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TF270 accessories #2705506
10/10/19 12:22 PM
10/10/19 12:22 PM
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Mt Morris Michigan
mopar dave Offline OP
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what rockers and headers fit these heads? After the couple track outings with the 511 using Victor MW heads and running a best 10.40 on pump gas, thought I would shave them enough to get 12.5:1 compression as a fix or wake up. Being I have a big intake"Indy 400-3" big heads" 330cc port volume" and big cam "270@50" my thought was it needs some compression to make the combo work properly. Second thought was to sell the heads and get a pair of 270's, but that would be quite an investment for not much more gain. Would my Maddog headers on my victors fit the 270 heads in an A body? Just kicking ideas around right now. Thanks

Re: TF270 accessories [Re: mopar dave] #2705512
10/10/19 12:36 PM
10/10/19 12:36 PM
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Before i did all that i would try to figure out how to get what you have to run up to its potential
500+ inch motor with good heads should run 9’s falling off a log in an A body


69 Dart GTS A4 Silver All steel, flat factory hood, 3360race weight
418 BPE factory replacement headed stroker, 565 lift solid cam
Best so far, 10.40 @127 1/4
1.41 best 60 foot
6.60 at 103.90 1/8

Re: TF270 accessories [Re: mopar dave] #2705528
10/10/19 01:18 PM
10/10/19 01:18 PM
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What do the 60, 330 and 660 Ft. times look like?


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: TF270 accessories [Re: Cab_Burge] #2705540
10/10/19 02:06 PM
10/10/19 02:06 PM
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Mt Morris Michigan
mopar dave Offline OP
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1.45, 4.272, 6.626 . The vert may be a tad on the tight side, but if the engine made more power it would make up the difference and stall higher.

Re: TF270 accessories [Re: B3422W5] #2705542
10/10/19 02:10 PM
10/10/19 02:10 PM
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mopar dave Offline OP
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That's what I have done. The engine is not making the power it should. Every thing in the combo is big except the compression, so that will now get addressed. I feel the ports are sub par design compared to TF and Indy. They are huge and lazy from what I can gather. Talked to a few on another forum and they have very similar combos going fast. Only difference is they have 12.5-13:1 compression and roller cams. I don't fell my cam is far off if any.

Re: TF270 accessories [Re: mopar dave] #2705546
10/10/19 02:21 PM
10/10/19 02:21 PM
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My 67 has a 470 , the CR is 12.5

cam is not wild, its a flat tappet, heads are Victors , more or less OTB ..

Car weighs 3280 with me in it ..

It has run the best of 10.41 to date, we have had lousy summer air here last two years , best 60 to date .1.37 --most often its 1.385

MPH is about 124.5 to 125 most of the time

I think in cool air it will pickup to at least 10.36 to 10.38


The lips of fools bring them strife, and their mouths invite a beating.Proverbs 18:6
Re: TF270 accessories [Re: B3422W5] #2705556
10/10/19 02:47 PM
10/10/19 02:47 PM
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So. Burlington, Vt.
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Originally Posted by B3422W5
Before i did all that i would try to figure out how to get what you have to run up to its potential
500+ inch motor with good heads should run 9’s falling off a log in an A body


It’s purely a car/combo problem.

His heads have already run well into 9’s with the car they used to be in.


68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123
Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
Re: TF270 accessories [Re: fast68plymouth] #2705575
10/10/19 03:24 PM
10/10/19 03:24 PM
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Mt Morris Michigan
mopar dave Offline OP
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I agree partly. I will put some double adjustable's on front next time out. I currently have 60/40's on front. I didn't like the 90/10's that were on it. I still believe it is not making the power it should as is. Something is off in the combo and not sure what it is, best guess is the 11.25:1 compression. I spoke with MALEX over on B bodies, he has the same combo with a roller. His was a slouch with 9.5:1, so he bumped it to 10.5:1 and still not impressive. He then shaved the heads to max giving him 12.8:1, that woke it up big time. I believe he is the one running 10 o's with same weight as me now.

Re: TF270 accessories [Re: mopar dave] #2705608
10/10/19 04:29 PM
10/10/19 04:29 PM
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Sydney,Australia
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definitely not living up to its promise .
what is rear suspension ? MPH ?
I run Crane Gold 1.5 rockers on my 270s , cant help you with headers I run Dougs

Tex

Last edited by tex013; 10/10/19 04:29 PM.

New best ET 10.259@129.65 .
New best MPH 130.32
Finally fitted a solid cam,
stepped it up a bit more
3690lbs through the mufflers
New World block 3780lbs 10.278@130.80 . Wowser 10.253@130.24 footbraking from 1500rpm
Power by Tex's Automotive
Re: TF270 accessories [Re: tex013] #2705612
10/10/19 04:42 PM
10/10/19 04:42 PM
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Mt Morris Michigan
mopar dave Offline OP
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Dana 60 with 4.10 gear. Calvert mono's with calvert 9 way shock set on 5. It frequently spun the tire with the sb 408 and the shock set on 3 and never spun the tire set on 5 with bb 511. Looks down on power to me.

Re: TF270 accessories [Re: fast68plymouth] #2705618
10/10/19 04:50 PM
10/10/19 04:50 PM
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Portage,michigan
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Originally Posted by fast68plymouth
Originally Posted by B3422W5
Before i did all that i would try to figure out how to get what you have to run up to its potential
500+ inch motor with good heads should run 9’s falling off a log in an A body


It’s purely a car/combo problem.

His heads have already run well into 9’s with the car they used to be in.


Thanks. If you read what i said closely that's exactly what i said. “ with those heads and 500+ Inches it should run 9’s falling off a log in an A body.
Obviously the combo isn't right, if it was the results would be different. We are saying the same thing...lol


69 Dart GTS A4 Silver All steel, flat factory hood, 3360race weight
418 BPE factory replacement headed stroker, 565 lift solid cam
Best so far, 10.40 @127 1/4
1.41 best 60 foot
6.60 at 103.90 1/8

Re: TF270 accessories [Re: B3422W5] #2705693
10/10/19 09:06 PM
10/10/19 09:06 PM
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Mt Morris Michigan
mopar dave Offline OP
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yep, but as I said 1 major thing is different between that combo and mine, compression. That 511 combo that ran 9.70's in a 3500# road runner also had close to 13:1 compression from what I was told. The calculators show not much gain horsepower wise in 1-1.5 point increase in compression. MALEX told me it took compression to run the numbers in his 511 combo with these heads. Not many have experience with these heads. I called Best Machine today and spoke with Chuck about it. He has no experience with these heads either, but his advise was to try more timing and maybe less jet. Some of his combos are running 38-40* of timing and some have 16:1 compression, yeah, crazy i know. Also suggested a different carb like a 4150 1050 for this combo. Chuck also said shaving these heads wont be inexpensive either. Looking at over $500 plus gaskets. He computes my combo to 570hp. That's pathetic in my opinion. I still think it needs more compression, but thats not a very economical way to go. Loosening the vert is $125 . gonna give it some more thought before I pull any thing apart. Thanks guys.

Re: TF270 accessories [Re: mopar dave] #2705738
10/10/19 11:00 PM
10/10/19 11:00 PM
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Val-haul-ass... eventually
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1. What's your budget for continuing to f%$k with this combination?

2. At what level of performance are you going to say it's good enough?

3. Have you ever heard the old Styx song "Too much time on my hands"?

Want to "proof of concept" your hypothesis it doesn't have enough CR? Put a smaller cam in it to build more cylinder pressure. PorkyPig would have told you to stuff a Hughes HTL6064 in it and see how it responds.

Re: TF270 accessories [Re: BradH] #2705759
10/11/19 01:40 AM
10/11/19 01:40 AM
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Loosening the lash .004 to .008 will make the cam smaller also work scope wrench up


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: TF270 accessories [Re: mopar dave] #2705774
10/11/19 06:01 AM
10/11/19 06:01 AM
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Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
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Dave,

You and I have kabitzed about my combo, and for what it is, it runs, its not bad.....Why does it run, I like to tinker. We sit around the shop or over lunch some days and look for ways to get more out of it...My heads don't flow $hit compared to what is out there these days. If this thing had real heads, I would be in the low 9's...

Lets talk about what you have and how it runs....As far as compression, I did the Wallace calc thing, and its not as much as you might think.


'70 Cuda,...605 EFI Hemi Street Car (6.20 best pass, 1.33 60ft)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYw6RA-k5Bk (6.25 at 108.75mph from inside car)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zQEb9uxFng (6.25 at 108mph from outside car)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCvfzsC4NgM (9.9)

'66 Barracuda AWB Stretched nose Blown 440 Car in build stage

'71 Duster Drag Car 400 Low Deck 512 best 6.002 at 115.44mph
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Znuo3jMUXTk
Re: TF270 accessories [Re: BradH] #2705785
10/11/19 08:17 AM
10/11/19 08:17 AM
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Originally Posted by BradH
1. What's your budget for continuing to f%$k with this combination?

2. At what level of performance are you going to say it's good enough?

3. Have you ever heard the old Styx song "Too much time on my hands"?

Want to "proof of concept" your hypothesis it doesn't have enough CR? Put a smaller cam in it to build more cylinder pressure. PorkyPig would have told you to stuff a Hughes HTL6064 in it and see how it responds.



Thats first thing i would try, smaller cam on a narrower( 108) LSA


69 Dart GTS A4 Silver All steel, flat factory hood, 3360race weight
418 BPE factory replacement headed stroker, 565 lift solid cam
Best so far, 10.40 @127 1/4
1.41 best 60 foot
6.60 at 103.90 1/8

Re: TF270 accessories [Re: B3422W5] #2705793
10/11/19 08:39 AM
10/11/19 08:39 AM
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What's your shift point and what rpm does it go through the traps? Ever run a shift loop? You'll be surprised what a difference that makes.

Re: TF270 accessories [Re: mopar dave] #2705797
10/11/19 08:51 AM
10/11/19 08:51 AM
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ohio
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[quote=mopar dave. I called Best Machine today and spoke with Chuck about it. , yeah, crazy i know. Also suggested a different carb like a 4150 1050 for this combo. [/quote]

Not apples to apples comparsion but on my race car only I ran faster with the 1050 dominator on the car vs 1000 Holley 4150 carb


71 demon stock stroke 440/indy ez-1 running 10.10 @ 132.14 mph in the 1/4 and 6.36 @ 107.46 mph in the 1/8 not in the same weekend but It did it then I sold it.
67 Belvedere that worked it's way in the 10's
Re: TF270 accessories [Re: mopar dave] #2705803
10/11/19 09:13 AM
10/11/19 09:13 AM
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Originally Posted by mopar dave
1.45, 4.272, 6.626 . The vert may be a tad on the tight side, but if the engine made more power it would make up the difference and stall higher.

I don't like harping on this, but here's some data that should put some perspective on how out of sync something is w/ your combination.

This was a 10.7 CR RB 452 w/ 305 (not a misprint) CFM Stage VI heads, 266 at .050 x .600 x 108 solid flat-tappet cam, and a small 1.42 venturi x 1.75 throttle 4150 carb on a standard Victor intake.

Engine made ~ 610 HP peak at 6300; ~ 570 torque peak at 4900

E-body aerodynamics... not great.

4200 stall / 4500-flash 9.5 converter; 8% slippage

4.10s; M/T ET Street 275/60R15s w/ loaded radius of ~ 13.7"

Best pass launching from approx 2200 RPM, 1-2 shift at 6300, 2-3 shift at 6500, trap RPM 6800+:

60' - 1.454
330 - 4.254
660' - 6.653
at 102.03
1000' - 8.745
1320' - 10.523 at 126.44

Track digital scale showed 3755#s w/ driver right after this pass.

Track elevation is 80'; weather conditions for that run were 63*, 70% humidity, 30.05" barometric pressure.

No, It's NOT an apples-to-apples comparison w/ your results. But your 60/330/660 times aren't much different than mine. Mine ran out of steam on the big end, though.

Here's another long thread from a couple years ago that's also NOT apples-to-apples w/ what we're talking about, but still might be of interest: HERE



Re: TF270 accessories [Re: BradH] #2705821
10/11/19 10:02 AM
10/11/19 10:02 AM
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Seems like Dave is just dying to make major changes to a combo that only has a hand full of runs on it.

Still no determination on the valve spring situation and the affect that could be having on the lack of top end pull.

If you really couldn’t find someone to test the current springs........ they’re not that expensive.
Buy something new that is a good match for the cam and just put them in.
Less than $200 and a few hours time.

It’s your car........ so you’ll go about it however you see fit.

Quote
He computes my combo to 570hp. That's pathetic in my opinion.


Soooo....... you think that if you pulled your motor out, brought it to a reputable dyno service and ran it just like it sits....... it would make 570hp?
A motor like that should be 675-700hp.
If you did nothing but swap to TF270’s...... you’d be expecting to pick up 100-130hp over your CNC ported Victors....... with zero other changes?

That would mean you’d be expecting to pick up 7-9mph in the 1/4 from the head swap alone.


68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123
Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
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