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Re: 518 transmission question
[Re: dusturbd340W5]
#1675250
09/27/14 01:55 AM
09/27/14 01:55 AM
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,491
Oologah, Oklahoma
Big Squeeze
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,491
Oologah, Oklahoma
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Quote:
It was standard practice to adjust all bands when we serviced a unit but 99% of the time they where never out enough to even show up.
I guess what I am trying to get at is I have adjusted probably 1000 bands on all kinds of different units over 27 years in the business and have rarely found one to be out of adjustment enough to make any difference in the way the unit worked.
If the unit was built correctly and adjusted correctly to begin with and it is functioning as it should I doubt you will see any difference after a band adjustment.
now if the band was never adjusted correctly to begin with when the unit was built or there is another problem than that is a different story. 
FINALLY someone that gets it...I've had the EXACT same experience with band adjustments...Since the pan is off when changing the fluid and filter, just reach up and grab the lever and pull on it...Stevie Wonder will know if it's out of adjustment... 
And Kunkel, the adjustment pin is threaded to make up for differences in band levers, drum diameters and band differences...pretty simple... 
Quote:
We used to buy 2000ish Dodge trucks at the auctions with no second gear. As long as they hadn't driven it so long like that, that 3rd gear was hurt, I would just drop the pan and put the strut plate back in place, adjust the band and go.
I have run into a dozen or so like that over the years. Most had right around 100k.
I've experienced that too and IMHO it's caused by a shift timing problem on stock transmissions (which, obviously, the OP doesn't have)...I've done the same as you and also installed Trango shift kits at the same time and haven't had any comeback...I've even installed slip bands to fix them when they're burnt up...like you said, it only seems to happen on trucks within a year or two window so the factory must have fixed the problem... 
If you can't handle the truth, you're living a lie.......
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Re: 518 transmission question
[Re: Big Squeeze]
#1675251
09/27/14 05:27 PM
09/27/14 05:27 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 25,951
Rio Linda, CA
John_Kunkel
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 25,951
Rio Linda, CA
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Quote:
And Kunkel, the adjustment pin is threaded to make up for differences in band levers, drum diameters and band differences...pretty simple...
Those differences could easily be accommodated with shim washers like the TH400 uses to set the band free play.
Again, too bad you weren't advising Mopar engineers back in the sixties, coulda saved them a heap of money in unneeded adjusting hardware.
The obvious reason they didn't is because the kickdown band is used on EVERY upshift unlike the TH400.
As to anecdotal experiences with band adjustments, review the number of times on these very forums that shift problems are traced to an out-of-adjustment band due by normal wear. I take notice of such things where others might not.
The INTERNET, the MISinformation superhighway
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Re: 518 transmission question
[Re: John_Kunkel]
#1675252
09/27/14 08:32 PM
09/27/14 08:32 PM
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 276
Temecula, Ca.
zzyzxpat
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 276
Temecula, Ca.
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400 uses different size servo pins on the rear band, nothing on the front, all the same, no washers, at least from the factory.
For those that reinstall the front band strut because it fell out, all you are doing is costing the vehicles owner a front drum, when the band and drum go metal to metal, which if it is a 48RE is $$$$. The strut fell out because the band wore the lining out and developed excessive clearance, which is what Mr Kunkel is alluding to I think.
Much of this can be explained by the different band types sometimes. When Chrysler went to the AFM designed band, there is less friction material on the band as it has grooves in it, vs, the BW band which has lining on the entire band.
95% of normal units, the adjustment will never change over the service life, assuming everything else is OK.
HTH, Pat
" The last official act of any goverment, is to loot the treasury" George Washington
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Re: 518 transmission question
[Re: zzyzxpat]
#1675253
09/27/14 11:30 PM
09/27/14 11:30 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,616
Kissimmee Fl.
dusturbd340W5
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,616
Kissimmee Fl.
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Quote:
400 uses different size servo pins on the rear band, nothing on the front, all the same, no washers, at least from the factory.
For those that reinstall the front band strut because it fell out, all you are doing is costing the vehicles owner a front drum, when the band and drum go metal to metal, which if it is a 48RE is $$$$. The strut fell out because the band wore the lining out and developed excessive clearance, which is what Mr Kunkel is alluding to I think.
Much of this can be explained by the different band types sometimes. When Chrysler went to the AFM designed band, there is less friction material on the band as it has grooves in it, vs, the BW band which has lining on the entire band.
95% of normal units, the adjustment will never change over the service life, assuming everything else is OK.
HTH, Pat
Uh not true almost all of the 518's I have had come in with no 2nd the band anchor had broken out the top of the recess and fell into the pad and upon inspection the band looks like brand new with 0 wear.
and I am not talking 1 or 2 I am talking 10-15 a year so many I keep at least 5 of the anchors in stock at all times.
70 duster full chassis super pro 416 CNC Indybrock heads 727 w/brake
best so far 1.212 60 6.219 in 1/8 at 110.88 9.768 at 137.81 1/4
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Re: 518 transmission question
[Re: dusturbd340W5]
#1675254
09/28/14 04:55 PM
09/28/14 04:55 PM
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 276
Temecula, Ca.
zzyzxpat
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 276
Temecula, Ca.
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OK, must be different in Florida. LOL The struts break because of the angle of the strut when the band wears. I assume you are in the business as well, how many do you see come in with the band adjustment 5 or 6 turns out and the strut is still in place? Lining wear...
" The last official act of any goverment, is to loot the treasury" George Washington
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Re: 518 transmission question
[Re: 71yelladustr]
#1675255
09/28/14 06:23 PM
09/28/14 06:23 PM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 8,339
fredericksburg,va
cudaman1969
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 8,339
fredericksburg,va
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Quote:
Seen quite a few also with the band strut popped out. Most of them chip a piece of the cup portion that mates to the adjuster and need replaced. As for the "GM sensor mod", he is talking about replacing the junk factory governor pressure solenoid found in RE type transmissions with a larger less problematic solenoid similar to what is found in GM transmissions.
Thanks for explaining the GM sensor for me,forgot about this post. Now the band, there is only so much travel in the front servo so the higher that lever(5.0)the less travel at the band so there is a small window of clamping force as the band wears, it has more leeway with a 2.9 over the 5.0(go back into an old service manual and see how often one has to adjust a hemi band with a 5.0 lever). If you drive a light vehicle with an egg under the pedal i guess it will last long but heavy truck with heavy load up mountains IT will wear out and need adjustments. Transmission repair is big business for a reason.
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Re: 518 transmission question
[Re: dusturbd340W5]
#1675257
09/28/14 09:53 PM
09/28/14 09:53 PM
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 276
Temecula, Ca.
zzyzxpat
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 276
Temecula, Ca.
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Well then, we are compadres  30 years @ 12-15 units a week, same employer. My question would be, why did you never see this problem with 727s? My answer would be band lining, the band gets loose, the strut cocks and breaks. 12-15 units a week, you are to be commended sir, not easy to do in this ever changing industry. Pat
" The last official act of any goverment, is to loot the treasury" George Washington
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Re: 518 transmission question
[Re: dusturbd340W5]
#1675260
09/29/14 12:21 AM
09/29/14 12:21 AM
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 276
Temecula, Ca.
zzyzxpat
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 276
Temecula, Ca.
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I would agree with a solid band in HP applications.
It is not a matter of thin or thick lining as much as how much lining is actually on the band, refer to my earlier post. Again, just my opinion.
Pat
" The last official act of any goverment, is to loot the treasury" George Washington
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