I am thinking of building a 500 inch 440 based engine for my 300G.It will have a 62 727 w/parking drum behind it. Stock valve covers are a must and a hyd cam. The factory long ram or if I can find the "short" version intake. Pump gas,3.23,29" tires. Unforntunetley probably stealth heads and shorty headers,3" full exhaust. How much would the extra cubes tame these intakes? Rod length same question? Camshaft? 4300# curb wt. I full well realize this is no racecar but I don't want it to nose over at 3500 either. Difficult unusual question I know but any thoughts? thanks, Steve

I've never messed with them but I thought that the long ram tubes were tuned for low rpm. On a 500 incher I would think it would be more even lower. I personally don't think that rod length plays a role unless you are looking at from a bob-weight standpoint. On the cam I would look at it this way 413 to 500 is 22% larger. So I would take the factory specs on the cam and do this say 213 at .050 on the intake (just a guess) so 213 * 1.22 is 259.86 then take that difference and split it 260-213= 47
then divide that by 2 gives you 23.5 and add that to the original 213 witch comes out to 236 at .050 . You could do the same with the valve
lift and be somewhere around .550 lift (again just guessing .495) and on the lobe sep. I would stay at or above 110. I must have had a little too much coffee sorry.

Why are the Stealth heads unfortunate?

I am not a guru on long rams, but had a 300F in HS, mounted a set of long rams on my 62 Polara 500 413, and currently have a set on the shelf to install on my replica 62 Polara. I don't believe the extra cubes will lower the manifold tuning, but it will restrict the power band, as the engine will effectively starve for air at a lower rpm. The long rams IMO are rather restrictive flow wise. There is info on line how to DIY modify the long ram tuning to the short ram version, which I will attempt. I am going to efi the manifolds at the same time, as being a wet manifold I suspect, is a big culprit in carb tuning. I from the onset will concede anything over 5K rpm will be pointless. Torque can be fun.

And, if any motor would need or benefit from a hydraulic roller, this has got to be the one, heavy lifters, low speed operation, ability to open/close fast because of the need to assist max flow with a restricted intake.

Yeah, the heads are probably perfect for what you are doing, and look stock like your stock valve covers and long tube intake you plan to run. But yes, what is unfortunate is that the shorty headers are probably the only shelf header that will fit that car.

Sounds like a cool project for sure

Chrysler made three different sets of the "long ram" intakes, long, medium and short divider
That difference made those motors peak at different RPMs on both torque and HP

The last version on the 413 max out at torque@4000+-RPM
and HP at 5000-5300 ish RPM
Not a big performer on a 500 inch but impressive to look at.If you are going that route use a small cam.

You won't need the 3 inch exhaust. 2 1/4 or 2 1/2 will work fine, cost less, fit better and probably sound better in that car.

Cab, they only made two versions of the long ram-intakes.

Steve,
I have exactly that, a 500ci longram engine in my 1960 New Yorker.
Edelbrock heads, shorty headers.
CompCam XR274R-10 – Mechanical roller cam
Adv.dur. 274°/280°, Lift .564"/.570"

Engine is built for torque.

Well then, you have the perfect example, so when does it run out upper RPM steam so to speak?

What would you different if you had to do it all over again?

Screw physics, I prefer real world

I first started out with a 'almost' bone-stock cam in this engine.
Engine pulled like a freight train.

But driveline-vibrations prevented me from driving anything above 80-90mph.

I've ran this setup with 3.91 rear gears and 3.23 gears... The combo liked the 3.23 gears much better, which could tell you the engine doesn't liked to rev.

After a few years, I got 'bored' with the stock sounding engine and installed a XR274 solid roller which I bought from this site used.
Mostly fixed the driveline balance-issues, but there's still some left.

With the roller cam, the engine idle went lopey, the stock stall convertor got a real workout, and the engine felt stronger and liked to spend more time in the higher rpms, while still being a torque-monster.

Two-foot driving is mandatory...

Only thing that I'm still fighting with, is underhood temps.
The roller cam creates more cylinder-pressure and when the engine bay is warmed up, the engine wants to ping.
This is partly a carb(s) issue (bit lean), but mainly also underhood temps, as the engine never pings with a cold engine bay.

Anything I want to change?
- Install a slightly higher stall convertor;
- Maybe add an electric vacuum pump for the power brakes, but the brake-system first needs a smaller diameter MC;
- Add EFI; digital timing and port-injection, or LPG as fuel, which would bring back drivabillity at cold starts.

Do you still have the OEM exhaust/intake warmer plumbing still functioning/in place?

I would think the intakes, even run "wet", would be subject to underhood heat soak. Wonder if as an experiment, by "wrapping/insulating" them on a temporary basis it might counter some "ping" issues.

Is this a "stock" Compression motor?

No, there's nothing under the carb-bowls.
The heat of the headers, and aluminium heads, radiate into the aluminium long rams quite easily, so 'entire' engine bay cooling needs to be considered.

I might also plan to wrap the headers. A double sided heatbarrier coating would be better on the headers I think, but the costs are about 2-3 times the price of the headers alone.

Been also thinking of louvering the hood, to vent out hot air, but that would be a bit extreme perhaps.

Engine compression is (around) 10.2:1cr I recall.
I know I did some cc'-ing and calculations at the time, but lost or didn't write notes. I have some info on my site about this built, but I recently noticed I somehow managed to mix up 2 engine builds do that needs to be sorted out again one day.

Pistons are ROSS with 10.5:1cr spec.
The 440 block is +.030" and the OOTB Edelbrock heads are spec'd at 84cc.
.039" FelPro headgaskets.

How about ditching the hood for a test run?
Problem is, the rad will likely lose some airflow and worsen your issue.

I forgot about your headers. Wrapping them, unless SS tubes, will soon lead to their failure, not a good solution IMO. Maybe an under manifold heat shield with air gap?

I removed the under carb manifold heat chambers on mine to gain some clearance.

Any way to get just cooler intake air to the motor?

Recently during a cold spell here, I took the NewYorker out for a drive and even after some highway driving and back into town, the engine didn't ping when getting on the throttle.

The pass.side would be rather easy to fab a coldair-intake, but the driverside is very crowded and hard to come up with something functional unless I relocate the battery.

(Sorry for the topic-hijack Steve)

Thanks for all the good replies and yes I am wanting to keep it stock appearing so the Chinese heads it will be. The physics aspect was on rod length would the increased dwell time of a longer rod play hell with the sono/ram effect or not and opinions on valve timing and cam advancing. As noted this things tongue will be hanging out by 5200 if it makes it that far but torque should be great. Herman of course I have seen your cars on the Fl site for years and the issues with the surging, I asked over here so I wouldn't get beat up, you would think I was chopping the top and metalflaking it. Helluva crew that replied, Thanks.

One of the Petersen publishing group magazines(maybe Road and track or (EDITED Car and Driver) did a write up on the all Chrysler corp. cross ram intake manifolds a long time ago, they showed all three versions of the long rams
Yours look like the original 1959 and possibly part of the 1960 Chrysler 300 letter car manifold, according to my memory they said Chrysler started shortening up the divider wall in mid 1960 production year and ended up with the shorter designed ones later, maybe only 3 or 4 inches different in length between the medium and short ones

How many bolts do 1961 413 valve covers have? Stock 440 has 6, the early 413's had 4 but I'm not sure when they changed.

Kevin

On my 62 Polara that I grafted long rams on,I ran a mild Crane cam that i haven't clue what the specs were, and then IMO as a teenager decided to help the long rams out, I ran 60's state of "the art latest thing", called the Varicam. Can't tell you how any of it really worked out, as college and girls started to get a lot more attention.

All the BB Mopar motors switch to the six bolt valve covers and heads with the cast in rocker shaft stands in 1964