt  Offline
master
S

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,245
Fragged State of Skuldruggery
The "grid" really is not to blame. California has somewhere around 6 separate electric companies and 46 districts serving the public.
The "grid" will create problems in CA, or anywhere across the country. Four federal Power Marketing Administrations Areas Divide the country and serve somewhat the basis for distrubuting Federally Created Electricity (Hydro Electric, or other sources) and North American power transmission grid is a completely separate system that disects USA and Canada into Interconnected Grids.
The situation last week was created solely as a self serving excercise to limit liability, flex muscle, conduct a drill, make more $ or any combination of those, and maybe other reasons. I will tell you the cost to business, schools, the public, government, etc., and the environment cost society (and the world in small engine emissions) far more than the self serving interests of PG&E.
I wouldn't be so quick to take short sighted swipes at CA, but look at the Capitalistic nature of the people *solely* responsible for the fiasco. I feel the root of the problem is the Lawyers and Administrators of PG&E.
p.s. The So Cal wildfire was caused by an person dumping some smoldering item (BBQ coals) into their trash and the garbage truck dumping at the landfill allowed air and sparked the fire which quickly escaped, burned 76 homes and killed 2 people.
fwiw The Paradise (Camp) Fire burned 150k ac, killed 85, destroyed close to 19k structures and incurred 16.5B in damages. Conversely Hurricane Dorian is expected to rack up $500 TO $1.6b in damages in the US alone. No doubt fires and other disasters create hardship and extraneous costs to society.
Goal should be to avoid preventable damages by entities and individuals preparing their infrastructure and properties to make it through unexpected events..

Re: Closer Towers - Line Spacing [Re: srt] #2706390
10/13/19 11:49 AM
10/13/19 11:49 AM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 14,929
PA.
pittsburghracer Offline
"Little"John
pittsburghracer  Offline
"Little"John

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 14,929
PA.
So should the power company have been sued or not. And if so way shouldn’t they turn off the power when it gets windy. Sounds like clear cutting would save a lot of fires from happening or at least make fighting them easier and quicker.


1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
6.143@110.85 mph
9.73@135.05 mph shifting at 6700 RPM
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27

Livin and lovin life one day at a time




Re: Closer Towers - Line Spacing [Re: srt] #2706426
10/13/19 02:33 PM
10/13/19 02:33 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,259
Omaha Ne
T
TJP Offline
master
TJP  Offline
master
T

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,259
Omaha Ne
I'm surprised no one has commented abut the insurance companies refusing to renew policies in a lot of the"problem areas" and if they do they are at a much higher rate than before. read the article below whistling realcrazy

Insurance mess


Last edited by TJP; 10/13/19 03:39 PM.
Re: Closer Towers - Line Spacing [Re: TJP] #2706440
10/13/19 03:27 PM
10/13/19 03:27 PM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,414
yarnell,az
M
mopacltd Offline
pro stock
mopacltd  Offline
pro stock
M

Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,414
yarnell,az
Both insurance companies and the power company (APS) raised their rates after the 2013 fire here!

Re: Closer Towers - Line Spacing [Re: pittsburghracer] #2706544
10/13/19 09:36 PM
10/13/19 09:36 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,245
Fragged State of Skuldruggery
S
srt Offline
master
srt  Offline
master
S

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,245
Fragged State of Skuldruggery
What the lawyers will argue is what is reasonable and prudent (where's Kim). I would think it reasonable and prudent to either trim branches, prune branches , or remove trees that could fall onto powerlines, or install slightly taller poles. Permanent aerial easements need to be secured requiring property owners to maintain their landscape trees or natural vegetation from the easements, or the utility can do it and back charge or lein owners property. I often wonder PG&E did not have a capital improvement and maintenance plan in effect. I can see no reason for the utility to charge more than an amount to operate their system, incur a trust fund for o&m, and also make a modest profit. What is absurd it the salaries and benefits and bonuses along with a obvious dereliction of responsibility to properly maintain their facilities.
RE: Insurance quotes. Somebody drew a line on a map around properties that they felt were within a risk area. Our home was included. Over the years I have had the insurance company inspect, and Cal Fire has inspected our property 4 of the past 7 years. We have always been proclaimed fire-safe and our home borders a main road that is cleared as a major fire break (100' each side of road (including a strip of our property). My first insurance company would not insure, but offered me a policy from Lloyd's of London for $7800 a year. I shopped and armed with inspection reports found a company that carries us for 1/3 the Lloyd's #. I feel lucky, neighbor down the road has been quoted $9k, and gets a 50% discount if he clears 200' around structures. I feel it ridiculous that each individual property is not looked at prior to quotes by insurance companies. Neighboring properties not maintained fire safe need to have an abatement standard implemented, or they should be cited for allowing hazards to exist on their property (like garbage, vicious dogs, etc.). Stupid people call for drastic measures.

Re: Closer Towers - Line Spacing [Re: srt] #2706552
10/13/19 10:05 PM
10/13/19 10:05 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 14,929
PA.
pittsburghracer Offline
"Little"John
pittsburghracer  Offline
"Little"John

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 14,929
PA.
My company West Penn Power has subcontractors that maintain a free service to landowners that will clear branches away from power lines.

Gas companies when running new underground gas lines will pay a small right away fee. They are only allowed to clear trees during certain months because of Bats rousting in trees.


1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
6.143@110.85 mph
9.73@135.05 mph shifting at 6700 RPM
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27

Livin and lovin life one day at a time




Re: Closer Towers - Line Spacing [Re: pittsburghracer] #2706564
10/13/19 10:46 PM
10/13/19 10:46 PM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,173
State of Jefferson
hooziewhatsit Offline
master
hooziewhatsit  Offline
master

Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,173
State of Jefferson
Originally Posted by pittsburghracer
So should the power company have been sued or not. And if so way shouldn’t they turn off the power when it gets windy. Sounds like clear cutting would save a lot of fires from happening or at least make fighting them easier and quicker.


"clear cutting" trees, will generally make fires worse, not better. Clear cuts generally allow quick growing (and dying) weeds to spring up which carry the fire faster.

Old growth trees aren't the problem either, but they are where the main money in logging comes from.

So we somehow need to incentivize thinning, which costs more and gets the lower value trees out, and thin the underbrush, to help prevent these massive fires.


If you ever find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck.
Re: Closer Towers - Line Spacing [Re: hooziewhatsit] #2706572
10/13/19 11:20 PM
10/13/19 11:20 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,245
Fragged State of Skuldruggery
S
srt Offline
master
srt  Offline
master
S

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,245
Fragged State of Skuldruggery
Originally Posted by hooziewhatsit
..we somehow need to incentivize thinning,..

Incentivize and or penalize for not doing so. There is too much land bought by people that have no idea what land stewardship is.
The mindset that thinks you carve out a road and building pad to have a nice home in the woods is the furthest thought from reality.
Unfortunately manual and mechanized manipulation is spendy and herbicides can be problematic. Fire was the natural way. Since man has crept from the caves and huts and built chattel in the woods fire can no longer serve it's natural benefit. I'd love to recurrently burn a few strips of scrub oak (road sound barrier) that has clearance for safe burning during the winter. CDF agrees, yet can't authorize due to nearby properties being heavily fuel loaded.
Interesting *fact* agricultural land does not need to be maintained fire safe. Dead vegetation and pruning debris can accumulate throughout orchards and vineyards and right up to adjoining properties. The hazard created has no abatement standard.

Re: Closer Towers - Line Spacing [Re: srt] #2706577
10/14/19 12:10 AM
10/14/19 12:10 AM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 14,929
PA.
pittsburghracer Offline
"Little"John
pittsburghracer  Offline
"Little"John

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 14,929
PA.
What’s the red fire retardant they are always seen dropping. Is it EPA approved and tested for water pollution concerns


1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
6.143@110.85 mph
9.73@135.05 mph shifting at 6700 RPM
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27

Livin and lovin life one day at a time




Re: Closer Towers - Line Spacing [Re: pittsburghracer] #2706581
10/14/19 12:52 AM
10/14/19 12:52 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,245
Fragged State of Skuldruggery
S
srt Offline
master
srt  Offline
master
S

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,245
Fragged State of Skuldruggery
borate - this from wiki - Fire retardant Borate salts used in the past to fight wildfires have been found to sterilize the soil and be toxic to animals so are now prohibited. Newer retardants use ammonium sulfate or ammonium polyphosphate with attapulgite clay thickener or diammonium phosphate with a guar gum derivative thickener.
We were told it's similar to fertilizer.

Re: Closer Towers - Line Spacing [Re: srt] #2706588
10/14/19 03:25 AM
10/14/19 03:25 AM
Joined: Aug 2019
Posts: 198
USA
Mr. Potatohead Offline
The member formerly known as..EV2..
Mr. Potatohead  Offline
The member formerly known as..EV2..

Joined: Aug 2019
Posts: 198
USA
I deeply feel for the people of Cali who have been and continue to be under the control of blind foolishness and meaning this in a non political way, Cali has become a victim of itself no matter who has been in control.

I guess I shouldnt be so upset over the 1:45 hour outage this past week where my flyover country rural cooperative ele company replaced my pole and transformer and they have been doing 3-5 poles a day for the last two years after fully rebuilding and doubling the the size of the substation a mile away.

And yes ironically I was worried about the ice cream my wife had just came home with in the groceries. Ohhh the foolishness of being proactive and responsible.

I think I will send a note in my next power bill payment and thank them and double thank them for not following Cali as a business model, a huge concern in my area as the Cali people bail out in search of a better place/life. Another ironic part of the whole mess where at one time "Cali" was the place to be. My take away is all humans suck, we [censored] up everything with our knowledge and wisdom.

Last edited by Mr. Potatohead; 10/14/19 03:29 AM.

My family is a bunch of Fruits and Vegetables and many cant tell us apart. EAT ME!
Re: Closer Towers - Line Spacing [Re: Mr. Potatohead] #2706669
10/14/19 10:48 AM
10/14/19 10:48 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,245
Fragged State of Skuldruggery
S
srt Offline
master
srt  Offline
master
S

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,245
Fragged State of Skuldruggery
Originally Posted by Mr. Potatohead
....... My take away is all humans suck, we [censored] up everything with our knowledge and wisdom.

Ever watch the movie "Heavy Metal". Animated Sci-Fi shorts combined into a feature length film. It has a common theme/item throughout. Green Orb, appropriately green it's the greed within. I think it transgresses all social and political boundries and, unfortunately permeates society.

Page 2 of 3 1 2 3

Advertisement
Sponsored Link
Moparts Newest Topics
wiw 273 with 340 parts
by TB3CUDA. 12/08/19 05:26 PM
Can anyone run a Carfax for me??
by RJS. 12/08/19 03:17 PM
'70 Swinger 340 in Cali
by larrymopar360. 12/08/19 03:13 PM
What you using for points these days
by Transman. 12/08/19 01:41 PM
Moparts Recent Posts
1973 dodge adventuer club cab
by AndyF. 12/08/19 06:37 PM
issues with fresh 440
by W.I.N. racing. 12/08/19 06:36 PM
What you using for points these days
by W.I.N. racing. 12/08/19 06:25 PM
'70 Swinger 340 in Cali
by blaze. 12/08/19 06:24 PM

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1