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Re: the hemi started smoking out the exh ????? [Re: 72swgnr] #1205253
03/29/12 02:20 AM
03/29/12 02:20 AM
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poplar bluff mo.
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toplescuda Offline OP
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Better shot


1970 barracuda convert. 1 of 59
1970 pro street A.A.R. clone (panther pink)
1971 charger
2015 hellcat challenger. Redline red
2014 quad cab 4x4 ram 8 speed hemi
Re: the hemi started smoking out the exh ????? [Re: toplescuda] #1205254
03/29/12 08:01 AM
03/29/12 08:01 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,436
Oklahoma City OK
Cudajon Offline
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You may have been abused by your machine shop worse than you know. If they failed to replace the valve seals, or used umbrella type seals you've been had. $700 bucks is ridiculous for spring change. I'd pull one of the intake springs and see exactly what you got. I've seen valve seals destroyed when the spring retainer hits them or pushing a new valve seal over a valve without the little plastic valve protector. Also you should be running the teflon/plastic seals that reguire the guide to be machined for them to set on.

Re: the hemi started smoking out the exh ????? [Re: Cudajon] #1205255
03/29/12 08:52 AM
03/29/12 08:52 AM
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Eighty Four, PA
B G Racing Offline
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Just a few places to look.Check the plug tubes for length and seating,check the intake ports for leaks(pin holes from port work in thin areas or cracks)check for ring seal or detonation damage.Look up the header tubes to see if you can isolate the cylinder or drop the headers.

Re: the hemi started smoking out the exh ????? [Re: B G Racing] #1205256
03/29/12 01:02 PM
03/29/12 01:02 PM
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poplar bluff mo.
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toplescuda Offline OP
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The heads have bout 30-40 hours on them
was on a a street car when we bought them (old willys) they have never been cut except a .010 clean up on deck ports never been touched hard to see throught the springs but looks to have seals inplace
the intake ports are dry and clean as a whistle
how would oil be on inside of the tubes (all) even before i removed the plugs?


1970 barracuda convert. 1 of 59
1970 pro street A.A.R. clone (panther pink)
1971 charger
2015 hellcat challenger. Redline red
2014 quad cab 4x4 ram 8 speed hemi
Re: the hemi started smoking out the exh ?**update** [Re: toplescuda] #1205257
03/29/12 01:05 PM
03/29/12 01:05 PM
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poplar bluff mo.
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toplescuda Offline OP
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Differnt valve


1970 barracuda convert. 1 of 59
1970 pro street A.A.R. clone (panther pink)
1971 charger
2015 hellcat challenger. Redline red
2014 quad cab 4x4 ram 8 speed hemi
Re: the hemi started smoking out the exh ????? [Re: toplescuda] #1205258
03/29/12 01:48 PM
03/29/12 01:48 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
B G Racing Offline
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Quote:

The heads have bout 30-40 hours on them
was on a a street car when we bought them (old willys) they have never been cut except a .010 clean up on deck ports never been touched hard to see throught the springs but looks to have seals inplace
the intake ports are dry and clean as a whistle
how would oil be on inside of the tubes (all) even before i removed the plugs?




If the bottom of the tubes do not seat at the plug it will get oil around the plug.Always check this area since it is the easiest and cheapest fix.It may be as simple as not enough torque on the plugs.If the pistons are getting oiled either from leaks at the head(cracks or pinholes)or distorted piston ring lands(detonated or damaged) it will push oil on top of the valves and around the sparkplug threads under compression.That much oil,I would look for piston/ring issues if you can't find it leaking from the top end.

Last edited by B G Racing; 03/29/12 02:04 PM.
Re: the hemi started smoking out the exh ????? [Re: toplescuda] #1205259
03/29/12 05:23 PM
03/29/12 05:23 PM
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Mt. Eden Ky.
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Quote:

Better shot




The inner head mounting studs need to have thread sealer on them, where they screw into the intake ports or oil can be drawn in to the ports by vacuum.



1996 Ram 1500 Sport
1968 road runner
1952 Sears Allstate licensed, pump gas, Hemi 5.98 @ 115.73 1.33 60 ft. The best is yet to come. Painless Performance / Street RODDER magazine Top 100 for 2019
Re: the hemi started smoking out the exh ????? [Re: Hemi Allstate] #1205260
03/29/12 06:13 PM
03/29/12 06:13 PM
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Kansas City Metro
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mbogina Offline
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This appears to a ring seal problem and is typical when the intake runners are dry at the intake manifold face but yet the backside of the intake valve has oil on top of it. You typically wouldn't see THAT much oil on the intake valve even with NO valve seals AND loose guides.


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Re: the hemi started smoking out the exh ????? [Re: mbogina] #1205261
03/29/12 09:23 PM
03/29/12 09:23 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,859
poplar bluff mo.
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toplescuda Offline OP
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What about from the plug tubes not being down tight iut of 16 spark plugs only one poped when took them out rest was like hand tight guiess from valve cover (cork) gasket relaxing


1970 barracuda convert. 1 of 59
1970 pro street A.A.R. clone (panther pink)
1971 charger
2015 hellcat challenger. Redline red
2014 quad cab 4x4 ram 8 speed hemi
Re: the hemi started smoking out the exh ????? [Re: toplescuda] #1205262
03/29/12 10:19 PM
03/29/12 10:19 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,436
Oklahoma City OK
Cudajon Offline
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Oklahoma City OK
In all my years working on Hemi's I've never seen oil leak past the sparkplugs into the cylinder. It only occurs when you pull the plugs and if the aluminum tube retainer is pulled up before the oil is wiped away around it. Since you are where you are at pull the number 1 cylinder intake valve spring and see what you are dealing with.

You need a valve spring compressor, mine is a sunpro or something like that, cheap. It has a screw top and legs that hook into the spring. Screwing the top down with the legs in the spring compresses it. You also need a pencil magnet and about a foot of 1/4" nylon rope. Bring the engine up on No 1 compression, both int and exh will be closed. Use a piece of soft wire and feed an inch or so of the rope thrpogh the sparkplug hole under the intake valve. This will keep the valve if it drops from hitting the piston. The valve can only drop a half inch or less before the piston stops it. Since the valve job is brand new the keepers shouldn't be frozen in the valve retainer. Ust the valve spring compressor and compress the valve. Usually the spring comes up, push down on the compressor and it should free up the keepers. Use the pencil magnet to remove them. Its a good idea to put a shop rag around the valve, sometimes my palsey kicks in I get the shakes and will knock one off the magnet. now you can lift the spring and retainer off the valve. IF you have umbrella valve seals pull the head and go get some of the good teflon ones that require the valve guides to be milled for them to attach too. Now comes the hard part. If they are the good type guides, (they'll have a metal band around the top and bottom to firmly grip the valve stem and guide) look to see if they are new. Do not remove the seal yet! If the springs were replaced any competent shop will replace the seals at the same time. See if they look like the retainer may have contacted the top. Take a hold of the valve stem and slowly slide the valve up and down. It should not slid to easily, if it drops immediately when you removed the keepers then its probably bad seals. Now the good news, you can replace these your self. Simply get a set and do each valve one at a time. Make sure you use the plastic protector on the valve when you push the new seal down. If you are going to do this, go ahead and remove the seal your looking at. Once you pull it up over the valve stem, its ruined. The groves in the valve will destroy the seals ability to control oil.

Good luck dude, wish I was there to help ya.

I'm sure the crew will chime in on anything I missed.

Forgot two things. If it still has springs between the rocker arms You can back off the adjuster till the ball and socket clear and then you can move the rocker out of the way of the push rod, rotate it up and out of the way. That way you want have to remove the whole rocker arm assembly. If it has locks or shims you'll probably have to do that.

Second if everything looks good replace the valve spring and run a compression test. You could have a broken ring. But I'd place my money on valve seals. A compression test isn't a bad idea anyway.

Last edited by Cudajon; 03/29/12 10:52 PM.
Re: the hemi started smoking out the exh ????? [Re: Cudajon] #1205263
03/29/12 10:47 PM
03/29/12 10:47 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 28,312
Cincinnati, Ohio
Challenger 1 Offline
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Cincinnati, Ohio
Quote:



You need a valve spring compressor, mine is a sunpro or something like that, cheap. It has a screw top and legs that hook into the spring. Screwing the top down with the legs in the spring compresses it.




It appears he has dual springs, that style compressor won't work.

Re: the hemi started smoking out the exh ????? [Re: Cudajon] #1205264
03/29/12 10:50 PM
03/29/12 10:50 PM
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,601
ky
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headhunter Offline
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mine did at the track once ended up being the spark plugs wernt tight enough.

Re: the hemi started smoking out the exh ????? [Re: headhunter] #1205265
03/29/12 10:55 PM
03/29/12 10:55 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,436
Oklahoma City OK
Cudajon Offline
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Oklahoma City OK
I'm calling you on that challenger, I always ran doubles with a harmoic flat wound in the middle and I did this at the track more times than I can remember. Broke valve springs, changed all one time for something fresher. Never had a problem. Just make sure you get the legs in there good.

Re: the hemi started smoking out the exh ????? [Re: Cudajon] #1205266
03/29/12 11:16 PM
03/29/12 11:16 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 28,312
Cincinnati, Ohio
Challenger 1 Offline
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Cincinnati, Ohio
OK...? I have one and it won't do the doubles that I tried.

Re: the hemi started smoking out the exh ????? [Re: Challenger 1] #1205267
03/30/12 08:45 AM
03/30/12 08:45 AM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,910
Eighty Four, PA
B G Racing Offline
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In all my years I have seen a few Hemis that pulled oil past the sparkplug threads.We seen that when the compression washer was removed which was the norm of the day.Recently we had one that the tubes didn't seat(too short) and the plugs tore up the tube hole balling up the aluminium under the plug allowing oil to enter and compression to exit.Heck I've seen wedges bleed oil around the intake bolts to the outside of the manifold.
As mentioned before if all else fails look at the ring seal.

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