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#2414633 - 12/07/17 09:12 AM Carbon fiber pickup bed, or aluminum truck?
360view Offline
master

Registered: 01/18/06
Posts: 4227
Loc: USA
The Thursday Wall Street Journal is reporting that
GM is aiming to have an extremely light weight carbon fiber cargo box
for its 2019 model year pickups that will get a weight reduction comparable to Ford's glitch hobbled aluminum pickup body parts.

Which is the better overall method:

Aluminum body panels and cargo box
Or
Carbon fiber cargo box and Saturn-like plastic body panels?

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#2414652 - 12/07/17 09:51 AM Re: Carbon fiber pickup bed, or aluminum truck? [Re: 360view]
Stanton Offline
master

Registered: 10/13/05
Posts: 6397
Loc: Ontario, Canada
The problem with any "composite" is it doesn't have the flexibility to take a hard hit. Drop a toolbox into a composite bed and you end up with a bad crack instead of a dent. Maybe they'll include a box liner in the deal !!!

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#2414658 - 12/07/17 10:02 AM Re: Carbon fiber pickup bed, or aluminum truck? [Re: Stanton]
Neil Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 12219
Loc: Eagle, Idaho
Whatever they do will drive the cost higher that's for sure. Want to save weight? Try downsizing the size of the truck.

Most people here with new trucks don't put anything in the bed. Construction workers, who actually use their trucks, usually drive a 95 Ford with 3 different tires and no tailgate. Their boss, the GC, are the ones who have new trucks with 20k worth of accessories, and they don't do anything that involves getting dirty.

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#2414663 - 12/07/17 10:24 AM Re: Carbon fiber pickup bed, or aluminum truck? [Re: 360view]
feets Offline
Senior Management

Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 26930
Loc: Irving, TX
Trucks have become too large but with the mentality surrounding them the first company to downsize is going to lose.

My 92 D250 is what I consider "proper" size. The last generation Dakotas were pretty close. The current leviathans are way too large and with the 24" deep beds (mine is 18" deep) you can't get to low items in the bed without dropping the tailgate.
I can drop some 2x4s in the bed of my truck and reach over the side to retrieve them. You can forget doing that in today's trucks. The tailgate has to come down and you'll likely have to break out the "man step" to get in there.

I still think that the outer body panels should be made like a smart car. Flexible plastic is cheap to replace, available in body color, and light dents pop out on their own.

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#2414677 - 12/07/17 10:43 AM Re: Carbon fiber pickup bed, or aluminum truck? [Re: 360view]
Θάνατος Offline
supercuda

Registered: 09/04/07
Posts: 12837
Loc: betwixt the land of the living...
I have zero problems getting things out of my truck, from the sides or the rear and it's a 4x4 to boot.

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#2414679 - 12/07/17 10:45 AM Re: Carbon fiber pickup bed, or aluminum truck? [Re: feets]
Rhinodart Offline
Rhinotruck

Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 35221
Loc: Round Lake Beach, Illinoisy
Make mine steel or forget me ever buying another one. Had my 2015 regular cab Ram 4x4 next to my 96 regular cab 2500 long box and my 1992 regular cab short box next to each other last week and the 2015 looked like a damn semi compared to the others... eek
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#2414680 - 12/07/17 10:46 AM Re: Carbon fiber pickup bed, or aluminum truck? [Re: 360view]
360view Offline
master

Registered: 01/18/06
Posts: 4227
Loc: USA
When my brother's "mid sized" 2016 Colorado is parked right next to my 1995 Ram we can easily see they are practically the same size. I can vividly remember that my first impression of the 1994 Rams were that they were "too big" compared to the fully capable previous years.

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#2414682 - 12/07/17 10:48 AM Re: Carbon fiber pickup bed, or aluminum truck? [Re: 360view]
RoadRunner Offline
master

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 4482
Loc: East Aurora (Buffalo) NY
I have an aluminum truck. And I use my bed. I also have a spray in liner. I have had transported loads of gravel, sand, dirt, and trees. Also loaded it up with engine parts, and took 2000lbs of scrap brake rotors, drums and other heavy metal pieces to the scrap yard this past spring. Its holding up no different that the bed in the last truck which was steel. In fact, I think better as I think this spray in liner is a bit thicker. I can say I am not one for hanging parts three feet in the air and dropping them into the bed. I think the commercials are ridiculous in that regard.
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#2414683 - 12/07/17 10:50 AM Re: Carbon fiber pickup bed, or aluminum truck? [Re: 360view]
sp392 Offline
master

Registered: 12/18/05
Posts: 8947
Loc: Etobicoke
GM used to offer a composite box, but look at the warping!

https://youtu.be/MxhMH7bd3BY?t=4m57s

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#2414686 - 12/07/17 10:59 AM Re: Carbon fiber pickup bed, or aluminum truck? [Re: sp392]
jcc Offline
No politics

Registered: 12/21/03
Posts: 16815
Loc: Trumussia
Originally Posted By sp392
GM used to offer a composite box, but look at the warping!

https://youtu.be/MxhMH7bd3BY?t=4m57s


Warping with CF/epoxy is many factors less then resin/FG composites, almost no comparison. And there is a distinction between "plastic" and "composites". The big problem not yet mentioned, CF, unless used in main structural components (ie not truck beds), will add little to any crash integrity compliance ( it shatters) if the CF is used in thicknesses for the stated purpose of reducing weight. And it certainly will not be cheaper, I expect.


Edited by jcc (12/07/17 11:03 AM)

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#2414687 - 12/07/17 11:00 AM Re: Carbon fiber pickup bed, or aluminum truck? [Re: 360view]
Θάνατος Offline
supercuda

Registered: 09/04/07
Posts: 12837
Loc: betwixt the land of the living...
Originally Posted By 360view
When my brother's "mid sized" 2016 Colorado is parked right next to my 1995 Ram we can easily see they are practically the same size. I can vividly remember that my first impression of the 1994 Rams were that they were "too big" compared to the fully capable previous years.


When we got my wife her '15 Canyon we parked it next to her 05 Ram.

It's about 8 inches shorter and not nearly as wide. In the Ram you could lie a piece of plywood between the wheel wells, in the Canyon it has to go above the wells but is will fit between the bedsides. The Ram sat much higher too, both 2wd's.

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#2414692 - 12/07/17 11:06 AM Re: Carbon fiber pickup bed, or aluminum truck? [Re: sp392]
wingman Offline


Registered: 06/23/04
Posts: 2136
Loc: St. Charles, MO
Pickups from all 3 manufacturers have gotten needlessly, ridiculously huge over the years, and the prices for them have gotten equally bloated. They have turned into profit gold mines for the companies because the markup is so crazy, but people keep paying it.

And the problem is half of these people that drive them use them as daily drivers, riding around with the bed empty, towing mirrors sticking out for no reason. Then when they get to Wal Mart they still want to park in the front row and can't manage to fit them into a normal size parking spot. rolleyes

I drive an 03 Dakota daily, and it can do almost anything a 1500 can do, in a footprint about the same as an '80s full size truck.

But Dodge beat the Dakota with an ugly stick, then killed it off completely, because it was taking away from their 1500 sales...

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#2414791 - 12/07/17 02:12 PM Re: Carbon fiber pickup bed, or aluminum truck? [Re: wingman]
sp392 Offline
master

Registered: 12/18/05
Posts: 8947
Loc: Etobicoke
Originally Posted By wingman
Pickups from all 3 manufacturers have gotten needlessly, ridiculously huge over the years, and the prices for them have gotten equally bloated. They have turned into profit gold mines for the companies because the markup is so crazy, but people keep paying it.

And the problem is half of these people that drive them use them as daily drivers, riding around with the bed empty, towing mirrors sticking out for no reason. Then when they get to Wal Mart they still want to park in the front row and can't manage to fit them into a normal size parking spot. rolleyes

I drive an 03 Dakota daily, and it can do almost anything a 1500 can do, in a footprint about the same as an '80s full size truck.

But Dodge beat the Dakota with an ugly stick, then killed it off completely, because it was taking away from their 1500 sales...


A modern interpretation of this would sell like hot cakes today. Same size with modernized styling. Come standard with the new turbo 4cyl 270hp/295tq hooked to the 8-speed and make an R/T 5.7L


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#2414799 - 12/07/17 02:24 PM Re: Carbon fiber pickup bed, or aluminum truck? [Re: 360view]
Orange_Crush Offline
Belieber!

Registered: 02/03/03
Posts: 17814
Loc: Charlotte, NC
Don't sing the praises of a steel bed TOO much.

The bed on my 2005 ram had several dents in it from from heavy stuff that was dropped in there.

I've seen a number of Dodge, Chevy, and steel Ford trucks with perforations in the bed due to something heavy being dropped in there.

As a matter of fact, I won't go back to a spray-in bedliner because it really does nothing to protect the bed itself, it just keeps the paint from getting scratched up.
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#2414802 - 12/07/17 02:31 PM Re: Carbon fiber pickup bed, or aluminum truck? [Re: sp392]
Neil Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 12219
Loc: Eagle, Idaho
I'd much rather have a Dakota than a full size truck. I waited too long to buy a used one and all that are left out there are worn out. Craigslist and used car lots have them with 225k miles including the no extra cost flaking clear coat and shredded seats and still want 5 grand or more for them. Sorry, not paying that much for a truck that's really worth no more than $500.

Any truck that is not a 1/2 ton or larger winds up in the hands of trailer park types who finish them off. Any time you see an S-10, Colorado, or a Ranger pickup it's always filthy dirty.


Edited by Neil (12/07/17 02:33 PM)

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#2414856 - 12/07/17 04:13 PM Re: Carbon fiber pickup bed, or aluminum truck? [Re: sp392]
DaytonaTurbo Offline


Registered: 02/26/03
Posts: 20453
Loc: Manitoba, Canada
Carbon fiber is great in that it's rigid and lightweight, however once it hits it's yield point it cracks violently in a way that there is no real way to repair. I think the aluminum is a good idea in that it can still be cut, welded and repaired like steel. All the dodges I see running around here with rotted out rear wheels wells tell me steel is the worst of the bunch.

Originally Posted By sp392

A modern interpretation of this would sell like hot cakes today. Same size with modernized styling.


Judging by what is selling today, I would wholeheartedly disagree. People basically want a minivan with a truck box. Nobody is buying single cab trucks or would buy anything with a tiny extended cab like a 90's dakota. The big 3 basically stopped making the tiny extended cabs for a reason.

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#2414877 - 12/07/17 04:52 PM Re: Carbon fiber pickup bed, or aluminum truck? [Re: 360view]
jcruse64 Offline


Registered: 05/30/14
Posts: 52
Loc: Paducah, KY USA Earth
Not just Dodges rusting out. I live in KY, and I see a bunch of Ford, GM and Dodge trucks at the 6-10 year mark with rusting rear wheel wells, rusting front fenders, and rotting cab corners and rockers. We DO tend to use salt on our roads here, to prepare us for those 1/2" Snowpocalypses, though...

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#2414880 - 12/07/17 04:58 PM Re: Carbon fiber pickup bed, or aluminum truck? [Re: DaytonaTurbo]
Neil Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 12219
Loc: Eagle, Idaho
Originally Posted By DaytonaTurbo

Judging by what is selling today, I would wholeheartedly disagree. People basically want a minivan with a truck box. Nobody is buying single cab trucks or would buy anything with a tiny extended cab like a 90's dakota. The big 3 basically stopped making the tiny extended cabs for a reason.


I only like regular cab short box trucks as they look better and have shorter wheelbases so you can park and turn around. No way am I ever buying an extra cab or 4 door pickup. I throw my work ladder and small tool bag in the bed and I'm good to go.

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#2414917 - 12/07/17 06:03 PM Re: Carbon fiber pickup bed, or aluminum truck? [Re: 360view]
topside Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 11647
Loc: So Near, Yet So Far
I'd be surprised if they really do carbon fiber; it's still an expensive material. I'd expect composite, meaning a glass-fiber-reinforced plastic.

As for new pickups, I think my '79 Chevy K10 & '89 GMC Dually will outlast me, and both are nice enough that I feel no need for one of the new gigantic $40,000-plus rigs that look like the box my GMC could've been shipped in.

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#2414933 - 12/07/17 06:38 PM Re: Carbon fiber pickup bed, or aluminum truck? [Re: 360view]
360view Offline
master

Registered: 01/18/06
Posts: 4227
Loc: USA
The same WSJ article states that pickups are only 16% of the total number of vehicles sold but create the "bulk" of the $25 Billion profit of the big three.

Average GM pickup sale price $43k
Average Ford $45k

Typical profit on pickups has grown from $15,000 in late 1990s to over $20,000 today

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