Re: small block indy head or 3g Hemi
[Re: MattW]
#1206648
03/30/12 08:27 PM
03/30/12 08:27 PM
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i know the 6.1 head can reach the 400 cfm range on a stock valve.
the apache ca hit the 430-440 range also. more than enough i think for that power level.
steve
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Re: small block indy head or 3g Hemi
[Re: tubtar]
#1206650
03/30/12 09:15 PM
03/30/12 09:15 PM
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The 392 production motor is already around 500 hp. What would be so hard to make a 426 or 440 stroker make 700 hp? The Apache heads flow great out of the box. Cubes, compression, cam...stir it up, add some race fuel.
[image][/image]
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Re: small block indy head or 3g Hemi
[Re: sgcuda]
#1206655
03/30/12 11:28 PM
03/30/12 11:28 PM
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tubtar
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Quote:
The 392 production motor is already around 500 hp. What would be so hard to make a 426 or 440 stroker make 700 hp? The Apache heads flow great out of the box. Cubes, compression, cam...stir it up, add some race fuel.
The only potential obstacle to reaching 700 h.p. in either case would be the hydraulic cam.......I am assuming we are talking N/A. Probably easier with the Hemi I think , so if you can cash out of the parts you already have , it makes sense.
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Re: small block indy head or 3g Hemi
[Re: Brian Hafliger]
#1206659
03/31/12 02:06 AM
03/31/12 02:06 AM
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remember that 340 rick just made 580 at the wheel on his ride. thats a 426 car with a hydraulic cam. add in a 18 percent dt loss and thats right around 680 crank hp...on pump gas
steve
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Re: small block indy head or 3g Hemi
[Re: gremlinsteve]
#1206660
03/31/12 02:07 AM
03/31/12 02:07 AM
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i cammed shafi keislers car. it made in the range of about 575 at the wheel. with not a whole lotta cam
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Re: small block indy head or 3g Hemi
[Re: MattW]
#1206661
03/31/12 08:17 AM
03/31/12 08:17 AM
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A 440 ci 11.5 comp R3-LA with your 230 Indy's will more than likely come very very close with the right camshaft. At those cubes a hydraulic roller will not give up ANYTHING to a solid roller (due to the rpm range) . Why don't we just call Johnson/Hylift and order up some of their way cool short travel drop in hydro-rollers and think long and hard about the valve events. Your intake will need attention. I recall your previous 416 made well over 600hp (at a similar comp ratio) with those heads so it stands to reason that with more cubes that 700 hp is more than possible. I say build since you have a lot of the components already--and sell it if you still want to explore the 3g Hemi. J.Rob
2009 PHR\EMC Competitor 2010 PHR\EMC Competitor 2011 PHR\EMC Competitor 2012 PHR\EMC Competitor 2013 PHR\EMC Competitor 2014 HotRod/EMC Competitor 2015 HotRod/EMC NoShow 2016 HotRod/EMC 3rd place SPEC Bigblock 2018 HotRod/EMC 7th place G3
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Re: small block indy head or 3g Hemi
[Re: tubtar]
#1206663
03/31/12 02:21 PM
03/31/12 02:21 PM
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MattW
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Quote:
Just sayin...
http://www.popularhotrodding.com/tech/1103phr_bes_417ci_gen_iii_hemi/index.html
A couple cubic dollars in that one , but she is a serious torque manufacturing machine. My gut feeling is that is you are contemplating selling one package to buy the other , this build might be out of reach unless you are both patient and frugal.
Leon441 posted this awhille back.
The BES engine masters engine had some tricks but, obviously nothing that could not be bought. Tony offered that engine with fuel injection for $10,000. How can you complain about a price like that.
Leon
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Re: small block indy head or 3g Hemi
[Re: MattW]
#1206664
03/31/12 02:37 PM
03/31/12 02:37 PM
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I would try and go the route of the new hemi, they just seem to be awesome motors...Nothing wrong with LA's, but it seems like the Hemi's have the head foundation (and blocks too) to make gobs of power for alot less work and money than any LA would take. I think the toughest thing would be having to sell the LA stuff you have and make up enough money to fund the Hemi. I say go for it though! I'd like to do one myself someday as you already know Good luck man! And if you start a build on one, keep us posted how it goes!
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Re: small block indy head or 3g Hemi
[Re: mshred]
#1206665
03/31/12 03:18 PM
03/31/12 03:18 PM
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Matt you've been all about the Gen 3 hemi for long enough to where I can't imagine you doing anything anything else.
If all the LA stuff was up for sale reasonable enough, I'm sure it'd be sold in no time.
Rich H.
Esse Quam Videri
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Re: small block indy head or 3g Hemi
[Re: MattW]
#1206666
03/31/12 04:23 PM
03/31/12 04:23 PM
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Quote:
Leon441 posted this awhille back.
The BES engine masters engine had some tricks but, obviously nothing that could not be bought. Tony offered that engine with fuel injection for $10,000. How can you complain about a price like that.
Leon
Actually , the dual distributor drive is a one off and I doubt there is anything like it in production. But my understanding of the Engine Masters efforts is they they really are purpose built and long term reliability is a secondary concern. Not a deal breaker for a race motor , but dual purpose or street applications will likely lead to disappointment. Yeah........I'd say 10 K , if that included the ignition and computer for the fuel injection is a steal. Without those two would be a bargain. But it may not be the right tool for every customer's job. And there's nothing worse than trying to tighten an allen head cap screw with a phillips screw driver.
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