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Re: Front Spoilers... [Re: BigBlockMopar] #1438670
05/31/13 11:31 AM
05/31/13 11:31 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,394
The Pale Blue Dot
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The Pale Blue Dot
YES!, I remember reading those and lost the links. A lot of good stuff on that site. Thanks for posting that.

Re: Front Spoilers... [Re: BigBlockMopar] #1438671
05/31/13 02:39 PM
05/31/13 02:39 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,969
Chandler, AZ
Duner Offline
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Chandler, AZ
Thanks for posting those links. That's interesting reading for sure.

Has anybody seen anything as far as links or write-ups for spoiling the air at the back of the cab on a pickup truck? I can see that the back window is trying to be sucked backwards out of the truck at speed.

Re: Front Spoilers... [Re: Duner] #1438672
05/31/13 05:25 PM
05/31/13 05:25 PM
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Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
BigBlockMopar Offline OP
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I found this PDF-link to study of "DRAG REDUCTION OF PICKUP TRUCK USING ADD-ON DEVICES"...

http://csus-dspace.calstate.edu/xmlui/bitstream/handle/10211.9/169/combined-finished.pdf?sequence=1


And here's a guy mounting and testing all kinds of spoilers and airdams on his Chevy Truck...
(I dig the MacGyver-factor of his front airdam-solution though.)

Front Airdam from Garden edging.
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/off-topic...-effective.html

Tailgate spoiler
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/off-topic...experiment.html

Cab roof spoiler
http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthread.php/roof-spoiler-pick-up-truck-cab-phase-1-a-19525.html

Re: Front Spoilers... [Re: BigBlockMopar] #1438673
05/31/13 07:07 PM
05/31/13 07:07 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,969
Chandler, AZ
Duner Offline
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Thanks for the links!

On my little beasty - at speed the back lexan window is sucked backwards toward the tailgate. I was thinking of trying to solve that if I could. The front and rear spoilers have really settled the truck handling down at speed, but still unsure whether it's help or hurt the ET and MPH. A block-off plate in the grill helps by about 2 mph and about 1.5 tenths.

I do know that on my tonneau cover - the last bow on the cover will be forced down on every pass over 100 mph or so. I would estimate it takes roughly 25-30 lbs worth of force to do that. Of course the wind has lots of surface area to work at generating that much down force.

Re: Front Spoilers... [Re: Duner] #1438674
05/31/13 10:22 PM
05/31/13 10:22 PM
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Nebraska
72Swinger Offline
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Always wondered what effect these might have...... http://3rdstrikeperformance.com/images/CabFairings.jpg

Last edited by 72Swinger; 05/31/13 10:24 PM.

Mopar to the bone!!!
Re: Front Spoilers... [Re: OzHemi] #1438675
05/31/13 10:35 PM
05/31/13 10:35 PM
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,490
Lethbridge, AB, Canada
dangina Offline
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Quote:

Quote:

Interesting, which is why i went with this - I wanted more function than looks - its a 67 camaro rear spoiler and would have been a perfect fit if it was about 1 1/2" - 2" longer




If you were looking for more width, a '69 Camaro spoiler is wider than a '67/8 one, incase you didn't know..




really? I did not know this - thanks for the info

Re: Front Spoilers... [Re: BigBlockMopar] #1438676
06/01/13 08:49 PM
06/01/13 08:49 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,695
Bitopia
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jcc Offline
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Bitopia
Quote:

I was looking for some windtunnel-testing videoclips of front and rearspoilers and such, when I stumbled on a number of interesting articles on Autospeed.com about spoiler and improving 'under car' airflow;

Part 1
http://www.autospeed.com/cms/A_2455/article.html

Part 2
http://www.autospeed.com/cms/A_2456/article.html


Earlier articles:

http://www.autospeed.com/cms/article.html?&A=109937

And...

Undertrays, Spoilers & Bonnet Vents, Part 1
http://www.autospeed.com/cms/A_2159/article.html

Undertrays, Spoilers & Bonnet Vents, Part 2
http://www.autospeed.com/cms/A_2160/article.html?popularArticle




Those are useful articles, thanks for posting, my biggest takeaway, without any testing, little can be learned, as aero "common sense" is still largely black magic, IMO.


Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
Re: Front Spoilers... [Re: jcc] #1438677
06/01/13 09:33 PM
06/01/13 09:33 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,695
Bitopia
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jcc Offline
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Posts: 22,695
Bitopia
In the 4th link BigBlock posted it refers to a air pressure differential gauge magnehelic, that seems useful for us backyard aero wannabes. They seem readily available and in the under $125 range.

Anybody have any real world experience with these gauges?

Like, wouldn't a -2.5 to +2.5" of water be a better choice?

Is That enough range?
How sensitive are readings to how pressure tube opening is oriented?
Where on a car is the reference pressure obtained? Inside the car would seem rather variable, by speed, windows up or down, defroster on off, etc
Is an analog better then the slightly more costly digital gauge?

This is the page that caught me eye.
http://www.dwyer-inst.com/Product/Pressure/DifferentialPressure/Gages/SeriesDM-1000/Ordering


Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
Re: Front Spoilers... [Re: jcc] #1438678
06/01/13 11:31 PM
06/01/13 11:31 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,394
The Pale Blue Dot
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The gauge measures pressure differential much like a vacuum gauge, much more sensitive than a vacuum gauge though. I plan on doing some testing with my Barracuda- yes I own one of those gauges, my understanding is to have the gauge in the cabin with windows/vents closed to isolate the gauge from turbulence. It wouldn't be difficult to have the reference in the engine compartment and the sense on the hood or in front of the grill, whatever you are looking to measure the difference of. The gauges pop up on E-bay, that's where I got mine. Oh ya, 0->1.0" hope that's enough range for what I want to do. If not I'll sell it and pick up another.

Re: Front Spoilers... [Re: Skeptic] #1438679
06/03/13 06:44 AM
06/03/13 06:44 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
BigBlockMopar Offline OP
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I 'thought' was able to cheaply fab up a front spoiler for my Dart. Just for kicks, but I found I got my butt kicked by 'geometry' here a bit in the progress.

I went to our local HomeDepot and grabbed a nice large cement bucket. These things here are made of very sturdy, but unbreakable plastic. Perfect for possible groundscraping once in a while I thought.

Once in the garage I started cutting the reinforced top edge and 4-5" down off it. Also made pie-cuts in the lip to straighten out the curvature.
But then I hit a geometric snag. Because of the taper of the bucket, the now 'straightened out' strip, was still curved along it's entire length when flattened out... Duh...
Also the curvature was the wrongway around for it to even remotely fit.
So I cut another strip, but this time from the bottom of the bucket and did a mockup on the car. Secured it with the center valance-bolt in the middle and a number of tie-raps towards the edges.
Not happy about how quickly the strip curves upwards behind the valance, I'm now looking for a 'real' spoiler.

Usually, my first attempt at making something from scratch is pretty much shoddy at best, so with that knowledge I always have better hopes for the second attempt...!





Re: Front Spoilers... [Re: BigBlockMopar] #1438680
06/03/13 03:11 PM
06/03/13 03:11 PM
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,490
Lethbridge, AB, Canada
dangina Offline
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Lethbridge, AB, Canada
Quote:

I 'thought' was able to cheaply fab up a front spoiler for my Dart. Just for kicks, but I found I got my butt kicked by 'geometry' here a bit in the progress.

I went to our local HomeDepot and grabbed a nice large cement bucket. These things here are made of very sturdy, but unbreakable plastic. Perfect for possible groundscraping once in a while I thought.

Once in the garage I started cutting the reinforced top edge and 4-5" down off it. Also made pie-cuts in the lip to straighten out the curvature.
But then I hit a geometric snag. Because of the taper of the bucket, the now 'straightened out' strip, was still curved along it's entire length when flattened out... Duh...
Also the curvature was the wrongway around for it to even remotely fit.
So I cut another strip, but this time from the bottom of the bucket and did a mockup on the car. Secured it with the center valance-bolt in the middle and a number of tie-raps towards the edges.
Not happy about how quickly the strip curves upwards behind the valance, I'm now looking for a 'real' spoiler.

Usually, my first attempt at making something from scratch is pretty much shoddy at best, so with that knowledge I always have better hopes for the second attempt...!






I think I'm more blown away at the fact they have a home depot in the netherlands!

Re: Front Spoilers... [Re: dangina] #1438681
06/03/13 06:05 PM
06/03/13 06:05 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
BigBlockMopar Offline OP
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No we don't, that's why I said 'our local' HD.
Had I said 'Gamma' or 'Karwei', as these shops are named here, no-one would have known what I was talking about.

I think I've located a suitable spoiler. Will probably be able to pick it up this saturday.
It's a brand new spoiler, for an '81 Mercedes. My guess is it will be very close in size to the Dart's width.



Re: Front Spoilers... [Re: dangina] #1438682
06/04/13 08:13 PM
06/04/13 08:13 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,862
the frozen wastes...
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the frozen wastes...
Quote:


Interesting, which is why i went with this - I wanted more function than looks - its a 67 camaro rear spoiler and would have been a perfect fit if it was about 1 1/2" - 2" longer





If you want to get tricky and spend a bit more money, why not get two, and fab a longer one from both?

Re: Front Spoilers... [Re: BigBlockMopar] #1438683
06/04/13 09:09 PM
06/04/13 09:09 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,394
The Pale Blue Dot
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Quote:

No we don't, that's why I said 'our local' HD.
Had I said 'Gamma' or 'Karwei', as these shops are named here, no-one would have known what I was talking about.

I think I've located a suitable spoiler. Will probably be able to pick it up this saturday.
It's a brand new spoiler, for an '81 Mercedes. My guess is it will be very close in size to the Dart's width.





What is the model of Benz, or part number?

Re: Front Spoilers... [Re: Skeptic] #1438684
06/05/13 05:10 AM
06/05/13 05:10 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
BigBlockMopar Offline OP
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The numbers listed along with the ad were;

RS 171
Mercedes S CL SS 81

Re: Front Spoilers... [Re: BigBlockMopar] #1438685
06/05/13 09:07 AM
06/05/13 09:07 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
BigBlockMopar Offline OP
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Found a couple of spoiler ads from the same (English) company.

Re: Front Spoilers... [Re: Pale_Roader] #1438686
06/06/13 03:51 PM
06/06/13 03:51 PM
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,490
Lethbridge, AB, Canada
dangina Offline
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Quote:

Quote:


Interesting, which is why i went with this - I wanted more function than looks - its a 67 camaro rear spoiler and would have been a perfect fit if it was about 1 1/2" - 2" longer





If you want to get tricky and spend a bit more money, why not get two, and fab a longer one from both?




just found out from the camaro guys that the 69 is about 1 1/2" longer and same bolt pattern, so I'm gonna pick one up, I'd rather buy something off the shelf than to modify one, that way if something happened to it, I can just buy another one!

Re: Front Spoilers... [Re: BigBlockMopar] #1438687
06/06/13 08:48 PM
06/06/13 08:48 PM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 6,516
Santa Cruz, California
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Lefty Offline
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Santa Cruz, California
That looks promising. Post the width at the widest point on the sides if could please...


Quote:

No we don't, that's why I said 'our local' HD.
Had I said 'Gamma' or 'Karwei', as these shops are named here, no-one would have known what I was talking about.

I think I've located a suitable spoiler. Will probably be able to pick it up this saturday.
It's a brand new spoiler, for an '81 Mercedes. My guess is it will be very close in size to the Dart's width.






Re: Front Spoilers... [Re: Lefty] #1438688
06/09/13 06:23 PM
06/09/13 06:23 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
BigBlockMopar Offline OP
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Picked up the spoiler today and did a quick mockup.

Haven't quite figured out yet what would be the best way to mount it, but the size is very close to the car. Maybe 2-3" too wide at the most outer top edges. But since the material is flexible and can be bend inwards a bit, I don't think this will pose any problems.

Hardest part will probably be how to neatly incorporate the spoiler with the valance and lower fender on the sides.
Perhaps cutting off the upright 'flaps' to the height of the center of the spoiler will give more possibilities.


Here are some pics...











Re: Front Spoilers... [Re: BigBlockMopar] #1438689
06/09/13 09:45 PM
06/09/13 09:45 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,695
Bitopia
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jcc Offline
If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
jcc  Offline
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Posts: 22,695
Bitopia
I like it, nice adaption, would it maybe be easier to modify a cheap run of the mill fiberglass lower valance to fit the plastic spoiler, rather then the other way around, and maybe have a better aero solution as a result?


Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
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