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Comp Cams cam button #1769676 03/03/15 01:11 AM 03/03/15 01:11 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,121 State, country, etc. G gss OP super stock
gss OP super stock G Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,121 State, country, etc.	I can't find any information on how they are installed. What holds them on?

Re: Comp Cams cam button [Re: gss] #1769677 03/03/15 01:21 AM 03/03/15 01:21 AM
Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,190 Bend,OR USA C Cab_Burge I Win
Cab_Burge I Win C Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,190 Bend,OR USA	It depends on which motor and which cam gear, IE single bolt or three bolts on BB, Hemi or if your working on a L.A SB motor OOPS, not needed on LA motors with the stock cam retaining plates Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)

Re: Comp Cams cam button [Re: gss] #1769678 03/03/15 02:03 AM 03/03/15 02:03 AM
Joined: Oct 2005 Posts: 8,872 Ontario, Canada S Stanton Don't question me!
Stanton Don't question me! S Joined: Oct 2005 Posts: 8,872 Ontario, Canada	The timing cover holds them in !!!

Re: Comp Cams cam button [Re: Cab_Burge] #1769679 03/03/15 02:07 AM 03/03/15 02:07 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,121 State, country, etc. G gss OP super stock
gss OP super stock G Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,121 State, country, etc.	It's a 3 bolt Comp Cams XR280R

Re: Comp Cams cam button [Re: gss] #1769680 04/01/15 12:44 AM 04/01/15 12:44 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,121 State, country, etc. G gss OP super stock
gss OP super stock G Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,121 State, country, etc.	Well this is starting to get a little aggravating. The cam/lifter/timing gear set I got from Comp cams didn't include the required cam button or the 3 cam bolts. So I get the recommended button from CC and the smallest head cam bolts I can find from ARP and the button still doesn't fit without hitting the bolt heads. Am I expected to put this button in a lathe and turn in down? There has got to be a better solution. What do you guys do with these?

Re: Comp Cams cam button [Re: gss] #1769681 04/01/15 01:30 AM 04/01/15 01:30 AM
Joined: Dec 2003 Posts: 628 Denison,Ia. C Cuda367 mopar
Cuda367 mopar C Joined: Dec 2003 Posts: 628 Denison,Ia.	Allen headed bolts worked just fine. Just finished one this week. The real problem is clearance. I like .004 to.006 cam end play. I install the cam with button and gear in place and nothing else. Then I bolt on water pump housing with gaskets in place using a feeler gauge I find the clearance between back of housing and button. Measure thickness of timing cover then find a washer that when tack welded to cover will give the clearance I want. Aluminum cover will not flex but steel cover will flex a lot.

Re: Comp Cams cam button [Re: Cuda367] #1769682 04/01/15 11:53 AM 04/01/15 11:53 AM
Joined: Oct 2005 Posts: 8,872 Ontario, Canada S Stanton Don't question me!
Stanton Don't question me! S Joined: Oct 2005 Posts: 8,872 Ontario, Canada	The only bolts I've found that a) have a narrow enough head for a button to fit and b) fit under the cover without hitting are called "low head socket head cap screws". These look like an allen head cap screw but are about half the height. You won't find these at Lowes or Home Depot - you'll need to go to a place that specializes in nuts and bolts. Any time I tried, standard allen head bolts didn't fit under the cover.

Re: Comp Cams cam button [Re: gss] #1769683 04/01/15 11:59 AM 04/01/15 11:59 AM
Joined: Oct 2005 Posts: 8,872 Ontario, Canada S Stanton Don't question me!
Stanton Don't question me! S Joined: Oct 2005 Posts: 8,872 Ontario, Canada	The topic was well covered a while back. Do a search on "cam walk"

Re: Comp Cams cam button [Re: Stanton] #1769684 04/01/15 04:46 PM 04/01/15 04:46 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,121 State, country, etc. G gss OP super stock
gss OP super stock G Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,121 State, country, etc.	There is some good info in that thread, thanks I tried allen head bolts but they only fit if I leave out the washers. I will check with Fastenal for low allen head bolts.

Re: Comp Cams cam button [Re: gss] #1769685 04/01/15 05:27 PM 04/01/15 05:27 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 31,036 Oregon A AndyF I Win
AndyF I Win A Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 31,036 Oregon	Quote: Well this is starting to get a little aggravating. The cam/lifter/timing gear set I got from Comp cams didn't include the required cam button or the 3 cam bolts. So I get the recommended button from CC and the smallest head cam bolts I can find from ARP and the button still doesn't fit without hitting the bolt heads. Am I expected to put this button in a lathe and turn in down? There has got to be a better solution. What do you guys do with these? It is all application specific. I think most engine builder come up with a combination that works for them. I used to use Hex-a-just timing sets with my own cam button and ARP bolts. But as soon as you switch brands you run into issues. Everyone builds their stuff to slightly different dimensions. Typical hot rodding problem.

Re: Comp Cams cam button [Re: AndyF] #1769686 04/01/15 06:10 PM 04/01/15 06:10 PM
Joined: Oct 2005 Posts: 8,872 Ontario, Canada S Stanton Don't question me!
Stanton Don't question me! S Joined: Oct 2005 Posts: 8,872 Ontario, Canada	Quote: they only fit if I leave out the washers Ditch the washers.

Re: Comp Cams cam button [Re: Stanton] #1769687 04/02/15 02:07 AM 04/02/15 02:07 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,121 State, country, etc. G gss OP super stock
gss OP super stock G Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,121 State, country, etc.	After taking a closer look, even after removing the washers, the button still hits the ARP bolts. Allen head bolts are even larger in diameter than the ARP bolts. If someone here has installed a Comp Cams nylon button, I would like know how you cleared the bolts. 8478442-photo.JPG (178 downloads)

Re: Comp Cams cam button [Re: gss] #1769688 04/02/15 09:05 AM 04/02/15 09:05 AM
Joined: Feb 2006 Posts: 1,051 The Great White North RAMM super stock
RAMM super stock Joined: Feb 2006 Posts: 1,051 The Great White North	Just went through this last week. Had to turn down the button in my lathe. PITA for an issue that should have been solved 20+ years ago. J.Rob 2009 PHR\EMC Competitor 2010 PHR\EMC Competitor 2011 PHR\EMC Competitor 2012 PHR\EMC Competitor 2013 PHR\EMC Competitor 2014 HotRod/EMC Competitor 2015 HotRod/EMC NoShow 2016 HotRod/EMC 3rd place SPEC Bigblock 2018 HotRod/EMC 7th place G3

Re: Comp Cams cam button [Re: gss] #1769689 04/02/15 11:49 AM 04/02/15 11:49 AM
Joined: May 2010 Posts: 485 Central California MoParFish mopar
MoParFish mopar Joined: May 2010 Posts: 485 Central California	Quote: After taking a closer look, even after removing the washers, the button still hits the ARP bolts. Allen head bolts are even larger in diameter than the ARP bolts. If someone here has installed a Comp Cams nylon button, I would like know how you cleared the bolts. I went through the same thing on the first one I did. I turned the button around and machined(actually did it with drill and bench grinder when I didn't have access to a lathe) the big end to fit the timing gear and faced it so the large end step goes flush with the face of gear. Then the bolts and washers capture the button so it can't fall out. Now, I keep a 1" diameter piece of Delrin acetyl plastic around and make them as needed. Done a couple since. I machine the cover side of button small enough so there is no problem with bolt or washer interference. Like said, I did the first one with a drill and grinder. Not too sterile but that motor has been thrashed on with a ton of nitrous and still together sitting on the floor ready for it's next venture. Sorry, don't have a pic. P.S. As memory serves on that first one, the small end was too big to chuck in drill so I drilled a 1/4 inch hole through the center of the button as straight as possible, then pressed the appropriate size drill bit in to serve as a mandrel and worked slow. Again, not ideal but did what I did. For the others, I used a lathe, much nicer Last edited by MoParFish; 04/02/15 12:03 PM. Sworn Member Central Valley MoPar Drag Pack. You can reach me at (done-et-chasing@going-rounds.gone)... :-) [img]https://s6.postimg.org/v3mbggksx/SAC16.jpg[/img]image hosting more than 5mb

Re: Comp Cams cam button [Re: RAMM] #1769690 04/02/15 11:51 AM 04/02/15 11:51 AM
Joined: Oct 2005 Posts: 8,872 Ontario, Canada S Stanton Don't question me!
Stanton Don't question me! S Joined: Oct 2005 Posts: 8,872 Ontario, Canada	It doesn't have to be pretty ... hit it with a grinder or whatever. Nylon will not wear unless the contact surface (the timing cover) is rough so it doesn't matter if the end is round. You're likely going to have to grind the end to get the right clearance anyway.

Re: Comp Cams cam button [Re: Stanton] #1769691 04/02/15 12:41 PM 04/02/15 12:41 PM
Joined: May 2009 Posts: 511 Temperance, MI 6 68 HEMI GTS mopar
68 HEMI GTS mopar 6 Joined: May 2009 Posts: 511 Temperance, MI	just take a die grinder and a burr and clearance the 3 spots where it hits the bolts. not a big deal. 68 Dart GTS "HEMI" 10.30 @ 131 pump gas street car 3780# 69 Roadrunner 511 six pack 10.92 drive to track street car

Re: Comp Cams cam button [Re: 68 HEMI GTS] #1769692 04/05/15 11:13 PM 04/05/15 11:13 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,121 State, country, etc. G gss OP super stock
gss OP super stock G Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,121 State, country, etc.	Quote: just take a die grinder and a burr and clearance the 3 spots where it hits the bolts. not a big deal. That is what I ended up doing. End play is .012". If I leave the gasket out, then I measure .009". I am surprised it is that loose. I would think they would make them oversize so they can be cut down for the desired end play. I'd rather not dimple the timing cover or weld to the inside so I may just go with the .012". Max end play is usually around .010" but I don't see another .002" causing problems. What do ya think?

Re: Comp Cams cam button [Re: gss] #1769693 04/06/15 11:34 AM 04/06/15 11:34 AM
Joined: Oct 2005 Posts: 8,872 Ontario, Canada S Stanton Don't question me!
Stanton Don't question me! S Joined: Oct 2005 Posts: 8,872 Ontario, Canada	Cut a small piece of the appropriate thickness of feeler gauge and put it in behind the button. But .012 isn't the end of the world !!

Re: Comp Cams cam button [Re: Stanton] #1807230 04/19/15 09:13 PM 04/19/15 09:13 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,121 State, country, etc. G gss OP super stock
gss OP super stock G Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,121 State, country, etc.	Ok finally have some time to get back to this engine build. From what I have read, it sounds like I need to fill the gap between the water pump and the timing cover to keep the cam from bowing out the timing cover. I could tack on some sort of metal spacer to the timing cover with a MIG welder. Would that create some distortion that would alter the cam end play? It wouldn't take much to mess it up when we are talking a few thousandths. Would a little duraglass or epoxy putty between the water pump and timing cover work?

Re: Comp Cams cam button [Re: gss] #1807267 04/19/15 10:14 PM 04/19/15 10:14 PM
Joined: Oct 2005 Posts: 8,872 Ontario, Canada S Stanton Don't question me!
Stanton Don't question me! S Joined: Oct 2005 Posts: 8,872 Ontario, Canada	Quote: Would a little duraglass or epoxy putty between the water pump and timing cover work? Absolutely !! Stick a piece of saran wrap to the timing cover first so it only sticks to the water pump.

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