Posted By: Gary Robbins
Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/18/10 07:42 PM
Can any of you with the upper control arm in the stock location and no inner fender show me some pic. from under hood,thanks...Gary
Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies?
Posted By: WILD BILL
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/18/10 08:18 PM
I can when I get home but it's not an A body.
What is it your wanting to know or see?
What is it your wanting to know or see?
Posted By: bigtimeauto
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/18/10 08:19 PM
here you go:
Posted By: DaKuda
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/18/10 08:21 PM
Heres one when my Valiant was in the body shop.
.jpg "6364610-rsz_z_mopar69_valiant_(70).jpg")
Posted By: DemonDust
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/18/10 08:24 PM
Posted By: jughed
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/18/10 08:37 PM
Posted By: rebel
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/18/10 08:56 PM
i decided the shock mount was interfearring with making some decent flowing headers so we moved the shock mount to the bar & cut the rest out.
Posted By: VernMotor
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/18/10 09:24 PM
Posted By: rickma
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/18/10 10:56 PM
69 dart
Posted By: earthmover
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/18/10 11:03 PM
whats the pros and cons of this i have thought of doing my duster this way with the new big block but thought i would ask before i do it...i know it helps cool down air flow in compartment and stuff like that maybe clearence for headers aswell 
thanks sorry dont mean to hi jack just would like to know..mike 
thanks sorry dont mean to hi jack just would like to know..mike
Posted By: rebel
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/18/10 11:07 PM
the pro's as i see it, you have room to build better flowing headers, you can access your plugs easier especially if you build good headers, on my car the front clip comes off so the front tires become a convieniant seat when working on the engine. i can't think of any cons apart front your engine will get dirty if you drive on the street in the rain.
Posted By: 70HemiGTX
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/18/10 11:09 PM
Here's what mine looks like. A little tough to see the shock mount, but it is tied in with the front runner of the cage.
Posted By: rowin4
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/18/10 11:16 PM
If it's a race car , ease of header install, plug change, maybe cooling, make sure you have the front cage tubes even if there welded to the firewall or your car will fold up. welding the remaining shock tower to the front tubes will add support also. If your looking for weight reduction , maybe 20 lbs., The down tubes will weigh more. It better be a race car or the value of your car will be reduced. 
Posted By: MR_P_BODY
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/18/10 11:22 PM
Quote:
whats the pros and cons of this i have thought of doing my duster this way with the new big block but thought i would ask before i do it...i know it helps cool down air flow in compartment and stuff like that maybe clearence for headers aswell
If you put the round tube in place as the others
show you can cut that sheet metal out and save weight
along with easier access... the upper A-arm carries
very little load... its there to hold the spindle
vertical, thats all(well in the case of a stock
set up its there to adjust the camber and caster)
Posted By: PolyDart
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 12:59 AM
Quote:
the pro's as i see it, you have room to build better flowing headers...
What's the spring for??
Posted By: rebel
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 01:02 AM
Quote:
What's the spring for??
it's not a spring but in fact a piece of plastic electrical conduit to hide the hori old chain i use to act as a limiter on the suspension.
Posted By: Sixpak
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 01:09 AM
Just an fyi - those inner fenders do a lot to strengthen the uni-body. And they will weigh much less than the cage bars you would need to install to regain that strength...you also lose a good many of the places that bolts go into the fenders to hold them in place.
Posted By: MR_P_BODY
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 01:58 AM
Quote:
Just an fyi - those inner fenders do a lot to strengthen the uni-body. And they will weigh much less than the cage bars you would need to install to regain that strength...you also lose a good many of the places that bolts go into the fenders to hold them in place.
On the weight... I disagree with you... thats alot
of metal your taking out... but I use moly tubing
which is 1.36# per foot but if you use MS its 2.0#
Posted By: @#$%&*!
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 04:00 AM
Here's my pig.
This was done for cooling, the A-body engine compartment is a hot-house otherwise. Bent bars are weaker in tension and compression. Mine isn't tied to the cage since I don't have one. Fwiw, the horizontal force in the upper control arms is F=W*A/B where W is the sprung corner weight, A is the distance from the center of the tire to the center of the lower ball joint and
B is the distance between the ball joints. Since A and B are similar the horizontal force is similar to the sprung corner weight.
Check out the high-tech cooling system. It's worked fine for at least 15 years and uses no wp housing. The bar code on the valve cover is for a Cordoba HP 400, I just couldn't paint over it. Harland Sharps hiding under the stock covers. I know, I have some clean-up to do, the engine is coming out soon.
This was done for cooling, the A-body engine compartment is a hot-house otherwise. Bent bars are weaker in tension and compression. Mine isn't tied to the cage since I don't have one. Fwiw, the horizontal force in the upper control arms is F=W*A/B where W is the sprung corner weight, A is the distance from the center of the tire to the center of the lower ball joint and
B is the distance between the ball joints. Since A and B are similar the horizontal force is similar to the sprung corner weight.
Check out the high-tech cooling system. It's worked fine for at least 15 years and uses no wp housing. The bar code on the valve cover is for a Cordoba HP 400, I just couldn't paint over it. Harland Sharps hiding under the stock covers. I know, I have some clean-up to do, the engine is coming out soon.
Posted By: bigtimeauto
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 04:36 AM
you need to build the front so everything ties together using the engine plate and transmission midplates as crossmembers:
Posted By: Gary Robbins
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 01:40 PM
Quote:Thanks everyone for the replies..it was what i was looking for.We have off the shelf tti headers and have you ever checked/changed spark plugs with everything hot...almost impossible.We run our car conservative and looking to step it up and will have to keep a check on the tune closer...rarely check them now lol.Your options on custom headers is alot better with no inner fenders and i was concerned about the upper control arm mount...
you need to build the front so everything ties together using the engine plate and transmission midplates as crossmembers:
Bob thats exactly what i kneeded as i have a alterkation frontend also...i like the clean look...Thanks again everyone...Gary
Posted By: 440Jim
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 02:28 PM
Quote:Yea, if you have the factory steering box and torsion bars, those shock towers make the initial bend for the center cylinders tight, especially for bigger headers over 2". I believe they will flow better with a straighter shot off the head.
i decided the shock mount was interfearring with making some decent flowing headers so we moved the shock mount to the bar & cut the rest out.
Posted By: cudadon
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 03:08 PM
Do you all think that with NO inner fenders it lets a lot more air in going down the track? More aero drag? My hood lifts up at about 138 or so, I wondered if it would be less air if I had inners? What do you think? Don
Posted By: WILD BILL
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 03:29 PM
I would think it lets more air in under the hood.
However, In your case I would suggest maybe adding more hood pins.
Can't really tell by the pic you posted but it looks like you may only be using 1 in each corner.
I have 10 Dusz fasteners on mine and it's nice a satble.
However, In your case I would suggest maybe adding more hood pins.
Can't really tell by the pic you posted but it looks like you may only be using 1 in each corner.
I have 10 Dusz fasteners on mine and it's nice a satble.
Posted By: Sixpak
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 04:46 PM
Quote:Quote:
Just an fyi - those inner fenders do a lot to strengthen the uni-body. And they will weigh much less than the cage bars you would need to install to regain that strength...you also lose a good many of the places that bolts go into the fenders to hold them in place.
On the weight... I disagree with you... thats alot
of metal your taking out... but I use moly tubing
which is 1.36# per foot but if you use MS its 2.0#
When I did this using mild steel 1 3/4 .134 wall the tubing definitely weighed more than the inner fenders. All total the inner fenders were about 20 pounds.
Posted By: hemicop
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 05:22 PM
If ity were me, I'd do what the old P/S cars did. They simply ran a piece of sheetmetal from the framerail to the fender with the edge bent-over so as to bolt the piece to the fender. Since they used coilovers, they simply notched the sheetmetal to accomodate the upper mount. This provided them with extra room (since there were no contours) yet kept air from getting caught in the engine bay as you're concerned with.If you look at many of the early 70s P/S mopars (Motown MIssile, Herb McCandless's Demon, etc.)they were done this way. Since these were factory cars, obviously someone, somewhere did the research to find & figure out it was necessary to isolate the engine bayand since you ARE talking speeds similiar to early P/S type cars, this fix seems applicable
Posted By: MR_P_BODY
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 05:35 PM
When I did this using mild steel 1 3/4 .134 wall the tubing definitely weighed more than the inner fenders. All total the inner fenders were about 20 pounds.
Your tubing weighs 2.31 lbs per foot and I would guess
you used about 7'
Your tubing weighs 2.31 lbs per foot and I would guess
you used about 7'
Posted By: BloFish
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 05:43 PM
Posted By: dennismopar73
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 06:04 PM
wish i could download pics of mine
just cant seam to find out how
just cant seam to find out how
Posted By: sixpackgut
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 06:10 PM
BloFish, can i have your car?
Posted By: redex79
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 06:26 PM
CAP upper arms, Aerospace hubs,rotors.calipers. Brace is to the firewall.
Posted By: ProSport
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 06:57 PM
Our local heads up classes require inner fenders.
I think it would be nice to have some aluminum inner fenders that were dzus'd on, I believe that's what BondoBob just had done to his DartSport.
I think it would be nice to have some aluminum inner fenders that were dzus'd on, I believe that's what BondoBob just had done to his DartSport.
Posted By: Super Scamp
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 07:20 PM
No inners here. Just got the headrers out of powder coat and looking good. new pics soon when motor gets installed and the first of the year.
Posted By: @#$%&*!
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 08:06 PM
Quote:
Do you all think that with NO inner fenders it lets a lot more air in going down the track? ...
I think the air comes in from the front and taking out the inner fenders lets it exit at the sides, which may not be the best at speed but it should reduce under hood pressure. I like to go to the top-end and watch the plastic cars come by. Some take on very funny shapes at speed.
Posted By: WILD BILL
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 08:14 PM
Quote:
wish i could download pics of mine
just cant seam to find out how
2 Options,
A) go to the archives and read the post I did on resizing and posting pics
B) I can PM you my number and walk you through it.
Posted By: HEMIFRED
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 08:40 PM
Quote:
If ity were me, I'd do what the old P/S cars did. They simply ran a piece of sheetmetal from the framerail to the fender with the edge bent-over so as to bolt the piece to the fender. Since they used coilovers, they simply notched the sheetmetal to accomodate the upper mount. This provided them with extra room (since there were no contours) yet kept air from getting caught in the engine bay as you're concerned with.If you look at many of the early 70s P/S mopars (Motown MIssile, Herb McCandless's Demon, etc.)they were done this way. Since these were factory cars, obviously someone, somewhere did the research to find & figure out it was necessary to isolate the engine bayand since you ARE talking speeds similiar to early P/S type cars, this fix seems applicable
here's an example of what most had back then thin .035 aluminum and Dzus fasteners
Posted By: BloFish
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 08:42 PM
Quote:For keeps?
BloFish, can i have your car?
Posted By: mafo
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 11:00 PM
Posted By: dennismopar73
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/19/10 11:48 PM
well may have to do that
i reposted my new car pics but they didnt attatch
so i dunno me dumb
thanks bill try to trdo the pics again later
and repost what my inners look like
not any diff than what im seeing tho
after all only so many ways to do them
thank you
i reposted my new car pics but they didnt attatch
so i dunno me dumb
thanks bill try to trdo the pics again later
and repost what my inners look like
not any diff than what im seeing tho
after all only so many ways to do them
thank you
Posted By: 67mprfan
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/20/10 01:02 AM
here mine 71 demon removable front clip
Posted By: sixpackgut
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/20/10 03:21 AM
Quote:Quote:For keeps?
BloFish, can i have your car?
if i lie to you and tell you that you will get it back will you let me borrow it? i would also like you to deliver it while your at it
Posted By: cudadon
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/20/10 02:40 PM
Quote:
I would think it lets more air in under the hood.
However, In your case I would suggest maybe adding more hood pins.
Can't really tell by the pic you posted but it looks like you may only be using 1 in each corner.
I have 10 Dusz fasteners on mine and it's nice a satble.
Bill it's a bolt on hood with stock hinges, stock latch in front. Maybe my hinges are loose? Don
Posted By: cudadon
Re: Guys with no inner fenders on stock type a-bodies? - 12/20/10 02:52 PM
Thanks hemicop. Thanks for the pic Fred, I may look into that. Don
