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Downshift kickdown 727. #1366270 01/08/13 11:19 AM 01/08/13 11:19 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 338 Montreal Quebec STROKIE OP enthusiast
STROKIE OP enthusiast Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 338 Montreal Quebec	I would like to know if it's possible to raised the kickdown downshift speed... Actually my 3 to 2 downshift occur at 65mph after this speed I don't have no more kickdown. Will be fun to have higher speed kd Thanks

Re: Downshift kickdown 727. [Re: STROKIE] #1366271 01/08/13 11:30 AM 01/08/13 11:30 AM
Joined: Jul 2008 Posts: 30,424 Florida STAYcation dOc ! The village idiot's idiot
dOc ! The village idiot's idiot Joined: Jul 2008 Posts: 30,424 Florida STAYcation	So ... you want a KD at what speed?

Re: Downshift kickdown 727. [Re: STROKIE] #1366272 01/08/13 11:33 AM 01/08/13 11:33 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 5,443 Indiana Y YO7_A66 master
YO7_A66 master Y Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 5,443 Indiana	I asked this question a couple of years ago and the general response at that time was no. The auto 3-2 downshift occurs depending on what parts you have in the tranny, plus rear gear and tire diameter. Mine does not auto downshift any higher than about 60-62mph, currently. I would like to raise mine too if possible, maybe 70-75mph or so and without changing the current WOT shift points. BUMP! 1970 YO7 A66 [Canadian Export] F8 Challenger 340 (Currently in shop for stroker assy.)

Re: Downshift kickdown 727. [Re: YO7_A66] #1366273 01/08/13 11:42 AM 01/08/13 11:42 AM
Joined: Jul 2008 Posts: 30,424 Florida STAYcation dOc ! The village idiot's idiot
dOc ! The village idiot's idiot Joined: Jul 2008 Posts: 30,424 Florida STAYcation	DO YOU have more "travel" in the linkage ? ... adjust it out more. OR .... buy a lite-weight govenor-package.

Re: Downshift kickdown 727. [Re: YO7_A66] #1366274 01/08/13 11:45 AM 01/08/13 11:45 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 338 Montreal Quebec STROKIE OP enthusiast
STROKIE OP enthusiast Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 338 Montreal Quebec	Mine does not auto downshift any higher than about 60-62mph, currently. I would like to raise mine too if possible, maybe 70-75mph or so and without changing the current WOT shift points. BUMP! Will be nice to 70-75mph or so and without changing the current WOT shift points. Actually my rear end is 3.23 with 26 inches tires...

Re: Downshift kickdown 727. [Re: dOc !] #1366275 01/08/13 11:52 AM 01/08/13 11:52 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 5,443 Indiana Y YO7_A66 master
YO7_A66 master Y Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 5,443 Indiana	In my case, I have my linkage maxed out to give me the WOT shift points that I want. I have tested with different 1-2 and 2-3 shift springs and line pressures to give me a 5700rpm shift at both the 1-2 and the 2-3 at WOT. This is by using a 5600rpm governor kit and a TF-2 kit. If I put in my 5800rpm governor kit, my shift points go up to 5900/6000rpms which is too high for my setup. So I am right where I want to be for the shift point setup and I want my cake too. If I could find an easy way to raise the 60-62mph auto 3-2 downshift without messing up the above, that would be great. But I don't know enough about it, so I gave up until I read this thread. Thanks Doc BUMP 1970 YO7 A66 [Canadian Export] F8 Challenger 340 (Currently in shop for stroker assy.)

Re: Downshift kickdown 727. [Re: STROKIE] #1366276 01/08/13 11:56 AM 01/08/13 11:56 AM
Joined: Jul 2008 Posts: 30,424 Florida STAYcation dOc ! The village idiot's idiot
dOc ! The village idiot's idiot Joined: Jul 2008 Posts: 30,424 Florida STAYcation	W/O changing regular/WOT shift points ? ...uNpossible !

Re: Downshift kickdown 727. [Re: dOc !] #1366277 01/08/13 12:18 PM 01/08/13 12:18 PM
Joined: May 2003 Posts: 15,487 Florida S scratchnfotraction I Live Here
scratchnfotraction I Live Here S Joined: May 2003 Posts: 15,487 Florida	it could have the PTK limeting valve to keep it from down shifting above a set rpm/speed.IIRC

Re: Downshift kickdown 727. [Re: dOc !] #1366278 01/08/13 01:08 PM 01/08/13 01:08 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 338 Montreal Quebec STROKIE OP enthusiast
STROKIE OP enthusiast Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 338 Montreal Quebec	I found this chart and I try to understand why the 3-2 Kickdown Limit is so different... TRANSMISSION � 15 SHIFT PATTERN SUMMARY CHART PSI & 3 PC3 Ram C300 Condition PS1&3 PCI PC2 PC3 PY1 Man RamMan Closed Throttle 1-2 Upshift 8-13 8-15 8-15 9-15 9-16 10-15 11-15 Closed Throttle 2-3 Upshift 10-16 12-18 12-19 12-19 13-20 14-19 13-20 W/Open Throttle 1-2 Upshift 29-41 31-46 31-47 32-48 33-49 37-42 38-44 W/Open Throttle 2-3 Upshift 61-74 67-83 68-84 69-86 72-90 60-74 61-75 3-2 Kickdown L i m i t 58-71 63-80 64-82 66-83 69-87 57-65 58-67 3-1 Kickdown L i m i t 28-39 30-43 31-44 32-45 33-47 36-42 37-43 Closed Throttle Downshift 6-11 6-13 6-13 6-13 7-14 8-12 8-13

Re: Downshift kickdown 727. [Re: STROKIE] #1366279 01/08/13 02:57 PM 01/08/13 02:57 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,747 Rio Linda, CA John_Kunkel Too Many Posts
John_Kunkel Too Many Posts Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,747 Rio Linda, CA	The only way to raise the forced kickdown road speed is to install a high-speed governor or change to a lower numeric axle ratio. The INTERNET, the MISinformation superhighway

Re: Downshift kickdown 727. [Re: YO7_A66] #1366280 01/08/13 05:01 PM 01/08/13 05:01 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 338 Montreal Quebec STROKIE OP enthusiast
STROKIE OP enthusiast Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 338 Montreal Quebec	Quote: In my case, I have my linkage maxed out to give me the WOT shift points that I want. I have tested with different 1-2 and 2-3 shift springs and line pressures to give me a 5700rpm shift at both the 1-2 and the 2-3 at WOT. This is by using a 5600rpm governor kit and a TF-2 kit. If I put in my 5800rpm governor kit, my shift points go up to 5900/6000rpms which is too high for my setup. So I am right where I want to be for the shift point setup and I want my cake too. If I could find an easy way to raise the 60-62mph auto 3-2 downshift without messing up the above, that would be great. But I don't know enough about it, so I gave up until I read this thread. Thanks Doc BUMP As per John Kunkel you need to raise the governor rpm... You already have a high speed governor, 5700rpm and this give give you only 60-62mph 3-2 downshift not very high... I don't know the stock governor rpm but 3-2 downshift must be lower Not very exciting.

Re: Downshift kickdown 727. [Re: STROKIE] #1366281 01/08/13 08:08 PM 01/08/13 08:08 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,747 Rio Linda, CA John_Kunkel Too Many Posts
John_Kunkel Too Many Posts Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,747 Rio Linda, CA	The transmission has no idea what the road speed is, it only knows output shaft speed. So the forced downshift lockout road speed will vary greatly with the axle ratio. The chart below shows the relationship of axle ratio and governors....note the difference in 3-2 forced downshift speed with the same gears but different governors. 7538810-Shiftspeeds.jpg (167 downloads)

Re: Downshift kickdown 727. [Re: John_Kunkel] #1366282 01/08/13 08:16 PM 01/08/13 08:16 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,200 Upper Midwest M MoparforLife Too Many Posts
MoparforLife Too Many Posts M Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,200 Upper Midwest	Quote: The transmission has no idea what the road speed is, it only knows output shaft speed. So the forced downshift lockout road speed will vary greatly with the axle ratio. The chart below shows the relationship of axle ratio and governors....note the difference in 3-2 forced downshift speed with the same gears but different governors. As will different gearing change shift points using the same governor.

Re: Downshift kickdown 727. [Re: John_Kunkel] #1366283 01/08/13 08:28 PM 01/08/13 08:28 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 338 Montreal Quebec STROKIE OP enthusiast
STROKIE OP enthusiast Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 338 Montreal Quebec	Quote: The transmission has no idea what the road speed is, it only knows output shaft speed. So the forced downshift lockout road speed will vary greatly with the axle ratio. The chart below shows the relationship of axle ratio and governors....note the difference in 3-2 forced downshift speed with the same gears but different governors. I wish to have the 3-2 kickdown limit set up of the high performance 426 3.23:1 in my Dodge Charger 67 (70-84) will be better than my 65mph downshift... May be the 426 have different rear end ratio

Re: Downshift kickdown 727. [Re: STROKIE] #1366284 01/08/13 09:19 PM 01/08/13 09:19 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 338 Montreal Quebec STROKIE OP enthusiast
STROKIE OP enthusiast Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 338 Montreal Quebec	Quote: Quote: The transmission has no idea what the road speed is, it only knows output shaft speed. So the forced downshift lockout road speed will vary greatly with the axle ratio. The chart below shows the relationship of axle ratio and governors....note the difference in 3-2 forced downshift speed with the same gears but different governors. I wish to have the 3-2 kickdown limit set up of the high performance 426 3.23:1 in my Dodge Charger 67 (70-84) will be better than my 65mph downshift... John Kunkel may you can help us to know the way to have the 3-2 kickdown limit set up of the high performance 426 3.23:1 in my Dodge Charger 67 to (70-84mph).

Re: Downshift kickdown 727. [Re: John_Kunkel] #1366285 01/08/13 10:05 PM 01/08/13 10:05 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 5,443 Indiana Y YO7_A66 master
YO7_A66 master Y Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 5,443 Indiana	If I test both of my 5600 and 5800 governors and set the pressure to achieve the same 5700rpm WOT setting, would the auto kickdown speed remain the same or would the rpm go up? Or, would I need to go up from a 5600 to a 6000 governor and reset my line pressure for a 5700rpm WOT shifts to see enough difference on my auto kickdown speed? If I could keep my current WOT shift speeds at 5700/5800rpms and then raise the auto kickdown speed from 62 to maybe 70, then I would be happy with that. If doing this requires changing to the higher rpm governor, then I would try that. thanks

Re: Downshift kickdown 727. [Re: YO7_A66] #1366286 01/09/13 03:01 PM 01/09/13 03:01 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,747 Rio Linda, CA John_Kunkel Too Many Posts
John_Kunkel Too Many Posts Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 25,747 Rio Linda, CA	Here's a revolutionary idea...grab the shifter and pull it into 2 instead of depending on the kickdown. The INTERNET, the MISinformation superhighway

Re: Downshift kickdown 727. [Re: John_Kunkel] #1366287 01/09/13 05:00 PM 01/09/13 05:00 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 338 Montreal Quebec STROKIE OP enthusiast
STROKIE OP enthusiast Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 338 Montreal Quebec	Quote: Here's a revolutionary idea...grab the shifter and pull it into 2 instead of depending on the kickdown. How come I never tried that before I didn't know I can pull the shifter into 2 at 70 mph. Thanks John, simple thing in live are often the best...

Re: Downshift kickdown 727. [Re: STROKIE] #1366288 01/09/13 05:15 PM 01/09/13 05:15 PM
Joined: Sep 2006 Posts: 3,009 Sac, CA M mopowers master
mopowers master M Joined: Sep 2006 Posts: 3,009 Sac, CA	Quote: Quote: Here's a revolutionary idea...grab the shifter and pull it into 2 instead of depending on the kickdown. How come I never tried that before I didn't know I can pull the shifter into 2 at 70 mph. Thanks John, simple thing in live are often the best... Just don't grab 1st. LOL

Re: Downshift kickdown 727. [Re: mopowers] #1366289 01/09/13 05:25 PM 01/09/13 05:25 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 27,421 Balt. Md 3 383man Too Many Posts
383man Too Many Posts 3 Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 27,421 Balt. Md	John might know what trannys have a "limit valve". I know some do but I cant remember if all or only some do. Its a valve that once it gets so much gov pressure it will move and keep the tranny from down shifting above a certain road speed controlled by output shaft speed of course. Heck it may only be in FWD trannys as at the moment I cant remember I just remember it is some Mopar trannys and it will move to block off throttle pressure to the throttle pressure side of the 2-3 shift valve. But I agree to just pull the shifter down to second when you want to downshift. I have too do it that way with my manual shift valve body. But over 55 mph I dont need to downshift with the torque of my 493. Ron Last edited by 383man; 01/09/13 05:26 PM.

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