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Re: Bored with 660hp....
[Re: B3422W5]
#1687881
10/19/14 09:17 PM
10/19/14 09:17 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 10,384
Upstate NY
Bigcube
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 10,384
Upstate NY
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Nope, not at 124 MPH, there is some HP missing. Needs a bigger carb and jetted accordingly. You might be surprised how big of jet I have in an 1150 dominator to give it what it needs. First calculation I assumed the 3220 lbs was race weight. It should dip in the nines if everything is playing nice. Little more weight... Quote:
Your ET / MPH computed from your vehicle weight of 3480 pounds and HP of 660 is 10.14 seconds and MPH of 133.30 MPH.
Give it fuel and air and let it eat.
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Re: Bored with 660hp....
[Re: Dragula]
#1687882
10/19/14 10:46 PM
10/19/14 10:46 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,913
Bend,OR USA
Cab_Burge
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,913
Bend,OR USA
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Quote:
It lays over on the top end after shifting to 3rd, and even sometimes at the top of 2nd....
So at a race weight of 3480lbs, and a best trap speed of 124mph, what do you guys calculate? 660hp seems pretty close to me.
I know last year when it ran 10.84 there was another .10 in it of I sealed the carb to the hood.
I keep wondering about the MSD box though....
You say you almost have the motor out of the car. leak it down and then concentrate on fixing the fuel delivery problems   My 518 C.I. 400 stroker made 727 HP on the dyno the last time I tested it, that motor ran 9.993 at 134.6 MPH at 3450 lbs with me in the car on Oregon 91 octane non ethanol  pump swill through the full exhaust exiting at the rear bumper with the air cleaner on I di have a bunch of fuel delivery gremlins when I built the car, I used a BG 500 fuel filter(10 micron) between the pump and the gas tank   Once I bought and used a LM1 wide ban I was able to idemtify it going lean at the hit of the throttle, it would still run mid tens at 127.= MPH  It ran better when I fixed the fuel system, low tens at 128 + MPH  Fix the obviuos(SP?) first after fixing the fuel delivery I hopped it up by using bigger and better heads, it went faster again 
Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
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Re: Bored with 660hp....
[Re: Bigcube]
#1687883
10/19/14 11:42 PM
10/19/14 11:42 PM
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Joined: May 2004
Posts: 12,493
Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
Dragula
OP
I Live Here
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OP
I Live Here
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 12,493
Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
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Quote:
Nope, not at 124 MPH, there is some HP missing. Needs a bigger carb and jetted accordingly. You might be surprised how big of jet I have in an 1150 dominator to give it what it needs.
First calculation I assumed the 3220 lbs was race weight. It should dip in the nines if everything is playing nice.
Little more weight...
Quote:
Your ET / MPH computed from your vehicle weight of 3480 pounds and HP of 660 is 10.14 seconds and MPH of 133.30 MPH.
Give it fuel and air and let it eat.
Well I know the carb is fine. That is the carb off the Duster and its been in the 9.70's already with a quickest pass of 6.14 in the 1/8th.
I am half tempted to put this engine on a dyno and see WTH is wrong with it. I will check the cam first as I had trouble with #8 intake most of the summer until I replaced the adjuster...Since then it has been good.
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Re: Bored with 660hp....
[Re: Dragula]
#1687885
10/19/14 11:51 PM
10/19/14 11:51 PM
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 730
Central TEXAS!!!!
sr4440
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 730
Central TEXAS!!!!
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This is where a engine dyno is a invaluable tool and I’ll bet I done this a dozen times for customers. If you are taking the engine out, take it, your ignition system, air cleaner and exhaust headers to an engine dyno. In a short period of time they will either have the tune up figured out or tell you the problem is back at the car. I.E fuel delivery, exhaust sytem. Or you could keep changing things until you fine it. Fuel, ignition, voltage, cam etc etc.
Joe
edit: I was typing up my reply before i seen your last post.
Last edited by sr4440; 10/19/14 11:53 PM.
Without Data, you’re just another guy with an opinion.
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Re: Bored with 660hp....
[Re: quickd100]
#1687887
10/20/14 12:05 PM
10/20/14 12:05 PM
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 2,008
Sweet Home Alabama
MRMOPAR622
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 2,008
Sweet Home Alabama
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Before you finish pulling it out find what's called a Tuner and put it on the Chassis dyno and let them get it right for you and if nothing else it will be Tuned right and you can see what you have or don't have.
Last edited by MRMOPAR622; 10/20/14 12:07 PM.
"To Be The Man'You Have Got To Beat The Man"
"T/D and Pro-Bracket Racer"
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Re: Bored with 660hp....
[Re: Dragula]
#1687888
10/20/14 12:12 PM
10/20/14 12:12 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
Mr.Yuck
Not enough dumb comments...yet
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Not enough dumb comments...yet
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
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Quote:
It lays over on the top end after shifting to 3rd, and even sometimes at the top of 2nd....
So at a race weight of 3480lbs, and a best trap speed of 124mph, what do you guys calculate? 660hp seems pretty close to me.
I know last year when it ran 10.84 there was another .10 in it of I sealed the carb to the hood.
I keep wondering about the MSD box though....
that doesn't sound like an egine problem. It should run WAY better that 10.80's... That's a pretty big and expensive mill. What is the fuel system? What/how does it run before it lays down?
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Re: Bored with 660hp....
[Re: Dragula]
#1687891
10/20/14 07:22 PM
10/20/14 07:22 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,591
Canton, Ohio
Sport440
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,591
Canton, Ohio
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Quote:
Quote:
Nope, not at 124 MPH, there is some HP missing. Needs a bigger carb and jetted accordingly. You might be surprised how big of jet I have in an 1150 dominator to give it what it needs.
First calculation I assumed the 3220 lbs was race weight. It should dip in the nines if everything is playing nice.
Little more weight...
Quote:
Your ET / MPH computed from your vehicle weight of 3480 pounds and HP of 660 is 10.14 seconds and MPH of 133.30 MPH.
Give it fuel and air and let it eat.
Well I know the carb is fine. That is the carb off the Duster and its been in the 9.70's already with a quickest pass of 6.14 in the 1/8th.
I am half tempted to put this engine on a dyno and see WTH is wrong with it. I will check the cam first as I had trouble with #8 intake most of the summer until I replaced the adjuster...Since then it has been good.
OK, I don't doubt the carb is fine, but Hows the fuel pressure, what system pump are you using. Even good carbs wont work without fuel.
Laying down in third and sometimes at the top of second is a classic example of a fuel issue. But not always a guarantee. Fuel would be my bet Until I hear of your Fuel set up. 
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Re: Bored with 660hp....
[Re: Tommy D]
#1687892
10/20/14 07:22 PM
10/20/14 07:22 PM
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Joined: May 2004
Posts: 12,493
Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
Dragula
OP
I Live Here
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OP
I Live Here
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 12,493
Taxes & Virus's R-US, NY
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Quote:
Post a picture of your last ET slip from the track. HP is seen as MPH on the ET slip. If you were running 134 at the same ET, it would show you the problem was with getting the car off the line, etc... Just curious if you possibly have an RPM limiter on the car that's engaging at the top end, limiting your RPM. Just a thought. TD
It went 124mph at 10.84...
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Re: Bored with 660hp....
[Re: Dragula]
#1687893
10/20/14 08:41 PM
10/20/14 08:41 PM
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,267
North, Alabama
D-50
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,267
North, Alabama
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Quote:
Quote:
Post a picture of your last ET slip from the track. HP is seen as MPH on the ET slip. If you were running 134 at the same ET, it would show you the problem was with getting the car off the line, etc... Just curious if you possibly have an RPM limiter on the car that's engaging at the top end, limiting your RPM. Just a thought. TD
It went 124mph at 10.84...
The Wallace Racing calculator says 124 mph at 3480 lbs is 531 flywheel horsepower. ET is 540 hp
1.33 60 ft,6.21 at 110.59 in the 1/8, pump gas small block,2950lbs,drag radials,mufflers and driven to track ...
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Re: Bored with 660hp....
[Re: D-50]
#1687894
10/20/14 08:51 PM
10/20/14 08:51 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 3,547
Syracuse,NY
CompWedgeEngines
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 3,547
Syracuse,NY
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It went 124mph at 10.84...
The Wallace Racing calculator says 124 mph at 3480 lbs is 531 flywheel horsepower. ET is 540 hp
Both ET AND MPH are way way down. Just a high side ignition miss wont bring back that much missing ET. ET is all made up in the eigth mile. Who specd the cam, and what are all the numbers on the head CFM, just not the "big" number?
RIP Monte Smith
Your work is a reflection of yourself, autograph it with quality.
WD for Diamond Pistons,Sidewinder cylinder heads, Wiseco, K1 rods and cranks,BAM lifters, Morel lifters, Molnar Technologies, Harland Sharp, Pro Gear, Cometic, King Engine Bearings and many others.
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Re: Bored with 660hp....
[Re: CompWedgeEngines]
#1687895
10/20/14 09:36 PM
10/20/14 09:36 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,591
Canton, Ohio
Sport440
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,591
Canton, Ohio
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Quote:
It went 124mph at 10.84...
The Wallace Racing calculator says 124 mph at 3480 lbs is 531 flywheel horsepower. ET is 540 hp
Both ET AND MPH are way way down. Just a high side ignition miss wont bring back that much missing ET. ET is all made up in the eigth mile. Who specd the cam, and what are all the numbers on the head CFM, just not the "big" number?
I don't understand Why your asking about the cam??
Drag, states that its laying down in third and sometimes in second.
Until That's , straightened out, you can forget about the cam numbers for now. 
EDIT, also I haven't seen a 60 ft. number yet. That would be another good indicator of what may be going on. If its soft too, then yes, something other then fuel delivery will be the problem.
Last edited by Sport440; 10/20/14 09:43 PM.
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Re: Bored with 660hp....
[Re: CompWedgeEngines]
#1687896
10/20/14 09:51 PM
10/20/14 09:51 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 11,810
Portage,michigan
B3422W5
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 11,810
Portage,michigan
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Quote:
It went 124mph at 10.84...
The Wallace Racing calculator says 124 mph at 3480 lbs is 531 flywheel horsepower. ET is 540 hp
Both ET AND MPH are way way down. Just a high side ignition miss wont bring back that much missing ET. ET is all made up in the eigth mile. Who specd the cam, and what are all the numbers on the head CFM, just not the "big" number?
In my case a MSD " high speed miss" in top half of second, and high gear, did knock out a ton of steam. From 10.50's when it would " act up" to. 9.90's when it ran normally.
Ultimately it started doing it every pass, and I finally swapped it out and fixed the problem(6al box).
If the OP is dealing with the same issue, the ET swing would put his car near where it should run.
My issue was extremely similar..... Box is pretty easy to swap to rule out. Especially if it happens to be an older 6al
69 Dart GTS A4 Silver All steel, flat factory hood, 3360race weight
418 BPE factory replacement headed stroker, 565 lift solid cam, footbrake street/strip car
1.41 best 60 foot
6.54 @ 105.20
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Re: Bored with 660hp....
[Re: Sport440]
#1687897
10/20/14 10:39 PM
10/20/14 10:39 PM
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 3,547
Syracuse,NY
CompWedgeEngines
master
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master
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 3,547
Syracuse,NY
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Quote:
Quote:
It went 124mph at 10.84...
The Wallace Racing calculator says 124 mph at 3480 lbs is 531 flywheel horsepower. ET is 540 hp
Both ET AND MPH are way way down. Just a high side ignition miss wont bring back that much missing ET. ET is all made up in the eigth mile. Who specd the cam, and what are all the numbers on the head CFM, just not the "big" number?
I don't understand Why your asking about the cam??
Drag, states that its laying down in third and sometimes in second.
Until That's , straightened out, you can forget about the cam numbers for now.
EDIT, also I haven't seen a 60 ft. number yet. That would be another good indicator of what may be going on. If its soft too, then yes, something other then fuel delivery will be the problem.
How they selected the cam, why they selected THAT cam, and how they mated it with the heads, will provide some more information about the total package.I have seen cams kill combinations. I dont think that is the " only" thing wrong here, but I am curious as to a few things. Ive certainly seen MSDs fail, thats for sure.I normally see them just die, or simply misfire. Not really " lay over" First time for everything, thats for sure.
RIP Monte Smith
Your work is a reflection of yourself, autograph it with quality.
WD for Diamond Pistons,Sidewinder cylinder heads, Wiseco, K1 rods and cranks,BAM lifters, Morel lifters, Molnar Technologies, Harland Sharp, Pro Gear, Cometic, King Engine Bearings and many others.
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Re: Bored with 660hp....
[Re: Mr.Yuck]
#1687900
10/21/14 09:09 AM
10/21/14 09:09 AM
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Time after time year after year we see deals like this--it always comes down to throttle blades 3/4 way open - lash way too tight is a good one ( you see--these modern computer created crap lobes with inverse radius etc have the lowest spot on the cam somewhere other than the back of the base circle--Surprise!! )-7 volts to fuel pump, 7 elbows in fuel system, WRONG converter, etc It is a rare day when it is the cam. Had a 500 inch running 5.50's right off the dyno--three weeks later running 5.90's after the customer replaced a ton of parts he got mad and sold it--one week later in similar car was running 5.50's again--Verdict--lash was too tight--simple as that Check the simple basics--look at the data you have from your timeslips--the answer is there.
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