Thats too bad. I thought you had found the cars and there were some anomalies that you were going to share with us.

In this case I wonder what they did back in the day at the St Louis plant? Would have they replaced the engine and tranny as a single assembly? Just the engine? Just the short block? Restamped the VIN? Did the people involved mention what cars they were? I wouldn't mind hearing more details...its not like any of the people invloved could still work at Chrylser so there can't be any harm in telling the whole story.

Thanks,
Dave

The only information I can provide in some of these scenarios, is first hand information from the Employees who were involved. Like most people who work at their daily jobs, they didn't take the time to video or take pictures of every moment of their day. All they have to offer is "anecdotal hearsay" about the situations they were involved in. One of the stories told to me involved a Hemi B Body car. There was a group of people in charge of driving the cars from the St. Louis Assembly Line to the Storage Lot. Someone wrecked the Hemi while moving it to the Lot. They never knew who actually was driving the car because it was abandoned and no one admitted to being involved. He also told me about one Employee who got caught using a front loader to dump Hemi Blocks over the back fence area and coming back after hours to steal them.

The information I provided about the Truck having a new Engine installed was actually told to me by one of the guys who was in the Truck during the trip to the Daytona 500 Parade. He too did not have anyone formally "documenting" the ordeal but I have no reason to think he falsified the story. I have other Chrysler contacts who back stories such as these and claim it was almost a weekly occurrence in the way some of these cars were sold. They were not considered iconic vehicles at that time and Chrysler did what was necessary to sell them.

WELCOME BACK SUPER

Didn't you ask any more questions? Sounds like a missed opportunity. I would be curious how at that plant, on that shift, at that point in time, how they would handle that. How bad hurt was the Hemi...was it a rod hanging out the side of the block hurt, or a spun bearing, or a bent pushrod or the coil wire falling off?

Then what would be the next step?
If it happened on the afternoon shift would the shift manager try and hide it and get the car fixed right away?
Or if it was day shift would the whole plant management get involved and create a focus group to avoid such occurances in the future?
Do they bring the car back into the plant?
Do they replace the engine and restamp it?
If they do replace it and don't restamp it and then is it still the orignal engine?
Do they take the engine out from the top or the bottom?
If while unhooking the battery cable it is distroyed and when they put the car back together with a new battery cable without any paint overspray....is that considered original?
Or if you are getting the car judged do they deduct points because its not the orignal battery cable?
Do they donate the car to a local community college?
Give it away to Sox and Martin?
Does the plant manager drive the car for awhile and do they sell it as an used car with no warranty?

It would be interesting to me if we could hear the rest of the story. Are you still able to ask the people involved some more questions?

Dave (too)

I appreciate all of the questions but you have to remember that these inquiries are being asked almost 50 years after the fact. When these things were happening, they didn't have a future knowledge of what these cars would become. I actually did ask some of those questions but most aspects were not a consideration to those guys at that particular time.

As I'm typing this, I have a couple of FCA managers sitting here discussing these topics. They mentioned a program in the seventies & eighties called OEP. (Overnight Evaluation Program) They said that select manufacturing personnel would take random cars off of the Assembly Line, prior to their final Inspection, with the odometer not yet connected and drive them Home (overnight) to find any problems with the vehicle. This was to complete the final evaluation form. If anything was found to be an issue, the vehicle would be fixed, the odometer connected, the Certification Decal applied to the car and then it would be shipped to be sold as new.

In the late eighties, Chrysler changed the policy to mandate the odometers being connected before they were driven for their finalized testing. There's more to the story but the legalities do not permit me to comment further. Sorry!

There are a few on moparts that have spent most if not all of their working careers as UAW members. It usually takes 30 years of working at these plants to get a pension and most have put in far more than the 30 years that it takes. I am just enjoying the reading that has not sparked one memory of spending time in that Dungeon called an Automotive Factory. Maybe the people that had to get their hands dirty assembling and repairing and driving saw it quite differently.

I guess that works both ways. Lots of guys I worked with told stories with great details...almost like you could picture being there and watch it all unfold yourself. They usually started with hey Dave you remember that year the Leafs won the Stanley Cup...Oh sorry of course not you weren't even born yet and then continue on....

I could never repeat them and do them any justice.

I was just curious about those Hemi blocks that went over the fence...did the St Louis plant assemble their own Hemi engines?

Dave (too)

He didn't say that it happened at the St. Louis Plant. Some of the Men who were lifetime Chrysler Employees, told about the various things that happened in the Industry throughout the years. I never gave it too much thought because you can't do conclusive research on circumstances that were so randomly inconsistent. They may have affected the scenarios we are talking about but there was never a written protocol to benchmark those subjective events.

Its now been 5 days since I politely asked Berry if he would share the information he has collected from members and other sources; number of T/A's and AAR's and their vin numbers, Compliance decal sticker date, and fender tag, block date with or without , with pics of each if possible between 3-70 and 4-30-70. the request was made in order for others to do some of their own research or obtaining some documentation for themselves. His Website says that he enjoys talking to other enthusiasts sharing info and to help them. I understand that he claims to be a little under the weather, I truly hope that he is feeling better and taking some of time during his recovery to put together that spread sheet that was requested . that would truly help everybody.

"that would truly help everybody." Actually giving up any info he has would go against his policy of not sharing registry members information.You can request a spread sheet all you want but its not going to happen. He has already answered your question but it wasn't the answer you were looking for. I didnt see where you say that all these cars were original one owner or survivor cars so how do you know that the engines are original to the cars???

"I believe you have simply lucked up on 3 cars with service replacement blocks and yes, engines were cast in bulk and not every engine was cast every week."

My thoughts exactly if what he is saying is true. This post just seems like a fishing post to get people to post or send their broadcast sheets to someone who has bad intentions in mind. Trying to fill gaps on their spread sheet so they can be the next guru.

Also the Autodynamics Challenger had a black painted top from day one. The race cars had absolutely nothing to do with the options on production line cars. The acid dipped story is true they did cut a roof off another challenger but thats where it ends. Sam Posey told me the story as well but never mentioned anything about painted roofs. The race cars and production cars were 2 completely different animals. Also the schedule for the SCCA races doesn't have anything to do with production cars.

Not that you care about the truth but I dropped some parts off to him last Saturday and he didn't feel like coming out of the house to unlock the shop for me.

Why don't you post the VINs and info on the 3 cars you are questioning? It is possible that someone on here has more info on them.

yet another opinion! reminds of a soap opera "as the world turns".
You may be correct it may not come from Berry ,as you have stated," it goes against his policy". does the word hypocrite come to mind ? read his words on his website. Seems like an open forum ask for information and help.
I don't recall asking for any members information, only data on cars which he has collected thru members or documentation, which he has insinuated he has obtained. What I received was an opinion not an answer to my original questions. my follow up questions asked for "documentation". You are correct I did not receive the answer I was looking for.
You are Obviously another one of those people that can not comprehend the question asked or understand why I was asking.
of course I didn't say whether these cars had the original motors that is reason I had asked questions and for any documentation.( my investigation ) Into a scenario I stumbled upon. You may be correct I may have stumbled across 3 cars that have service, but it was enough of a coincidence for me to investigate?
Please show me where I have Asked anybody to post their broadcast sheet? Unfortunately I do not have a data base, I am just doing some research to satisfy my own curiosity. that my help others as well.
If I understand your post correctly nobody including myself has a right to question the "MOPAR GOD or his DECIPLES" on their speculations or documentation .
Its seems like you are trying to point some fingers. I am the original poster of this thread and I make no apologies for my enquires. You and others have tried to put a spin on this to protect "your" God.
Finally, to point. If it is me you are referring to that has "bad intensions", Please grow a set of Huevos be a man and put it on the table. I do take a large exception to your remarks .
As I was writing this another post was made. I'll answer it as short as I can . Why would I?

If I didn't care about the truth I wouldn't have asked for documentation!

Why would any hypocrite give you any information when all you are doing with your friend SD is to insult a member on moparts. 5 days is not a long time, it took God longer to create the universe. Barry dont bother adding any information to this post, no need to defend yourself here either. I hope that is why you have not posted again and realize this is not about Chrysler cars anymore. Since you have been on Barrys web site you had the opportunity to communicate with him for answers on what you have asked here and more via his site or his email. People wonder why the posts have gone done 50% on moparts this is a perfect example of that. I am going to watch the NFL playoffs, there are other things in life than waiting for answers to question for 5 days on a moparts post.

Have a great day.

in all honesty I have no idea who SD is but according to your post apparently he may have found a few holes Berry's "opinions "also as have others I've found out. I think I'll be ok without Berry's Questionable info. It may take a little longer but eventually I will obtain some a facts to find out the answers to my questions. As for insults don't believe I made any with the exception of the "Mopar God" thing but as one of his "disciples" I can understand your frustrations. You see I just simply asked for documents that could either confirm or deny my questions and all I got was opinions and treated like a mushroom,(kept in the dark and had manure thrown at me. So if you want to put a spin on my asking questions about the facts then that is ok with me . as one member says "careful your attitude is showing". As the world turns.

I only have one addition to the above remarks. Regarding the Autodynamice Challenger having a black painted top from day one?? I can tell you first hand, as I live right here. John Harkness who was part of the 1970 Trans Am car team, told me face to face that the 77 car was sent out after all the modifications were made and it came back to the shop painted in Sublime Green from top to bottom. John remembered the morning Sam Posey, who lived right around the corner, came into the shop and set eyes on the car for the first time. He walked up to the car and told them he hated the color and was not going to drive the green car. While standing right nest to the car, he told them to send the car back to the paint shop and to get the awefull green out of my face. He told them to paint the top black. Now I know that Sam talks a lot about a roof being cut off a car and changed out because of acid dipping. But I do believe John Harkness and his story and really feel these two stories are being mixed up. What I am saying is that both stories may be correct?? I, like the other poster on here was just trying to get a better understanding of why there were so FEW cars with the V02 code and why Plymouth did not even offer it. I know Sam's car had no fender tags or option codes, but I was told that the SCCA cars had to have any options available that the cars were run with, including colors. NOW, that is what I was told were the SCCA rules to enter a car. So, I always thought the V02 had to be added to the Dodge cars because Sam ordered that roof to get painted black as John Harkness told me. He also said he would never forget it, because Sam was so pissed about the color. Now, on the AAR/TA website, I allowed them to post my car due to them wanting to fact find info such as this?? They even mention if anybody has any further info to let them know so they can add it to the site. So, I am a little disappointed that I am sharing this info as it was told to me directly by John Harkness (look him up) and I am being told that this is not true but the story they tell is the correct one?? We could both have correct stories. Sam was talking about cutting a roof off at the track? I was talking about the car before it ever went to the track? Hey, I have no other intention here but to try and further the history of how these cars came to be. I also asked anyone here to show me a PLYMOUTH AAR order sheet regarding the existence of the V02 option code, but nobody has come forward. I gues that sheet does not exist? I also point to a reference above that says the Plymouth line did not have as many options as Dodge. Well, if you just do a search ro a 1970 Plymouth Barricuda or Cuda with a two tome paint job, you will find numbers of them all over the puter with pictures. So the option actually did exist in the 1970 Plymouth year. That is why I am so curious as to why folks are saying it was not available. All you have to do is search V02 1970 Barricuda and push the picture icon. So, yes, I am confused as well regarding the accuracy of this information, and I do find it strange that the folks who have gathered this info will not even share it with me, who was kind enough to bring my car to the forefront when asked??? I almost feel a little slighted by the keepers of these records. I see that Galen Govier charges $250.00 if you want to talk to him for 30 minutes??? I feel like I gave me info freely and now folks are trying to make money from the info I gave up freely,, but will not help me resolve my simple question that I have been trying to resolve for years. Not that I really care, as it is what it is. So why bother collecting any info at all????

I have a question that I want answered. Why can't you spell his name correctly Little Detroit? I'll give you 5 days to answer.

Two things;

1. I obviously can not share what I do not have.

2. Documentation. Here is teh most recent bloody snot rag. Just keep kicking me while i am down & out. I can take it.

I'll be back when I amm able to try & clean some of this mess up.

If you are gonna quote me, quote me right - it is documented.

And yes it is very appropriate in this thread.

Galen does charge and that is why a lot have lost respect for him, I do not know of a case where Barry or Jeff have charged anyone for information or help in retrieving original components for their cars. I said it once but I'll say it again, Jeff's site have a list of all the AARs known to him only the last 3 digits are Xed out to protect the innocent. They, both Barry and Jeff, have a privacy agreement with the people that contribute.

You have also not answered my question about the transmission numbers and the reason you should consider posting your info is you may find there is additional information that will be posted that you may either not know or have choose to ignore in an effort to make your car matching numbers with a replacement block.

On the lighter side of this I think I will respond to your questions.
1. the spelling of his name; see Berry's post 1/15/2017 5:02 pm , I think the spelling of his name was apparent.(answered in less than 5 days.)
2. made my first on 12/30/2016; took Berry 15 days to say I cannot share what I do not have. pretty much says it all.
3. never bothered to check transmissions.
4. mopar346 I think you watch way too much Dragnet.
5. mopar346 you are correct "your character is showing"

Would somebody please direct mopar346 back to the short bus.