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Warming timken axle bearings to ease installation? #1768238
03/01/15 01:49 PM
03/01/15 01:49 PM
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Winlock, Wa
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fshd4it Offline OP
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I just got a new set of timken A-7 bearings, to put on stock axles, for the 8 3/4 that's going in my challenger... and was wondering if warming them up to 200 degrees in the oven would make pressing them on any easier. I have a 12 ton harbor freight-style press for the job. When I did the set on the belvedere several (10?) years ago, I seem to remember there being some grunt required to push those bearings on. I don't recall, however, the size, quality or condition of the press I used...which could have been part of the issue. Timkens website says not to exceed 300 degrees on cones, so I thought I'd stay well on the safe side. Opinions?


In order to know what you want, you'll probably have to find out what you don't want.
Re: Warming timken axle bearings to ease installation? [Re: fshd4it] #1768239
03/01/15 01:54 PM
03/01/15 01:54 PM
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Alberta
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rustbuckett68 Offline
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I've had luck placing them gently on an open trouble light bulb for a few minutes. Clean, dry and very gently, don't want to break the bulb.

Re: Warming timken axle bearings to ease installation? [Re: rustbuckett68] #1768240
03/01/15 02:13 PM
03/01/15 02:13 PM
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Winlock, Wa
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fshd4it Offline OP
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I've heard that light bulbs make great little bearing heaters. I'm planning on putting a bit of oil on the axles' surfaces also, as I cringe at dry installation. The FSM I have is pretty short on info, othe than how to use their special bearing installer.


In order to know what you want, you'll probably have to find out what you don't want.
Re: Warming timken axle bearings to ease installation? [Re: fshd4it] #1768241
03/01/15 08:41 PM
03/01/15 08:41 PM
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St Louis, MO 63026
convx4 Offline
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A 100 Watt light bulb will work fine.
You want to install it dry.
No oil! Oil would become trapped between the axle and the bearing not allowing the shrink of the bearing to grab hold on the axle. If you want to put some thing on the axle to ease the bearing removal dry moly works best. I don't advise it.

At work I rebuild all kinds of things and this is what I have been thought / learned.

Re: Warming timken axle bearings to ease installation? [Re: convx4] #1768242
03/01/15 09:21 PM
03/01/15 09:21 PM
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Big Sky Country
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MO_PA Offline
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You can safely warm them to about 400*
then just drop them on and let them cool.

Re: Warming timken axle bearings to ease installation? [Re: fshd4it] #1768243
03/01/15 09:34 PM
03/01/15 09:34 PM
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Texas
GoodysGotaCuda Offline
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Warming them up sure helps, I've used a toaster oven out in the garage for that before.

Be sure to not press on the cage, if you have an old bearing, you can use it to push on the new one. Depending on how long the bearing surface is on the axle...may need to hog it out some.


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Re: Warming timken axle bearings to ease installation? [Re: GoodysGotaCuda] #1768244
03/01/15 10:55 PM
03/01/15 10:55 PM
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 154
Winlock, Wa
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fshd4it Offline OP
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Roger that, no oil. Didn't think about it getting trapped under the bearing. Somewhere I've got a piece of heavy wall aluminum pipe that worked perfectly last time I did this, figured it was soft enough not to score the bearing surface on the axle. Warming is no problem, as I have an old electric smoker in the shop. Works great for heating, drying etc, even if the first few parts came out smelling like bbq... Thanks for the replies, hopefully I can get back on this project tomorrow.


In order to know what you want, you'll probably have to find out what you don't want.
Re: Warming timken axle bearings to ease installation? [Re: fshd4it] #1768245
03/02/15 02:38 PM
03/02/15 02:38 PM
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dogdays Offline
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You guys using 100 watt lightbulbs, enjoy them while they last. They're against the law to manufacture or import for sale in the US since a few years ago.

I support energy efficiency because it is the right thing to do with the gift of Earth that God has given us, but some things are just plain stupid. Die, energy Nazis!

R. (inappropriate political comment free of charge)

Last edited by dogdays; 03/02/15 02:38 PM.
Re: Warming timken axle bearings to ease installation? [Re: MO_PA] #1768246
03/02/15 04:33 PM
03/02/15 04:33 PM
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U.S.S.A.
JohnRR Offline
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Quote:

You can safely warm them to about 400*
then just drop them on and let them cool.




400 is too high , We have an SKF bearing heater at work, it's an induction style , its set at 250 degrees.

Warming to 200 degrees in an oven will be fine , it's a press fit so putting oil on to aid the fit is a waste of time, and oil, the bearing will just scrape the oil off and trap it between the inner race of the bearing and the point that it seats against on the axle leaving the bearing not fully seated.

Re: Warming timken axle bearings to ease installation? [Re: JohnRR] #1768247
03/03/15 10:23 AM
03/03/15 10:23 AM
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North Dakota
6PakBee Online content
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I do not agree with any of the comments about not lubricating a press fit. IMHO doing press fits dry with certain materials is just asking for a gall. If you go through the FSM when a press fit is done (piston pins for example) the procedure typically starts out with some kind of lubrication (admittedly suspension parts are an exception). For this specific example, I just don't buy off on the concept of lubricant holding a bearing off the shoulder of the axle. If I put a dab of grease on the jaws of a pliers and close it, the result is metal to metal contact. I can't see where this would be any different.


"We live in a time when intelligent people are being silenced so that stupid people won't be offended".
Re: Warming timken axle bearings to ease installation? [Re: 6PakBee] #1768248
03/03/15 11:49 AM
03/03/15 11:49 AM
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Ohio
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jlatessa Offline
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In certain applications, you can trap a lubricant in a blind
shoulder or other application and get a sort of hydraulic lock
to prevent proper seating.

With sleeves or other open-ended applications I don't think it's a problem, just keep it in mind.

Joe

Re: Warming timken axle bearings to ease installation? [Re: 6PakBee] #1768249
03/03/15 12:57 PM
03/03/15 12:57 PM
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U.S.S.A.
JohnRR Offline
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Quote:

I do not agree with any of the comments about not lubricating a press fit. IMHO doing press fits dry with certain materials is just asking for a gall. If you go through the FSM when a press fit is done (piston pins for example) the procedure typically starts out with some kind of lubrication (admittedly suspension parts are an exception). For this specific example, I just don't buy off on the concept of lubricant holding a bearing off the shoulder of the axle. If I put a dab of grease on the jaws of a pliers and close it, the result is metal to metal contact. I can't see where this would be any different.




Can you see a .001/.002 thick film with your naked eye ?

We can agree to disagree ...

Re: Warming timken axle bearings to ease installation? [Re: JohnRR] #1768250
03/03/15 02:16 PM
03/03/15 02:16 PM
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Utah and Alaska
astjp2 Offline
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Quote:

Quote:

I do not agree with any of the comments about not lubricating a press fit. IMHO doing press fits dry with certain materials is just asking for a gall. If you go through the FSM when a press fit is done (piston pins for example) the procedure typically starts out with some kind of lubrication (admittedly suspension parts are an exception). For this specific example, I just don't buy off on the concept of lubricant holding a bearing off the shoulder of the axle. If I put a dab of grease on the jaws of a pliers and close it, the result is metal to metal contact. I can't see where this would be any different.




Can you see a .001/.002 thick film with your naked eye ?

We can agree to disagree ...


John, oil film is like .00012 thick if its a light oil, it can still cause a problem though. Tim


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Re: Warming timken axle bearings to ease installation? [Re: JohnRR] #1768251
03/04/15 12:09 AM
03/04/15 12:09 AM
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Morrow, OH
markz528 Offline
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Quote:

Quote:

You can safely warm them to about 400*
then just drop them on and let them cool.




400 is too high , We have an SKF bearing heater at work, it's an induction style , its set at 250 degrees.

Warming to 200 degrees in an oven will be fine , it's a press fit so putting oil on to aid the fit is a waste of time, and oil, the bearing will just scrape the oil off and trap it between the inner race of the bearing and the point that it seats against on the axle leaving the bearing not fully seated.




230 Deg F is a better target than 250. 250 is a bit high.


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Re: Warming timken axle bearings to ease installation? [Re: markz528] #1768252
03/04/15 02:41 AM
03/04/15 02:41 AM
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Gilroy,CA.
mopardude318 Offline
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you could also, if you have a large enough freezer, put the axles in the freezer! yes it works, ive done it. ive done it countless times when installing ball bearings on motorcycle crank shafts. throw the crankshaft in the freezer for a few hours. same for an axle...you'd be surprised....

happy moparing.


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Re: Warming timken axle bearings to ease installation? [Re: fshd4it] #1768253
03/04/15 10:43 AM
03/04/15 10:43 AM
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471Magnum Offline
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Quote:

Warming them up sure helps, I've used a toaster oven out in the garage for that before.




Yep. I'll warm them up in the toaster oven set about 300. Bearing temp probably doesn't get that high. Sometimes they'll actually drop right on with no additional force.

Done this for both outer (axle) bearings and inner (differential) bearings.

I do it in the kitchen and run them to the garage. When the wife isn't home, of course.

Not sure I agree with the 250 degree limit. Seems pretty conservative. For sealed/green bearings I sure wouldn't go any higher since most polymers HDT is 250 or less, but tapered bearings should be fine at the higher temps.


-Jim

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Re: Warming timken axle bearings to ease installation? [Re: 471Magnum] #1768254
03/04/15 12:50 PM
03/04/15 12:50 PM
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Colo
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250F is generally regarded as the max temp. to pre-heat a bearing for installation.
Google "Timken Industrial Bearing Maintenance Manual" Go to Page 15







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