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how thin can you bore a sleeved engine? #2689303
08/19/19 08:57 AM
08/19/19 08:57 AM
Joined: Nov 2015
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Missouri
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jwb123 Offline OP
super stock
jwb123  Offline OP
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Just need some free advice if I can get it. I posted a while back that I windowed my aluminum world products RB mopar block. I borrowed a mill and cut out the broken sections, made some repair pieces, and had it welded back together, turned out really well, hard to see where it was broken. Took it to my regular engine machinist to get it bored for the damaged hole, and it needed a .010 bigger outside diameter sleeve, on the welded hole to make it straight, which took a month to get. The other bores had many runs on them and a few scratches, and as it turned out a little distortion from the damage and repairs. Anyway 4.50 bore is the next practical size to take it. The stock sleeves are 4.685 outside diameter, and with the 4.5 bore that leaves .185 and divided 1/2 that should leave .0925 wall thickness, dry liner pressed into aluminum about 1/2 inch thick, from what I saw on the damaged hole. My machinist thinks it will fly, what do you guys think? Camshaft fits in and spins free after the welding, so I think it might just be on the road to getting fixed. Mains look good with a straight edge as well, will see more when he align hones it. I have never tried to fix a block damaged this bad, just nervous I guess.

Re: how thin can you bore a sleeved engine? [Re: jwb123] #2689308
08/19/19 09:17 AM
08/19/19 09:17 AM
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Stuttgart, Arkansas
rickseeman Offline
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I can't believe using a sleeve with a .010" larger OD is going to hurt anything.


2011 Drag Pak Challenger
Re: how thin can you bore a sleeved engine? [Re: rickseeman] #2689309
08/19/19 09:21 AM
08/19/19 09:21 AM
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 3,097
back in Georgia
dthemi Offline
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I've been as thin as .065 before. Would depend on what you're doing with it for me. NA I wouldn't think twice about it. Nitrous, or forced, I'd be really careful with the tune. Wouldn't take much detonation to hurt it.

Re: how thin can you bore a sleeved engine? [Re: jwb123] #2689471
08/19/19 04:57 PM
08/19/19 04:57 PM
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Canada
WO23Coronet Offline
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Given that you have 1/2” of aluminum surrounding the sleeve, that’s where your strength is coming from. I’d say you’ll be more than fine

Re: how thin can you bore a sleeved engine? [Re: WO23Coronet] #2689547
08/19/19 08:45 PM
08/19/19 08:45 PM
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Washington
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hemienvy Offline
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Washington
Where is the aluminum 1/2" thick ? Not between the bores.

Re: how thin can you bore a sleeved engine? [Re: dthemi] #2689557
08/19/19 09:33 PM
08/19/19 09:33 PM
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Posts: 12,383
Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
Dragula Offline
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Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
How do you get one with nice thick sleeves......

Been wanting to go back to aluminum, and it seems the Indy is the only game in town......This was our complaint. Our block, as received at 4.490 bore had .011 taper and .008 out of round.

That block was the worst machining.....Some of us are not made of money, nor do we like to sit out season after season.

I have called to get a KB time and time again.....They have nothing....nothing in stock, no timing, no status.....nothing.

I would never go that thin with a big arm in it. Ours scuffed out the thrust side of the cylinder wall cross hatch with a 4.75 arm in it...The pistons are so short they shingle in the bore and rub out the cross hatch. If you go thin, keep a shorter arm in it so the piston skirts are longer.

Machining has to be dead nuts with .002 clearance in an aluminum motor......Our CI block, no issues, had it apart a couple times now for other reasons. Bores are gorgeous. But you can't get a CI block.....


Last edited by Dragula; 08/19/19 09:43 PM.

'70 Cuda,...605 EFI Hemi Street Car (6.20 best pass, 1.33 60ft)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYw6RA-k5Bk (6.25 at 108.75mph from inside car)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zQEb9uxFng (6.25 at 108mph from outside car)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCvfzsC4NgM (9.9)

'66 Barracuda AWB Stretched nose Blown 440 Car in build stage

'71 Duster Drag Car 400 Low Deck 512 best 6.002 at 115.44mph
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Znuo3jMUXTk
Re: how thin can you bore a sleeved engine? [Re: rickseeman] #2689589
08/19/19 10:53 PM
08/19/19 10:53 PM
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 873
Missouri
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jwb123 Offline OP
super stock
jwb123  Offline OP
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Joined: Nov 2015
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Missouri
Originally Posted by rickseeman
I can't believe using a sleeve with a .010" larger OD is going to hurt anything.


No the .010 over sleeve was not an issue, the issue was stress from the rod breaking, pressing in the sleeve in the welded hole, and warpage from the welding distorted a couple of the cylinders, block was a 4.440 so 4.150 was the next size everything would clean up at.

Re: how thin can you bore a sleeved engine? [Re: dthemi] #2689590
08/19/19 10:54 PM
08/19/19 10:54 PM
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 873
Missouri
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jwb123 Offline OP
super stock
jwb123  Offline OP
super stock
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Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 873
Missouri
Originally Posted by dthemi
I've been as thin as .065 before. Would depend on what you're doing with it for me. NA I wouldn't think twice about it. Nitrous, or forced, I'd be really careful with the tune. Wouldn't take much detonation to hurt it.


Nostalgia super stock, so yes its NA, Thanks I was just wondering how thin you could go.

Re: how thin can you bore a sleeved engine? [Re: Dragula] #2689591
08/19/19 10:57 PM
08/19/19 10:57 PM
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 873
Missouri
J
jwb123 Offline OP
super stock
jwb123  Offline OP
super stock
J

Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 873
Missouri
Originally Posted by Dragula
How do you get one with nice thick sleeves......

Been wanting to go back to aluminum, and it seems the Indy is the only game in town......This was our complaint. Our block, as received at 4.490 bore had .011 taper and .008 out of round.

That block was the worst machining.....Some of us are not made of money, nor do we like to sit out season after season.

I have called to get a KB time and time again.....They have nothing....nothing in stock, no timing, no status.....nothing.

I would never go that thin with a big arm in it. Ours scuffed out the thrust side of the cylinder wall cross hatch with a 4.75 arm in it...The pistons are so short they shingle in the bore and rub out the cross hatch. If you go thin, keep a shorter arm in it so the piston skirts are longer.

Machining has to be dead nuts with .002 clearance in an aluminum motor......Our CI block, no issues, had it apart a couple times now for other reasons. Bores are gorgeous. But you can't get a CI block.....

Yes I know, I bought this world products block 10 years ago and its been a good one. So I had to fix it, as you say nothing to replace it with. I called world products and they said sometime this summer they were planning to start making blocks again, and wanted $500.00 to reserve your spot when they start making them again, and at over $6,000.00 I just decided to spend a couple grand fixing mine.

Re: how thin can you bore a sleeved engine? [Re: jwb123] #2689712
08/20/19 12:16 PM
08/20/19 12:16 PM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 12,383
Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
Dragula Offline
I Live Here
Dragula  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: May 2004
Posts: 12,383
Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
We have had a couple World blocks. As long as they don't drill the head deck holes into the water jacket, I would buy another in a heartbeat. We have a CI one in the car now, and it's been a great block.


'70 Cuda,...605 EFI Hemi Street Car (6.20 best pass, 1.33 60ft)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYw6RA-k5Bk (6.25 at 108.75mph from inside car)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zQEb9uxFng (6.25 at 108mph from outside car)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCvfzsC4NgM (9.9)

'66 Barracuda AWB Stretched nose Blown 440 Car in build stage

'71 Duster Drag Car 400 Low Deck 512 best 6.002 at 115.44mph
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Znuo3jMUXTk






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