Drill for clearance, or replace?
#2703906
10/04/19 06:13 PM
10/04/19 06:13 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,760 Windsor, ON, Canada
Diplomat360
OP
top fuel
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OP
top fuel
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,760
Windsor, ON, Canada
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So I finally pick up my 360 at the shop, driving back home with that happy as "you know what" look on my face...LOL!
Get the stuff into the garage, pull back the bag, start looking things over, things look nice until I spot the following issue with the camshaft bearings (see attachments).
Looks like most of them were pressed in a bit too far, but #2 in particular was clocked incorrectly and I actually have about 1/2 of the passage completely blocked off. To top it off this is the oil feed into the head, grrrhh....
So I'm thinking: 1) bring the darn thing back to the shop? Hassle, b/c I'm in Windsor, ON, Canada and the shop is in Taylor, MI...so standard border crossing hassle applies
2) attempt to clearance by drilling through...seems easy, but I dread the idea of the bit breaking in the block, and besides, no idea really how "clean" that sort of a clearencing will turn out anyways
OK, so take a peek...should these be completely pressed out and new bearings installed?
Thanks!
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Re: Drill for clearance, or replace?
[Re: Diplomat360]
#2703914
10/04/19 06:34 PM
10/04/19 06:34 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,174 Bend,OR USA
Cab_Burge
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,174
Bend,OR USA
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Do your heads need the oil feeding to the rocker shafts or no ? If not don't worry about that hole, I wouldn't If the heads need the oiling to the rocker shafts get it fix now It has been a while since I've install L.A. cam bearing, I'm thinking the #2 and #4 cam bearings should have full oil grooves in them maybe not Thinking about that some more the heads with rocker arm shafts get oiled through the hole in the camshaft, don't they
Last edited by Cab_Burge; 10/04/19 06:35 PM.
Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
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Re: Drill for clearance, or replace?
[Re: MoparMike1974]
#2704019
10/05/19 06:32 AM
10/05/19 06:32 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,393 Abilene, Texas
fastmark
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,393
Abilene, Texas
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I have tore down many engines that had misaligned cam bearing holes from the factory. Its not a huge deal for a relatively stock engine. Personally when I install them I get them as lined up as possible. Since the engine is not together I would go ahead and correct it. It’s hard to get the perfectly aligned in the first place. I have a long 1/4” drill bit that I use to drill the bearing after the install. Just catch all the shavings and wash the block again. It’s supposed to be aligned.
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Re: Drill for clearance, or replace?
[Re: fastmark]
#2704088
10/05/19 11:43 AM
10/05/19 11:43 AM
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Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 257 Alberta
440_Offroader
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 257
Alberta
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It’s hard to get the perfectly aligned in the first place. I have a long 1/4” drill bit that I use to drill the bearing after the install. Just catch all the shavings and wash the block again. It’s supposed to be aligned.
I have drilled them as well. Carefully knock down any high spots/ burrs with a razor blade. As mentioned, they are hard to line up. If you replace it, I would install a new bearing. I don't like using a previously installed bearing because of the scrubbing it has when it was installed in the first place. That's just me though, my opinion.
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Re: Drill for clearance, or replace?
[Re: Diplomat360]
#2704099
10/05/19 12:12 PM
10/05/19 12:12 PM
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Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399 Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar
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master
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
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I would re-install them correctly. I have a cam bearing tool, so it's not a big deal. Not sure how far away the original shop is, but it might cost more to travel there than pay a local shop to fix it?
Drilling is an option, but need to be careful not to raise a burr, or distort the bearing when breaking through the bearing.
On my 360 RV engine with Crane gold aluminum rocker arms, I wanted more rocker oiling, so the #2 an #4 cam journals were grooved (a small groove.)
If using head studs, enlarge the tall cylinder head hole where the oil comes up for a bit more clearance around the head stud.
Last edited by 451Mopar; 10/05/19 12:24 PM.
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Re: Drill for clearance, or replace?
[Re: 451Mopar]
#2704103
10/05/19 12:59 PM
10/05/19 12:59 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040 Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
Circle Track
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Circle Track
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
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if you have an 1/8" dia passage left after the misalignment you are fine (& 1/16 is fine on the 1,3,5 non oilers). EDIT if you can stick a 1/16 drill bit in the holes you are set, no opinion on the bearings too far lateral (I'd mockup the cam) but I got a feeling you are OK. MORE EDIT meant to say 1/8" (#2 & #4)
Last edited by RapidRobert; 10/05/19 04:07 PM.
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Drill for clearance, or replace?
[Re: Diplomat360]
#2704157
10/05/19 07:41 PM
10/05/19 07:41 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,174 PA.
pittsburghracer
"Little"John
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"Little"John
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,174
PA.
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From looking at that picture I can’t honestly say what I would do as I would want to see and check it out better. I will tell you that I did tap the rocker stands on my Edelbrock heads and install brass set screws that I drilled to .062 so I could limit the oil to my Harlan Sharp rockers. A 1/16 hole flows a lot of oil in a pressurized system.
1970 Duster Edelbrock headed 408 5.984@112.52 422 Indy headed small block 5.982@112.56 mph 9.42@138.27
Livin and lovin life one day at a time
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Re: Drill for clearance, or replace?
[Re: Diplomat360]
#2704252
10/06/19 09:34 AM
10/06/19 09:34 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,760 Windsor, ON, Canada
Diplomat360
OP
top fuel
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OP
top fuel
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,760
Windsor, ON, Canada
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Thanks for the feedback and suggestions everyone.
That build is a stroker W2 motor, using Harland Sharp rocker arms, and indeed I had actually threaded the oil feed hole in the head itself so that I can install a restrictor plug in case I need too, all without having the pull the head and deal with this type of a thing at the block deck to head interface level. The HS folks did actually say that an oil restrictor may be needed given the design of their rocker arms.
However, I do not want to assume that this is the only combo I might run. Heck, if I want to try the MP W2 rockers (which are 1.5 ratio) over the HS (which are 1.6) I want to be able to make sure that I have enough oil feed to the top end.
The cam is a hydraulic roller without the grooved journal, so no other way to assure a steady feed of oil other than the periodic oil feedthrough alignment as the cam rotates.
I am taking the block back to the shop, as some of you pointed out this type of an issue should not arise. It is easy enough to mark with a felt pen and just align the darn thing.
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Re: Drill for clearance, or replace?
[Re: Diplomat360]
#2705733
10/10/19 10:41 PM
10/10/19 10:41 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,791 Hamilton, Ontario Canada
Magnum
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Posts: 5,791
Hamilton, Ontario Canada
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The HS folks did actually say that an oil restrictor may be needed given the design of their rocker arms.
A factory rocker system needs the volume and the rocker on the shaft becomes the restriction to regulate the proper amount of oil. A full radius bearing is just a giant leak around a rocker shaft. I can see pressurized oil in a rocker shaft sending too much oil to the rocker bearings. I'd say leave it and it will still be too much oil.
69 Super Bee, 93 Mustang LX, 04 Allure Super
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Re: Drill for clearance, or replace?
[Re: Magnum]
#2706157
10/12/19 11:16 AM
10/12/19 11:16 AM
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 12,234 Looking for a way out of Middl...
IMGTX
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 12,234
Looking for a way out of Middl...
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The HS folks did actually say that an oil restrictor may be needed given the design of their rocker arms.
A factory rocker system needs the volume and the rocker on the shaft becomes the restriction to regulate the proper amount of oil. A full radius bearing is just a giant leak around a rocker shaft. I can see pressurized oil in a rocker shaft sending too much oil to the rocker bearings. I'd say leave it and it will still be too much oil. You are probably right but remember Mopars do not get a constant flow of oil to the rockers. The oil passes through holes in the camshaft that only line up once per cam revolution per side or once every other engine revolution. That small spurt can't be much to begin with. Again you are probably right because of the rocker system he is running but traditional systems are pretty limited in the oil flow category.
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