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Re: TAKING IT TO THE "NEW" NEXT LEVEL!! [Re: ECS] #137182
10/17/08 07:52 PM
10/17/08 07:52 PM
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 466
U.S.A.
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Captain Flapjack Offline
mopar
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mopar
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Posts: 466
U.S.A.
Quote:








wow! wow!
that is beautiful!!!

its so nice it doesnt look real

you have turned back the clock 30+ years

that picture blows my mind, i cant stop looking at it

if any car was ever too nice to drive, its yours

thats a view and picture that im sure has + will make an impression on many of us

thanks for sharing it

way to go!!

Re: TAKING IT TO THE "NEW" NEXT LEVEL!! [Re: I go fast] #137183
10/17/08 08:40 PM
10/17/08 08:40 PM
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,711
USA
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ECS Offline OP
David Walden
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David Walden
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USA
Quote:

my head is still not to big for my hat to fit.




Do they even make a hat designed to fit a pin?

Re: TAKING IT TO THE "NEW" NEXT LEVEL!! [Re: I go fast] #137184
10/17/08 09:24 PM
10/17/08 09:24 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 6,299
colorado
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a12superbee Offline
master
a12superbee  Offline
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Posts: 6,299
colorado
Quote:

Do we have to go through all your greatness again?




Go find another parade to rain on, the rest of us are enjoying ourselves and aren't threatened by the fact dave's cars are nicer than ours.


I can't afford this. mark
Re: TAKING IT TO THE "NEW" NEXT LEVEL!! [Re: a12superbee] #137185
10/17/08 10:01 PM
10/17/08 10:01 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 190
Wilmington,NC
I
I go fast Offline
member
I go fast  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 190
Wilmington,NC
Quote:

Quote:

Do we have to go through all your greatness again?




Go find another parade to rain on, the rest of us are enjoying ourselves and aren't threatened by the fact dave's cars are nicer than ours.




Na,can't do that,love you guys too much!

Re: TAKING IT TO THE "NEW" NEXT LEVEL!! [Re: a12superbee] #137186
10/17/08 10:18 PM
10/17/08 10:18 PM
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,711
USA
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ECS Offline OP
David Walden
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David Walden
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Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,711
USA
Quote:

the rest of us are enjoying ourselves and aren't threatened by the fact dave's cars are nicer than ours.




While that is a very kind compliment, it is definitely not true. There are MANY cars that are “nicer” or just as nice as what we have done. I would even venture to say that every car that is refurbished or restored has attributes that make it unique or just as “nice” to its owner. I have seen custom vehicles that convey craftsmanship unequaled to any thing we have ever done. What we do is better described as “different”. Every vehicle plays a significant role in the Car World that we all enjoy.

PS....I hope that the "well wishers" (or sometimes called nay sayers) continue to stick around. All joking aside, sometimes they really DO make comments that prompt constructive input or ideas!

Re: TAKING IT TO THE "NEW" NEXT LEVEL!! [Re: ECS] #137187
10/17/08 10:22 PM
10/17/08 10:22 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 5,048
Atlanta Indiana
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Dave Watt Offline
master
Dave Watt  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 5,048
Atlanta Indiana
The Challenger is incredible and I appreciate the fact you are willing to share the detailed photos and information with us.

Re: TAKING IT TO THE "NEW" NEXT LEVEL!! [Re: Captain Flapjack] #137188
10/18/08 07:40 AM
10/18/08 07:40 AM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,909
Medina, Ohio
HEMICUDA Offline
top fuel
HEMICUDA  Offline
top fuel

Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,909
Medina, Ohio
Oh just great Dave, now I guess you won't be selling the 1:12 scale model of the Challenger sitting on your desk that the underside picture is of right? And the fact that you photo shopped in the ultra rare blue left handed lick knob into the photo that you couldn't find for the real car is a dead giveaway the photo is a fake.

Just kidding Mustafa. Having the opportunity to personally stand under that car I can tell you the photo doesn't give the car justice. Without seeing it for yourself, in person, you can't appreciate what it really is.

Don't get all jammed up about any of the negative comments being made about your Challenger. On second thought, maybe you should let it jack you up so the hobby can witness an even more over the top restoration.

BTW Dave, I have an original assembly line blue left handed lick knob that I might be willing to trade you for the rare 70' 440 HEMI abody your doing next.

Last edited by HEMICUDA; 10/18/08 07:41 AM.
Re: TAKING IT TO THE "NEW" NEXT LEVEL!! [Re: HEMICUDA] #137189
10/18/08 09:58 AM
10/18/08 09:58 AM

A
Anonymous
Unregistered
Anonymous
Unregistered
A



WOW !!! Excellent Dave.One question,it appears the six way seat floor braces are painted black.Not questioning it,just want to make sure I'm seeing it correctly so I can paint mine.Thanks!!

Re: TAKING IT TO THE "NEW" NEXT LEVEL!! #137190
10/18/08 12:54 PM
10/18/08 12:54 PM
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,711
USA
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ECS Offline OP
David Walden
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David Walden
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Posts: 1,711
USA
Hello Jim,
You are correct, they are painted black. I have seen variations of gloss between different original samples. We ended up doing these in a semi-gloss (a tad more towards a glossy look) finish. If you have access to any original cars try and check out how they are painted. Thanks!

Re: TAKING IT TO THE "NEW" NEXT LEVEL!! [Re: HEMICUDA] #137191
10/18/08 01:07 PM
10/18/08 01:07 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 6,556
KY
65pacecar Offline
master
65pacecar  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 6,556
KY
Quote:


Having the opportunity to personally stand under that car I can tell you the photo doesn't give the car justice. Without seeing it for yourself, in person, you can't appreciate what it really is.






That is the truth, photos cannot capture the incredible detail and craftmanship of the Challenger. I literally spent a couple of hours on and off during the day around this car Saturday at the Nats, taking a ton of pictures and everytime you look at it you find new details and items that you missed the first 10 times.

Re: TAKING IT TO THE "NEW" NEXT LEVEL!! [Re: ECS] #137192
10/18/08 01:30 PM
10/18/08 01:30 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 6,556
KY
65pacecar Offline
master
65pacecar  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 6,556
KY
Quote:

Shannon....what can I say to such a statement?!? You have been one of the better surprises (and friends) that resulted from this years Nationals. It would be my pleasure to help with your project (as well as ANYONE else following this thread) regarding documentation or the procedures that we discover. I am an advocate of sharing all the data that might be used to help the efforts of others. This thread started out a little rocky but I sincerely hope that down deep, some of the skeptics will realize that our focus is on the progression of the hobby and its participants! This will be a long (hopefully fun) journey and if one other person can benefit from the work involved, I will consider the outcome a successful one. I do promise that the car will be better than the Challenger in all areas. Each project is a learning experience. You take the aspects previously discovered in the last restoration, bring them to the next project and improve from there!




Dave, it was great to meet you and strike up a friendship at the Nats this year and I look forward to seeing this A-Body complete. The Promise that it will be better than the Challenger is a strong promise to keep, but I am sure that you and your team will accomplish it. The information that you acquire and share will certainly help my project and others, I am happy to see someone taking a similar track to what I have been planning with my car. I struggled back and forth for years on the decision to either restore my car or let it remain a survivor and live with the few items that need attention and the accumulated dust and dirt. Like I said, about a year ago, while finishing the Road Runner and restoring the Black car I had made the decision to clean up what is necessary on my Plymouth and leave my car as original and as close to Survivor status as possible. In the long run, it will be more time consuming and tedious, but it will be worth it since this car has been with me since I was 16 and it's the only car in the fleet that I will not sale unless I am in dire straights and absolutely have to. While it is "only a C-Body" (as some would say), it is still a pretty unique car. Similar to your car, I have the original tires that probably still have the original air in them since the owner put a set of Keystones on it almost immediately and put the tires, hubcaps and fender skirts in dry storage and they will probably stay there after I complete the car. It looks better with the Keystones on it, so if I display the car I will have the original tires and hubcaps on display next to it while running the current set-up. This car is still driven limited miles every year and will probably be driven after I am done with it, still on a limited basis.

Anyway enough about that, good luck on your A-Body and enjoy the process. Every restoration offers a unique opportunity to learn, document, teach and display how the cars were built and the subtle differences between each car, even if they were built back to back on the line.

Re: TAKING IT TO THE "NEW" NEXT LEVEL!! [Re: 65pacecar] #137193
10/18/08 05:34 PM
10/18/08 05:34 PM
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,711
USA
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ECS Offline OP
David Walden
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David Walden
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USA
Quote:

Similar to your car, I have the original tires that probably still have the original air in them since the owner put a set of Keystones on it almost immediately and put the tires, hubcaps and fender skirts in dry storage and they will probably stay there after I complete the car.




It appears both of us will need to use the same "carbon dating" kit in order to prove the validity of our statements. Steven Juliano spent the weekend visiting with me a couple of weeks ago and he ALSO spoke of a couple of his cars that tires have never been tweaked or inflated in over 20 years.
So the question is Shannon, who is going to purchase the carbon dating equipment? Do you want me to get the test unit and ship it to you after I have completed testing or should I wait for you to get it and then rent it from you at a later date?
Why do these things always have to get so complicated?

Thanks again!

Re: TAKING IT TO THE "NEW" NEXT LEVEL!! [Re: ECS] #137194
10/18/08 05:53 PM
10/18/08 05:53 PM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 174
Upstate NY
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Big_John Offline
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Upstate NY
Would using an air compressor with the same build date as the car give you the correct air?




Sorry... just could not resist...

Re: TAKING IT TO THE "NEW" NEXT LEVEL!! [Re: ECS] #137195
10/18/08 06:33 PM
10/18/08 06:33 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 6,556
KY
65pacecar Offline
master
65pacecar  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 6,556
KY
Quote:

Quote:

Similar to your car, I have the original tires that probably still have the original air in them since the owner put a set of Keystones on it almost immediately and put the tires, hubcaps and fender skirts in dry storage and they will probably stay there after I complete the car.




It appears both of us will need to use the same "carbon dating" kit in order to prove the validity of our statements. Steven Juliano spent the weekend visiting with me a couple of weeks ago and he ALSO spoke of a couple of his cars that tires have never been tweaked or inflated in over 20 years.
So the question is Shannon, who is going to purchase the carbon dating equipment? Do you want me to get the test unit and ship it to you after I have completed testing or should I wait for you to get it and then rent it from you at a later date?
Why do these things always have to get so complicated?

Thanks again!


We have a full lab at work, but no carbon dating equipment.....Yet! Maybe I can shove it in on a CA sometime and justify it as Engineering Cost. I like the guys idea above too, date coded air compressor may save us all some time, I assume my tires may need to be topped off a little anyway.

Re: TAKING IT TO THE "NEW" NEXT LEVEL!! [Re: 65pacecar] #137196
10/18/08 11:03 PM
10/18/08 11:03 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,044
At a gas station near you
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badblack68 Offline
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At a gas station near you
How will you keep the original factory installed fluids (oil, gear lube, etc.?) in useable condition?

Re: TAKING IT TO THE "NEW" NEXT LEVEL!! [Re: badblack68] #137197
10/19/08 12:35 AM
10/19/08 12:35 AM
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,711
USA
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ECS Offline OP
David Walden
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David Walden
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USA
Quote:

How will you keep the original factory installed fluids (oil, gear lube, etc.?) in useable condition?





In the Biblical sense (Matt 9:17) you should not put old wine into new wine skins.
Come to think of it, the oil of today was still processed thousands of years ago. (Wouldn't that make all oils NOS?) Who knows....the batch of fluids we end up using might have even come from the same site/batch used to lube these cars 40 years ago.

All kidding aside, new lubricants will be used of course.

Should we mix a small sample of the original oil, with the new oil for nostalgia’s sake?

Re: TAKING IT TO THE "NEW" NEXT LEVEL!! [Re: 65pacecar] #137198
10/19/08 07:56 AM
10/19/08 07:56 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,304
Northern Indiana
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mr_belvedere Offline
super gas
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Northern Indiana
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Similar to your car, I have the original tires that probably still have the original air in them since the owner put a set of Keystones on it almost immediately and put the tires, hubcaps and fender skirts in dry storage and they will probably stay there after I complete the car.




It appears both of us will need to use the same "carbon dating" kit in order to prove the validity of our statements. Steven Juliano spent the weekend visiting with me a couple of weeks ago and he ALSO spoke of a couple of his cars that tires have never been tweaked or inflated in over 20 years.
So the question is Shannon, who is going to purchase the carbon dating equipment? Do you want me to get the test unit and ship it to you after I have completed testing or should I wait for you to get it and then rent it from you at a later date?
Why do these things always have to get so complicated?

Thanks again!


We have a full lab at work, but no carbon dating equipment.....Yet! Maybe I can shove it in on a CA sometime and justify it as Engineering Cost. I like the guys idea above too, date coded air compressor may save us all some time, I assume my tires may need to be topped off a little anyway.



Along with using a date coded air compressor, may I suggest using this air compressor only in the general vicinity of where your assembly plant is/was. The compressor will also need to have the air in it pumped out leaving only a vacuum, we don't need contaminated air.

Re: TAKING IT TO THE "NEW" NEXT LEVEL!! [Re: mr_belvedere] #137199
10/19/08 09:00 AM
10/19/08 09:00 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 190
Wilmington,NC
I
I go fast Offline
member
I go fast  Offline
member
I

Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 190
Wilmington,NC
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Similar to your car, I have the original tires that probably still have the original air in them since the owner put a set of Keystones on it almost immediately and put the tires, hubcaps and fender skirts in dry storage and they will probably stay there after I complete the car.




It appears both of us will need to use the same "carbon dating" kit in order to prove the validity of our statements. Steven Juliano spent the weekend visiting with me a couple of weeks ago and he ALSO spoke of a couple of his cars that tires have never been tweaked or inflated in over 20 years.
So the question is Shannon, who is going to purchase the carbon dating equipment? Do you want me to get the test unit and ship it to you after I have completed testing or should I wait for you to get it and then rent it from you at a later date?
Why do these things always have to get so complicated?

Thanks again!


We have a full lab at work, but no carbon dating equipment.....Yet! Maybe I can shove it in on a CA sometime and justify it as Engineering Cost. I like the guys idea above too, date coded air compressor may save us all some time, I assume my tires may need to be topped off a little anyway.



Along with using a date coded air compressor, may I suggest using this air compressor only in the general vicinity of where your assembly plant is/was. The compressor will also need to have the air in it pumped out leaving only a vacuum, we don't need contaminated air.




The air is already contaminated,I'm back!

Re: TAKING IT TO THE "NEW" NEXT LEVEL!! [Re: ECS] #137200
10/19/08 10:42 AM
10/19/08 10:42 AM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,567
None
71rm23 Offline
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Posts: 2,567
None
Quote:

It has been about eight weeks since the Nationals and the completion of the Challenger project. Things went well overall but a reoccurring question kept finding its way back to me as a nagging thought. Could we have provided a better representation of a Factory Correct Vehicle? After about four weeks of thinking it over I have to say YES, we could have. With that in mind I asked myself what would constitute a “better” restoration than the one we had just completed? The only thing I could think of was to locate an absolutely pristine Survivor that still had EVERY single original part, hose, gasket, weather strip, etc…. that it did when it left the assembly line. Not only would this car have to posses those qualities but the components had to be in a condition not far off from the way they would have appeared when the car was new. In essence the selection of the car had to fit the category which meant that the “selection” of vehicle was not really much of a choice at all. A survivor in that particular condition isn't so easily found. Needless to say a vehicle was discovered that is almost as new looking (in some aspects) as the Challenger that we had brought to the Nationals. It even has the original air in all 5 tires. No joke! In 2010 (the good Lord willing) we will be bringing a BRAND SPANKING NEW 1970 BLACK A BODY PLYMOUTH to be entered in the OE competition. Not a single reproduction part, not even (hopefully) an NOS part. A car that is new with ALL the original components that it was born and manufactured with. It will be completely disassembled and touched up (where needed) in order to look like new. The party is about to start all over again. This one will definitely be fun!




Here's my question, Dave: Are you going to put the restoration process on this thread or have a separate one for it? My two I think it would be nice to have it on a different thread 'cause there's already two pages on this one or some other way?. But do as you wish, I'll probably still read them
Rod

Re: TAKING IT TO THE "NEW" NEXT LEVEL!! [Re: I go fast] #137201
10/19/08 01:58 PM
10/19/08 01:58 PM
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 146
California
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Plymouth273 Offline
member
Plymouth273  Offline
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 146
California
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Similar to your car, I have the original tires that probably still have the original air in them since the owner put a set of Keystones on it almost immediately and put the tires, hubcaps and fender skirts in dry storage and they will probably stay there after I complete the car.




It appears both of us will need to use the same "carbon dating" kit in order to prove the validity of our statements. Steven Juliano spent the weekend visiting with me a couple of weeks ago and he ALSO spoke of a couple of his cars that tires have never been tweaked or inflated in over 20 years.
So the question is Shannon, who is going to purchase the carbon dating equipment? Do you want me to get the test unit and ship it to you after I have completed testing or should I wait for you to get it and then rent it from you at a later date?
Why do these things always have to get so complicated?

Thanks again!


We have a full lab at work, but no carbon dating equipment.....Yet! Maybe I can shove it in on a CA sometime and justify it as Engineering Cost. I like the guys idea above too, date coded air compressor may save us all some time, I assume my tires may need to be topped off a little anyway.



Along with using a date coded air compressor, may I suggest using this air compressor only in the general vicinity of where your assembly plant is/was. The compressor will also need to have the air in it pumped out leaving only a vacuum, we don't need contaminated air.




The air is already contaminated,I'm back!




So, does that mean your a complete jerk to everyone you know, or just the people you are jealous of? There are too many jealous petty people in this world that criticize others to mask their own lack of ability. Enjoy being making an A$$ of yourself, it does serve to amuse the rest of us.

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