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Re: CHARLIES OIL PAN
[Re: Al_Alguire]
#1592130
03/13/14 10:04 PM
03/13/14 10:04 PM
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Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 220
Jerry Kathe
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 220
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Quote:
Chris I ran that pan for years and NEVER ha d a leak. Also in reply to the no HP gain with the kickout I will call BS as well. We ran mine on the dyno when I first bought one. We made 23 more HP with the side kickout than we did with the milodon dragster style pan. So my experience is quit e a bit different than posted here. We have since moved on to a different pan builder. But I still feel this is one area many Mopar guys are missing the boat.
Totally agree….gotta call BS myself….23HP switching to a kickout pan on a bb mopar….absolute BS! What else did you change prior to that dyno pull?
Switching from a wet sump to a dry sump only yields 25 – 30 hp on average with virtually any brand. (bigger the arm - bigger the gain)
For those who still have an open mind, consider that a kickout is only a reversion devise that prevents the windage from climbing the right side of the block, making the windage even worse, increasing the froth and overcoming the right bank of piston rings….which could also contribute to detonation, but don’t give a kickout pan all of the credit for preventing that. Some of the other posters’ above have it right in that a properly shaped and located scraper will help a noticeable amount…on virtually any brand of engine.
Using a Chrysler bb with a 4.5 arm, std pin diameter and aluminum rods the reciprocating assembly breaches the pan rail about 3 inches. With that as a fairly extreme example, the crank is only pitching the oil from ~185º through ~215 of crankshaft arc allowing the kickout to trap windage……now compare that to a BB gm, the crankshaft axis and the oil pan rail are in the same plane….using a kickout on that design will provide trapping benefit from ~185º to ~255º in crankshaft arc. The bb gm will only see about 3 – 5 hp……so 23hp on a bb Chrysler? Me thinks someone has been vacationing in Colorado 
....and for those special individuals, dont compare a kickout pan designed for windage reduction to a kickout pan designed for ground clearance 
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Re: CHARLIES OIL PAN
[Re: wideopen231]
#1592132
05/05/14 04:17 AM
05/05/14 04:17 AM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,667
Arizona
Chris'sBarracuda
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,667
Arizona
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UPDATE.. I put the Charlies oil pan in question on my Engine and it helped my oil pressure situation.. Didn't go to zero at the end of the run..  Lowest was 40 psi hot.. after run.. And.. Was 0-20 before with the old pan.. Did it make more power.?? Not sure yet.. Only raced it in really bad air, but it ran better than expected... I'll know more when I get to run in conditions that I have data for.. Anyway, I like the pan and I got it from a member (Doug-- d7cook) here at a really good price.. Chris.. 
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Re: CHARLIES OIL PAN
[Re: Jerry Kathe]
#1592133
05/05/14 11:53 AM
05/05/14 11:53 AM
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Joined: May 2014
Posts: 4
north carolina
wideopen231
member
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member
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 4
north carolina
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Quote:
Quote:
Chris I ran that pan for years and NEVER ha d a leak. Also in reply to the no HP gain with the kickout I will call BS as well. We ran mine on the dyno when I first bought one. We made 23 more HP with the side kickout than we did with the milodon dragster style pan. So my experience is quit e a bit different than posted here. We have since moved on to a different pan builder. But I still feel this is one area many Mopar guys are missing the boat.
Totally agree….gotta call BS myself….23HP switching to a kickout pan on a bb mopar….absolute BS! What else did you change prior to that dyno pull?
Switching from a wet sump to a dry sump only yields 25 – 30 hp on average with virtually any brand. (bigger the arm - bigger the gain)
For those who still have an open mind, consider that a kickout is only a reversion devise that prevents the windage from climbing the right side of the block, making the windage even worse, increasing the froth and overcoming the right bank of piston rings….which could also contribute to detonation, but don’t give a kickout pan all of the credit for preventing that. Some of the other posters’ above have it right in that a properly shaped and located scraper will help a noticeable amount…on virtually any brand of engine.
Using a Chrysler bb with a 4.5 arm, std pin diameter and aluminum rods the reciprocating assembly breaches the pan rail about 3 inches. With that as a fairly extreme example, the crank is only pitching the oil from ~185º through ~215 of crankshaft arc allowing the kickout to trap windage……now compare that to a BB gm, the crankshaft axis and the oil pan rail are in the same plane….using a kickout on that design will provide trapping benefit from ~185º to ~255º in crankshaft arc. The bb gm will only see about 3 – 5 hp……so 23hp on a bb Chrysler? Me thinks someone has been vacationing in Colorado
....and for those special individuals, dont compare a kickout pan designed for windage reduction to a kickout pan designed for ground clearance
Far from expert here. Especailly on BB mopars gains.I do know there are lots of guys who would argue the gains on BBC.Most backed by dyno results.One would be R-M,seems they claim gains of 20 plus hp also.I agree BB mopar with skirted block will probably not gains as much,but I do thing theres gains to be made. After all the debate I plan on soing a oil pan swap on car after I get basic tuneup and cars consistent enough to verify results. Don't be holding breath on them since I'm still building car and have been for way too long.We do except donations at Chris needs to race soon.LOL
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Re: CHARLIES OIL PAN
[Re: LSP]
#1592136
05/07/14 01:03 PM
05/07/14 01:03 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,369
Las Vegas
Al_Alguire
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 19,369
Las Vegas
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Hmmm...One of my skirted blocks..Someone was thinking out of the box developing this set up.  FWIW when we went ot a GOOD pan and picked up power it was in a low deck motor not an RB..
"I am not ashamed to confess I am ignorant of what I do not know."
"It's never wrong to do the right thing"
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Re: CHARLIES OIL PAN
[Re: Al_Alguire]
#1592137
05/07/14 01:59 PM
05/07/14 01:59 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,624
Orange County, Ca.
B1CUDA
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,624
Orange County, Ca.
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Quote:
Hmmm...One of my skirted blocks..Someone was thinking out of the box developing this set up.
FWIW when we went ot a GOOD pan and picked up power it was in a low deck motor not an RB..
I invented new cuss words when I had that motor......
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Re: CHARLIES OIL PAN
[Re: 408strokerdart]
#1592141
05/08/14 10:26 PM
05/08/14 10:26 PM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,314
Charlotte, NC
LSP
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,314
Charlotte, NC
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I sent Charlie a drawing last year for a double kickout wet sump pan, and he nailed it in 3 weeks. Very pleased with the quality, fit, and the accuracy to the drawing. If it was off dimensionally even slightly I was going to have clearance issues with the headers, water drains, starter, etc..
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Re: CHARLIES OIL PAN
[Re: Al_Alguire]
#1592142
06/27/14 09:53 AM
06/27/14 09:53 AM
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Joined: May 2014
Posts: 503
Idaho
1320Dart
mopar
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mopar
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 503
Idaho
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How much "kick out" is recommended? How deep? etc...
Greg ----------------------------------------------------------------- Cost is irrelevant, making memories is far more valuable! 
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Re: CHARLIES OIL PAN
[Re: cudabin]
#1592144
06/28/14 08:08 PM
06/28/14 08:08 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,010
Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...
gregsdart
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,010
Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...
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As far as gains go on a skirted block, the long skirt HOLDS the oil more so than a BBC, I bet. A 426 Hemi was tested way back in the day and could hold 8 quarts wrapped around the crank at 8,000 rpm. That should say something. So I don't buy the argument of less degrees to lose the oil into the side bucket.
8..603 156 mph best, 2905 lbs 549, indy 572-13, alky
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Re: CHARLIES OIL PAN
[Re: 1320Dart]
#1592145
06/28/14 08:14 PM
06/28/14 08:14 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,667
Arizona
Chris'sBarracuda
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 3,667
Arizona
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Quote:
How much "kick out" is recommended? How deep? etc...
I would think any side kickout has to help some..
As i posted earlier, this new Charlie's pan definitely helped my oil pressure loss at the top end..
Went from 0-20 psi to 40 psi steady after shutdown.. I have it on video
for proof to me.. 
BTW.. I had a nice Williams pan before, but it was too deep.. Couldn't use it.
Chris..
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