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I've changed to methanol(pro systems SV-1) picked up close to 2 tenths 12.5:1 CR.The only draw backs are hard starting in cold weather and a little more fuel system maintenance.I can purchase methanol locally for about $150.00/drum.So far I really like it.
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and also need to know what to do with all of this compression if I make the switch.
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I only have limited experience, so FWIW my opinion.
Typically in hot weather you can see 0.3 tenths in the 1/4 mile, so maybe .2 in the 1/8th mile. The torque improvement can show more improvement in the 1st half of the track.
In cold weather, the ET difference will be less. And in mineshaft air it might be too close to call. But people have reported different results in different combos.
I also am a firm believer that alcohol can make a car more consistant from less change with weather changes. But some gas combos are very consistant too.
If you go alcohol injection, give serious thought to a gas primer/idle system. This helps put/keep heat in the motor, easier cool weather starting, saves fuel, etc. Recommended, but not required !
and A+ for the primer plus gas system. It sure makes my life better. I'm with Ryan J. What do you mean? Alky loves compression. 
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and also need to know what to do with all of this compression if I make the switch.
? What do you mean?
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and also need to know what to do with all of this compression if I make the switch.
? What do you mean?
Just thought I was on the high side for going alky?
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and also need to know what to do with all of this compression if I make the switch.
? What do you mean?
Just thought I was on the high side for going alky?
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and also need to know what to do with all of this compression if I make the switch.
? What do you mean?
Just thought I was on the high side for going alky?
It's a high static #, but with wide LSA & alot of duration, I'm sure the cranking pressure & dynamic is'nt that radical.
Methanol is unusual stuff from my limited research on it, it has a really high RON # like in the low 130's, but a low MON # in low 100's. I just know alot of turbo cars especially 4 cyl stuff with really high boost (30+) are going to it. & if it lives in those apps, it will be more than fine in yours.
I'd start out on cheap M1 VP & then try their new M5 stuff... I talked to one guy @ track last fall who was running the M5 in his BB GM Dragster & was real happy with it. I've never tried it, but if I was running meth I certainly would. I'm injecting M1 into my turbo motor, M5 is not recommended for pre-compressor due to it's increased volitility...
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Well Brian, I don't have a bunch of info, but mine picked up .17 in the 1/4 (flying toilet). Not much to add about the throttle response. Unreal! I was running it like it was on gas the first couple times and it didn't like it. Starting bumping the temp up before staging, and found it likes right around 190-200*. My 1/8 picked up almost a .1
HTH, Beep
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and also need to know what to do with all of this compression if I make the switch.
? What do you mean?
Just thought I was on the high side for going alky?
It's a high static #, but with wide LSA & alot of duration, I'm sure the cranking pressure & dynamic is'nt that radical.
Methanol is unusual stuff from my limited research on it, it has a really high RON # like in the low 130's, but a low MON # in low 100's. I just know alot of turbo cars especially 4 cyl stuff with really high boost (30+) are going to it. & if it lives in those apps, it will be more than fine in yours.
I'd start out on cheap M1 VP & then try their new M5 stuff... I talked to one guy @ track last fall who was running the M5 in his BB GM Dragster & was real happy with it. I've never tried it, but if I was running meth I certainly would. I'm injecting M1 into my turbo motor, M5 is not recommended for pre-compressor due to it's increased volitility...
This is good to know Ryan. With the thought of changing to alky, does this change much of what we talked about doing to the engine last week?
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Not really other than if you did a Toilet/injection, the intake work is not as critical.... if you do carb Meth it "should" actually like the new intake even more...
Cam wise... it will still pick up about same no matter what the fuel, that's just a matter of ramp speed & some more duration. That's gonna help no matter what.
To be honest I think if you did injection with M5 on a 420 intake & lose 100 lbs you'll be where you need to be, without screwing with cam, so you could limit all your changes to external of motor. The added TQ the meth will put in will also really help cover up that glide lacking gear in the first 1/2 track.
Every dyno test I have ever done on Carbureted gas VS Carb meth, they always pick up 20-25 Ft lbs across board & usually about 20 HP. & I'm not using junk gas carbs to test against... it's just realistic gain to be expected if both carbs are good. I have not tested Gas VS injected methanol, (since it's a difficult thing to switch & test quickly) but everyone claims the TQ increase is even greater....
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Not really other than if you did a Toilet/injection, the intake work is not as critical.... if you do carb Meth it "should" actually like the new intake even more...
Cam wise... it will still pick up about same no matter what the fuel, that's just a matter of ramp speed & some more duration. That's gonna help no matter what.
To be honest I think if you did injection with M5 on a 420 intake & lose 100 lbs you'll be where you need to be, without screwing with cam, so you could limit all your changes to external of motor. The added TQ the meth will put in will also really help cover up that glide lacking gear in the first 1/2 track.
Every dyno test I have ever done on Carbureted gas VS Carb meth, they always pick up 20-25 Ft lbs across board & usually about 20 HP. & I'm not using junk gas carbs to test against... it's just realistic gain to be expected if both carbs are good. I have not tested Gas VS injected methanol, (since it's a difficult thing to switch & test quickly) but everyone claims the TQ increase is even greater....
I might think about doing the cam as well since it is a fairly small cost and I will be into the engine anyway. Still giving some thought to sending the engine to you to put on the dyno for before/after pulls.
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Not really other than if you did a Toilet/injection, the intake work is not as critical.... if you do carb Meth it "should" actually like the new intake even more...
Cam wise... it will still pick up about same no matter what the fuel, that's just a matter of ramp speed & some more duration. That's gonna help no matter what.
To be honest I think if you did injection with M5 on a 420 intake & lose 100 lbs you'll be where you need to be, without screwing with cam, so you could limit all your changes to external of motor. The added TQ the meth will put in will also really help cover up that glide lacking gear in the first 1/2 track.
Every dyno test I have ever done on Carbureted gas VS Carb meth, they always pick up 20-25 Ft lbs across board & usually about 20 HP. & I'm not using junk gas carbs to test against... it's just realistic gain to be expected if both carbs are good. I have not tested Gas VS injected methanol, (since it's a difficult thing to switch & test quickly) but everyone claims the TQ increase is even greater....
I might think about doing the cam as well since it is a fairly small cost and I will be into the engine anyway. Still giving some thought to sending the engine to you to put on the dyno for before/after pulls.
I'm all into cam regrinds, trust me, but I just remember looking @ valve relief depth on the spec sheet the other day.... I'd love to regrind cam too but... I really don't think you're gonna have room without fly cutting pistons.
I believe CP picked the depth on those reliefs based off of the free drop of the valves in the heads & the existing cam specs... now days I dictate the relief depths on Diamonds & usually make them overly generous for issues like this in future, but CP likes to run the piston to valve tight & go off of all known specs. Tighter piston to valve makes hair more power, & it allows you not to have so much dome if you don't have that extra relief depth volume to make up for.... So their are reasons they chose those relief depths but.... it's not gonna help when we want to put 8 degrees more ramp speed in it.
As long as you're kosher with cutting the pistons as well, then can do the cam grind.
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Not to argue with your advice Ryan but if I had to pay for M! or M5 I seriously doubt I'd run alky. One of the best things about Alky is that it's cheap! Many racers including me feel the VP meth is just a marketing ploy and money grab and do not buy it.
Quote:Yupp...Local farmers co-op here does that...
Car dealers buy a drum, add number 5 blue dye to it and that's what they use as windshield washer fluid. We've been running it for years with the same results and have been paying around $110 a barrel for the past 3 or so years.
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I paid $305 for a drum of M-5. That price will vary around the country. I got a price in the Dallas area for $275. People who run M-5 say its good for about .1-.15 over regular methanol. M-5 contains Nitro parrafin. The M-5s little pricey for me to run on a regular basis. The last drum of Methanol I bought here was about $150/drum. I paid $200 in Vegas.I know some racers who run some reclaimed methanol from the oil field who say its ok I think they paid around $110/drum. I'm leary of the reclaimed stuff.I'm certainly no alky expert though.
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I've changed to methanol(pro systems SV-1) picked up close to 2 tenths 12.5:1 CR.The only draw backs are hard starting in cold weather and a little more fuel system maintenance.I can purchase methanol locally for about $150.00/drum.So far I really like it.
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I've changed to methanol(pro systems SV-1) picked up close to 2 tenths 12.5:1 CR.The only draw backs are hard starting in cold weather and a little more fuel system maintenance.I can purchase methanol locally for about $150.00/drum.So far I really like it.
Are you using the vacuum referenced regulator with the SV1?
Quote:Good to get that across. You are looking for performance gain, not cost savings. I wanted cost savings 1st, improved ability to repeat/consitant dial-in (bracket racing), and reduced heat for round robin racing (3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th round), putting 5 rounds with 10 minutes between each.
Fuel cost isn't a concern though.
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What does that thing weigh?I would just spend the money and find you a better top end,cam,etc..mine runs 5.60's at 3100 pounds on Q-16..on mild tune..and 90 degree weather.but your talking pro stock top end with a highly modified 420 manifold.Your car runs real close to what my old 410 inch motor ran with old 16 degree heads,the best it would run was 9.20 with c-25..keep plugging away at it..
I could set you up with a good motor??
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There's nothing cost effective about any of this stuff....
about E85 me-self ... LOTS of good reports I have heard ...and some BIG POWER increases possible.
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If fuel cost is not a concern, stick with gas. If alky picks up a combo with a carb, 3 to 4 tenths, the set up was not even close to right.
Monte
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If fuel cost is not a concern, stick with gas. If alky picks up a combo with a carb, 3 to 4 tenths, the set up was not even close to right.
Monte
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If fuel cost is not a concern, stick with gas. If alky picks up a combo with a carb, 3 to 4 tenths, the set up was not even close to right.
Monte
Quote:Not really. A gas car can run just as cool as an alky car, most just don't do it. We don't even run a radiator in our drag radial car. We tow to the lanes, fire the car at 100*, burnout and pass, the car is 120-130 at the stripe. Now if a car with no radiator or water pump, only makes 20* on a run, you know one with a cooling system can. If you run the car at the same temp every run, it WILL be consistent, does not matter if that temp is 100 or 200. If you don't let it make a lot of heat during the run, a chiller will have it back to ice cold in a matter of minutes.Quote:
If fuel cost is not a concern, stick with gas. If alky picks up a combo with a carb, 3 to 4 tenths, the set up was not even close to right.
Monte
I agree with the above statement, but there are still advantages to going alky for those that run in alot of heat and it will be more consistant from round to round when there is limited cool down time.
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If fuel cost is not a concern, stick with gas. If alky picks up a combo with a carb, 3 to 4 tenths, the set up was not even close to right.
Monte
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I personally would rather have the gas and the chiller any day, as fool with the aggravation of the alky, but thats just me.
. Put alky in a drive back up for the final. That ain't gonna happen on gas...
Quote:I agree. When done properly, it is great for bracket racing, and saves money.
I have run both fuels and will tell you from a "bracket" racer standpoint alky is hard to beat.