Re: Welders in the house? Disaster strikes!
[Re: gdonovan]
#2136700
08/19/16 04:22 PM
08/19/16 04:22 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 75,282 A gulag near you.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
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Posts: 75,282
A gulag near you.
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I've tig'd a couple of trans cases , even filled holes , no problem.
Mainstream Media is the new Pravda
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Re: Welders in the house? Disaster strikes!
[Re: gdonovan]
#2137161
08/20/16 11:34 AM
08/20/16 11:34 AM
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Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 10,958 Oakdale CT
gdonovan
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Were planning on welding it up on Wednesday, I have a junk case I'm going to practice on first to find the best settings for the welder.
Plan on v-ing out the inner section of the bellhousing first with a fresh burring bit (the surrounding area already cleaned up with 36 grit ro-lock) , drill and chamfer the crack end, de-greasing the area with a little acetone, hit it with the propane torch to warm up the area and burn off and chem, weld up the inner and then grind out the outer and repeat.
"I think its got a hemi"
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Re: Welders in the house? Disaster strikes!
[Re: moparx]
#2137162
08/20/16 11:34 AM
08/20/16 11:34 AM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 23,295 Here
jcc
If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
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If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
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Yes, alum and cleanliness are an illusive goal in welding alum. Everything, as you suggest, that comes in contact with the area, only seems to contaminate the weld. On other threads, I've suggested even dedicated alum tig gloves, to keep the tig rod clean that you handle. I think there is something to welding used/weathered alum castings with non visible porosity concerns, it seldom/never matches the results of when welding new alum, no matter how clean one tries to get the weld area..
edit: Lacquer thinner has always been my favorite alum cleaner, it seems to have a wider range of solvents, since the exact contaminates are not always known, although acetone is promoted as a stronger solvent?
Last edited by jcc; 08/20/16 11:38 AM.
" All sorts of things can happen when you are open to new Ideas" Inventor of Kevlar
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Re: Welders in the house? Disaster strikes!
[Re: gdonovan]
#2137290
08/20/16 03:19 PM
08/20/16 03:19 PM
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,318 Fulton County, PA
CMcAllister
Mr. Helpful
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Mr. Helpful
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Posts: 12,318
Fulton County, PA
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Cast aluminum absorbs fluids like a sponge. I've fixed broken mounting ears on Holley base plates in the past. Wash, clean, acid, v the edges, all of it, and when you strike an arc and make it melt, it smells like the exhaust of a running engine - strong enough that you don't want to breathe it. Water pumps and housings - like exhaust from something with a blown head gasket. Perfectly clean motorcycle cases - like oil on a hot exhaust.
One trick is to use a TIG torch, strike an arc and work the area of the crack as if you were going to weld, making it hot enough to melt without adding filler. Contamination will come to the surface and can be cleaned with a wire brush, carbide, etc. May have to do it a number of times, but you should be able to get it cleaned to the point where you can add filler and get it to flow and freeze without looking like puke. If it doesn't look like chrome when it melts, it has junk in it. Propane works to preheat and clean the surface, but it really doesn't cook the contaminates out of the casting. The quality of the casting has a lot to do with it also. Some castings are made from garbage and turn to dog poop as soon as you make it melt. Aluminum can run smooth as silk or it can turn to junk and make you say bad words. It just depends.
Last edited by CMcAllister; 08/20/16 03:21 PM.
If the results don't match the theory, change the theory.
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Re: Welders in the house? Disaster strikes!
[Re: gdonovan]
#2137325
08/20/16 04:02 PM
08/20/16 04:02 PM
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,318 Fulton County, PA
CMcAllister
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Mr. Helpful
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Your saving grace may be that the bellhousing area is not continuously in contact with hot oil as is the body of the trans. As a result, it may clean up and weld just fine without having to go through all of the dramatics. Just have to strike an arc and see what it does.
If the results don't match the theory, change the theory.
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Re: Welders in the house? Disaster strikes!
[Re: MattW]
#2137455
08/20/16 08:49 PM
08/20/16 08:49 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972 Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY
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Romeo MI
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Lincoln square wave.. not a bad unit but I like Miller better... I've had this unit about 20 years When I was working.. 95% of my tig was with a Hobart 300 water cooled machine.. loved that big thing
Last edited by MR_P_BODY; 08/21/16 10:55 AM.
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Re: Welders in the house? Disaster strikes!
[Re: gdonovan]
#2137739
08/21/16 10:47 AM
08/21/16 10:47 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 12,043 State of Confusion
hp383
Just a normal tag again
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Just a normal tag again
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Posts: 12,043
State of Confusion
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As a non-welder can someone expand on the absolutely no brakleen to clean the area.
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Re: Welders in the house? Disaster strikes!
[Re: moparx]
#2137780
08/21/16 11:59 AM
08/21/16 11:59 AM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 23,295 Here
jcc
If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
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If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 23,295
Here
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As a non-welder can someone expand on the absolutely no brakleen to clean the area. this product creates phosgene gas. similar to mustard gas. when inhaled, it removes oxygen and you die. there are numerous documented death cases as well as some very close near misses, some of which survived only to have severe brain damage. a very dangerous product to use for cleaning anything you will weld on. the newer labels on the can state to not use the product for this purpose due to just this reason. My experience was, IMO much more dramatic. I knew the cautions, not sure if they ever presented themselves, welded for 4+ decades, I seldom used brake cleaner for pre weld cleaning. However, I had a 4"? crack in the tongue area of my Alum Featerlite that needed tigging. It was not possible to fully v groove from both sides. The crack was nearly a year old. I wire brushed w/SS, I v grooved, I lacquer thinned, and lastly, I thought a shot of brake cleaner might blow out of the crack of anything I had missed. Hours later, in 85F, in Florida sun, outside, in moving air, I tigged the crack. Hour? later, for 24? hours, I thought my chest was in a vise, breathing was difficult. Never again. There was no discernible odor. I suspect the cleaner reacts/or leaves a dried residue, that the intense welding UV reacts with.
" All sorts of things can happen when you are open to new Ideas" Inventor of Kevlar
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Re: Welders in the house? Disaster strikes!
[Re: jcc]
#2137942
08/21/16 03:23 PM
08/21/16 03:23 PM
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Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399 Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar
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Aurora, Colorado
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As a non-welder can someone expand on the absolutely no brakleen to clean the area. this product creates phosgene gas. similar to mustard gas. when inhaled, it removes oxygen and you die. there are numerous documented death cases as well as some very close near misses, some of which survived only to have severe brain damage. a very dangerous product to use for cleaning anything you will weld on. the newer labels on the can state to not use the product for this purpose due to just this reason. My experience was, IMO much more dramatic. I knew the cautions, not sure if they ever presented themselves, welded for 4+ decades, I seldom used brake cleaner for pre weld cleaning. However, I had a 4"? crack in the tongue area of my Alum Featerlite that needed tigging. It was not possible to fully v groove from both sides. The crack was nearly a year old. I wire brushed w/SS, I v grooved, I lacquer thinned, and lastly, I thought a shot of brake cleaner might blow out of the crack of anything I had missed. Hours later, in 85F, in Florida sun, outside, in moving air, I tigged the crack. Hour? later, for 24? hours, I thought my chest was in a vise, breathing was difficult. Never again. There was no discernible odor. I suspect the cleaner reacts/or leaves a dried residue, that the intense welding UV reacts with. I looked into the cause a while back, but I thought some chemical component (maybe in the clorinated brake cleaner) reacts with the UV light and creates the phosgene gas. Found links to how the gas was used in Word War 1. And I think one source mentioned the gas acts like a corrosive acid on the lung tissues.
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Re: Welders in the house? Disaster strikes!
[Re: gdonovan]
#2137957
08/21/16 03:43 PM
08/21/16 03:43 PM
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,318 Fulton County, PA
CMcAllister
Mr. Helpful
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Mr. Helpful
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Fulton County, PA
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Blowing it dry with a blow gun, allowing it to air dry for an extended period, etc doesn't make it safe. Remember, cast aluminum is like a sponge.
On a related note, using brakleen anywhere in a shop where there is an open flame (wood stove, kerosene space heater, etc.) is the same situation. I made that mistake many years ago, once. Bad stuff.
If the results don't match the theory, change the theory.
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Re: Welders in the house? Disaster strikes!
[Re: CMcAllister]
#2139162
08/23/16 05:07 AM
08/23/16 05:07 AM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 5,207 Menomonee Falls
DemonDust
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Menomonee Falls
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Clean, clean, clean. Do NOT use brakekleen. Yup, acetone is the way to go. I wipe all my parts and filler rod down with acetone. Brakekleen will kill ya.
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