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Boneyard Front Suspension
#193420
01/14/09 04:16 PM
01/14/09 04:16 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 300
MA
Greg55_99
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OK, so I hope I don't piss off the purists, but, I'm looking seriously into a couple of IFS packages straight from the boneyard. I've seen the Alterkation and XV setups and WOW, they are excellent! But, I'm an old hot rodder... so... Recently, on another board, a gent posted some pics of the front cradle from a 03-09 Ford Crown Victoria. He's putting it into an old pickup. I have a 77 F body Road Runner. The track width of the Crown Vic and F body are pretty close. The good part is, the Crown Vic front suspension completely unbolts from the car. Complete, hub to hub with power steering rack and a-arms. The Police car versions are the best. Since hot rod truck guys have been puting Volare front suspensions into old trucks, why not the Ford? I'm also playing with the idea of fitting a T-Bird independent rear suspension as well. More here: http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/716058-buildup-06-crown-vic-front-suspension-into-67-f100.htmlLike I said... If it can be done in a truck... why not a car? Greg
Last edited by Greg55_99; 01/14/09 04:18 PM.
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Re: Boneyard Front Suspension
[Re: Greg55_99]
#193422
01/14/09 04:39 PM
01/14/09 04:39 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,123
Grand Haven, MI
patrick
I Live Here
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I Live Here
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Grand Haven, MI
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they are similar track width as an F body? my friend's grand marquis feels a good 4-6" wider than my 5th ave...
1976 Spinnaker White Plymouth Duster, /6 A833OD
1986 Silver/Twilight Blue Chrysler 5th Ave HotRod **SOLD!***
2011 Toxic Orange Dodge Charger R/T
2017 Grand Cherokee Overland
2014 Jeep Cherokee Latitude (holy crap, my daughter is driving)
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Re: Boneyard Front Suspension
[Re: patrick]
#193424
01/14/09 10:14 PM
01/14/09 10:14 PM
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,826
NY usa
540challenger
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master
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NY usa
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Quote:
they are similar track width as an F body? my friend's grand marquis feels a good 4-6" wider than my 5th ave...
Maybe he is refering to the framerails not the body ???? 
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Re: Boneyard Front Suspension
[Re: Greg55_99]
#193428
01/15/09 02:02 AM
01/15/09 02:02 AM
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,568
Omaha, Nebraska
Scott Carl
pro stock
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pro stock
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Omaha, Nebraska
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Quote:
OK, so I hope I don't piss off the purists, but...
Man! Am I pissed!!! 
Just kidding. Hey if it works and it don't hurt anybody, why not Sounds like a fun project! I had a 56 D100(?) (1/2 ton pu) I wanted to put a modern front end under. That would have been perfect!
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Re: Boneyard Front Suspension
[Re: Greg55_99]
#193430
01/15/09 04:21 AM
01/15/09 04:21 AM
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 10,129
A Red State
SNK-EYZ
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I Live Here
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A Red State
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Cool idea! Hopefully it will work for you. It sounds like you're going to need some positive offset wheels (offset to under the car) to make it work though. I guess it just depends on what wheels you were planning on using. 
Kayse can't keep up at all now. lol
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Re: Boneyard Front Suspension
[Re: patrick]
#193433
01/15/09 07:56 PM
01/15/09 07:56 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,810
Between Houston & Galveston TX
SattyNoCar
Smarter than no class Flappergass by a mile
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Smarter than no class Flappergass by a mile
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,810
Between Houston & Galveston TX
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sounds like it'd be an interesting setup for a late B ('71-up) or a C body. Wonder how hard it would be to mount in a unibody car? Since '73-up B's are the red headed step childs of Mopar and NO ONE will build a custom front end for them, this seems like an interesting alternative.  Could this be the Mustang II front end of the new milenium?
John
The dream is dead, long live the dream.......😥
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Re: Boneyard Front Suspension
[Re: SNK-EYZ]
#193434
01/16/09 02:00 PM
01/16/09 02:00 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 300
MA
Greg55_99
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Quote:
Cool idea! Hopefully it will work for you.
It sounds like you're going to need some positive offset wheels (offset to under the car) to make it work though.
I guess it just depends on what wheels you were planning on using.
I've been told that Magnum and Charger wheels work perfectly and have the correct backspacing.
Greg
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Re: Boneyard Front Suspension
[Re: B5TA]
#193436
01/17/09 06:25 PM
01/17/09 06:25 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,533
Indiana
Fury Fan
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master
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Indiana
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Keep in mind for any car you install this in: The orientation this was mounted in the 'Vic is part of the caster 'equation', so that must be taken into account when mounting it into the new car. If you simply mount it 'flat' into the new car there might not be suitable range of caster adjustment. The 'Vic framerail angle with respect to the horizon should be compared to the angle on the receiver car. Does this mean we'll see an influx of 4.6 engines installed in Mopars??? 
Parts I seek:
driver doorpanel, 65 Sport Fury, prefer black, needs to be 7-8 on 10 scale, might buy set
16" x 6" Dodge truck wheel(s), from early 70s?, takes 9" dogdish - need for a research job so cheaper is better.
69-73 C-body caliper brackets and/or splashields
Send a PM.
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Re: Boneyard Front Suspension
[Re: B5TA]
#193437
01/17/09 07:19 PM
01/17/09 07:19 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,511
Tampa , Fl
MoparJoe
super gas
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super gas
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,511
Tampa , Fl
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Quote:
Hi, After reading your post I got sorta excited, I have a '62 Merc. Comet that I went out and measured but it looks like the Crown Vic. front end is to wide  . So is there anything out there that is made that way only not as wide of track?  Thanks , Kev
Anything for an early mustang should work under the comet, when my Dad had a '62 comet he used a disc brake setup from a 65-66 mustang, is yours a 6cyl or V8 car? his started came with a 221 so it was already 5 lug.
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Re: Boneyard Front Suspension
[Re: Clair_Davis]
#193438
01/18/09 12:09 AM
01/18/09 12:09 AM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,204
Fort Worth, TX
Clair_Davis
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Fort Worth, TX
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Quote:
FWIW, I know of a guy who has a T-bird rear under a 66? Dart...
As luck would have it, he (David Belau) posted some links to some articles he posted on Cardomain just the other day:
Article 1
Article 2
Great looking project he's got going there.
Clair
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Re: Boneyard Front Suspension
[Re: Greg55_99]
#193440
01/18/09 09:56 AM
01/18/09 09:56 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 350
central IL
myduster360
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central IL
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Quote:
It's a nice looking piece...
Greg
Greg,
Are you certain that the upper spring seats are designed to be completely unsupported?
If you look at the mounting locations of the cross memenber, the entire wieght of the front end is cantilevered out on the spring mount. I cant find a decent pic to confirm this but I don't think its designed to do that. Al isn't very fatique "friendly" and the lower half of the spring seat wil be deflecting A LOT, during normal driving. I think the AL would fracture eventually if not sup)ported(5k-10k miles.
It looks to me like the aluminum spring seat just helps during assembly, but a portion of the frame is suppose to contact the spring seat to transmit the load to the rest of the chassis.
I don't mean, in any way, to discourage you, i think the idea is great. Just please varify that the Al upper spring seat needs a reinforced mount to the chassis/frame rail.
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Re: Boneyard Front Suspension
[Re: dragaddict]
#193443
01/18/09 01:52 PM
01/18/09 01:52 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 300
MA
Greg55_99
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Quote:
Now you went and did it. I have a 69 Coronet hot rod and a 2003 Mercury Marauder. If I could get the Dodge to handle like the Merc for less than a grand it would be great. Keep us posted and let me know if pics from the Merc would help.
YES! There IS something you can do for me! Can you remove the front wheel from the Merc and take a pic of the entire front side. I need to see how the lower A arm attaches to the frame. It looks like it stretches back about 6-8".
Greg
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Re: Boneyard Front Suspension
[Re: Dartslantsix]
#193444
01/18/09 01:54 PM
01/18/09 01:54 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 300
MA
Greg55_99
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Quote:
Clair pointed me to this thread, looks like a great project! I've got 3-4 more articles to write on the IRS I put in my Dart. The first one is about how I chose the thunderbird and the second one was about my subframe.
"If you build a better mousetrap... the world will beat a path to your door."
You should start selling those... Do one for an F-body?
Greg
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Re: Boneyard Front Suspension
[Re: dragaddict]
#193448
01/30/09 01:11 PM
01/30/09 01:11 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,131
Amarillo, Texas
BBR
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master
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Amarillo, Texas
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BS on the wheel should be 5.72"
I was just thinking about this front suspension and stumbled upon this thread.
There's an F100 around the corner from me that I keep eyeballing and thinking about this....
As for mopar swap-ibility, I'd want to know the outside dims of a b-body subframe.
Drag Week 2011 - 77th place - DD
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Drag Week 2014 - Kapooya
RMRW 2018
RMRW 2020
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Re: Boneyard Front Suspension
[Re: BBR]
#193449
02/01/09 12:48 PM
02/01/09 12:48 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 300
MA
Greg55_99
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Quote:
BS on the wheel should be 5.72"
I was just thinking about this front suspension and stumbled upon this thread.
There's an F100 around the corner from me that I keep eyeballing and thinking about this....
As for mopar swap-ibility, I'd want to know the outside dims of a b-body subframe.
Anybody want to take a wack at measuring the distance between the frame rails on a B and E body?
Greg
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Re: Boneyard Front Suspension
[Re: Greg55_99]
#193450
02/01/09 01:43 PM
02/01/09 01:43 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,001
Coram, NY
Pool Fixer
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Coram, NY
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Quote:
Quote:
BS on the wheel should be 5.72"
I was just thinking about this front suspension and stumbled upon this thread.
There's an F100 around the corner from me that I keep eyeballing and thinking about this....
As for mopar swap-ibility, I'd want to know the outside dims of a b-body subframe.
Anybody want to take a wack at measuring the distance between the frame rails on a B and E body?
Greg
this might help..it's frame dimension diagram from my 68 charger FSM
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Re: Boneyard Front Suspension
[Re: Pool Fixer]
#193452
02/01/09 02:04 PM
02/01/09 02:04 PM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 5,314
Carstairs, Alberta, Canada
dave571
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Carstairs, Alberta, Canada
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Those first two pics are of my clip and truck! It is a nice piece. Keep in mind you need 16" wheels as a minimum. The newer crown vic cop cars actually come with 17" steel wheels. This frame needs to be dead flat where it's installed, whuich is why it seems to work so well with old trucks etc... I think you could make it work on an F body, but you may have make some brackets or something.  
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Re: Boneyard Front Suspension
[Re: Clair_Davis]
#193456
02/02/09 11:28 PM
02/02/09 11:28 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 300
MA
Greg55_99
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Quote:
Greg,
It looks like the F-bod frame is also thinner than the truck where the Phord parts will bolt up. Maybe you could space it down a bit to strengthen the frame where it mounts and line up the LCA mount better? Purely from a ride height standpoint, you'd probably want to mock up the subframe to see what ride height you'd have to have for a reasonable stance. With the F-bod kicking up so high, it may sit way too low to live with if you just bolted it in. That's something I'm mulling on for my Dad's kit car where we're going to use a Jaguar front suspesion (also a nice bolt-in component).
Clair
The F body frame is a hair over 3.5" at the point where it meets the subframe. The Ford mounting space is wider so one would have to weld in more frame to make it fit.
Greg
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Re: Boneyard Front Suspension
[Re: Greg55_99]
#193457
02/02/09 11:50 PM
02/02/09 11:50 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,123
Grand Haven, MI
patrick
I Live Here
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I Live Here
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Grand Haven, MI
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Quote:
Quote:
Greg,
It looks like the F-bod frame is also thinner than the truck where the Phord parts will bolt up. Maybe you could space it down a bit to strengthen the frame where it mounts and line up the LCA mount better? Purely from a ride height standpoint, you'd probably want to mock up the subframe to see what ride height you'd have to have for a reasonable stance. With the F-bod kicking up so high, it may sit way too low to live with if you just bolted it in. That's something I'm mulling on for my Dad's kit car where we're going to use a Jaguar front suspesion (also a nice bolt-in component).
Clair
The F body frame is a hair over 3.5" at the point where it meets the subframe. The Ford mounting space is wider so one would have to weld in more frame to make it fit.
Greg
This front end it way to wide for an F/M/J. our cars are ~61-62" disc face to disc face (where the wheel bolts up), the crown vic front end is ~68" wide. you'd need some super mega backspace rims and fender flares to get the wheels inside the body. now this looks like it would be an interesting setup for a fuselage body C though....
1976 Spinnaker White Plymouth Duster, /6 A833OD
1986 Silver/Twilight Blue Chrysler 5th Ave HotRod **SOLD!***
2011 Toxic Orange Dodge Charger R/T
2017 Grand Cherokee Overland
2014 Jeep Cherokee Latitude (holy crap, my daughter is driving)
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Re: Boneyard Front Suspension
[Re: None2Slow]
#193459
02/03/09 08:35 AM
02/03/09 08:35 AM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 300
MA
Greg55_99
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Quote:
What about looking into the 98-2001? Crown vic. I know that in 2002 they used a different setup for the arms and all. Shocks are a different part due to the redesign. They also had a deeper offset rim as well. Still needed 16" rims though.
From what I can see, some of them had a stamped steel lower A arm and others had a cast aluminum one. Maybe that's what the difference is. Problem is, it looks like the attachment points are still the same between them.
Greg
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Re: Boneyard Front Suspension
[Re: patrick]
#193464
02/03/09 10:59 PM
02/03/09 10:59 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 300
MA
Greg55_99
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Anybody know how wide the Dakota track is? Industrial Chassis in Phoenix makes a kit to use Dakota parts for a front end swap. Looks good. Might be a better fit than the Ford. About $700 for the crossmember. http://www.industrialchassisinc.com/Greg
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Re: Boneyard Front Suspension
[Re: Clair_Davis]
#193469
02/04/09 10:02 PM
02/04/09 10:02 PM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 5,314
Carstairs, Alberta, Canada
dave571
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Carstairs, Alberta, Canada
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The Crown Vic cross member is aluminum, so not something that would normally be narrowed at home.
For me, the big plus of this piece, is that it is a bolt on, and won't pose any questions of weld strength and quality later on.
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Re: Boneyard Front Suspension
[Re: Greg55_99]
#193472
01/04/14 01:19 PM
01/04/14 01:19 PM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 2,683
Des Moines IA
Soopernaut
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Des Moines IA
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Another option that might have been a good fit would be a Pacer IFS. I was going to put one in my Scout but the frame rails were slightly over 35 inches outside to outside so it would have required frame or crossmember modification.
1970 Dodge d100/eventually going on a 77 D100 frame
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for interesting reading...
