Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft?
[Re: Cab_Burge]
#2342228
07/24/17 12:31 AM
07/24/17 12:31 AM
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,137 Byron, NY
W.I.N. Racing
top fuel
|
top fuel
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,137
Byron, NY
|
My 525(4.5" X 4.310.) motor with a big roller hit the rods when it wasn't degreed. Once it was set no problem with clearance... the lobe juts squeaks past the rod though.
'01 P1500, Blown/Inj BAE,/Veney ,Bruno/CS2,Dana 60 '01 Dodge 3500 S Cummins Auto, Fresh air kit, 4" Exhaust, '05 Dodge Magnum R/T - Too Much to list '60 Willys CJ5 '01 International LPX - Project,DT466, Allison '64 Plymouth Valiant, Inj 528 Hemi, 2spd
|
|
|
Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft?
[Re: gregsdart]
#2342973
07/25/17 11:42 AM
07/25/17 11:42 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,544 Las Vegas
Al_Alguire
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,544
Las Vegas
|
Cab having to clearance a rod or bolt is not unusual at all. It is common practice on many engine combos done by big name race engine shops everyday, it is nothing out of the norm. Guess those names most know are just backyard hacks too I would also suggest especially for the combo you are building to remove all but #1 and degree the cam in and recheck. You may be ok then but maybe not. If you have to clearance the rods a bit it is not a big deal
"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."
"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
|
|
|
Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft?
[Re: Al_Alguire]
#2343064
07/25/17 02:18 PM
07/25/17 02:18 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,273 PA.
pittsburghracer
"Little"John
|
"Little"John
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,273
PA.
|
Maybe that's the reason I'm burning out on the sport after 42 plus years. I rairly pay anyone to do my work and I don't grind on rods, rod bolts, tap oil pans while on the car, or other shortcuts the experts say is common practice. I take it apart and fix the issues.
1970 Duster Edelbrock headed 408 5.984@112.52 422 Indy headed small block 5.982@112.56 mph 9.38@138.67
Livin and lovin life one day at a time
|
|
|
Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft?
[Re: Cab_Burge]
#2343633
07/26/17 12:44 PM
07/26/17 12:44 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,539 So. Burlington, Vt.
fast68plymouth
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,539
So. Burlington, Vt.
|
I guess if you buy rods where they come out of the box "stroker clearanced" it's fine....... But if you modify the rod in the same manor yourself its a "hack job".
I'll have to make a note of that.
68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123 Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
|
|
|
Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft?
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#2343642
07/26/17 01:09 PM
07/26/17 01:09 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,544 Las Vegas
Al_Alguire
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,544
Las Vegas
|
Maybe that's the reason I'm burning out on the sport after 42 plus years. I rairly pay anyone to do my work and I don't grind on rods, rod bolts, tap oil pans while on the car, or other shortcuts the experts say is common practice. I take it apart and fix the issues. You don't need to beat around the bush. The fact you do not personally do any of this is fine by me. I really have no issue with it. Just because many others are willing to do things different from your way does not make them wrong either....
"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."
"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
|
|
|
Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft?
[Re: Al_Alguire]
#2343656
07/26/17 01:28 PM
07/26/17 01:28 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,273 PA.
pittsburghracer
"Little"John
|
"Little"John
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,273
PA.
|
Some guys will thinks it's ok to clearance them in the block and don't say ohhh no that would never happen. I've personally watched guy's grind and continue on with their builds like nothing happened. Lol. The masking tape will catch everything
1970 Duster Edelbrock headed 408 5.984@112.52 422 Indy headed small block 5.982@112.56 mph 9.38@138.67
Livin and lovin life one day at a time
|
|
|
Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft?
[Re: Porter67]
#2343832
07/26/17 06:48 PM
07/26/17 06:48 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,273 PA.
pittsburghracer
"Little"John
|
"Little"John
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,273
PA.
|
Maybe golf or something might be a better choice, but it looks like after 42 years of racing you have become closed minded and bitter.
Go pull the wings off some flies, legs off ants, set a cat on fire, not everyone does things the same way and that dont make them wrong or bad.
Go grind some rods
1970 Duster Edelbrock headed 408 5.984@112.52 422 Indy headed small block 5.982@112.56 mph 9.38@138.67
Livin and lovin life one day at a time
|
|
|
Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft?
[Re: Porter67]
#2343848
07/26/17 07:15 PM
07/26/17 07:15 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,273 PA.
pittsburghracer
"Little"John
|
"Little"John
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,273
PA.
|
Im doing that right now But im almost out of tape. What some of you guys don't realize or think about is that on a public forum like this We have anyone from a young child wanting to learn to the experienced engine builder. Some of our guys that post often and answer lots of questions are sometimes just "parts buyers" that buy from others and have engine builders that put things together for them. Not everyone should be taking a grinder to their blocks, cranks, rods, and heads as they could do LOTS of unrepairable damage. I've seen a lot over the years and like I said above I've been there done that on my 572 Keith Black build and there was no way in heck was I going to grind when I had so much on the line.
1970 Duster Edelbrock headed 408 5.984@112.52 422 Indy headed small block 5.982@112.56 mph 9.38@138.67
Livin and lovin life one day at a time
|
|
|
Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft?
[Re: pittsburghracer]
#2343856
07/26/17 07:34 PM
07/26/17 07:34 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,376
dogdays
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,376
|
Well, you have a point, and it is valid. Just like a cylinderhead, an untutored person with a grinder can do a lot of harm. I remember a few years ago that a member used a ridge reamer and had to buy oversize pistons as the standard pistons had the top ring getting into the reamed area.
However, if the rods won't clear the camshaft or the block, what do you suggest? Buy a smaller base circle cam? Disassemble the block and send the rotating assembly out to be reground for a new set of 2.200" rods? Grind, new rods, rebalance all cost money. What about the block? If you cannot modify the block to get clearance then the whole thing comes out. What then? Buy a new block? Cut the counterweights in a lathe even though it's a heck of a job with interrupted cuts all over the place? AndyF says it can be done. Then rebalance.
Many times an experienced engine builder will grind a small bit of something to get clearance. This doesn't seem to influence longevity. I don't think they are being irresponsible.
We need to remember that an engine is just a greasy lump of cast iron and doesn't know if what you did to it was the proper method or not.
Peace to you All, R.
|
|
|
Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft?
[Re: Cab_Burge]
#2344131
07/27/17 10:22 AM
07/27/17 10:22 AM
|
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 3,097 back in Georgia
dthemi
master
|
master
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 3,097
back in Georgia
|
This a little like, "how do you cure polio without using a needle".
Big stroke, big rods, big cams = Big cuts on the rods. No way around it, and done every single day. That's why you can buy rods with cam cuts,and so on.
Ford, and Chevy, OK, we'll try it.
Mopar, no, it was perfect when it was made...
|
|
|
Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft?
[Re: dthemi]
#2344153
07/27/17 10:51 AM
07/27/17 10:51 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,924 Weddington, N.C.
Streetwize
master
|
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,924
Weddington, N.C.
|
Ran into this mocking up one of the first 427" Stroker 351 Windsor fords in the mid 90's, the combo used a 400M crank offset ground to 4.17" and the rod journals cut for mopar 340 rods. Wound up having the cam reground plus still massaging the shoulders of the bolts just a tad until I had .060" clearance.
A neat trick for mock-up is to wrap the lobe with a medium grade black (outdoor type) electrical "Zip-tie" or "Tie-Wrap" since they are almost exactly .060" thick. I also put in a Pete Jackson gear drive to eliminate the chance of chain stretch related problems down the road.
Patience is the key. It seemed frustrating at the time but I was building the Cobra so I knew fire-up was a long way off so I just "lived and learned". Since it was the first Coast High Performance stroker kit they sold so they comp'ed me some freebies (like fly-cutting my pistons for the new (at the time) Trick flow Windsor Heads, since I basically did most of their R&D for them.
I had known (from the old timers long ago) that a '5/8 Stroker (4.375" or bigger) crank in the Hemi usually wound up getting up in the cam and Paul Savadin (Paul's Crankshafts) and I had a long talk about the merits of the 2.200 BBC journals on the B/RB/hemi's for that reason as well.
Last edited by Streetwize; 07/27/17 12:50 PM.
|
|
|
|
|