Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 2 of 2 1 2
Re: Bought a complete 9.2" Deck R3 365" W2, what to build? [Re: RAMM] #2015174
02/19/16 01:45 AM
02/19/16 01:45 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,866
Weddington, N.C.
Streetwize Offline OP
master
Streetwize  Offline OP
master

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,866
Weddington, N.C.
I remember a Single 4150, I didnt see anything that outlawed TR's, but i was trying to read it at work off a pdf....on my phone.

Could use the indy I suppose

Edit: Didnt see the TR prohibited at first glance, just did though....oh well :-(




Last edited by Streetwize; 02/19/16 01:54 AM.

WIZE

World's Quickest Diahatsu Rocky (??) 414" Stroker Small block Mopar Powered. 10.84 @ 123...and gettin' quicker!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mWzLma3YGI

In Car:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PjXcf95e6v0
Re: Bought a complete 9.2" Deck R3 365" W2, what to build? [Re: Streetwize] #2015231
02/19/16 04:25 AM
02/19/16 04:25 AM
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 161
In a house near you
S
Street Monkies Offline
member
Street Monkies  Offline
member
S

Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 161
In a house near you
A 1000 hp pro systems carb will be plenty for 370" at 7,500 only needs 883 cfm and that's using 1.1 VE. A Mopar performance M1 water heated manifold is decent with work. It has decent length runners, decent size plenum area. Work good with 1" spacer. The Indy has the longest runners besides the TR out of all the cast intake options. It has a pretty big plenum so that's good for revs, and runner length is good for torque. Just depends on how much you want to favor hp/tq, or maybe in between if you can. The Victor is a good option as well, and the cheapest I believe. All of these intakes will need work. Welding, epoxy, tons of grinding, etc if willing to take it that far. Line of sight, straightest shot to the head possible, along with the correct length runner, and plenum size. Also add custom made spacers under the flanges. My thoughts.

Re: Bought a complete 9.2" Deck R3 365" W2, what to build? [Re: Streetwize] #2015273
02/19/16 09:53 AM
02/19/16 09:53 AM

C
crabman173
Unregistered
crabman173
Unregistered
C



I am behind you boys 100% Go Get'em!!
John Kasse ( many time winner) says it is all in the cam and the headers--he said working on headers is key to a win!
Good Luck!!!!!!!!

Re: Bought a complete 9.2" Deck R3 365" W2, what to build? [Re: Street Monkies] #2015286
02/19/16 10:29 AM
02/19/16 10:29 AM
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,048
The Great White North
RAMM Offline
super stock
RAMM  Offline
super stock

Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,048
The Great White North
Originally Posted By Street Monkies
A 1000 hp pro systems carb will be plenty for 370" at 7,500 only needs 883 cfm and that's using 1.1 VE. A Mopar performance M1 water heated manifold is decent with work. It has decent length runners, decent size plenum area. Work good with 1" spacer. The Indy has the longest runners besides the TR out of all the cast intake options. It has a pretty big plenum so that's good for revs, and runner length is good for torque. Just depends on how much you want to favor hp/tq, or maybe in between if you can.This is the hard part! The Victor is a good option as well, and the cheapest I believe. All of these intakes will need work. Welding, epoxy,again read the rules closer tons of grinding, etc if willing to take it that far. Line of sight, straightest shot to the head possible, along with the correct length runner, and plenum size. Also add custom made spacers under the flanges.Keep reading. My thoughts.


J.Rob


2009 PHR\EMC Competitor
2010 PHR\EMC Competitor
2011 PHR\EMC Competitor
2012 PHR\EMC Competitor
2013 PHR\EMC Competitor
2014 HotRod/EMC Competitor
2015 HotRod/EMC NoShow
2016 HotRod/EMC 3rd place SPEC Bigblock
2018 HotRod/EMC 7th place G3
Re: Bought a complete 9.2" Deck R3 365" W2, what to build? [Re: ] #2015287
02/19/16 10:31 AM
02/19/16 10:31 AM
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,048
The Great White North
RAMM Offline
super stock
RAMM  Offline
super stock

Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,048
The Great White North
Originally Posted By crabman173
I am behind you boys 100% Go Get'em!!
John Kasse ( many time winner) says it is all in the cam and the headers--he said working on headers is key to a win!
Good Luck!!!!!!!!


A large part of it is the headers and in Smallblock Shootout this year you are free to try anything you can. The manifold is also a huge part the EMC. J.Rob

Last edited by RAMM; 02/19/16 10:31 AM.

2009 PHR\EMC Competitor
2010 PHR\EMC Competitor
2011 PHR\EMC Competitor
2012 PHR\EMC Competitor
2013 PHR\EMC Competitor
2014 HotRod/EMC Competitor
2015 HotRod/EMC NoShow
2016 HotRod/EMC 3rd place SPEC Bigblock
2018 HotRod/EMC 7th place G3
Re: Bought a complete 9.2" Deck R3 365" W2, what to build? [Re: RAMM] #2015294
02/19/16 10:53 AM
02/19/16 10:53 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,866
Weddington, N.C.
Streetwize Offline OP
master
Streetwize  Offline OP
master

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,866
Weddington, N.C.
The reason so many EM motors use long stroke combos is simple, piston speed is a product of stroke regardless of bore and a long stroke gives the motor momentum as the dyno brake is applied, if you can't get out of the basement you can't get to the ceiling.

One thing I've noticed over the years is that the 3.58" to 3.79" strokes seem to be the sweet spot for small block mopars, in terms of efficiency. 4" and longer stokes make mad torque and very good power, but if you compare the hp/cube "efficiency" for a given head/cam combination, the sweet spot strokes usually generate better average torque and HP per cube of displacement.

To some extent, we will 'have what we have' to work with and with that said....I think in the 355"-370"-ish range, the LS, conventional SBC and Ford combos don't necessarily have a clear cut advantage within the 3500-7500 rpm range. It's a port cross sectional range where the LS and Cleveland/Windsor Hybrid ford combos won't necessarily be dominant over a well-prepped well-thought-out Mopar combo.


WIZE

World's Quickest Diahatsu Rocky (??) 414" Stroker Small block Mopar Powered. 10.84 @ 123...and gettin' quicker!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mWzLma3YGI

In Car:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PjXcf95e6v0
Re: Bought a complete 9.2" Deck R3 365" W2, what to build? [Re: Streetwize] #2015296
02/19/16 10:58 AM
02/19/16 10:58 AM
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,048
The Great White North
RAMM Offline
super stock
RAMM  Offline
super stock

Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,048
The Great White North
Originally Posted By Streetwize
The reason so many EM motors use long stroke combos is simple, piston speed is a product of stroke regardless of bore and a long stroke gives the motor momentum as the dyno brake is applied, if you can't get out of the basement you can't get to the ceiling.

One thing I've noticed over the years is that the 3.58" to 3.79" strokes seem to be the sweet spot for small block mopars, in terms of efficiency. 4" and longer stokes make mad torque and very good power, but if you compare the hp/cube "efficiency" for a given head/cam combination, the sweet spot strokes usually generate better average torque and HP per cube of displacement.

To some extent, we will 'have what we have' to work with and with that said....I think in the 355"-370"-ish range, the LS, conventional SBC and Ford combos don't necessarily have a clear cut advantage within the 3500-7500 rpm range. It's a port cross sectional range where the LS and Cleveland/Windsor Hybrid ford combos won't necessarily be dominant over a well-prepped well-thought-out Mopar combo.


BES will bring his G3 back and depending on what they actually allow for cylinder heads in that class, he will more than likely be the guy to beat.

You should build it at 365 inch and 11-1 comp so you can run it on Friday in the N20 class. J.Rob


2009 PHR\EMC Competitor
2010 PHR\EMC Competitor
2011 PHR\EMC Competitor
2012 PHR\EMC Competitor
2013 PHR\EMC Competitor
2014 HotRod/EMC Competitor
2015 HotRod/EMC NoShow
2016 HotRod/EMC 3rd place SPEC Bigblock
2018 HotRod/EMC 7th place G3
Re: Bought a complete 9.2" Deck R3 365" W2, what to build? [Re: RAMM] #2015400
02/19/16 01:30 PM
02/19/16 01:30 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,866
Weddington, N.C.
Streetwize Offline OP
master
Streetwize  Offline OP
master

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,866
Weddington, N.C.
That's another idea, J.Rob. Them Daurity boys out our way know a thing or 2 about spray motors, I'm sure they'd lend us a hand if we need it.

But us Carolina boyz "Ain't Skeered" to go up against Bischoff, Kasse, bring 'em on, and if we do go down, we go down Swingin!

In all seriousness though, I like the idea of competing in that 355-370" range, all the NASCAR technology for the past nearly 40 years has been geared directly at that 358" range, so there's an awful lot of resource-pool to dive into around here. Larry Smith is an AMAZING porter and it'll be awesome to see what he comes up with. Hollis, having been there will also be well-aware of how high the bar will be set. We already have most of the good stuff we need to really turn up the wick, Hollis's thought is if we get the motor done fairly soon we'd have a lot of time available to test & tune, might be optimistic (since Life happens) but not having to go out and buy a bunch of stuff could be an advantage, I guess. It's just fun to ponder right now, logistically I think we have a shot to get there though.


Last edited by Streetwize; 02/19/16 02:43 PM.

WIZE

World's Quickest Diahatsu Rocky (??) 414" Stroker Small block Mopar Powered. 10.84 @ 123...and gettin' quicker!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mWzLma3YGI

In Car:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PjXcf95e6v0
Re: Bought a complete 9.2" Deck R3 365" W2, what to build? [Re: Streetwize] #2015421
02/19/16 02:03 PM
02/19/16 02:03 PM
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,048
The Great White North
RAMM Offline
super stock
RAMM  Offline
super stock

Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,048
The Great White North
StreetWize, what team or year did Hollis attend EMC? Just wondering if I met him and didn't know it. J.Rob


2009 PHR\EMC Competitor
2010 PHR\EMC Competitor
2011 PHR\EMC Competitor
2012 PHR\EMC Competitor
2013 PHR\EMC Competitor
2014 HotRod/EMC Competitor
2015 HotRod/EMC NoShow
2016 HotRod/EMC 3rd place SPEC Bigblock
2018 HotRod/EMC 7th place G3
Re: Bought a complete 9.2" Deck R3 365" W2, what to build? [Re: RAMM] #2015446
02/19/16 02:42 PM
02/19/16 02:42 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,866
Weddington, N.C.
Streetwize Offline OP
master
Streetwize  Offline OP
master

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,866
Weddington, N.C.
2011 I think, he had a tunnel rammed 383B motor if I recall right

you can PM him, HPengines


WIZE

World's Quickest Diahatsu Rocky (??) 414" Stroker Small block Mopar Powered. 10.84 @ 123...and gettin' quicker!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mWzLma3YGI

In Car:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PjXcf95e6v0
Re: Bought a complete 9.2" Deck R3 365" W2, what to build? [Re: Streetwize] #2015455
02/19/16 03:05 PM
02/19/16 03:05 PM
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,048
The Great White North
RAMM Offline
super stock
RAMM  Offline
super stock

Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,048
The Great White North
You must mean the MoparMuscle Engine Challenge? I've never attended that one but I would imagine there are vast differences between it and the Ammsoil/HotRod EMC. J.Rob


2009 PHR\EMC Competitor
2010 PHR\EMC Competitor
2011 PHR\EMC Competitor
2012 PHR\EMC Competitor
2013 PHR\EMC Competitor
2014 HotRod/EMC Competitor
2015 HotRod/EMC NoShow
2016 HotRod/EMC 3rd place SPEC Bigblock
2018 HotRod/EMC 7th place G3
Re: Bought a complete 9.2" Deck R3 365" W2, what to build? [Re: Streetwize] #2015489
02/19/16 03:59 PM
02/19/16 03:59 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,406
Kalispell Mt.
H
HotRodDave Offline
I Live Here
HotRodDave  Offline
I Live Here
H

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,406
Kalispell Mt.
I am no "engine master" but I can attest from personal experience that just getting a good quench area and setting it real tight helps mid range power a ton with no down side, that being said if you considered getting the silly open chambers filled in and set up a nice tight quench I agree that what you are planning could do real well. Without that it will look like another engine slapped together with whatever is laying around.

Keith Dunnuck did a test on his 440 with closed chamber heads on his 440 and when he got the quench set real tight it made about 80 more HP than the real loose quench, some of the gain was from compression obviously but probably half was from the quench and it was all gained in the range that would help an engine masters motor build a bigger score.


I am not causing global warming, I am just trying to hold off a impending Ice Age!



Re: Bought a complete 9.2" Deck R3 365" W2, what to build? [Re: HotRodDave] #2015521
02/19/16 04:50 PM
02/19/16 04:50 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,866
Weddington, N.C.
Streetwize Offline OP
master
Streetwize  Offline OP
master

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,866
Weddington, N.C.
Ramm, you'd have ask Hollis or David Kluttz (Crabman) but i think (?) it was the EMC the year they went for Hp/cube

Dave, let's see what all we can come up with, lots of ways to skin a cat, The Moparts entry back in '03 pulled pretty good with a lot of "That won't run..." parts

Hollis found this motor, I bought it and ( within only a few days) offered it up if he and Larry want to make a run at an EM entry, I'm happy and proud to do it, these are two of the finest and awesome car guys I've had the pleasure to meet, and call my friends.


Last edited by Streetwize; 02/19/16 05:11 PM.

WIZE

World's Quickest Diahatsu Rocky (??) 414" Stroker Small block Mopar Powered. 10.84 @ 123...and gettin' quicker!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mWzLma3YGI

In Car:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PjXcf95e6v0
Re: Bought a complete 9.2" Deck R3 365" W2, what to build? [Re: RAMM] #2015522
02/19/16 04:53 PM
02/19/16 04:53 PM
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 161
In a house near you
S
Street Monkies Offline
member
Street Monkies  Offline
member
S

Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 161
In a house near you
I haven't read the rules at all so I have no idea besides what some say on here. Either way everyone will have the same goal in mind and that's leaning towards max effort/extreme measures to achieve the most out of their combination to get the best score.

Re: Bought a complete 9.2" Deck R3 365" W2, what to build? [Re: Streetwize] #2015629
02/19/16 07:31 PM
02/19/16 07:31 PM

C
crabman173
Unregistered
crabman173
Unregistered
C



Yep -we did the Mopar Muscle deal--$5k budget on parts --most HP per CI
We took a 400 with a 383 crank, Edelbrock heads, flat tappet cam and gave it a whirl--Plan was to turn it until we were doing good. We finished third in a tight race--made like 608 HP IIRC --looking back we were within reach of winners had we only turned it harder--that was my call/ my fault--it was gaining 6 HP per 100 RPM at 7400 where we cut it off--just a dumb call on my part--we had a tunnel ram hiding in a garbage bag--rules called for any production cast intake single four --we had a time limit on the dyno to do our required runs--so at the end we had just enough time to try the TR intake--hoping ( as we had not tested it) that would give us the boost we needed--so we used precious time swapping intakes--it fell off and in the video the end cylinders went so lean the header tubes on 1,2, 7, 8 went cherry red--was crazy lean on the ends--had we just opted to turn the wizzz out of it we may have done better but....we brought it home, sold it and moved on having had a great experience--Have to say the stop in Nashville on the way was the best part as we had girls with us--
Lots of fun--sold the engine so no major expense--had we destroyed it for glory then we would have not been so happy--Buying glory can get real expensive!
Great fun though!!!!!!!!!! I am pulling for you guys--I think the Real Engine Masters will be a lot tougher deal--Maybe you guys can get some REAL glory! Go for it!!!!!

Last edited by crabman173; 02/19/16 07:34 PM.
Re: Bought a complete 9.2" Deck R3 365" W2, what to build? [Re: ] #2015645
02/19/16 08:09 PM
02/19/16 08:09 PM

C
crabman173
Unregistered
crabman173
Unregistered
C



Having Fun at EMC

Re: Bought a complete 9.2" Deck R3 365" W2, what to build? [Re: Streetwize] #2015648
02/19/16 08:14 PM
02/19/16 08:14 PM

C
crabman173
Unregistered
crabman173
Unregistered
C



Made exactly 1.50 HP per CI with $5000 winner made 1.58
Comp Cams was a great host --we had a ball!!

Page 2 of 2 1 2






Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1