Re: Green Bearings
[Re: Fury Fan]
#134462
10/17/08 01:07 PM
10/17/08 01:07 PM
|
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,568 Omaha, Nebraska
Scott Carl
OP
pro stock
|
OP
pro stock
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,568
Omaha, Nebraska
|
Quote:
This topic is a good example of one of my favorite phrases: 'Just because someone knows how to work on things doesn't mean they know how things work.' There are good points (and bad points) brought up by both sides here.
About a year ago I found a copy of this article, today I was able to find it on the web. I encourage everyone with an interest in this topic to read this article and learn a little about bearings. It clearly explains the advantage the tapered bearing has over a roller bearing in a wheel bearing application.
The factory application/designs have a Factor Of Safety associated with them, and it's evidently high enough that a lower-capacity roller bearing can be installed in its place without a tremendous amount of failures.
The roller bearing is clearly inferior to the tapered roller from a load-bearing perspective, however there are other factors in a rear axle application that are the reason this topic brings passionate feelings from both sides. We should focus on simple things like engine oil or filters instead.
As for me, I'll stick with my Timken rollers, clean/re-grease them periodically, and worry about my other worries instead...
http://www.schaeffler.com/remotemedien/m...here_roller.pdf
Awesome article! Very informative. Thanks, FF Scott
|
|
|
Re: Green Bearings
[Re: Scott Carl]
#134463
10/17/08 09:13 PM
10/17/08 09:13 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,355 Omaha Ne
TJP
I Live Here
|
I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,355
Omaha Ne
|
Timkens here, roller bearings are for roller skates, chevy's and Ford's. My Tim
|
|
|
Re: Green Bearings
[Re: TJP]
#134464
10/18/08 07:48 AM
10/18/08 07:48 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 25,200 Upper Midwest
MoparforLife
Too Many Posts
|
Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 25,200
Upper Midwest
|
Quote:
Timkens here, roller bearings are for roller skates, chevy's and Ford's.
My
Tim
Roller skates I have seen have ball bearings. Skateboards too. The OEM 8 3/4 bearing is a tapered roller. Just because it say Timkin doesn't make it a tapered roller. They make all kinds of bearings. And not only Timkin makes bearings for this application that fit and work.
|
|
|
Re: Green Bearings
[Re: I go fast]
#134466
10/18/08 09:39 AM
10/18/08 09:39 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 25,200 Upper Midwest
MoparforLife
Too Many Posts
|
Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 25,200
Upper Midwest
|
Quote:
But,Timkin introduced the tapered roller,others copied!
In 1898 they were patented by Timkin. My point above is that the posted info is incorrect. The 8 1/4 rear uses a caged non-tapered roller bearing with the axle itself as the inner race. A lot of the time if a bearing goes south it takes the axle with it
|
|
|
Re: Green Bearings
[Re: fbernard]
#134467
10/18/08 11:33 AM
10/18/08 11:33 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 693 Coronado, CA
go-fish
mopar
|
mopar
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 693
Coronado, CA
|
Quote:
Quote:
Fabien,
I'm guessing your friend has the Wilwood kit with parking brake shoes in the rotor hat.
Yep, that's the one. Wilwood kit 140-7144 .
Quote:
Did you install the snap ring directly against the housing end? Unfortunately, Wilwood's instructions don't mention you must use the 5 hole retainer that comes with the bearings as a shim to properly space the axles away from the differential internals. Otherwise, constant preloading will destroy the wheel bearings.
Ooops! you're right, we never used this retainer (thanks Wilwood). We'll try and see what happens.
Thanks Cass!
Edit : when we installed the kit, the axles did not touch each other. Where would the preloading come from? is the housing not deep enough for the bearing?
Looks like I have some work to do. I have the same Wilwood kit and never driven it. I have just rolled it from spot to spot. I noticed recently a screeching noise. I bet it is already screwed up because I didn't use this 5 hole spacer.
Dr. Diff, how much are your Green Bearings and do they come with the 5 hole spacer? Can I just buy the 5 hole spacer if the bearings aren't torn up? I have just pushed it to and fro a total of 100 yards in the past year.
70 'cuda: ProCharged 408, Tremec 5 speed, S60,triangulated 4 link, Hydroboost and Wilwoods
|
|
|
Re: Green Bearings
[Re: DoctorDiff]
#134469
10/18/08 12:11 PM
10/18/08 12:11 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 693 Coronado, CA
go-fish
mopar
|
mopar
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 693
Coronado, CA
|
I'm going to go out now and pull the brakes and take a look. It was a year ago but I went straight off Wilwoods instructions so if it didn't say to do it I didn't do it.
70 'cuda: ProCharged 408, Tremec 5 speed, S60,triangulated 4 link, Hydroboost and Wilwoods
|
|
|
Re: Green Bearings
[Re: go-fish]
#134470
10/18/08 04:32 PM
10/18/08 04:32 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 693 Coronado, CA
go-fish
mopar
|
mopar
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 693
Coronado, CA
|
Doctor Diff,
Alright, I disassembled the brakes and I did not use the five hole 1/8" plate. I did some digging and luckily found them.
So what you are saying is I need to install those against the axle flange and then re-assemble the Wilwood kit as it was?
This is not my photo but the five hole plate with the flat top is what I've got, just to make sure. I found the Wilwood instructions and it does not mention using this.
Thank God I have not driven with it like this. And thak you Dr. Diff. Wilwood dropped the ball on this.
BTW, this is on an S-60. I didn't find out about Dr. Diff until after I purchased the rear. If only I would have known I would have saved money and headaches I would have given my buisness to Dr. Diff.
I told Strange I was going to use the kit. They sell Baer or something and they told me they didn't recommend Wilwood. I asked them why and they could not tell me so I assumed it was because they were trying to sell me another companies brakes and wuldn't make any money there. I already have the Wilwood fronts that came with my Alter-k-tion. I am not satisfied with thier customer service.
Also, when I pulled the axle a ton of fluid came out like it was over filled. I am thinking now that thier diff girdle housing oil level plug is located a little high. What is the fluid capacity of a Dana.
It says alot about a guy that helps out when you didn't even give him buisness. Thanks again Doctor.
70 'cuda: ProCharged 408, Tremec 5 speed, S60,triangulated 4 link, Hydroboost and Wilwoods
|
|
|
Re: Green Bearings
[Re: go-fish]
#134471
10/18/08 06:12 PM
10/18/08 06:12 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,759 So Cal
HealthServices
Why would you even post that?
|
Why would you even post that?
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,759
So Cal
|
I just installed a set from Doctordiff today here is a picture of the order I put them on the axle. The plate first, the gasket can be added later to prevent ripping, then the bearing, collar, and the seal goes in the housing. If you are working with a jack on the ground, jack the side you are working on a little higher than the other side and do one side at a time. The oil will stay in the rear end that way.
Allen
Here's a novel idea, let's not throw a bunch of parts at the car hoping it will fix the problem and instead spend a little time diagnosing it first.
Life was a little easier when I was just a wrench.
|
|
|
Re: Green Bearings
[Re: go-fish]
#134474
10/19/08 12:59 AM
10/19/08 12:59 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 693 Coronado, CA
go-fish
mopar
|
mopar
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 693
Coronado, CA
|
I think this is a better scan. Please show where exactly the 5 hole flange that comes with the bearings goes.
70 'cuda: ProCharged 408, Tremec 5 speed, S60,triangulated 4 link, Hydroboost and Wilwoods
|
|
|
Re: Green Bearings
[Re: go-fish]
#134475
10/19/08 03:56 AM
10/19/08 03:56 AM
|
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,759 So Cal
HealthServices
Why would you even post that?
|
Why would you even post that?
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 7,759
So Cal
|
Ok, Sorry I’m thinking of getting the same brake setup as you so I want to understand the setup too, better for me to learn now. Please confirm if you have the 140-7144 brake setup, because here are the instructions in PDF form. https://www.jegs.com/InstallationInstructions/900/950/950-140-7144-D.pdfAccording to the instructions it states you need to remove the stock floating retainer and install the one that comes in the kit. According to the figure 7 both the backing plate and the bearing retainer is used to retain the bearing. This is stated in the paragraph to the left of figure 7. Right? Sorry to the OP this is way OT now. Should of started a new topic. Anyone for pancakes?
|
|
|
Re: Green Bearings
[Re: quick77rt ]
#134479
10/19/08 12:08 PM
10/19/08 12:08 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 693 Coronado, CA
go-fish
mopar
|
mopar
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 693
Coronado, CA
|
And this thread will still be going!
70 'cuda: ProCharged 408, Tremec 5 speed, S60,triangulated 4 link, Hydroboost and Wilwoods
|
|
|
Re: Green Bearings
[Re: go-fish]
#134481
10/19/08 02:08 PM
10/19/08 02:08 PM
|
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,568 Omaha, Nebraska
Scott Carl
OP
pro stock
|
OP
pro stock
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,568
Omaha, Nebraska
|
Quote:
And this thread will still be going!
I got my questions answered, so carry on I'm still readin' anyway
|
|
|
|
|