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Re: Bang for Buck 440 Motor Mods Stockish 67
[Re: Mr.Yuck]
#1756934
02/20/15 07:02 PM
02/20/15 07:02 PM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,584
MD
p d'ro
OP
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Quote:
Quote:
Ok, I might have a line on a barely used Holley SD dual plane and Holley 650 vac sec. I am hoping that will fit and wont have the same fuel boil issues a Eddy does.. Was also told that 440 source had good heads that look stock when painted turquoise...
easy killer lets fix what you have now 1st. EVEN with that carb it should run pretty well. Does the SD have the stock coil mount location?
I think the answer is no and I would have to maybe get the six pack bracket or make one. I also now think this one may be a hair too tall.
Do you know if the M1 bolts up to a holley??
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Re: Bang for Buck 440 Motor Mods Stockish 67
[Re: Mr.Yuck]
#1756935
02/20/15 07:13 PM
02/20/15 07:13 PM
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 6,559
Downtown Roebuck Ont
Twostick
Still wishing...
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Still wishing...
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 6,559
Downtown Roebuck Ont
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Quote:
Quote:
Ok, I might have a line on a barely used Holley SD dual plane and Holley 650 vac sec. I am hoping that will fit and wont have the same fuel boil issues a Eddy does.. Was also told that 440 source had good heads that look stock when painted turquoise...
easy killer lets fix what you have now 1st. EVEN with that carb it should run pretty well. Does the SD have the stock coil mount location?
You need to verify what you have to start with before you spend a dime on parts.
This means at the very least, a compression test. Just because you were told the engine is fresh doesn't mean it is or was assembled correctly. If you assume because it is fresh it will have 150 psi and when you check it you find it only has 90, or they are all over the place, you just found your problem.
The engine does NOT need to be hot to do this. If they are all 80-90 psi (low) cold or some good some horrible, warming it up isn't going to cure that. If it is low or not consistent, you need to find out why.
If it actually has good compression then you need to next confirm why it started knocking. That stuff does NOT heal itself. Did it lose oil pressure and scorch the rod bearings or did it float the valves?
Lots of stuff to check and the ONLY thing I would assume at this point is that everything that can be, is FUBAR.
Kevin
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Re: Bang for Buck 440 Motor Mods Stockish 67
[Re: Twostick]
#1756936
02/20/15 08:15 PM
02/20/15 08:15 PM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,584
MD
p d'ro
OP
pro stock
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OP
pro stock
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Ok, I might have a line on a barely used Holley SD dual plane and Holley 650 vac sec. I am hoping that will fit and wont have the same fuel boil issues a Eddy does.. Was also told that 440 source had good heads that look stock when painted turquoise...
easy killer lets fix what you have now 1st. EVEN with that carb it should run pretty well. Does the SD have the stock coil mount location?
You need to verify what you have to start with before you spend a dime on parts.
This means at the very least, a compression test. Just because you were told the engine is fresh doesn't mean it is or was assembled correctly. If you assume because it is fresh it will have 150 psi and when you check it you find it only has 90, or they are all over the place, you just found your problem.
The engine does NOT need to be hot to do this. If they are all 80-90 psi (low) cold or some good some horrible, warming it up isn't going to cure that. If it is low or not consistent, you need to find out why.
If it actually has good compression then you need to next confirm why it started knocking. That stuff does NOT heal itself. Did it lose oil pressure and scorch the rod bearings or did it float the valves?
Lots of stuff to check and the ONLY thing I would assume at this point is that everything that can be, is FUBAR.
Kevin
I hear you and will do. Oil pressure stayed good during issue, is 60 at start now and 45 warm idle. Freaked me out but strange the noise left as it was loud..
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Re: Bang for Buck 440 Motor Mods Stockish 67
[Re: Mr.Yuck]
#1756937
02/20/15 09:03 PM
02/20/15 09:03 PM
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 11,836
Florida
mopar346
Let me tell ya about fat chicks!
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Let me tell ya about fat chicks!
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 11,836
Florida
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[quoteeasy killer lets fix what you have now 1st.
This is the best advice so far and he is even willing to help you find it. Relax, ya'll probably aint driving it for awhile yet up there anyway.
Careful, your character's showing!
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Re: Bang for Buck 440 Motor Mods Stockish 67
[Re: JohnRR]
#1756938
02/20/15 10:03 PM
02/20/15 10:03 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,310
Prospect, PA
BSB67
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,310
Prospect, PA
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Quote:
you need an adaptor for a holley on a stock intake.....
Not sure I understand why you need an adaptor?
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Re: Bang for Buck 440 Motor Mods Stockish 67
[Re: mopar346]
#1756939
02/20/15 10:37 PM
02/20/15 10:37 PM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,584
MD
p d'ro
OP
pro stock
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OP
pro stock
Joined: Dec 2007
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Quote:
[quoteeasy killer lets fix what you have now 1st.
This is the best advice so far and he is even willing to help you find it. Relax, ya'll probably aint driving it for awhile yet up there anyway.
As soon as we can get some rain to take the salt off of the road. Now ice snow salt yuck. I bet the tires will break loose when ten degrees outside. I have been in my frozen garage doing plugs etc.
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Re: Bang for Buck 440 Motor Mods Stockish 67
[Re: mopar346]
#1756940
02/20/15 11:24 PM
02/20/15 11:24 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
Mr.Yuck
Not enough dumb comments...yet
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Not enough dumb comments...yet
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
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Quote:
[quoteeasy killer lets fix what you have now 1st.
This is the best advice so far and he is even willing to help you find it. Relax, ya'll probably aint driving it for awhile yet up there anyway.
noooo kidding 8* right now and 4-6" of snow heading this way tomorrow. With all the salt they've been laying down Mine won't see the road until late March.
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Re: Bang for Buck 440 Motor Mods Stockish 67
[Re: mopar346]
#1756942
02/21/15 01:42 AM
02/21/15 01:42 AM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,584
MD
p d'ro
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Quote:
I feel ya, it was only mid-50s here today. 
i know. I have a friend who is an old timer and he is inCocoa beach for a few weeks. He was supposed to go to an apparently good swap meet in zephyr hills, wherever that is,and was going to lookout for a cheap manifold. He said it got way too cold and windy. But that wont stop him from working out with the Nationals tomorrow! He has connections..
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Re: Bang for Buck 440 Motor Mods Stockish 67
[Re: BSB67]
#1756943
02/21/15 12:20 PM
02/21/15 12:20 PM
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Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,663
Wichita
GY3
master
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master
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,663
Wichita
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Quote:
Quote:
you need an adaptor for a holley on a stock intake.....
Not sure I understand why you need an adaptor?
On the '67 and '71 intakes I didn't need an adapter.
I did use a 1/2" phenolic spacer. 
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Re: Bang for Buck 440 Motor Mods Stockish 67
[Re: p d'ro]
#1756944
02/21/15 05:15 PM
02/21/15 05:15 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 74,947
U.S.S.A.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 74,947
U.S.S.A.
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Quote:
Ok, I might have a line on a barely used Holley SD dual plane and Holley 650 vac sec. I am hoping that will fit and wont have the same fuel boil issues a Eddy does.. Was also told that 440 source had good heads that look stock when painted turquoise...
NOT GOING TO FIT WITH YOUR STOCK AIR CLEANER PERIOD
CH4B is taller so if you have a problem now forget that .
Performer ... not RPM , or OLD M1
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Re: Bang for Buck 440 Motor Mods Stockish 67
[Re: BSB67]
#1756945
02/21/15 05:18 PM
02/21/15 05:18 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 74,947
U.S.S.A.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 74,947
U.S.S.A.
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Quote:
Quote:
you need an adaptor for a holley on a stock intake.....
Not sure I understand why you need an adaptor?
I meant to say SPACER
Because a Holley has parts hanging below the carb base that will hit the 67-69 intake , this is why Mopar didn't run a single 4bbl holley before 70 , the 70 intake heat riser was lowered and a Holley will fit.
Because he is stuck on stock only certian parts will work.
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Re: Bang for Buck 440 Motor Mods Stockish 67
[Re: GY3]
#1756946
02/21/15 05:20 PM
02/21/15 05:20 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 74,947
U.S.S.A.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 74,947
U.S.S.A.
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
you need an adaptor for a holley on a stock intake.....
Not sure I understand why you need an adaptor?
On the '67 and '71 intakes I didn't need an adapter.
I did use a 1/2" phenolic spacer.
When I said adaptor I meant SPACER
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Re: Bang for Buck 440 Motor Mods Stockish 67
[Re: JohnRR]
#1756947
02/21/15 05:36 PM
02/21/15 05:36 PM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,584
MD
p d'ro
OP
pro stock
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OP
pro stock
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,584
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
you need an adaptor for a holley on a stock intake.....
Not sure I understand why you need an adaptor?
I meant to say SPACER
Because a Holley has parts hanging below the carb base that will hit the 67-69 intake , this is why Mopar didn't run a single 4bbl holley before 70 , the 70 intake heat riser was lowered and a Holley will fit.
Because he is stuck on stock only certian parts will work.
I agree. Ok M1 or Performer. I am not using the heat riser. Was going to try compression test today but twenty degrees and six inches of snow and counting. Not going to Advance auto today.
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Re: Bang for Buck 440 Motor Mods Stockish 67
[Re: JohnRR]
#1756948
02/21/15 09:08 PM
02/21/15 09:08 PM
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,310
Prospect, PA
BSB67
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 4,310
Prospect, PA
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
you need an adaptor for a holley on a stock intake.....
Not sure I understand why you need an adaptor?
I meant to say SPACER
Because a Holley has parts hanging below the carb base that will hit the 67-69 intake , this is why Mopar didn't run a single 4bbl holley before 70 , the 70 intake heat riser was lowered and a Holley will fit.
Because he is stuck on stock only certian parts will work.
Spacer, yes. 
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Re: Bang for Buck 440 Motor Mods Stockish 67
[Re: Mr.Yuck]
#1756950
02/22/15 02:36 PM
02/22/15 02:36 PM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,584
MD
p d'ro
OP
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Quote:
as for fit, you can use a drop base and your stock lid. Paint the base black and roll. I had a CH4B 1/2" spacer and 625 Carter on my GTX w/ Stock assembly...well 2/3rds anyway. I ran a drop base, painted black. I Also ran the same set-up on a 67 Coronet w/ a Holley 750DP and it fit as well.
Ok, I thought the stock one dropped it pretty low. Where can I find one?
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Re: Bang for Buck 440 Motor Mods Stockish 67
[Re: p d'ro]
#1756951
02/22/15 03:32 PM
02/22/15 03:32 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,389
nielsville, minn.
quickd100
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,389
nielsville, minn.
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I dyno'd a 440 I built for a friend many years ago last summer. It was 8.9-1 (at the time of the build we were looking at 89.5 octane fuel), 906 heads with just a cleanup, factory intake, carb, exhaust, and a MP .474 'hemi grind cam'. Motor was supposed to be dyno'd on 91 octane fuel but due to a mixup we used 100+ octane which lowered the numbers a bit. It made 386hp@5300 and 462.9ftlbs@3975rpm. Installing the factory duel snorkel air cleaner assembley DROPPED the hp to 362.9hp and 442.8ftlbs. Just flipping the lid upside down as we all did back in the day brought the hp back up to 380.9hp. If it was mine, (your motor) I'd install a MP.528 mechanical, recurve the distributer, install a Holley street dominator intake, use the Carter 4327, and use a A/F meter to tune the carb, use an open element air cleaner assembley, install a TA 10" convertor, use a 3.55-3.91 gear, a pinion snubber and clamp the front spring segments. It would be hard to wipe the smile off your face the first time you got on the throttle.Dave 
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Re: Bang for Buck 440 Motor Mods Stockish 67
[Re: quickd100]
#1756952
02/22/15 04:46 PM
02/22/15 04:46 PM
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Joined: May 2004
Posts: 3,210
robin hood country
deaks
master
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master
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 3,210
robin hood country
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I had a 67 R/T full weight car with a late 72 engine, factory hi stall converter, felt like 3.23 or 3.55 gears, headers, factory intake, holley 750 V/S It ran 14.3 at 94 mph on slicks and would incinerate the small street tyres from a standstill. My friend bought it from me, then fitted a .509, ported RPM's milled .050, a performer intake and a 2500 stall converter.
He only ran it once best 13.0 at 105 mph. I told him it would be a dog with the .509 and to advance it 4 degrees. I think with more comp, it would have gone low 12's to high 11's. I believe the late 72 engine had the same comp as the 73 which i dont think was even 8.1.
Mick
69 Dart GTS 440 mopar .590 cam, Edelbrock heads, 3200#
best et 6.45, 106.78, 10.14, 132.88 mph, 1.47 60ft
best 60ft 1.36
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Re: Bang for Buck 440 Motor Mods Stockish 67
[Re: quickd100]
#1756953
02/22/15 04:59 PM
02/22/15 04:59 PM
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Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,663
Wichita
GY3
master
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master
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 4,663
Wichita
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Quote:
I dyno'd a 440 I built for a friend many years ago last summer. It was 8.9-1 (at the time of the build we were looking at 89.5 octane fuel), 906 heads with just a cleanup, factory intake, carb, exhaust, and a MP .474 'hemi grind cam'. Motor was supposed to be dyno'd on 91 octane fuel but due to a mixup we used 100+ octane which lowered the numbers a bit. It made [Email]386hp@5300[/Email] and [Email]462.9ftlbs@3975rpm.[/Email] Installing the factory duel snorkel air cleaner assembley DROPPED the hp to 362.9hp and 442.8ftlbs. Just flipping the lid upside down as we all did back in the day brought the hp back up to 380.9hp.
If it was mine, (your motor) I'd install a MP.528 mechanical, recurve the distributer, install a Holley street dominator intake, use the Carter 4327, and use a A/F meter to tune the carb, use an open element air cleaner assembley, install a TA 10" convertor, use a 3.55-3.91 gear, a pinion snubber and clamp the front spring segments. It would be hard to wipe the smile off your face the first time you got on the throttle.Dave
Very good advice!
I had a 71 440 with 452 heads, .528 MP cam, stock intake and headers.
While I didn't dyno, the difference between the dual snorkel and the open element K&N aircleaner (as you pointed out) was startling! I was going for the resto look but decided it was way too restrictive!
So many small things that people overlook or don't do that make a HUGE difference!
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