Re: Throttle response and Low speed performance in a 440 stick.
[Re: 2264PLY]
#2446528
02/04/18 09:56 PM
02/04/18 09:56 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,294 Someplace you aren't
SomeCarGuy
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Bolt on stockish street car with a raceish cam. Seems straight forward and predictable to me. Who put that cam in and why? I didn’t see porting mentioned and if you are expecting to turn higher rpm with a cam like that I’d think you’d use 1 7/8 headers. Just looks like a mismatched cam and nothing more. I wouldn’t bother advancing that one.
I want my fair share
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Re: Throttle response and Low speed performance in a 440 stick.
[Re: 2264PLY]
#2446537
02/04/18 10:15 PM
02/04/18 10:15 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,890 Pittsburgh,PA
RTSrunner
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I haven't checked the cranking compression.The rear tire is a 275/60/R15.The trans is an older 18 spline which I believe has the original 1st gear in it. I'm guilty of tuning it like my automatics.The post has opened up my mind a little more. I just have to do the homework. A 275/60/15 is a tall tire,try a 295/50/15 it will be a bit shorter and help gearing but you may need wider wheels. I agree on checking cranking compression and either advancing the cam if possible or a milder stick as suggested.
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Re: Throttle response and Low speed performance in a 440 stick.
[Re: RTSrunner]
#2446646
02/05/18 02:00 AM
02/05/18 02:00 AM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 21,909 Kirkland, Washington
Pacnorthcuda
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I haven't checked the cranking compression.The rear tire is a 275/60/R15.The trans is an older 18 spline which I believe has the original 1st gear in it. I'm guilty of tuning it like my automatics.The post has opened up my mind a little more. I just have to do the homework. A 275/60/15 is a tall tire,try a 295/50/15 it will be a bit shorter and help gearing but you may need wider wheels. I agree on checking cranking compression and either advancing the cam if possible or a milder stick as suggested. Yea, ditch your wheels and tires to go from 275/60's to 295/50's. Good Lord.
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Re: Throttle response and Low speed performance in a 440 stick.
[Re: Pacnorthcuda]
#2446682
02/05/18 03:04 AM
02/05/18 03:04 AM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,890 Pittsburgh,PA
RTSrunner
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I haven't checked the cranking compression.The rear tire is a 275/60/R15.The trans is an older 18 spline which I believe has the original 1st gear in it. I'm guilty of tuning it like my automatics.The post has opened up my mind a little more. I just have to do the homework. A 275/60/15 is a tall tire,try a 295/50/15 it will be a bit shorter and help gearing but you may need wider wheels. I agree on checking cranking compression and either advancing the cam if possible or a milder stick as suggested. Yea, ditch your wheels and tires to go from 275/60's to 295/50's. Good Lord. A shorter tire was my main point from a gearing aspect,but you probably knew that
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Re: Throttle response and Low speed performance in a 440 stick.
[Re: 2264PLY]
#2446961
02/05/18 05:43 PM
02/05/18 05:43 PM
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,261 IL
furious70
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IL
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that tire change would be the same as changing to a 3.73 gear - it would help some but probably not as much as you'd hope. only a 5.18% change.
70 Sport Fury 68 Charger 69 Coronet 72 RR
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Re: Throttle response and Low speed performance in a 440 stick.
[Re: SportF]
#2446980
02/05/18 06:19 PM
02/05/18 06:19 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,492 Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda
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A lot of sophisticated answers here. Why not try something real easy like bumping that timing up to 36-38 degrees. Just try it. Then work on the acceleration rich factor. Bump the timing up to 38° and it'll wake up. My dad's road runner has 3.54 gears, hemi 4 speed, and a 10:1 440 w/ the 509/292 cam w/ 6 pack induction. It is a blast on the street and will roast the 275-60 tires. Has much better driveability than I expected it to have. I even put the cam in straight up instead of 4° advanced like most do. Timing is locked out at 38°.
CHIP '70 hemicuda, 575" Hemi, 727, Dana 60 '69 road runner, 440-6, 4 speed, Dana 60 '71 Demon 340, no drivetrain, on blocks behind the barn '73 Chrysler New Yorker, 440, 727, 8.75 '90 Chevy 454SS Silverado, 476" BBC, TH400, 14 bolt '06 GMC 2500HD LBZ Duramax
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Re: Throttle response and Low speed performance in a 440 stick.
[Re: an8sec70cuda]
#2447175
02/05/18 11:56 PM
02/05/18 11:56 PM
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 10,607 Rittman Ohio
fourgearsavoy
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I know my combo is a bit differn't with Indy EZ heads but my engine screams from 2000-5000 and my passengers are looking for something to hold onto I have a 3.54 gear and 2.66 low gear 4-speed with 29" tall tires. I've got a Performer RPM,Quickfuel 1050 4150 carb, Firecore distributor set at 24* base and 34* total all in at 2200. The cam is a very mild solid Comp grind XTQ series with 1.5 rockers. I just touch the pedal and the tires are smokin Gus
64 Plymouth Savoy 493 Indy EZ's by Nick at Compu-Flow 5-Speed Richmond faceplate Liberty box Dana 60
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Re: Throttle response and Low speed performance in a 440 stick.
[Re: 2264PLY]
#2447237
02/06/18 01:32 AM
02/06/18 01:32 AM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 8,793 Mt.Gilead, Ohio
OhioMopar
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Interesting thread. How much do you drive the car and where? Freeway? Just to cruise nights? Sounds like a bit much on the cam side to me. I've also heard the 3.54 gear wasn't a great performer down low for cars not set up to overcome the gear. I think changing tires to the 295/60 will help the pep, but I don't think you will like it if you drive it any significant distances.
1969 Dart GTS 340 1969 Coronet R/T X9 N-96 1999 Dodge Dakota R/T RC 2015 Dodge Dart GT 2019 Ram 2500 Big Horn
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Re: Throttle response and Low speed performance in a 440 stick.
[Re: 2264PLY]
#2447461
02/06/18 05:11 PM
02/06/18 05:11 PM
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,495 Shelby mi.
JAKE68
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Shelby mi.
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All good recommendations here but they are stuff to try and band aid a problem of wrong combo of parts. Carb is not too big ,timing is safe where it is at , gear is good street gear, tires are not too big. cam is wrong!!! probably wants more compression and port work to utilize that cam. change cam to one that fits the rest of your combo better and you will be happy.
JAKES AUTOMOTIVE
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Re: Throttle response and Low speed performance in a 440 stick.
[Re: Pacnorthcuda]
#2447729
02/06/18 11:17 PM
02/06/18 11:17 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,890 Pittsburgh,PA
RTSrunner
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Without the OP providing more info about the cars powerband vs what he's looking for, the biggest (by far) problem with it not performing the way he wants is....
THE CAM IS TOO BIG. Agreed.
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Re: Throttle response and Low speed performance in a 440 stick.
[Re: 2264PLY]
#2447779
02/07/18 12:09 AM
02/07/18 12:09 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,591 Canton, Ohio
Sport440
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A few things have gone through my mind. The weight of the rotating assembly and the length of the stroke. I've had 383s that had better throttle response and low speed performance. I've thought about advancing the cam. I've had good results with that in the past. It's a heavy car and I'd like to keep the 3.54 gear in it. That in itself presents a bit of a challenge. In this situation it seems like the automatic is more forgiving. Anxious to try some different things and hoping to get the chance soon. Where have you been brother, Lots of input and some questions to help. But you've been I guess. Don't worry about the rotating assembly or stroke length. That's the Hard stuff to fix. Even with the best tune the 253*@ .050 cam is going to be a dog below 3500RPM, with a stick, Well unless you dump the clutch and let her rip. With a high stall vert automatic you can make it work. IMO, a smaller cam change. But it looks like you've decided to bow out of this thread. If your tunes fine, Cam change is your Best bet. Rotating assembly, stroke length. Shouldn't even be in the mix of thoughts for your fix.
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Re: Throttle response and Low speed performance in a 440 stick.
[Re: ahy]
#2447802
02/07/18 12:45 AM
02/07/18 12:45 AM
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,565 tennessee
pushbutton
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Suggest you go down 20-30 degrees... 222-235 @.050 range to get the low and mid range torque back. A
This.^^
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Re: Throttle response and Low speed performance in a 440 stick.
[Re: 2264PLY]
#2447807
02/07/18 01:01 AM
02/07/18 01:01 AM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 12,675 Columbia, CT
moper
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Simple. Cam's too big for what you want to have for other parts, and how you're driving it. Simple parts mismatch.
Well, art is art, isn't it? Still, on the other hand, water is water! And east is east and west is west and if you take cranberries and stew them like applesauce they taste much more like prunes than rhubarb does. Now, uh... Now you tell me what you know.
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