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#2392919 - 10/25/17 12:47 PM Re: 470 dry sump engine on the dyno [Re: AndyF]
AndyF Offline
Too Many Posts

Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 24508
Loc: Oregon
There are pluses and minuses that is for sure. The dry sump is great for oil control and engine packaging as well as things like temp control, pre-oiling, pan vacuum, etc. But it is also expensive and difficult to package and complex.

I like the belt drive external oil pump since it is easy to change drive ratios and easy to pre-oil the engine. But it is also more expensive than a normal pump and requires more parts for mounting. I think the belt driven pump is a better solution than buying some of the really big and expensive cam driven pumps though. Just depends if you can fit it into your chassis or not.

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#2392926 - 10/25/17 12:57 PM Re: 470 dry sump engine on the dyno [Re: AndyF]
AndyF Offline
Too Many Posts

Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 24508
Loc: Oregon
The other thing is that I don't think a low rpm pump gas engine is all that good of a test bed for this stuff. If I really want to see what is going on I need to build a high rpm screamer and then do some testing. Probably need to build something that has a power peak up around 8000 or 8500 rpm before the power changes start to get bigger. Just not a lot of choices for doing that with a BB Mopar unless I buy a KB block and then get some B1 heads or something like that.

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#2393013 - 10/25/17 04:43 PM Re: 470 dry sump engine on the dyno [Re: AndyF]
csk Offline
super stock

Registered: 08/13/11
Posts: 1133
Loc: KATY TEXAS
Originally Posted By AndyF
The other thing is that I don't think a low rpm pump gas engine is all that good of a test bed for this stuff. If I really want to see what is going on I need to build a high rpm screamer and then do some testing. Probably need to build something that has a power peak up around 8000 or 8500 rpm before the power changes start to get bigger. Just not a lot of choices for doing that with a BB Mopar unless I buy a KB block and then get some B1 heads or something like that.


you could build a steel crank high rpm 400. smile that is if we had money to burn smile
_________________________
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68 Charger daily driver 512 low deck, 4050lb,11.33 @ 121.1, 1750DA
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#2393366 - 10/26/17 12:23 PM Re: 470 dry sump engine on the dyno [Re: AndyF]
cudadon Offline
top fuel

Registered: 11/24/03
Posts: 2109
Loc: New Lenox IL
Originally Posted By AndyF
Just finished up the analysis and building charts for the magazine article. Short summary is that on this engine a wet sump with vac pump made basically the same power as a dry sump setup. So pick your poison.

The Wilson porting work on the Indy intake picked up a nice chunk of power. The gain over the unported intake was more than 30 hp at the top of curve. The unported intake was run on the dry sump engine while the ported intake was on the wet sump + vac pump combo.

So if you have an as cast Indy 400-3 and you are making around 750 hp, sending that intake to Wilson for porting should be worth 25 or 30 hp.


Andy when Wilson ported the Indy intake did they leave the clover leaf or change it to square flange?

Witch magazine is this article in? Thanks for passing your tech to us!

Don

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#2393387 - 10/26/17 01:03 PM Re: 470 dry sump engine on the dyno [Re: cudadon]
AndyF Offline
Too Many Posts

Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 24508
Loc: Oregon
Originally Posted By cudadon
Originally Posted By AndyF
Just finished up the analysis and building charts for the magazine article. Short summary is that on this engine a wet sump with vac pump made basically the same power as a dry sump setup. So pick your poison.

The Wilson porting work on the Indy intake picked up a nice chunk of power. The gain over the unported intake was more than 30 hp at the top of curve. The unported intake was run on the dry sump engine while the ported intake was on the wet sump + vac pump combo.

So if you have an as cast Indy 400-3 and you are making around 750 hp, sending that intake to Wilson for porting should be worth 25 or 30 hp.


Andy when Wilson ported the Indy intake did they leave the clover leaf or change it to square flange?

Witch magazine is this article in? Thanks for passing your tech to us!

Don


Wilson has always gotten rid of the clover leaf design on any intake they have ported for me. There are some pictures earlier in this thread but here are some more.

All of my tech articles are on the Hot Rod website. Just go to Hot Rod and then search for 470 or 270 Trick Flow or something like that and you'll find them.


Attachments
DSC_0737 (Large).JPG

DSC_0692 (Large).JPG



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#2394725 - 10/29/17 10:31 AM Re: 470 dry sump engine on the dyno [Re: AndyF]
moparx Offline
Dreaming of implants

Registered: 09/03/03
Posts: 9143
Loc: north of coder
andy, are those two small, diagonally opposed holes the original carb base holes in the unmodified intake ?
beer

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#2394778 - 10/29/17 11:30 AM Re: 470 dry sump engine on the dyno [Re: AndyF]
AndyF Offline
Too Many Posts

Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 24508
Loc: Oregon
Wilson drills those holes to index a spacer. Their spacers also have the same hole pattern so you can use dowel pins to locate the spacer very precisely on the intake.

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#2394794 - 10/29/17 11:47 AM Re: 470 dry sump engine on the dyno [Re: AndyF]
moparx Offline
Dreaming of implants

Registered: 09/03/03
Posts: 9143
Loc: north of coder
Originally Posted By AndyF
Wilson drills those holes to index a spacer. Their spacers also have the same hole pattern so you can use dowel pins to locate the spacer very precisely on the intake.

up thanks ! wasn't sure, but now i know.
beer

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