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Re: first 440's [Re: 1_WILD_RT] #1375277 01/25/13 10:30 PM 01/25/13 10:30 PM
Joined: Mar 2007 Posts: 9,336 South-Central (Sebring), FL Commando1 master
Commando1 master Joined: Mar 2007 Posts: 9,336 South-Central (Sebring), FL	Quote: Quote: Any 440. 452 heads. Period. End of story. Move on folks. Nothing more to say here. Other than Wrong! I have no use for 452 heads.... I knew that would be the exact next reply after mine....

Re: first 440's [Re: Commando1] #1375278 01/25/13 10:41 PM 01/25/13 10:41 PM
Joined: Sep 2011 Posts: 2,042 colorado S savoy64 top fuel
savoy64 top fuel S Joined: Sep 2011 Posts: 2,042 colorado	the earlier 440 blocks had higher nickel content and are stronger and more sought after---later smog year motors were cheapened up in the nickel content----there are mopar articles with metalurgic tests done to all the blocks (years) showing the differences in strength----you would be hard pressed to show the diffence in performance in a 600 hp motor in any of the blocks---bob

Re: first 440's [Re: 340mouse] #1375279 01/25/13 10:43 PM 01/25/13 10:43 PM
Joined: Oct 2007 Posts: 736 New York R/T1968R/T super stock
R/T1968R/T super stock Joined: Oct 2007 Posts: 736 New York	I would think the 1978 motorhome block would be best. Has the later cooling passages, less core shift than early blocks and a thick main web. .520 vs .375 Last edited by R/T1968R/T; 01/25/13 10:45 PM.

Re: first 440's [Re: DaytonaTurbo] #1375280 01/26/13 01:23 AM 01/26/13 01:23 AM
Joined: Jan 2004 Posts: 27,347 Today? Who Knows? 1_WILD_RT Management Trainee
1_WILD_RT Management Trainee Joined: Jan 2004 Posts: 27,347 Today? Who Knows?	Quote: Some guys do run the steel shim gaskets with the aluminum heads. Also IIRC cometic makes a very thin composite gasket as well. Yes guys have run the shim gasket on Aluminum heads, & the heads show brindling damage when they are removed... And on the Cometics between the cost & the fact many people have had fluid leaks I don't see them as a good option for a regularly driven street vehicle... "The Armies of our ancestors were lucky, in that they were not trailed by a second army of pencil pushers."

Re: first 440's [Re: 1_WILD_RT] #1375281 01/26/13 01:37 AM 01/26/13 01:37 AM
Joined: Nov 2003 Posts: 36,041 Lincoln Nebraska R RapidRobert Circle Track
RapidRobert Circle Track R Joined: Nov 2003 Posts: 36,041 Lincoln Nebraska	Quote: And on the Cometics between the cost & the fact many people have had fluid leaks I don't see them as a good option for a regularly driven street vehicle... What would be a good gasket for that app (iron block/alum head), street driven live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth

Re: first 440's [Re: RapidRobert] #1375282 01/26/13 01:50 AM 01/26/13 01:50 AM
Joined: Jan 2004 Posts: 27,347 Today? Who Knows? 1_WILD_RT Management Trainee
1_WILD_RT Management Trainee Joined: Jan 2004 Posts: 27,347 Today? Who Knows?	Fel-pro & Victor Reinz both have good gaskets for the application but they are to thick if the piston is in the hole... If you build at zero deck it's not an issue but so many pistons wind up .018-.024 in the hole & you add that to the head gasket dimension & quench is out the window... "The Armies of our ancestors were lucky, in that they were not trailed by a second army of pencil pushers."

Re: first 440's [Re: 1_WILD_RT] #1375283 01/26/13 11:52 AM 01/26/13 11:52 AM
Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 275 Oakwood Ont Canada 340mouse OP enthusiast
340mouse OP enthusiast Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 275 Oakwood Ont Canada	Wow!! Guys I did'nt expect this much. Just wanted a good 440 for a duster project, driver not racer, but wanted the 440 mystic or wow factor, likely just need a stock 440 from a c body with a good cam or maybe a later motorhome 440 with a good cam. Thanks all.

Re: first 440's [Re: 340mouse] #1375284 01/26/13 11:58 AM 01/26/13 11:58 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,941 Holly/MI D Dean_Kuzluzski master
Dean_Kuzluzski master D Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 8,941 Holly/MI	The reason you've heard of 440's overheating is due to the "vertical tube" style radiators that were factory on all of those old Mopars. They tend to clog over time (ALL tubes progrssively), then the motor runs hot, cracks a head, motor gets blamed by the uninformed. Horizontal tube style radiators fixed that. In this case you only lose the bottom tubes on up and it's a longer progression. R.I.P.- Gary "Coop" Davis 02/09/68-05/13/04

Re: first 440's [Re: 62maxwgn] #1375285 01/26/13 12:37 PM 01/26/13 12:37 PM
Joined: Aug 2007 Posts: 1,271 Vista, California 6 67Satty pro stock
67Satty pro stock 6 Joined: Aug 2007 Posts: 1,271 Vista, California	Quote: Quote: I guess the ultimate 440 with stock parts would be to use the thickest wall stock bore block you could find (any year), big valve 915 heads, non HP rods, any year forged crank, 70-71 HP pistons, 69 six pack intake with a set of six pack carbs that didn't have sticking problems, oh and a 73 electronic distributor as well as a 3 bolt drive Six Pack spec camshaft with matching double roller, windage tray and 70-71 HP oil pan. Sheldon Just about right !! Except I would use the the pistons from a 6 Pack motor to get the pistons closer to zero deck.

Re: first 440's [Re: 67Satty] #1375286 01/26/13 01:07 PM 01/26/13 01:07 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 9,436 Blair County,PA 62maxwgn master
62maxwgn master Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 9,436 Blair County,PA	Quote: Quote: Quote: I guess the ultimate 440 with stock parts would be to use the thickest wall stock bore block you could find (any year), big valve 915 heads, non HP rods, any year forged crank, 70-71 HP pistons, 69 six pack intake with a set of six pack carbs that didn't have sticking problems, oh and a 73 electronic distributor as well as a 3 bolt drive Six Pack spec camshaft with matching double roller, windage tray and 70-71 HP oil pan. Sheldon Just about right !! Except I would use the the pistons from a 6 Pack motor to get the pistons closer to zero deck. The original 6pk piston's (1970) were 864 grams,first thing I would do is pitch them.The TRW replacements are probably about the same,my Ross's are zero deck and weigh somewhere around 550 if my memory is correct.

Re: first 440's [Re: 62maxwgn] #1375287 01/26/13 01:26 PM 01/26/13 01:26 PM
Joined: Aug 2007 Posts: 1,271 Vista, California 6 67Satty pro stock
67Satty pro stock 6 Joined: Aug 2007 Posts: 1,271 Vista, California	The idea we were kicking around (after going off on the typical Moparts tangent from the OP's question) was how could you make the best 440 motor out of all stock parts, right?

Re: first 440's [Re: 62maxwgn] #1375288 01/26/13 01:27 PM 01/26/13 01:27 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 15,976 Chilliwack B.C. Canada R RUNCHARGER I Live Here
RUNCHARGER I Live Here R Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 15,976 Chilliwack B.C. Canada	Right on: I used to buy the forged Six Pack pistons and have 200 grams milled out of them, no need for that these days. To the OP, these engines are old now and most you will find have been messed with. Try to find one that is unbored, uncracked and with a forged crank if possible. Sheldon

Re: first 440's [Re: savoy64] #1375289 01/26/13 01:27 PM 01/26/13 01:27 PM
Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 14,889 up yours Supercuda About to go away
Supercuda About to go away Joined: Sep 2007 Posts: 14,889 up yours	Quote: the earlier 440 blocks had higher nickel content and are stronger and more sought after---later smog year motors were cheapened up in the nickel content----there are mopar articles with metalurgic tests done to all the blocks (years) showing the differences in strength----you would be hard pressed to show the diffence in performance in a 600 hp motor in any of the blocks---bob Got a link? cause I don't recall that being true of Mopars, Chevy yes. They say there are no such thing as a stupid question. They say there is always the exception that proves the rule. Don't be the exception.

Re: first 440's [Re: Supercuda] #1375290 01/26/13 03:00 PM 01/26/13 03:00 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 9,436 Blair County,PA 62maxwgn master
62maxwgn master Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 9,436 Blair County,PA	Most of the high nickel blocks were the AAQA early Max wedge blocks.

Re: first 440's [Re: savoy64] #1375291 01/26/13 03:03 PM 01/26/13 03:03 PM
Joined: Mar 2007 Posts: 9,336 South-Central (Sebring), FL Commando1 master
Commando1 master Joined: Mar 2007 Posts: 9,336 South-Central (Sebring), FL	Quote: the earlier 440 blocks had higher nickel content and are stronger and more sought after---later smog year motors were cheapened up in the nickel content----there are mopar articles with metalurgic tests done to all the blocks (years) showing the differences in strength----you would be hard pressed to show the diffence in performance in a 600 hp motor in any of the blocks---bob Yah. I would like yo see links to those articles also because you have it backwards.

Re: first 440's [Re: Supercuda] #1375292 01/26/13 03:22 PM 01/26/13 03:22 PM
Joined: Apr 2005 Posts: 15,134 Kelowna, B.C. Canada D DPelletier I Live Here
DPelletier I Live Here D Joined: Apr 2005 Posts: 15,134 Kelowna, B.C. Canada	Quote: Quote: the earlier 440 blocks had higher nickel content and are stronger and more sought after---later smog year motors were cheapened up in the nickel content----there are mopar articles with metalurgic tests done to all the blocks (years) showing the differences in strength----you would be hard pressed to show the diffence in performance in a 600 hp motor in any of the blocks---bob Got a link? cause I don't recall that being true of Mopars, Chevy yes. I don't have a link, but I do remember the article. Problem is that the castings were improved as the nickle content dropped a bit making it a wash. Any differences are overstated IMO; any year 440 is just as good as any other; try to find a good one with as close to standard bore as you can get with little to no core shift and no cracks and you're good to go. IMO people overthink the 440 block issue. Dave 1970 Super Bee 440 Six Pack 1974 'Cuda 2008 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Ram 3500 Diesel 2004.5 Ram 2500 Diesel 2003 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Durango Limited [url] http://1970superbee.piczo.com [/url]

Re: first 440's [Re: DPelletier] #1375293 01/26/13 04:17 PM 01/26/13 04:17 PM
Joined: Mar 2007 Posts: 9,336 South-Central (Sebring), FL Commando1 master
Commando1 master Joined: Mar 2007 Posts: 9,336 South-Central (Sebring), FL	Quote: ...any year 440 is just as good as any other; try to find a good one with as close to standard bore as you can get with little to no core shift and no cracks and you're good to go. IMO people overthink the 440 block issue. You nailed it and here's your backup that will end this myth once and for all: http://moparforums.com/forums/f62/440-3-engine-4973/

Re: first 440's [Re: flypaper] #1375294 01/26/13 05:05 PM 01/26/13 05:05 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 14,471 renton, Washington ph23vo I Live Here
ph23vo I Live Here Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 14,471 renton, Washington	Quote: Quote: I hope this seems relevant to the question and isn't hijacking the thread. I have been wanting to ask this; I remember hearing some 440's were prone to overheating. Was this a particular production year and what was the cause. Thanks! its more like bb cars that had 22' radiator openings were more prone to overheating. just take the shroud off and you would start to have problems.. what if your big block [440-6] has a 22" rad and NEVER HAD A SHROUD AVAIL?....obviously they would not sell a package that would overheat regularly... so it can't be this..

Re: first 440's [Re: ph23vo] #1375295 01/26/13 05:16 PM 01/26/13 05:16 PM
Joined: Jan 2004 Posts: 27,347 Today? Who Knows? 1_WILD_RT Management Trainee
1_WILD_RT Management Trainee Joined: Jan 2004 Posts: 27,347 Today? Who Knows?	Quote: what if your big block [440-6] has a 22" rad and NEVER HAD A SHROUD AVAIL?....obviously they would not sell a package that would overheat regularly... so it can't be this.. What 440-6 equipped vehicle that came with a 22" radiator didn't come with a shroud? I've owned 960 with a shroud... I know there was a shroud on my buddies 71 vintage 938 so whats that leave? "The Armies of our ancestors were lucky, in that they were not trailed by a second army of pencil pushers."

Re: first 440's [Re: Commando1] #1375296 01/26/13 05:57 PM 01/26/13 05:57 PM
Joined: Apr 2005 Posts: 15,134 Kelowna, B.C. Canada D DPelletier I Live Here
DPelletier I Live Here D Joined: Apr 2005 Posts: 15,134 Kelowna, B.C. Canada	Quote: Quote: ...any year 440 is just as good as any other; try to find a good one with as close to standard bore as you can get with little to no core shift and no cracks and you're good to go. IMO people overthink the 440 block issue. You nailed it and here's your backup that will end this myth once and for all: http://moparforums.com/forums/f62/440-3-engine-4973/ Thanks, they debunked a couple of pervasive myths in that thread. ...but I'm too cynical to believe that these urban myths will ever really go away! Ever heard these ones? - HP2 = 6 pack - All 6 pack cars got torque boxes - All 6 pack cars came with 26" rads - All 6 pack/Hemi cars came with Dana rears - All V code cars came with N96 - All '69.5 lift off cars had A12 on the FT. ...etc. etc. etc. Dave 1970 Super Bee 440 Six Pack 1974 'Cuda 2008 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Ram 3500 Diesel 2004.5 Ram 2500 Diesel 2003 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Durango Limited [url] http://1970superbee.piczo.com [/url]

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