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Re: Opinions for a 440 based race only engine [Re: Digger73] #2520388
07/11/18 09:32 AM
07/11/18 09:32 AM
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Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...
gregsdart Offline
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As i reread this post it sounds to me like your oiling system may be inadequate. What ever you do, set up some form of warning system for oil pressure below 30 psi or HIGHER. With what you have discribed as an engine package, i would think you need a ten quart well baffled pan, and maybe an acusump system with another couple of quarts to stay out of trouble when braking!

Last edited by gregsdart; 07/11/18 09:33 AM.

8..603 156 mph best, 2905 lbs 549, indy 572-13, alky
Re: Opinions for a 440 based race only engine [Re: gregsdart] #2520521
07/11/18 02:14 PM
07/11/18 02:14 PM
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Originally Posted By gregsdart
As i reread this post it sounds to me like your oiling system may be inadequate. What ever you do, set up some form of warning system for oil pressure below 30 psi or HIGHER. With what you have discribed as an engine package, i would think you need a ten quart well baffled pan, and maybe an acusump system with another couple of quarts to stay out of trouble when braking!


I'm trying to understand why he would need all that when I've been running a basic 8 qt. Moroso pan usually with 6 qts. in it and a windage tray street driving the hell outta my car forever and zero issues past 7000 rpms.......... work

Last edited by Thumperdart; 07/11/18 02:14 PM.

72 Dart 470 n/a BB stroker street car `THUMPER`...Check me out on FB Dominic Thumper for videos and lots of carb pics......760-900-3895.....
Re: Opinions for a 440 based race only engine [Re: Digger73] #2520768
07/11/18 10:29 PM
07/11/18 10:29 PM
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Nevada
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merpar Offline
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The difference is street driving vs drag racing. G-forces!

Check out Tech talk written by David Reher article #74. He has a lot of really good tech articles. Good read.

Re: Opinions for a 440 based race only engine [Re: Digger73] #2521656
07/13/18 10:42 PM
07/13/18 10:42 PM
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Portland, Oregon
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Digger73 Offline OP
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Ok, I got the bottom end taken apart. I am thinking that the bearings that were coated with a friction reducing powder coating made the clearances too tight. The black on the Thrust bearing is the remains of the coating.
So, is the crank worth saving? Can the rods be safely ran after they got this hot? Moral of this story is don't listen to someone that is trying to sell powder coating and has no idea about engine clearance.

Digger73 (Mike)

IMAG1089_2.jpgIMAG1091_2.jpgIMAG1094_2.jpgIMAG1092_2.jpg

I live with fear everyday but, sometimes she lets me race!
Re: Opinions for a 440 based race only engine [Re: Digger73] #2521662
07/13/18 11:17 PM
07/13/18 11:17 PM
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pittsburghracer Offline
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They only sell the coating. The engine builder is responsible for checking and setting engine clearances


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422 Indy headed small block
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Re: Opinions for a 440 based race only engine [Re: Digger73] #2521686
07/14/18 12:40 AM
07/14/18 12:40 AM
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sam64 Offline
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I would be more worried about all that blue silicone!

Re: Opinions for a 440 based race only engine [Re: Digger73] #2521703
07/14/18 01:40 AM
07/14/18 01:40 AM
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Haul the whole thing down to Grays Automotive in McMinnville and let him set it up for you. Looks to me like you have some good parts but it wasn't set up properly. Now you probably need to have the crank ground and buy new bearings. Might need to hone the cylinders too. Looks like the clearances were too tight everywhere in that engine?

Have Grays assemble the engine for you and then do a dyno test before you put it back in the car. That way you'll know it is good and ready to run.

Last edited by AndyF; 07/14/18 01:42 AM.
Re: Opinions for a 440 based race only engine [Re: pittsburghracer] #2521787
07/14/18 01:06 PM
07/14/18 01:06 PM
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Digger73 Offline OP
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Originally Posted By pittsburghracer
They only sell the coating. The engine builder is responsible for checking and setting engine clearances


Sadly, the one I have to blame for this is myself. I assembled the engine.
When it was going together the clearance on the bearings was in spec but on the tight side. I should have stopped and bought new bearings at that time.

Digger73 (Mike)


I live with fear everyday but, sometimes she lets me race!
Re: Opinions for a 440 based race only engine [Re: sam64] #2521788
07/14/18 01:08 PM
07/14/18 01:08 PM
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Digger73 Offline OP
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Originally Posted By sam64
I would be more worried about all that blue silicone!


I know there is alot but that was what I was told to use to seal the block to the main griddle. There was no leak and the Oberg showed no signs of silicone so no harm there.

Digger73 (Mike)


I live with fear everyday but, sometimes she lets me race!
Re: Opinions for a 440 based race only engine [Re: AndyF] #2521791
07/14/18 01:11 PM
07/14/18 01:11 PM
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Digger73 Offline OP
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Originally Posted By AndyF
Haul the whole thing down to Grays Automotive in McMinnville and let him set it up for you. Looks to me like you have some good parts but it wasn't set up properly. Now you probably need to have the crank ground and buy new bearings. Might need to hone the cylinders too. Looks like the clearances were too tight everywhere in that engine?

Have Grays assemble the engine for you and then do a dyno test before you put it back in the car. That way you'll know it is good and ready to run.


Thank you Andy. I am still sort of new to this area and had no idea what shop to trust.
Do you think the rods are salvageable? They have hot spots from the bearings.

Digger73 (Mike)


I live with fear everyday but, sometimes she lets me race!
Re: Opinions for a 440 based race only engine [Re: Digger73] #2521821
07/14/18 02:31 PM
07/14/18 02:31 PM
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AndyF Offline
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You need to get it to a good shop who has experience setting up race engines so they can check everything out. The stuff that got hot needs to be checked for cracks, size and straightness. I can't tell from the pictures what is good and what isn't but I've torn enough of that stuff down over the years to know that it all needs to be carefully cleaned and inspected. Box it all up and take it over to Grays or you could go to King and Larsen down in Wilsonville. Both shops do a lot of race engines.

Re: Opinions for a 440 based race only engine [Re: Digger73] #2522004
07/15/18 01:03 AM
07/15/18 01:03 AM
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Missouri U.S.A.
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Load the stuff up and take it to a reputable machine shop. By the pictures, the crank doesn’t really look that bad to me. Most of the stroker cranks I’ve installed have had the bearing clearances way on the tight side. I’m betting that’s what has happened here. Heck, you might just be able to inspect the crank for cracks and excessive wear and if all checks ok, and give it a polish and install new bearings that provide proper clearance and go.


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Re: Opinions for a 440 based race only engine [Re: 71yelladustr] #2679534
07/20/19 07:38 PM
07/20/19 07:38 PM
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Digger73 Offline OP
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Well I know it has been a long time but I finally got my engine back together. The rods and Crank were redone by the same machinist that Andy F suggested.
I have to give him two thumbs way up to him. He did a first rate job in fact maybe too good! I just got back from Woodburn. They told me not to come back until I am ready to license!
The car is a 1970 Plymouth Road Runner. Please ignore the Reaction times... Thanks to all that made suggestions and gave me input.
BTW this is the first time the car has ever been on the track.

Digger73 (Mike)

IMAG1230.jpg

I live with fear everyday but, sometimes she lets me race!
Re: Opinions for a 440 based race only engine [Re: Digger73] #2679545
07/20/19 08:27 PM
07/20/19 08:27 PM
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AndyF Offline
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That car is honking for a '70 RR. Looks like you're making really good power and the car is hooking up pretty well too. Are you taking the car to Woodburn tomorrow for the Mopar Nats? Paul and I will be there in the swap meet area.

Re: Opinions for a 440 based race only engine [Re: AndyF] #2679556
07/20/19 08:52 PM
07/20/19 08:52 PM
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Digger73 Offline OP
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Well I will be there with the car but I was told I can't run it until I am ready to license.
I would love for you and Paul to stop by and take a look at my car.
I will be running my daily driver a 2018 Challenger Scat Pack.
My Challenger is white with blue strips.
Hope to see you there.

Digger73 (Mike)


I live with fear everyday but, sometimes she lets me race!
Re: Opinions for a 440 based race only engine [Re: Digger73] #2679569
07/20/19 09:10 PM
07/20/19 09:10 PM
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Thigh-Gap Junction
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Take some timing out of it or disconnect the secondaries. Promise you slowed it down and they should let you run.



Originally Posted by Digger73
Well I will be there with the car but I was told I can't run it until I am ready to license.
I would love for you and Paul to stop by and take a look at my car.
I will be running my daily driver a 2018 Challenger Scat Pack.
My Challenger is white with blue strips.
Hope to see you there.

Digger73 (Mike)

Re: Opinions for a 440 based race only engine [Re: Digger73] #2679595
07/20/19 10:47 PM
07/20/19 10:47 PM
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Bend,OR USA
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There are many ways to slow a car down at the track, short shift it by 500 to 800 RPM, over rev it several hundred RPM above the best shift point, let off the off the throttle on the other end or on the starting line 30 to 50 ft. from the starting line. Put weight in it, put more air in the rear tires, deep stage the same every run, lots of options to slow the car down up


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: Opinions for a 440 based race only engine [Re: Cab_Burge] #2679601
07/20/19 11:02 PM
07/20/19 11:02 PM
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Portland, Oregon
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Digger73 Offline OP
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The next option is that I am going to see if I can start my licensing tomorrow.

Digger73 (Mike)


I live with fear everyday but, sometimes she lets me race!
Re: Opinions for a 440 based race only engine [Re: Digger73] #2679619
07/21/19 01:12 AM
07/21/19 01:12 AM
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Bend,OR USA
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I'll be glad to watch and sign off on your runs if you can make some of them tomorrow up
I'm bringing my B5 1970 Cuda S/P #678C car to try and find a new owner for that rascal luck


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: Opinions for a 440 based race only engine [Re: Cab_Burge] #2679652
07/21/19 08:16 AM
07/21/19 08:16 AM
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Digger73 Offline OP
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Thanks Cab! That is something I was sort of worried about.
See you there.

Digger73 (Mike)


I live with fear everyday but, sometimes she lets me race!
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