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To take on more or do as intended? *long* #1679441
09/28/14 07:39 PM
09/28/14 07:39 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
GoodysGotaCuda Offline OP
5.7L Hemi, 6spd
GoodysGotaCuda  Offline OP
5.7L Hemi, 6spd

Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
I've owned my Barracuda for ten years in November and am getting things torn down to work over some problem areas and drop-in [more or less] a new driveline in it. I certainly expected to find some areas that needed attention, the car is a Canadian export and spent a bit of it's life up North.

What I currently have planned:
  • 3gen Hemi swap with T56 trans
  • Treat and replace some sheet metal [floors/patches]
  • Cap frame T's and right rear frame rail
  • Add subframe connectors, fender-to-cowl braces, under radiator support brace, torque boxes.
  • Paint and install a 'Cuda hood I already have [likely farm out the paint/blend work]
  • Rewire the entire car
  • Add vintage air A/C
  • Fill holes/clean up the engine bay, repaint that myself
  • Add some suspension/steering upgrades



Time Frame: Two years. With my current fun money and time availability, I don't think a 2 year time frame will be much trouble to have it go back down the road. Perhaps quite a bit sooner.


--

Proposed:
  • All of the above
  • Build a rotisserie for the car
  • Media blast
  • Replace the passenger door skin, passenger fender, assess other panels post blasting
  • Basic body work/primer - body shop for final block/shoot/clear/buff


I know the car has had 1/4s put onto it, they seem to be pretty reasonable and get the job done. The rotisserie would sure be nice for cleaning up the bottom of the car, undercoat it, etc, etc.

--



The reason for this post is to hear some insight from those that have done both. Dove into a car completely and those that have fixed what was needed and blazed on. I have zero plans to sell this car and my Wife has put the bug in my ear to just go ahead and prep the car for paint while I'm at it and get the car "done".

What I want to avoid is it turning into a 3...5...7 year project after it snowballs!

...however I would like:
A) Some clean metal to work with on my repairs
B) Not waste some effort trying to color match the engine bay or new hood and just do it all.
C) Have a car that I didn't limp along for another few years and know I have to go back to later.



.

How much project?
single choice
Votes accepted starting: 09/28/14 05:38 PM
You must vote before you can view the results of this poll.

1972 Barracuda - 5.7L Hemi, T56 Magnum 6spd - https://www.facebook.com/GoodysGotaHemi
2020 RAM 1500
[img]https://i.imgur.com/v9yezP9.jpg[/img]
Re: To go "all in" on a car resto or do as intended? *long* [Re: GoodysGotaCuda] #1679442
09/28/14 07:40 PM
09/28/14 07:40 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
GoodysGotaCuda Offline OP
5.7L Hemi, 6spd
GoodysGotaCuda  Offline OP
5.7L Hemi, 6spd

Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
The bad:


Driver's floor and a way up on the firewall needs replaced.




Fore of the shackle is a crack in the frame rail, it's quite weak in that area. It appears somewhat might have messed with it before.




T-frames, need capped at a minimum



Passenger floor/firewall






As you can see, I have 99% of the interior out and everything that will unbolt out of the engine bay out. I will also have the rear axle out for addressing that frame rail. The extra effort to pull the glass and take it to get blasted is minimal..plus the addition of building a rotisserie. Which I can DIY.


1972 Barracuda - 5.7L Hemi, T56 Magnum 6spd - https://www.facebook.com/GoodysGotaHemi
2020 RAM 1500
[img]https://i.imgur.com/v9yezP9.jpg[/img]
Re: To go "all in" on a car resto or do as intended? *long* [Re: GoodysGotaCuda] #1679443
09/28/14 07:49 PM
09/28/14 07:49 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 8,660
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Andrewh Offline
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Andrewh  Offline
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I am torn.
I constantly think about starting over, picking up another car and starting from scratch.
it make take 2 to 5 years to finish based on other things needing time or money.
because I hate having to go back and fix something, and there is always some overhead you could have avoided if you just took the time to finish that one thing now.

BUT a couple of things stop me.
1st. I remember when my car was down for more than 2 years.
I couldn't drive it, couldn't afford to finish it, or even get it in driving condition.
I just wanted to get rid of it and buy something that ran.
or worse, just get rid of it.
second.
once it was running and driving, anywhere I went, I was always paranoid about someone killing it. either door dings, or just plain not driving right. many people run stop signs in my neighborhood.
Had one guy just run one and stop in front of me, like it was my fault they had to stop.

The nicer my car was, the harder it was to drive it and park it somewhere.
when it was a beater, it didn't matter that much. (not this car, but old cars I had before).

so while I would like the perfect finished car that I could jump in and drive, I am not sure I "want" it, nor have the patients to wait for it to be done.

not really helping, but I get where you are.

Re: To go "all in" on a car resto or do as intended? *long* [Re: Andrewh] #1679444
09/28/14 07:57 PM
09/28/14 07:57 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
GoodysGotaCuda Offline OP
5.7L Hemi, 6spd
GoodysGotaCuda  Offline OP
5.7L Hemi, 6spd

Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
Quote:


1st. I remember when my car was down for more than 2 years.
I couldn't drive it, couldn't afford to finish it, or even get it in driving condition.
I just wanted to get rid of it and buy something that ran.
or worse, just get rid of it.




Certainly a valid point, I don't foresee me having much of an issue with it not running. I've waited long enough to start the project that I seeing it through is something I've had in the back of my mind for quite a long time. Affording it is another valid point, as for now, I don't foresee any problems with that aspect...but if there is a hiccup, that is going to be the first thing to get the brakes thrown on it. Sooner it gets done, "the better".

Quote:


second.
once it was running and driving, anywhere I went, I was always paranoid about someone killing it. either door dings, or just plain not driving right. many people run stop signs in my neighborhood.
Had one guy just run one and stop in front of me, like it was my fault they had to stop.

The nicer my car was, the harder it was to drive it and park it somewhere.
when it was a beater, it didn't matter that much. (not this car, but old cars I had before).

so while I would like the perfect finished car that I could jump in and drive, I am not sure I "want" it, nor have the patients to wait for it to be done.

not really helping, but I get where you are.




Another valid point, I will add that I plan on driving the wheels off the car. Having a pristine paint job isn't a major priority of mine, the car is "good enough" for now and how I intend on using it....but if I'm going to paint it, I want to ensure nothing is going to pop up later [hence the media blast].

Re: To go "all in" on a car resto or do as intended? *long* [Re: Andrewh] #1679445
09/28/14 08:01 PM
09/28/14 08:01 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,431
SK,Canada
gregsrt Offline
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SK,Canada
I started two cars planning on doing the full boogie. Two years in each time I got tired of the expense and the work. Doing it all yourself is taxing and time consuming. The last car I did what your plan isalmost exactly. Capped the t bar mount, replaced the drivers shacklemount, installe connectors, painted the engine and trunk comptments. I had to paint the doors and fenders also but resisted the urge to completely teardown. Rebuilt front and rear susp, paint and detailed. Installed a 512 stroker and did the trans and diff. Done in 2.5 years....already bored with it.

Why not find a clean Texas car?


An association of men who will not quarrel with one another is a thing which has never yet existed, from the greatest confederacy of nations down to a town meeting or a vestry. Thomas Jefferson
Re: To go "all in" on a car resto or do as intended? *long* [Re: GoodysGotaCuda] #1679446
09/28/14 08:02 PM
09/28/14 08:02 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 8,660
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Andrewh Offline
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well to the first part, I too thought, I could just sit on it.
it didn't "hurt" to have it sit in the garage.
but as the months dragged on, it just bothered me. got into a funk about it, and it just felt like it would sit there forever.

as to the second point.
it hurt when my dd gets door dings. I still park it to protect one side.
my old car, just freaks me out if I see anything on it when I walk up to it.

Re: To go "all in" on a car resto or do as intended? *long* [Re: gregsrt] #1679447
09/28/14 08:05 PM
09/28/14 08:05 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
GoodysGotaCuda Offline OP
5.7L Hemi, 6spd
GoodysGotaCuda  Offline OP
5.7L Hemi, 6spd

Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
Quote:

I started two cars planning on doing the full boogie. Two years in each time I got tired of the expense and the work. Doing it all yourself is taxing and time consuming. The last car I did what your plan isalmost exactly. Capped the t bar mount, replaced the drivers shacklemount, installe connectors, painted the engine and trunk comptments. I had to paint the doors and fenders also but resisted the urge to completely teardown. Rebuilt front and rear susp, paint and detailed. Installed a 512 stroker and did the trans and diff. Done in 2.5 years....already bored with it.

Why not find a clean Texas car?




Thanks for the input, another car isn't in the cards. My Wife is very sentimental with the car, as silly as it is, I will regret it...maybe not today, but eventually I will. The car stays.

Getting bored with it is a possibility. That's why I have another 5.7 block to build for boost.

Re: To go "all in" on a car resto or do as intended? *long* [Re: GoodysGotaCuda] #1679448
09/28/14 09:45 PM
09/28/14 09:45 PM
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,800
South Lyon MI
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sleddinfool Offline
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Goody, do it once you will be happier.. I have had my car torn apart for over two years.. It is getting closer though.. If my lazy azz would get off this computer I could get more done. Trying to do it right.. Athough there will be headaches--such as repop wheel wellt rim not fitting.. I think I am leaving it off LOL.. Kevin

8283976-phone053.jpg (167 downloads)

71 gtx.....
Re: To go "all in" on a car resto or do as intended? *long* [Re: sleddinfool] #1679449
09/28/14 09:49 PM
09/28/14 09:49 PM
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,800
South Lyon MI
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sleddinfool Offline
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Before.. Car was originally curious yellow so its going back..

8283978-004.JPG (206 downloads)

71 gtx.....
Re: To go "all in" on a car resto or do as intended? *long* [Re: GoodysGotaCuda] #1679450
09/28/14 10:37 PM
09/28/14 10:37 PM
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Posts: 2,033
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RTSE4ME Offline
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Option#3
You could do more mods than you have planned for the car before spending money on body and paint. Go all out on the suspension mods or engine. You can always get it painted after your satisfied with the performance.

Re: To go "all in" on a car resto or do as intended? *long* [Re: sleddinfool] #1679451
09/28/14 10:40 PM
09/28/14 10:40 PM
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RSNOMO Offline
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Quote:

If my lazy azz would get off this computer I could get more done. repop wheel wellt rim not fitting.. I think I am leaving it off LOL.. Kevin




C'mon Kev, get 'er done...

(I bet I can guess where the wheel lip moldings are from)...

Re: To go "all in" on a car resto or do as intended? *long* [Re: sleddinfool] #1679452
09/28/14 10:43 PM
09/28/14 10:43 PM
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 959
france
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jose jones Offline
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france
WOW!!!!! what a undertaking! the car should be awesome, BUT... I think you will have a huge chunk of cash in it, I doubt you can build it for under 50K. I am not trying to talk you out of it, Good Luck, It is a big project.

Re: To go "all in" on a car resto or do as intended? *long* [Re: sleddinfool] #1679453
09/28/14 10:53 PM
09/28/14 10:53 PM
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eastern, pa.
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cudabitten Offline
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It sounds like you have already answered your question. It sounds like you both want the car done once and completely. However, it will take you 5 to 7 years to complete this project, just my opinion. I am in my seventh year with my 74 Barracuda. I'm just about finished and it is completely re-done. I also had to fix the rear frame rails, the front driver rail under the brake/battery area, new trunk, drop-offs, 1/4 skins, etc...My vote would be to do the minimal. Its really hard to do that once you start taking things apart though, Good Luck.

Re: To go "all in" on a car resto or do as intended? *long* [Re: jose jones] #1679454
09/28/14 10:55 PM
09/28/14 10:55 PM
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RSNOMO Offline
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Quote:

WOW!!!!! what a undertaking! the car should be awesome, BUT... I think you will have a huge chunk of cash in it, I doubt you can build it for under 50K. I am not trying to talk you out of it, Good Luck, It is a big project.




Capt...

(The last '71 GTX that I heard about getting an OEM 'ground-up' in these parts came in at north of 100k...)

Today, 50k is optimistic...

Re: To go "all in" on a car resto or do as intended? *long* [Re: jose jones] #1679455
09/28/14 10:59 PM
09/28/14 10:59 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
GoodysGotaCuda Offline OP
5.7L Hemi, 6spd
GoodysGotaCuda  Offline OP
5.7L Hemi, 6spd

Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
Quote:

WOW!!!!! what a undertaking! the car should be awesome, BUT... I think you will have a huge chunk of cash in it, I doubt you can build it for under 50K. I am not trying to talk you out of it, Good Luck, It is a big project.




"Restoration" was perhaps the wrong word to put in the title of this thread.

I am at about $16k for the engine/trans, a/c, wiring, chassis stiffening kit, and suspension upgrades on a pretty detailed spreadsheet.

I'm thinking about another $10-12k if I went with what I was describing adding on. Perhaps I oversold my intentions, I am not looking to do a complete restoration where it is all "perfect". Rather where everything is as structurally sound as it should and protected from further corrosion...then painting the car would be more accurate. Whatever that's called.

Re: To go "all in" on a car resto or do as intended? *long* [Re: GoodysGotaCuda] #1679456
09/28/14 11:11 PM
09/28/14 11:11 PM
Joined: Apr 2004
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Houston, Texas
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Slant6pak Offline
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Just my opinion,

You've had the car for 10 years, and you've driven/enjoyed it for at least a good chunk of that time. If you are attached to the car and have good memories with the car... that will go a long way towards beating the "project car depression" that people are always talking about.

Do the metalwork right... no caps. They are a bandaid IMO and not something I would put on a long term investment.


2016 Challenger Scat Pack Shaker smile

1000 ci Brass Era Speedster project
Re: To go "all in" on a car resto or do as intended? *long* [Re: sleddinfool] #1679457
09/28/14 11:14 PM
09/28/14 11:14 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 18,632
jersey shore
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flypaper Offline
I hate Texas
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jersey shore
to do it right on your own takes alot of time.
how long, depends on how much time you put into it
you have a job,life,all eats into the time you can spend on it.
i have years myself invested into 2 cars..

i do question your plans with the body?
you have floor issues and you say you need to cap the
torsion bar x member and install frame connectors.
to me a x member cap and frame connectors together make no sense?
you are beefing up one area and band aiding up another weak area that connects to it?
on top of that it looks like dung when your done.
heres some advice take it or laugh at it.
you want to keep the car,do it once and do it right
halfazz something and you will be living with it for good.
to replace the torsion x member properly you
need to remove the whole floor.
the floor already has damage
instead of band aiding/patching 2 things,
replace both and restore the structural integrity of the area instead of just cover it all over.

Re: To go "all in" on a car resto or do as intended? *long* [Re: GoodysGotaCuda] #1679458
09/28/14 11:17 PM
09/28/14 11:17 PM
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Posts: 11,836
Florida
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mopar346 Offline
Let me tell ya about fat chicks!
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Body shop jail will be the most discouraging part. If you can do the metal work yourself and keep the outer skins in take and in color I say do that and assess were you are and what your next move is, ie get the outside done or proceed with your plan. Advantages to both but I have to agree I hate shiney cars there a pain in the ash!


Careful, your character's showing!
Re: To go "all in" on a car resto or do as intended? *long* [Re: RSNOMO] #1679459
09/28/14 11:21 PM
09/28/14 11:21 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 18,632
jersey shore
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flypaper Offline
I hate Texas
flypaper  Offline
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jersey shore
Quote:

Quote:

WOW!!!!! what a undertaking! the car should be awesome, BUT... I think you will have a huge chunk of cash in it, I doubt you can build it for under 50K. I am not trying to talk you out of it, Good Luck, It is a big project.




Capt...

(The last '71 GTX that I heard about getting an OEM 'ground-up' in these parts came in at north of 100k...)

Today, 50k is optimistic...




no its not..
is this 100k number you speak of
come from a check writer who pays retail for everything?
which is about double or more of the cost to do the work yourself?

Re: To go "all in" on a car resto or do as intended? *long* [Re: GoodysGotaCuda] #1679460
09/28/14 11:24 PM
09/28/14 11:24 PM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 704
USA
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rftroy Offline
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Sorry to put a damper on the conversation, but I would be quite surprised, given the pictures you have posted, if you didn't find substantially more rust issues when you strip the car, remove undercoating, and media blast or dip.

When you have sections completely rusted through, or gone, the problem doesn't end at the edge. The insides of the frame rails have been exposed to the same environment as the parts which are gone, and they are probably very thinned out.

Capping just the area that is gone won't be effective because the rest of the rails will continue to rust until they are gone as well.

Unless you have experience making major rust repair, and frame component replacement, or are willing to spend the money to have it done, selling and buying a rust free car, as suggested, may be a better alternative.
If you wouldn't consider that, I would certainly vote for "all in" because I don't see the other way as a viable option given the level of rust damage.

I had a T/A body that I sold last year for that very reason. There was similar rust in the rails, wheel wells, and firewall.
I knew that with a good jig and lots of time, I could fix it all......but I decided I didn't want to. It would take way too long.
I found a very clean '70 318 S/E Challenger, and I am doing that instead. It won't have the J in the VIN, but there is almost no bodywork and it will be done a lot faster and cheaper.

Though selling this car and buying a clean one is a short term financial negative, it will be less costly in the long run.
My

Robert


AAR 4-speed 3.91, Tor-Red;
70 440 6 pack Roadrunner 4-speed 3.54, Plum Crazy;
68 Formula S conv 383 4-speed 3.23, Electric Blue;
69 Barracuda conv Slant 6 OD4 2.94, 71 B5 Blue;
78 Lil' Red Truck, Red;
70 Challenger S/E. 505 6 pack, Passon 5-speed, 3.55, B7 Blue
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