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comp cam pro magnum or harland sharp rockers #1774368
03/07/15 09:59 PM
03/07/15 09:59 PM
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restos just aren't my thing
gtsuperbee Offline OP
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restos just aren't my thing
Looking for opinions on the harland sharp 1.5 rockers or the comp cam 1.5 pro magnums. Is one better than the other and why? They will be installed on an eddy headed big block. Thx in advance btw, I know the pro magnums need matching push rods.


Restoring a car to look "only" as good as the factory made it is like getting a boob job for your wife and having the doctor make them two different sizes to seem more natural
Re: comp cam pro magnum or harland sharp rockers [Re: gtsuperbee] #1774369
03/07/15 10:38 PM
03/07/15 10:38 PM
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Lowes
steve660 Offline
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Depends a lot on how much spring pressure your running. Ive ran 525ish open pressure with Comps and no problems. I don't think aluminum rockers are best for high spring pressure anyway. Ive had a set of Crane Gold rockers break with hi spring pressure. Yes, you will need diff pushrods with Comp Pro Magnums, and they get direct oiling from the adjusters, which I think is a better setup. With the Harland Sharps if your off more than ~.030 you can burn up the pushrods. Who knows, you may need diff pushrods with the Harland Sharps too.

Last edited by steve660; 03/08/15 01:36 AM.
Re: comp cam pro magnum or harland sharp rockers [Re: gtsuperbee] #1774370
03/07/15 10:48 PM
03/07/15 10:48 PM
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USA
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B3RE Offline
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Quote:

Looking for opinions on the harland sharp 1.5 rockers or the comp cam 1.5 pro magnums. Is one better than the other and why? They will be installed on an eddy headed big block. Thx in advance btw, I know the pro magnums need matching push rods.



Ok, you asked for an opinion. Over priced and over rated. No matter which one you pick, the geometry will be way off.


Mike Beachel

I didn't write the rules of math nor create the laws of physics, I am just bound by them.
Re: comp cam pro magnum or harland sharp rockers [Re: B3RE] #1774371
03/08/15 12:40 AM
03/08/15 12:40 AM
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Ontario, Canada
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Stanton Offline
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Re: comp cam pro magnum or harland sharp rockers [Re: B3RE] #1774372
03/08/15 01:44 AM
03/08/15 01:44 AM
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St. Paul , Mn.
tubtar Offline
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Quote:

Quote:

Looking for opinions on the harland sharp 1.5 rockers or the comp cam 1.5 pro magnums. Is one better than the other and why? They will be installed on an eddy headed big block. Thx in advance btw, I know the pro magnums need matching push rods.



Ok, you asked for an opinion. Over priced and over rated. No matter which one you pick, the geometry will be way off.




So go with the stock stamped then ?

Re: comp cam pro magnum or harland sharp rockers [Re: steve660] #1774373
03/08/15 03:16 AM
03/08/15 03:16 AM
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Posts: 3,378
Rancho Cordova, CA
Exit1965 Offline
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Quote:

Depends a lot on how much spring pressure your running. Ive ran 525ish open pressure with Comps and no problems. I don't think aluminum rockers are best for high spring pressure anyway. Ive had a set of Crane Gold rockers break with hi spring pressure. Yes, you will need diff pushrods with Comp Pro Magnums, and they get direct oiling from the adjusters, which I think is a better setup. With the Harland Sharps if your off more than ~.030 you can burn up the pushrods. Who knows, you may need diff pushrods with the Harland Sharps too.




What different pushrods are you talking about, ball/ball? I'm putting some 'ultra pro magnums' on a 493 right now and stock length replacement pushrods (ball/ball solid, no oiling) seem to fit fine with the solid lifters I'm using.

Re: comp cam pro magnum or harland sharp rockers [Re: tubtar] #1774374
03/08/15 01:15 PM
03/08/15 01:15 PM
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USA
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B3RE Offline
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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Looking for opinions on the harland sharp 1.5 rockers or the comp cam 1.5 pro magnums. Is one better than the other and why? They owill be installed on an eddy headed big block. Thx in advance btw, I know the pro magnums need matching push rods.



Ok, you asked for an opinion. Over priced and over rated. No matter which one you pick, the geometry will be way off.




So go with the stock stamped then ?



Considering the OP didn't mention a cam, spring pressures, or rpm capabilities, stock stamped might be the better option. I'm sure if he dropped a valve or had some other serious damage result from poor valvetrain geometry, he wouldn't find the humor in it. Breaking a stamped rocker pales in comparison.


Mike Beachel

I didn't write the rules of math nor create the laws of physics, I am just bound by them.
Re: comp cam pro magnum or harland sharp rockers [Re: steve660] #1774375
03/08/15 02:53 PM
03/08/15 02:53 PM
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Bend,OR USA
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Cab_Burge Offline
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Quote:

I don't think aluminum rockers are best for high spring pressure anyway. Ive had a set of Crane Gold rockers break with hi spring pressure. Yes, you will need diff pushrods with Comp Pro Magnums, and they get direct oiling from the adjusters, which I think is a better setup. With the Harland Sharps if your off more than ~.030 you can burn up the pushrods. Who knows, you may need diff pushrods with the Harland Sharps too.


I ran 275 lbs on the seats and 680 lb open on my pump gas 518 C.I. motor with Harland Sharps 1.60 ratio rockers(.700 + lift), shifted it at or above 7000 RPM regulary with a lot of laps and 3000+ street miles with no problems As far as breaking Crane extruded aluminum rockers and then comparing them to full needle bearing Harland Sharp roller rockers is like comparing a brass hammer to a tool steel hammer, the results are based on the use As far as the length of the pushrods Harland Sharp reccommmends from zero to 2 full threads exposed on their 7/16 x 20 adjsuters, which is . 080 differences, if you burnt them up with .030 difference you have some other problem, like rubbing against the block or head not allowing oil to get to the pushrod tips Been there, done that OP, I have used more than one set of Harland Sharp roller rockers as well as T&D and a bunch of other brands and types of rocker on the street and race motors, but not any of the current stainless steel Comp so no comment on them. I am buying another set of full roller Harland Sharp right now to replace the Hughes aluminum rockers on my current 505 C.I. bracket motor Hopefully someone with personel experience on the Comp Stainless will chip in


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: comp cam pro magnum or harland sharp rockers [Re: Cab_Burge] #1774376
03/08/15 03:41 PM
03/08/15 03:41 PM
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Posts: 35
Canada
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Criterion Offline
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Canada
Quote:

I am buying another set of full roller Harland Sharp right now to replace the Hughes aluminum rockers on my current 505 C.I. bracket motor Hopefully someone with personel experience on the Comp Stainless will chip in




Quick question, Cab. What were your impressions like of the Hughes rocker arms? Quality, fit, geometry, any failure issues?

Re: comp cam pro magnum or harland sharp rockers [Re: Criterion] #1774377
03/08/15 03:47 PM
03/08/15 03:47 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 501
Easton, PA
68DART360 Offline
mopar
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Easton, PA
I've used the comp cam pro magnums for years. The only issue I had was getting the geometry right. I had to use lash caps after I had ordered what I thought were the correct length pushrods. Very durable.

Re: comp cam pro magnum or harland sharp rockers [Re: Criterion] #1774378
03/08/15 04:42 PM
03/08/15 04:42 PM
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Bend,OR USA
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Quote:

Quote:

I am buying another set of full roller Harland Sharp right now to replace the Hughes aluminum rockers on my current 505 C.I. bracket motor Hopefully someone with personel experience on the Comp Stainless will chip in




Quick question, Cab. What were your impressions like of the Hughes rocker arms? Quality, fit, geometry, any failure issues?



I had two of thier adjusters break so I replaced all the adjusters, not the nuts with Manton heat treated after the second one broke( it took some runs on them before they broke ) and then one of the original lock nuts backed off on the new adjusters and ruined that rocker arm and adjuster So three strikes and thier out of my motor. They bolted on and worked, Hughes exchanged them with me(even though I didn't buy them from them originally ) from thier new 1.5 non cyro treated extruded aluminum rocker assemblys to thier 1.6 with cryo treating for the price of the cyro treating and shipping These are on a Eddy Victor Max wedge heads. I over stressed them, evidently I don't pay a lot of attention to scrub patterns, I use lash caps on all my builds, unless it is a low RPM hydraulic lifter motor with spring pressures under 350 lbs open.I have thought of trying to make them better but I would rather race and drive them instead of putting off the maintenance needed later I do have a set of CNC ported 440-1 with a set of Jesel paired shaft rocker arms on them, maybe I'll focus on getting them better on the rocker arm tip alignment to the valve stem center like all the guys with those type rocker do


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: comp cam pro magnum or harland sharp rockers [Re: Cab_Burge] #1774379
03/08/15 05:35 PM
03/08/15 05:35 PM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,684
W. Kentucky
justinp61 Offline
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I've been running Hughes roller rockers on my small block for about 10 years with moderate spring pressure, 153 on the seat and 383 at 1.25". I had to grind the pi$$ out them to clear the od of the spring. They have a bunch of street miles and 1/8 mile passes on them with no issues.

Re: comp cam pro magnum or harland sharp rockers [Re: 68DART360] #1774380
03/08/15 06:19 PM
03/08/15 06:19 PM
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B3RE Offline
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Quote:

I've used the comp cam pro magnums for years. The only issue I had was getting the geometry right. I had to use lash caps after I had ordered what I thought were the correct length pushrods. Very durable.



Give this some serious thought. How does a lash cap correct geometry, and what effect does the pushrod length have besides moving the adjuster in or out?


Mike Beachel

I didn't write the rules of math nor create the laws of physics, I am just bound by them.
Re: comp cam pro magnum or harland sharp rockers [Re: Cab_Burge] #1774381
03/08/15 06:52 PM
03/08/15 06:52 PM
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USA
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B3RE Offline
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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

I am buying another set of full roller Harland Sharp right now to replace the Hughes aluminum rockers on my current 505 C.I. bracket motor Hopefully someone with personel experience on the Comp Stainless will chip in




Quick question, Cab. What were your impressions like of the Hughes rocker arms? Quality, fit, geometry, any failure issues?



I over stressed them, evidently I don't pay a lot of attention to scrub patterns, I use lash caps on all my builds, unless it is a low RPM hydraulic lifter motor with spring pressures under 350 lbs open.


Lash caps huh? Maybe Mopar should have put 1/2" valve stems in their motors so builders had enough contact area for all that sweep. Could that be why you over stressed them? Maybe that scrub pattern (sweep) might be something to look at after all. There are a lot of .800+ lift motors with 5/16 stemmed valves out there that don't use or need lash caps.
Quote:

I have thought of trying to make them better but I would rather race and drive them instead of putting off the maintenance needed later


I can't believe you don't have a ton of maintenance now.
Quote:

I do have a set of CNC ported 440-1 with a set of Jesel paired shaft rocker arms on them, maybe I'll focus on getting them better on the rocker arm tip alignment to the valve stem center like all the guys with those type rocker do


Do they really? While they may align them to the center, that is only after the shaft height is correct. Centering the roller doesn't do anything to correct geometry.


Mike Beachel

I didn't write the rules of math nor create the laws of physics, I am just bound by them.
Re: comp cam pro magnum or harland sharp rockers [Re: justinp61] #1774382
03/08/15 06:55 PM
03/08/15 06:55 PM
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B3RE Offline
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Quote:

I've been running Hughes roller rockers on my small block for about 10 years with moderate spring pressure, 153 on the seat and 383 at 1.25". I had to grind the pi$$ out them to clear the od of the spring. They have a bunch of street miles and 1/8 mile passes on them with no issues.



The shaft height was too low which is why you had to grind them for clearance. Raise the shaft to the correct location and the clearance issues go away.


Mike Beachel

I didn't write the rules of math nor create the laws of physics, I am just bound by them.
Re: comp cam pro magnum or harland sharp rockers [Re: gtsuperbee] #1774383
03/08/15 08:47 PM
03/08/15 08:47 PM
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Oregon
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Depends on the lift. The HS rocker arms are a little long. I think they were designed for higher lift. For a street type engine the Comps work pretty well. I run them on my street motor.

8453706-08(Large).jpg (521 downloads)
Re: comp cam pro magnum or harland sharp rockers [Re: B3RE] #1774384
03/08/15 09:13 PM
03/08/15 09:13 PM
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Bend,OR USA
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On the all of the motors I've built and used Harland Sharp aluminum roller rocker arms, both on OEM cast iron heads and several different sets of Eddy aluminum heads as well as one set of Indy 440-1 aluminum heads, the roller wheel contact at no lift was on the inside third(towards the rocker shafts) of the valve stem, at max lift it was close to the center of the stems( on 5/16,11/32 and 3/8 valve stems ), at max lift is had moved back towards the rocker shafts on both valves, intakes and exhausts . Not the same results with other rocker arms, especially on Hemiroid motors
I started using lash caps to avoid mushrooming the valve stem tips on solid lifter motors years ago, not to correct rocker arm deficits I got tired of having to file or stone the ridges, edges, off the top of the mushroomed valve stems before removing them(to avoid ruining the valve guides) when I wanted to take them apart I have found that the valve stem finish can influence the amount of wear that occurs on our motors, a very smooth polished stem will not wear as fast as a unpolished, rough finished valve stem will
I'm sure that if I was shooting for the moon(perfection) on all of my motors, RPM and HP output, I would focus on all the aspects of acheiving perfection, not accepting some things like less than perfect rocker arm geometry I have a motor under construction now that I'm waiting on the heads and T&D single shaft rocker arms on, it will be interesting to see how they fit on those heads I'll think about posting the results, if the customer doesn't mind


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: comp cam pro magnum or harland sharp rockers [Re: AndyF] #1774385
03/08/15 10:53 PM
03/08/15 10:53 PM
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B3RE Offline
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Quote:

Depends on the lift. The HS rocker arms are a little long. I think they were designed for higher lift. For a street type engine the Comps work pretty well. I run them on my street motor.



I run these on my street motor, and they are a little long, but they don't care what lift I'm running because I moved the shaft to the right place. Also, the sweep across the valve is only .029" with .595" lift. If I had just bolted the rockers to the stand, the sweep would have been over .092".

8453853-IMAG0418-2.jpg (1294 downloads)

Mike Beachel

I didn't write the rules of math nor create the laws of physics, I am just bound by them.
Re: comp cam pro magnum or harland sharp rockers [Re: Cab_Burge] #1774386
03/08/15 11:05 PM
03/08/15 11:05 PM
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Posts: 561
USA
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B3RE Offline
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Quote:

On the all of the motors I've built and used Harland Sharp aluminum roller rocker arms, both on OEM cast iron heads and several different sets of Eddy aluminum heads as well as one set of Indy 440-1 aluminum heads, the roller wheel contact at no lift was on the inside third(towards the rocker shafts) of the valve stem, at max lift it was close to the center of the stems( on 5/16,11/32 and 3/8 valve stems ), at max lift is had moved back towards the rocker shafts on both valves, intakes and exhausts . Not the same results with other rocker arms, especially on Hemiroid motors
I started using lash caps to avoid mushrooming the valve stem tips on solid lifter motors years ago, not to correct rocker arm deficits I got tired of having to file or stone the ridges, edges, off the top of the mushroomed valve stems before removing them(to avoid ruining the valve guides) when I wanted to take them apart I have found that the valve stem finish can influence the amount of wear that occurs on our motors, a very smooth polished stem will not wear as fast as a unpolished, rough finished valve stem will
I'm sure that if I was shooting for the moon(perfection) on all of my motors, RPM and HP output, I would focus on all the aspects of acheiving perfection, not accepting some things like less than perfect rocker arm geometry I have a motor under construction now that I'm waiting on the heads and T&D single shaft rocker arms on, it will be interesting to see how they fit on those heads I'll think about posting the results, if the customer doesn't mind



Cab, I could understand not shooting for absolute perfection, but do you realize that a .700" valve lift with Harlands, and stock length valves, will be off about .150" by just bolting the rockers to the cast in stands? That's hardly just shy of perfection.
Also, if you are having that much trouble with the burrs and mushrooming on the valve tip, I'd say the valvetrain has some instability that is causing it to take a pounding. Either that, or you are using crappy valves (which I doubt).


Mike Beachel

I didn't write the rules of math nor create the laws of physics, I am just bound by them.
Re: comp cam pro magnum or harland sharp rockers [Re: B3RE] #1774387
03/09/15 01:07 AM
03/09/15 01:07 AM
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Bend,OR USA
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I used what valves Ma Mopar put in the stock heads originally back then Ductile iron rocker also. I do check the lift at the retainers with checking springs to see how close the rocker arm ratio is, I haven't checked all my motors after installing the race springs but I do know they make a difference on the net lift at the valve reatainers I do remember one motor picking up 8 hp and 300 RPM increase on the peak HP RPM the dyno by switching pushrods from a set of Smith Bros. 3/8x.083 to a set of Manton Serioes # 3/8 x.120 wall. I was charged by Smith Bros for .120 wall originally I had one break in two pieces in the middle It took the one next to it out and broke the top of the Crower Ultra roller lifter off and it ended up scoring the lifter bushing and damage the cam lobe also I took it back to Smith Bros, it had a visable defect where it broke in the wall, and they replaced both of the damaged pushrods but didn't offer to help on any of the other damamg parts The dyo results ended up making me decide to buy Mantons from then on
BTW, I seem to remember at one time that all the cam companys recommended having the sweep start on the inside of the valve stem, on shaft rocker systems, and travel across
the middle of the stem to the other side of the stem and then back to where it started, I haven't seen that in a while though I have seen a machine shop plug the original bolt holes on a 440 head and remachine the holes and stands to move the shafts back towards the cam to get the rocker tip to valve stem center better and correct the geometry(SP?) Maybe some day I will get all of this race stuff figured out, maybe not


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
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