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Re: 4 speed install, cutting input shaft [Re: MoonshineMattK] #2685399
08/07/19 04:26 PM
08/07/19 04:26 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 32,884
Grand Prairie,Texas
stumpy Offline
I Win
stumpy  Offline
I Win

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 32,884
Grand Prairie,Texas
JK I wasn't referring to you. I know you know your stuff.

Re: 4 speed install, cutting input shaft [Re: RMCHRGR] #2685401
08/07/19 04:31 PM
08/07/19 04:31 PM
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Posts: 1,023
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dan9 Offline
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Have you tried jacking it up near the bell housing and hooking up the clutch linkage? Sometimes releasing the disc will correct some misalignment.

Re: 4 speed install, cutting input shaft [Re: John_Kunkel] #2685457
08/07/19 06:58 PM
08/07/19 06:58 PM
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,890
Spahn Ranch
RMCHRGR Offline OP
top fuel
RMCHRGR  Offline OP
top fuel

Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,890
Spahn Ranch
Originally Posted by John_Kunkel
There's a difference between being a naysayer (it can't be so) and being a skeptic (show me).

The OP states he has a '68 crank which would be forged. The typical forged crank flange is shown in the diagram below. Both the initial drilling and the final bore are sufficient in diameter and depth to clear the .750" pilot on a 833.

Yes, some later cranks have only a "divot" instead of a drilled hole but I've never seen (not the same as saying it can't be) a '68 like that, that's why I asked for a pic...for my own edification.


Pic below as requested. To my knowledge, the crank is 1968 OE.

Based on the drawing above, I'm starting almost 3/4" short of the minimum 8.75" depth requirement for a stock length input shaft. The overall depth I got was 8.437" measured from the back of the bell to the deepest part of the crank bore. In reality, that depth was even less since you have to subtract some length because the hole becomes conical at the bottom. There's probably a point in every crank where even the stock length/diameter input shaft snout wont fit whether the depth is correct or not. It's tough to discern exactly how much deeper the hole gets after it starts to taper but it's more than .125".

Anyway...

The input shaft on my unit measured 8.625" which is the generally accepted stock length. Add .125" for tip clearance and there's your 8.75" minimum required depth.

So when you convert an automatic car with a crank that's almost .75" shallower than what you need and you're using a bearing rather than a bushing which moves that distance further back towards the trans., you wind up where I'm at having to either drill the crank or cut the shaft. I frankly have no interest in removing the bearing so the shaft goes under the knife.

Could I order a bearing removal tool from Eberg and do it that way? Sure. But hey, I'm lazy and cut corners left and right so buying a tool to properly remove the bearing, waiting three days for it to arrive, chucking it up in the crank and using it, cleaning the grease from everywhere after it's out and then drilling a blind hole for however long it takes to get the depth I need is not happening.

pilot hole .jpg

'71 Duster
'17 Ram 1500
Re: 4 speed install, cutting input shaft [Re: RMCHRGR] #2685479
08/07/19 07:51 PM
08/07/19 07:51 PM
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dan9 Offline
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To remove a bushing you can pack it full of grease and get a proper sized wooden dowel rod, tap on it and they come right out. I’m not sure if it works with a bearing but it should.

Re: 4 speed install, cutting input shaft [Re: dan9] #2685500
08/07/19 09:13 PM
08/07/19 09:13 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 20,149
Park Forest, IL
slantzilla Offline
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Park Forest, IL
Cut the input and enjoy driving your car. boogie


"Everybody funny, now you funny too."
Re: 4 speed install, cutting input shaft [Re: slantzilla] #2685540
08/07/19 10:43 PM
08/07/19 10:43 PM
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 10,550
Rittman Ohio
fourgearsavoy Offline
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Rittman Ohio
Originally Posted by slantzilla
Cut the input and enjoy driving your car. boogie

iagree I tried drilling the Eagle crank in my engine and I couldn't even get a bit to go into the metal and I tried 3 different brands and no deal. I now have a Richmond 5 speed and an 18 spline four speed with about 3/4" taken off the end of the pilot.

Gus beer


64 Plymouth Savoy
493 Indy EZ's by Nick at Compu-Flow
5-Speed Richmond faceplate Liberty box
Dana 60
Re: 4 speed install, cutting input shaft [Re: fourgearsavoy] #2685548
08/07/19 11:00 PM
08/07/19 11:00 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 32,884
Grand Prairie,Texas
stumpy Offline
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Grand Prairie,Texas
I think I remember driving out the bearing using grease and a 1/2" drive short extension. The big end in the crank hole. But I am old and the memory is failing.

Re: 4 speed install, cutting input shaft [Re: stumpy] #2685841
08/08/19 09:46 PM
08/08/19 09:46 PM
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,890
Spahn Ranch
RMCHRGR Offline OP
top fuel
RMCHRGR  Offline OP
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,890
Spahn Ranch
Cut the input shaft another 3/8" and the trans went in like it was supposed to without bottoming out. Does not appear to be any other potential binding since I was able to thread the bell and the cross member bolts easily. I may try to figure out how much clearance there is between the tip of the input and the bottom of the hole before it's all torqued down. Or, I might not.

No other parts were harmed during the installation.


'71 Duster
'17 Ram 1500
Re: 4 speed install, cutting input shaft [Re: RMCHRGR] #2685868
08/08/19 11:27 PM
08/08/19 11:27 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,007
Bend,OR USA
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Cab_Burge Offline
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If you have end play on the out put shaft in neutral your probably good on the input shat to crankshaft clearances work scope up
If the input shaft was contacting the crankshaft it would take up any end play in the tranny, correct work twocents


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: 4 speed install, cutting input shaft [Re: RMCHRGR] #2686573
08/11/19 05:46 PM
08/11/19 05:46 PM
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Posts: 1,023
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dan9 Offline
super stock
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If it is bottoming out you will know it. If it bottoms out you won't be able to shift gears even with the clutch pushed in because the input shaft will be turning. If it let's you shift then all is well.

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