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DIY brake valves resto #1144338
12/26/11 04:42 PM
12/26/11 04:42 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,177
People's Republic of Kali
70runner Offline OP
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70runner  Offline OP
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Restoration of the disc-drum brake system for my 70RR included an NOS Bendix master cylinder/booster, new lines and wheel cylinders, and the original 3 element valve system: tee, metering, and proportional valves. Since I'm using DOT5, decided to take the valves apart to at least clean them up. Jules DAddio was a valuable resource for this resto. Bought the tee and prop valve rebuild kits sold by Scott at Muscle Car Research. Took some pictures along the way for reference if anyone else wants to restore their original valves.

Tee valve. Disassembly of the tee valve is well documented at the MCR website. Below is a picture of my disassembled tee valve with the MCR seal-spring kit. As noted on the MCR site, you must be very careful removing the hex brass plug on one end of the bore (far right in the pic). After soaking with PB Blaster and heating with a propane torch, I was able to <carefully> get it off without distorting the brass head. Used air pressure to remove the internals. Soaked the valve/parts in orange cleaner, then used a paint gun brush to clean the bore. Used a 3M fine Scotchbrite pad to finish cleaning the bore. Note that the bracket plating has worn off, so I'll need to remove the bracket to get it plated.


Prop valve. MCR also sells a rebuild kit (seals only) for this valve which was manufactured by Kelsey Hayes. The trick with this one is removing the bore snap ring. It requires snap ring pliers with some long, thin fingers. Had purchased a repro prop valve from Inland Tube before deciding to rebuild mine. Took it apart also to see how close the internals matched. Below is a pic of my orig (top) and the repro prop valves. The components are very similar, the pistons have a similar design and identical widest diameter (.42"). The bore diameters appear to be the same, approx .50" (difficult to get an exact measurement, the smallest fitting for my bore gauge was slightly too large). The orig valve is 1.868" long (along the bore), .008" longer than the repro. The orig piston is 1.468" long, .008" longer than the repro. Use your own judgement as to whether the hard bore parts will interchange. The rubber should interchange or, cheaper, buy the MCR kit. I used the same process to clean the bore - orange soak, bore brush, and fine scotchbrite.


Metering valve. AFAIK there is no rebuild or seal kit for this valve. The biggest challenge, on an OEM valve, is the octagon bore nut. Removal of this nut is easier, with less risk to damaging the nut, by using a special socket available here. Thx to Jules for the reference. Here's a pic of the socket and octagon nut.


I obtained a repro metering valve from Finelines to determine if I could use the seals to rebuild my original. Below is the orig (top) and repro valves with the bore assemblies out. Note the Finelines bracket is plated while the plating has worn off my original. Interestingly, a friend has an Inland Tube metering valve and the bracket is not plated. I'm planning to graft the Finelines bracket to my original. If you look closely at the orig valve you can see a rectangular punch mark left of the bracket. There is no corresponding mark on the repro. This was probably done to stake the nut once installed.

Used small vice grips to compress the spring portion of the piston assembly to access and remove the <very> small lock rings. The lock ring is just ahead of the white plastic fitting. Be sure to use a washer or some other means to protect the rubber seal if you use vicegrips to do this.

Here's a pic of the internals separated for each valve.

Dimensionally the internals appear very similar but there are some differences. The repro uses a standard 6pt nut instead of the octagon nut on the original. This certainly makes for easier disassembly but, besides the stampings, is a dead giveaway of a repro valve. The nut can be removed from the shaft (shown separate in the pic). The nut was initially stuck to the shaft on the orig valve. After some WD40 treatment, I was able to unstick the nut such that it would slide off the shaft. From the pic, note that the perforated fittings just below the springs are of similar design though one is metal (orig), the other plastic. The repro rubber fitting on top of the bore nut (external to the valve body) is substantially different than the orig.

Here are some comparative measurements: orig; repro
Bore diam: .687"; .687"
Shaft length: 2.062"; 2.055"
Valve body length (along bore axis): .89"; .90"
Valve body width: .82"; .88"
Brass disk diam: .685"; .685"

Below is a closeup of the "hat" fitting that goes into the bore first and fits in a small cavity at the bottom of the bore. The orig hat is a single brass piece while the repro appears to be 2 pieces, or perhaps a broken single piece??? I will contact Finelines to check this out. Plan to use the 2 repro rubber pieces to rebuild the orig valve. Again used the same process to clean the bore, except I had to use a quick blast of glass beads to clean the bottom cavity.


Update: Finelines states that the 2 piece cavity fitting is per design. I'll use my single piece for the rebuild. Reassembled the prop valve today, using the MCR seals. The orig piston was gouged a bit when removing the snap ring so used the repro piston/spring. As the MCR site states, reinstalling the snap ring is a bit of a challenge. I used a long thin screwdriver to "balance" pressure, with the snap ring pliers, against the spring while inserting the snap ring. Marked the shaft of the screwdriver to the depth of the snap ring bore slot so I'd know when I was at/near the slot.

Last edited by 70runner; 01/08/12 06:18 PM.
Re: DIY brake valves resto [Re: 70runner] #1144339
12/27/11 09:40 AM
12/27/11 09:40 AM

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Anonymous
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Great post! I just got kits to rebuild my distribution block as well as the hold off valve. What did you use to clean up the inside of the bore? All I could get in there was a bottle brush but wanted to hit it with some really fine grit sand paper or steel wool but nothing was small enough to get inside there.

Re: DIY brake valves resto [Re: 70runner] #1144340
12/27/11 03:42 PM
12/27/11 03:42 PM
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,285
Pacific NW USA
CompSyn Offline
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Great find and info. I just ordered up the prop seals and tee kit.

Re: DIY brake valves resto [Re: ] #1144341
12/27/11 04:31 PM
12/27/11 04:31 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,177
People's Republic of Kali
70runner Offline OP
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70runner  Offline OP
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Joined: Jan 2003
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Quote:

Great post! I just got kits to rebuild my distribution block as well as the hold off valve. What did you use to clean up the inside of the bore? All I could get in there was a bottle brush but wanted to hit it with some really fine grit sand paper or steel wool but nothing was small enough to get inside there.




I cut some fine scotchbrite into narrow pieces and carefully cleaned the bore using orange cleaner to lubricate. The tee valve is the smallest bore but open on each end, so that helps cleaning. Both the metering and prop valves have a cavity at the bottom - I used short blasts of glass beads to clean these.

Re: DIY brake valves resto [Re: 70runner] #1144342
12/27/11 06:06 PM
12/27/11 06:06 PM

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I actually left the one end in and used a small diameter rod to push out the pistons and springs through the opening for the brake fluid. No need to pull the seat out and have to reinstall it.

Re: DIY brake valves resto [Re: 70runner] #1144343
12/27/11 09:36 PM
12/27/11 09:36 PM
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,285
Pacific NW USA
CompSyn Offline
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Paid for for the parts using my PayPal account today and within a few hours I had an e-mail from Scott Hollenbeck at Muscle Car Research LLC., with an attached USPS tracking number. Looks like a top notch vendor.

Re: DIY brake valves resto [Re: 70runner] #1144344
12/28/11 10:19 AM
12/28/11 10:19 AM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 32
Virginia, USA
sah62 Offline
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I've been giving some thought to the rubber parts needed to rebuild the metering/hold-off valve. The challenge is that the cap and the main seal appear to be unique to these valves and I can't find a supplier who has them. That means they'll have to be custom made. I have a quote from one manufacturer who needs $2100 for "shared" tooling and $4800 for tooling I'd own, but both options mean that I'd have to sell a lot of seals before I could cover my costs - and that's just for the seal. The cap costs would probably be similar. If anyone knows of a less expense way to produce custom rubber seals please clue me in!

Thanks for the positive feedback, too. I aim to please!


Scott Hollenbeck Administrator, Mustang 428 Cobra Jet Registry Owner, Muscle Car Research LLC 1970 Ford Mustang Mach 1 2006 Dodge Charger SRT8 1995 Chevrolet Impala SS
Re: DIY brake valves resto [Re: sah62] #1144345
12/28/11 11:21 AM
12/28/11 11:21 AM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,462
Mrytle Beach SC
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johnscudashop Offline
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Mrytle Beach SC
Lots of great information here. I worked with Jules to develop the Octagon Socket, They have a 1/2 drive and are made from hi carbon steel. They are available at www.custommachinecomponents.com

6988154-000_0156.jpg (46 downloads)
Re: DIY brake valves resto [Re: johnscudashop] #1144346
12/28/11 11:22 AM
12/28/11 11:22 AM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,462
Mrytle Beach SC
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johnscudashop Offline
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One more

6988155-000_0157.jpg (77 downloads)
Re: DIY brake valves resto [Re: sah62] #1144347
12/28/11 10:49 PM
12/28/11 10:49 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,177
People's Republic of Kali
70runner Offline OP
super stock
70runner  Offline OP
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,177
People's Republic of Kali
Quote:

I've been giving some thought to the rubber parts needed to rebuild the metering/hold-off valve. The challenge is that the cap and the main seal appear to be unique to these valves and I can't find a supplier who has them. That means they'll have to be custom made. I have a quote from one manufacturer who needs $2100 for "shared" tooling and $4800 for tooling I'd own, but both options mean that I'd have to sell a lot of seals before I could cover my costs - and that's just for the seal. The cap costs would probably be similar. If anyone knows of a less expense way to produce custom rubber seals please clue me in!

Thanks for the positive feedback, too. I aim to please!




Scott, well, someone is making them because the Finelines repro metering valve has the proper rubber seals. Maybe you should talk to them - good folks.

Re: DIY brake valves resto [Re: 70runner] #1144348
12/29/11 12:02 AM
12/29/11 12:02 AM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 32
Virginia, USA
sah62 Offline
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Quote:

Scott, well, someone is making them because the Finelines repro metering valve has the proper rubber seals. Maybe you should talk to them - good folks.




I can't find any brake valves on the finelinesinc.com web site. Can you point me to them? Did you mean Inline Tube? I can ask, but I doubt that they'll be willing to sell parts. That might have an impact on their repro valve sales.


Scott Hollenbeck Administrator, Mustang 428 Cobra Jet Registry Owner, Muscle Car Research LLC 1970 Ford Mustang Mach 1 2006 Dodge Charger SRT8 1995 Chevrolet Impala SS
Re: DIY brake valves resto [Re: sah62] #1144349
12/30/11 02:02 AM
12/30/11 02:02 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,177
People's Republic of Kali
70runner Offline OP
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70runner  Offline OP
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Quote:

Quote:

Scott, well, someone is making them because the Finelines repro metering valve has the proper rubber seals. Maybe you should talk to them - good folks.




I can't find any brake valves on the finelinesinc.com web site. Can you point me to them? Did you mean Inline Tube? I can ask, but I doubt that they'll be willing to sell parts. That might have an impact on their repro valve sales.




I had to call Finelines (Rick) to make sure I got the correct valve. Their website has a few valve references, but no pix. Inline Tube, OTOH, has a LOT of good pix. Don't know if they use the same source for the metering valve, but I do know that the brackets are different. After I posted my note, I got to thinking the same thing - they may be reluctant to help you, tho someone out there is making the correct rubber seals.

Re: DIY brake valves resto [Re: 70runner] #1144350
01/08/12 05:41 PM
01/08/12 05:41 PM
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Just to close this off...

Removed the brackets from both the tee and metering valves and had them plated. Got some rivets from Jules (THX!) and had local rivet supply reattach bracket to metering valve. Restaked bracket to tee valve. All ready now for their introduction to DOT5.

7008235-rebuilt_all3.jpg (48 downloads)
Re: DIY brake valves resto [Re: 70runner] #1144351
01/08/12 05:44 PM
01/08/12 05:44 PM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 32
Virginia, USA
sah62 Offline
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Where did you have the plating done? How much?


Scott Hollenbeck Administrator, Mustang 428 Cobra Jet Registry Owner, Muscle Car Research LLC 1970 Ford Mustang Mach 1 2006 Dodge Charger SRT8 1995 Chevrolet Impala SS
Re: DIY brake valves resto [Re: sah62] #1144352
01/08/12 05:51 PM
01/08/12 05:51 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,177
People's Republic of Kali
70runner Offline OP
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Local plating company just down the freeway a bit - recommended by mopar club.

Member here (Eric) does good plating work, his handle is 3404.

Re: DIY brake valves resto [Re: 70runner] #1144353
01/08/12 05:58 PM
01/08/12 05:58 PM
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71rm23 Offline
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VERY nice 70Runner

Re: DIY brake valves resto [Re: 71rm23] #1144354
01/08/12 06:37 PM
01/08/12 06:37 PM
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Montreal,Quebec,Canada
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JulesdaWiperman Offline
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Well done.
Congratulations
Jules

Re: DIY brake valves resto [Re: JulesdaWiperman] #1144355
01/08/12 07:01 PM
01/08/12 07:01 PM
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Posts: 1,168
Richmond, VA
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rayztoy Offline
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Quote:

Well done.
Congratulations
Jules




Thanks for posting the info and pics. This should be Archived.







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