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Paint question #1760650
02/22/15 05:20 PM
02/22/15 05:20 PM
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Tacoma, Washington USA
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Adam71Charger Offline OP
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I used rustoleum professional semi gloss black to paint one of my cars. sanded body with a mix of 120 and 220 grit. Did a little bondo work, sanded that down with 120 then 220 then 400. Painted 2 coats with roller then wetsand 400, 2 more coats then wetsand 600, then 2 final coats then wetsand 1000.

I used a cutting pad on a DA sander with Meguiars M101 cutting compound. This was my first attempt at any paint job and I had tons of sanding marks, swirls, but no bubbling or peeling or flaking. There is also some concave dimpling but it doesnt look like 'wrinkle' This is why I chose an aggressive compound before polishing.

My question is, between compounding, polishing, and waxing should I be doing more than just wiping the paint down with a microfiber pad? I feel like Im not fully removing the m101 with a dry cloth.. and dont want to start polishing with the m205 if residue from the m101 will mess it up in any way.

Re: Paint question [Re: Adam71Charger] #1760651
02/22/15 06:47 PM
02/22/15 06:47 PM
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Highland, MI.
Sunroofcuda Offline
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The "concave dimpling" you are describing sounds like silicone or oil under the paint & in the primer.


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Re: Paint question [Re: Adam71Charger] #1760652
02/22/15 07:01 PM
02/22/15 07:01 PM
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Rio Linda, CA
John_Kunkel Offline
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Quote:

There is also some concave dimpling




AKA "fisheyes".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bkzwmozW0n8


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Re: Paint question [Re: Sunroofcuda] #1760653
02/22/15 08:02 PM
02/22/15 08:02 PM
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Tacoma, Washington USA
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Adam71Charger Offline OP
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After watching a few vidoes and looking at pictures, Im pretty sure its not fisheyes. Ill have to take a picture and show. It's more like the look of that krylon 'hammered' paint, but the paint is completely smooth, so it's not hammered.... hard to explain. Its completely uniform on the whole car, looks intentional but I know it was caused by me somewhere along the line.

I was just trying to do the tremclad job with a roller brush. but since no tremclad here in states I used rustoleum professional semi gloss black, thinned with mineral spirits. It's a project car that I lost interest in and Im selling, but, the only way to get back the money was to paint it. I prepped really well, washed, dried, sanded the whole car, sanded the body work, cleaned with SPI waterborne wax and grease remover, then applied 2 coats, wet sanded then waterborne wax and grease remover, 2 coats wet sanded waterborn WAGR,, 2 coats wet sand Waterborne WAGR then used M101 cut compound.


I think maybe my wet sanding technique was poor or I didnt thin the paint enough? Ill post a picture.


I ended up using 50/50 Isopropyl alcohol and water and a microfiber cloth to wipe down the car after using the m101, now Im polishing with the M205. Still unsure if a dry wipedown is all thats needed before I wax, or if I need to use the 50/50 spray down again

Re: Paint question [Re: Adam71Charger] #1760654
02/22/15 08:22 PM
02/22/15 08:22 PM
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Pittsburgh,PA
RTSrunner Offline
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I use Wizards products Wipe Down to remove compounds between buffing.I would not wax a new paint job,wax will trap solvents and cause the paint to dye back,which will look dull.If it is a semi-gloss,I have to ask why you are sanding and polishing it,wouldn't that change the sheen?
RT

Re: Paint question [Re: RTSrunner] #1760655
02/22/15 08:57 PM
02/22/15 08:57 PM
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KY
Telvis Offline
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1000 grit is going to leave more scratches than a buffer will take out. I wet sand by hand progressively up to 2000 grit then use a wet trizac up to 3000 grit on a DA sander before buffing. The dimples may be orange peel that wasn't cut all the way down smooth. I see that a lot.


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Re: Paint question [Re: RTSrunner] #1760656
02/22/15 08:58 PM
02/22/15 08:58 PM
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Tacoma, Washington USA
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Adam71Charger Offline OP
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Well it definitely needed wet sanding between coats, and the final wetsand left the paint very dull.. The compound was to get out as much scratches as possible, and the polish (Im halfway through) is really making it shine more.

The final coat was put on probably 2 weeks ago, or longer, would I still risk trapping solvents with a wax?

Re: Paint question [Re: Adam71Charger] #1760657
02/22/15 09:27 PM
02/22/15 09:27 PM
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Quote:

Well it definitely needed wet sanding between coats, and the final wetsand left the paint very dull.. The compound was to get out as much scratches as possible, and the polish (Im halfway through) is really making it shine more.

The final coat was put on probably 2 weeks ago, or longer, would I still risk trapping solvents with a wax?




YES! Do not wax for at least 90 days or risk the consequences. Lets see a pic of the problem area.

Re: Paint question [Re: Adam71Charger] #1760658
02/23/15 02:33 AM
02/23/15 02:33 AM
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Missouri
MOBodyman Offline
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Quote:

I used rustoleum professional semi gloss black




I still trying to wrap my head around polishing 'semi gloss' paint. If you are successful I don't think it will be 'semi gloss' any more.

Unless you put a lot of paint on it (sanding between coats) you will have scratches even if you sanded down to 400 after using 120 & 220.

Using 'aggressive compound' on 'semi gloss' paint is likely what caused your swirls.
Dallas


2012 Rallye Redline Challenger, 1st new car!
2010 Ram 1500 4wd HEMI-hauler
2014 Dodge Dart-gas saver
4 projects and a bunch of parts cars, losing interest since buying the Challenger lol
1969 Dodge Coronet 500-'gonna fix 'er up someday!'
Re: Paint question [Re: MOBodyman] #1760659
02/23/15 04:44 AM
02/23/15 04:44 AM
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Tacoma, Washington USA
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Adam71Charger Offline OP
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Dont think too hard, like i said, I know nothing about painting or detailing. I just read the tremclad thread, tried to pick the most similar product in the states (the rustoleum tech rep said rustoleum professional). I tried to follow what the OP said to the best of my beginner ability. Obviously botched it up pretty well. Ill post the pictures asap. I picked the semi gloss, because the color on the can looked like what I wanted. I From there I thought I could give it a deeper darker wet look by polishing and waxing.

Re: Paint question [Re: Adam71Charger] #1760660
02/23/15 04:56 AM
02/23/15 04:56 AM
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Granite Bay CA
Kern Dog Offline
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Is this a paint sprayed from a paint gun? Was a hardener/catalyst used?
Without a catalyst, the paint will never hold a shine. The hardener is crucial for shine and durability.

Re: Paint question [Re: Kern Dog] #1760661
02/23/15 02:12 PM
02/23/15 02:12 PM
Joined: Jun 2013
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Tacoma, Washington USA
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Adam71Charger Offline OP
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I sanded the car heavily, I used no primer, I used an oil based alkyd paint, and several high density foam rollers. This is just naming off what I used. I dont know much about the paint other than I let it dry 24 to 48 hours before recoat and thinned 20 to 40% with mineral spirits. I used a dehumidifier and an electric heater in garage during whole process, and it ranged about 50 to 75 degrees, and 30 to 60 percent humidity. well within the specifications on the back of the paint can.

Re: Paint question [Re: Adam71Charger] #1760662
02/23/15 04:03 PM
02/23/15 04:03 PM
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Chino Valley
RodStRace Offline
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As said, semi gloss is not designed to be polished.
The spots could be orange peel or something else. Pics would clear this up. Closeups in good light, Please.

I'd wash the car with mild car wash soap (NOT Dawn) between polishes.

Re: Paint question [Re: RodStRace] #1760663
02/23/15 09:50 PM
02/23/15 09:50 PM
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Tacoma, Washington USA
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Adam71Charger Offline OP
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Anything was better than the dullness the wetsanding created. Im not saying polishing was right, its just the first thing I could think of to make the paint look less dull, more black, ,more wet.

Heres photos. They arent great, the car is stuck in the garage for now cant bring it out till I finish putting it together.








Re: Paint question [Re: Adam71Charger] #1760664
02/23/15 11:16 PM
02/23/15 11:16 PM
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Chino Valley
RodStRace Offline
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This pic looks like the paint didn't 'lay out' completely. Considering it was rolled on not sprayed, I would guess that more than orange peel.
Only way to fix that is to lay on more paint and color sand it smooth.
Sorry this is probably not the answer you are looking for (another round of the whole process), but this also may allow you to get a nice smooth coat on that won't require cut and buff after.

Re: Paint question [Re: RodStRace] #1760665
02/23/15 11:51 PM
02/23/15 11:51 PM
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Tacoma, Washington USA
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Adam71Charger Offline OP
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Quote:

This pic looks like the paint didn't 'lay out' completely. Considering it was rolled on not sprayed, I would guess that more than orange peel.
Only way to fix that is to lay on more paint and color sand it smooth.
Sorry this is probably not the answer you are looking for (another round of the whole process), but this also may allow you to get a nice smooth coat on that won't require cut and buff after.






Constructive criticism and solutions are always welcome! I knew I did something wrong but couldn't figure out what.

Can you elaborate more on the fix? What is color sanding? Should I thin my paint more or less or not at all?

Re: Paint question [Re: Adam71Charger] #1760666
02/24/15 03:02 AM
02/24/15 03:02 AM
Joined: Sep 2005
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Chino Valley
RodStRace Offline
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again, this is just a guess from the pics and description, but I'd suggest finding a spare, smooth surface chunk of metal. Extra fender, whatever...
Thin the paint out a bit more than you have been and try rolling it on again without runs.
It should flow out and dry smooth with the semi-gloss you are hoping for. Once you have figured out how to get the results desired, sand the car smooth, then apply your new talents.

See, the thing is, flat, semi-gloss and eggshell are supposed to remain as applied, NOT cut and buffed after application.

This is what is done to gloss paint.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxnnA7ntDUo

Doing it to anything but gloss (like your semi-gloss) tends to ruin the intended top surface.

I think that your sanding between coats didn't completely smooth the surface. A common thought is that the paint will flow out like water, leaving a flat smooth surface. Instead, it tends to fall like snow when spraying, following the surface. Rolling tends to be like a grader moving dirt, it leaves ridges and troughs. Using thinner will help this, allowing the paint to level out more before drying. Vertical areas and curves make this a delicate balancing act.

I'd also say that the paint looks okay for a quick sale. Unless it's gotta be a nice custom job to get the money needed, having the car all one color, fairly smooth and shiny will be enough in most cases. Since you chose to to the $50 buck paint job method, I assume this would be close to acceptable.

Last edited by RodStRace; 02/24/15 03:07 AM.






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