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Re: Wow... Time for 5/8“ wheel studs?! [Re: dizuster] #2121404
07/30/16 04:00 PM
07/30/16 04:00 PM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,387
W. Kentucky
justinp61 Offline
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Looking at the photo of the rotor hat/axle end it appears the only place the wheel is contacting the hat is around the perimeter of the hat and right at the studs. I would take the hat off and lay it in the wheel to see how it fits the back of the wheel.

Nice catch BTW.

Re: Wow... Time for 5/8“ wheel studs?! [Re: dizuster] #2121409
07/30/16 04:16 PM
07/30/16 04:16 PM
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Posts: 1,267
North, Alabama
D-50 Offline
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I just had the same problem. I was putting on my new M/T 315/60 Pros and noticed all my Strange wheel studs were bent as bad as yours. I am running HoleShot wheels and foot braking at 2950 lbs. I ordered a set of ARP studs and will see how they last.


1.33 60 ft,6.21 at 110.59 in the 1/8, pump gas small block,2950lbs,drag radials,mufflers and driven to track ...
Re: Wow... Time for 5/8“ wheel studs?! [Re: D-50] #2121480
07/30/16 06:39 PM
07/30/16 06:39 PM
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North Alabama
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Monte_Smith Offline
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Originally Posted By D-50
I just had the same problem. I was putting on my new M/T 315/60 Pros and noticed all my Strange wheel studs were bent as bad as yours. I am running HoleShot wheels and foot braking at 2950 lbs. I ordered a set of ARP studs and will see how they last.
May as well upgrade to 5/8 now

Re: Wow... Time for 5/8“ wheel studs?! [Re: dizuster] #2121561
07/30/16 09:13 PM
07/30/16 09:13 PM
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Polson, MT
DoctorDiff Offline
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You can enlarge the holes in the axle flange with a 43/64" drill bit and run press-in circle track 5/8" studs and conical seat lug nuts. Of course, you must also re-drill and bevel the holes in your steel wheels.

Re: Wow... Time for 5/8“ wheel studs?! [Re: dizuster] #2121568
07/30/16 09:27 PM
07/30/16 09:27 PM
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Posts: 21,966
Trumussia
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jcc Offline
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Originally Posted By dizuster
Went to take off my wheels yesterday to mount up some new tires. Couldn't believe my eyes!

Checked all of the lugs and they were all at least 100 ft/lbs to remove, so they weren't loose!


Nobody so far is addressing your problem from this angle, but normal torque values 1/2" Fine Gr 8 are 90 ft/bs. I am not sure how one can relate removal torgue to tightening torque. It seems most are assuming they are the same, I'd want something to back that up. Further, the conical dry wheel hole seat, has got to significantly distort measured torque vales when tightening. And this all leads to the premise, wheels are meant to be secured to the mounting surface by the induced friction of 5 properly tightened fasteners of the necessary capacity for job. Shear resistance is not supposed to be a concern. And 5/8" studs allow typically double the torque values, with a corresponding increase in friction from the clamping they supply. I think being distracted by the centering concerns/hole design is not solving the real problem here. twocents

On drilling out conical wheels to fit larger 5/8" studs, I would hesitate, I believe one aspect of the typical conical seat design is, it allows for a slight amount of give and tension to be applied and maintained thru use and temp, etc variations, kinda like a large circular lock washer, one of the reasons on steel wheels the metal directly behind the conical seat is not designed/intended to bottom out on the axle flange, but keep a space. With 5/8" larger studs, the metal is compressed greater, into a range a 1/2" stud could not approach, but wheel hub is the same thickness. Not sure this is ideal solution, if wheels weren't ever offered in the larger stud sizes.

I'd like to see the backside hub of the OP's steel wheels.

Last edited by jcc; 07/30/16 11:22 PM.

If you can't dazzle them with diamonds, don't waste your time, because nothing will
Re: Wow... Time for 5/8“ wheel studs?! [Re: dizuster] #2121722
07/31/16 02:49 AM
07/31/16 02:49 AM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,128
MI, usa
dvw Offline
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Easy fix. Some 10" centerline or similar flat style wheels painted green with big studs. 5/8" studs are upstairs, pick them up at the checkout.
Dad

Last edited by dvw; 07/31/16 02:49 AM.
Re: Wow... Time for 5/8“ wheel studs?! [Re: dizuster] #2121755
07/31/16 08:39 AM
07/31/16 08:39 AM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,969
Chandler, AZ
Duner Offline
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[img:left]http://s61.photobucket.com/user/sktt1209/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20160729_181356_zpsmyjmuecl.jpg.html[/img]

It looks to me that there is a small shoulder on the stud without threads. Is it possible that the lug nut bottomed on the threads before the wheel was actually able to "center up" on the studs using the conical lug nuts?

Re: Wow... Time for 5/8“ wheel studs?! [Re: Duner] #2121788
07/31/16 10:02 AM
07/31/16 10:02 AM
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Posts: 4,742
new jersey usa
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11secdart Offline
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new jersey usa
I upgraded years ago, I broke studs on the starting line and the wheel/tire came off resulting in a bent quarter panel. The studs were only a few years old. Since I have Mark Williams axles I sent them to them and had 5/8 studs installed and they have been fine ever since, I also check the torque quite frequently. On my way to Carlisle last year I broke three studs on my H.Q.C. luckily I caught it and a fellow racer works at a 4WD shop near the route I was taking was able to fix it,but I had to leave the truck and buy a new wheel. The night before I decided to check my air pressure when I did the tire valve fell apart I got it fixed and put the wheel/tire back on in the rain, I swear I tightened up all the lugs with my impact apparently I didn`t and I should have checked again before I left.

IMG_0565.jpg

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Re: Wow... Time for 5/8“ wheel studs?! [Re: dvw] #2121810
07/31/16 10:26 AM
07/31/16 10:26 AM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,243
Charlotte, North Carolina
sgcuda Offline
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Originally Posted By dvw
Easy fix. 5/8" studs are upstairs, pick them up at the checkout.
Dad


Hey, my kids have a checkout counter like that, too. And one of those "You Break, I Fix" style garages in the backyard. laugh2 I wish I had one when I was their age.

Last edited by sgcuda; 07/31/16 10:27 AM.

[image][/image]
Re: Wow... Time for 5/8“ wheel studs?! [Re: sgcuda] #2121821
07/31/16 10:51 AM
07/31/16 10:51 AM
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Posts: 1,566
Apollo, PA.
B1MAXX Offline
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That thing had to be vibrating your fillings out, being that much off center from the wrong wheel/axle register eek

Re: Wow... Time for 5/8“ wheel studs?! [Re: dizuster] #2122107
07/31/16 06:15 PM
07/31/16 06:15 PM
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Posts: 1,837
tulsa ok
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upnover Offline
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tulsa ok
ya that was a good catch, id think an alum wheel would have more meat in the seat area and a better (more)contact area on the rotor than an oe style steel wheel

Re: Wow... Time for 5/8“ wheel studs?! [Re: dvw] #2122219
07/31/16 09:32 PM
07/31/16 09:32 PM
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Posts: 3,285
Tulsa, Oklahoma
340Cuda Offline
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Originally Posted By dvw
Easy fix. Some 10" centerline or similar flat style wheels painted green with big studs. 5/8" studs are upstairs, pick them up at the checkout.
Dad


Father knows best...

Re: Wow... Time for 5/8“ wheel studs?! [Re: dizuster] #2122226
07/31/16 09:39 PM
07/31/16 09:39 PM
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Posts: 4,243
Charlotte, North Carolina
sgcuda Offline
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Lots of plastic centering rings available these days. Check out some of those dub a dub or rice burner shops. I've seen a bunch come with wheels. There must be a listing for the rings by themselves.


[image][/image]
Re: Wow... Time for 5/8“ wheel studs?! [Re: dizuster] #2122515
08/01/16 10:46 AM
08/01/16 10:46 AM
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Posts: 12,843
Marion, South Carolina [><]
an8sec70cuda Offline
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Good catch!!! Makes me glad I sent my axles in to Moser earlier this year to upgrade to 5/8" studs.


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Re: Wow... Time for 5/8“ wheel studs?! [Re: an8sec70cuda] #2122549
08/01/16 11:47 AM
08/01/16 11:47 AM
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washington
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Bruce Offline
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I got Hub rings from this place. They are made from Alcoa 6061t6 billet aluminum. They aren't cheap.

http://www.motorsport-tech.com/hub_rings.html

I used them when I put new wheels on my 2003 Grand Marquis. I got some plastic ones from the company I got the wheels from but they were crap. I don't think the plastic would hold up anyway.

On the other hand, I ordered weld racing wheels for my 1965 Coronet and Weld specifically says they are lug centric and should not be balanced using the cone most shops use. There is an adapter that uses the lug holes to center the wheel for balancing.

Re: Wow... Time for 5/8“ wheel studs?! [Re: dizuster] #2122563
08/01/16 12:12 PM
08/01/16 12:12 PM
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Fulton County, PA
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CMcAllister Offline
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5/8" hardware in the axles is one of those things that cost little to upgrade to but make a big difference in function and safety. No brainer for me in just about everything that will go to the track.


If the results don't match the theory, change the theory.
Re: Wow... Time for 5/8“ wheel studs?! [Re: CMcAllister] #2122652
08/01/16 01:51 PM
08/01/16 01:51 PM
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dogdays Offline
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I am agreeing with jcc on this one. It is straight out of the Machine Design textbook.

Best way I can describe it is, the surface where the wheel center bottoms on the axle flange is EXACTLY like a clutch disk and flywheel. The axle studs are not supposed to see any shearing. If your wheels were contacting the studs and wearing on them, you have a "clutch disk" slipping because the "pressure plate" isn't clamping hard enough.

The 5/8" studs can be torqued tighter and that will provide the clamping force necessary.

The wheel centering rings are for mounting the wheel, getting it centered.

R.

Re: Wow... Time for 5/8“ wheel studs?! [Re: dizuster] #2292772
04/23/17 02:48 PM
04/23/17 02:48 PM
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gulfport, ms, west mi
rowin4 Offline
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You guys and your centering rings, properly nut installation is what centers the wheel on any application. Did old Volkswagens have centering rings ? Pontiac's with 8 lug wheels? how about semi trailers with lugs to hold the wheels on. If you don't know how to properly install and tighten lug nuts to the proper torque ,read up on it or ride the bus .


it's ok to butt heads, just don't do it with a butthead
Re: Wow... Time for 5/8“ wheel studs?! [Re: rowin4] #2292778
04/23/17 03:12 PM
04/23/17 03:12 PM
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Pangaea
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Originally Posted By rowin4
You guys and your centering rings, properly nut installation is what centers the wheel on any application. Did old Volkswagens have centering rings ? Pontiac's with 8 lug wheels? how about semi trailers with lugs to hold the wheels on. If you don't know how to properly install and tighten lug nuts to the proper torque ,read up on it or ride the bus .


It all depends on how the wheel/hub is designed, hub centric or lug centric.
30 years ago, most semi trucks and trailers were lug centric, now most are hub centric.
Dodge D350's were lug centric till '93, they went hub centric in '94.
I'll take hub over lug centric.

Re: Wow... Time for 5/8“ wheel studs?! [Re: dizuster] #2292849
04/23/17 05:28 PM
04/23/17 05:28 PM
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Rio Linda, CA
John_Kunkel Offline
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Rio Linda, CA

Why stop at 5/8"? Go to 11/16".

R brake3.jpg

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