Moparts
727 lasted 8 passes
Posted By: dragram440
727 lasted 8 passes - 09/10/10 02:46 PM
Finally got my car going and got 5 passes on it on a street legal night and it worked good, Brought it down for muscle car shootout and on the third run it started slipping on the launch. Brought it back checked the fluid looked good was down about half a pint so I filled it up gave it a easy run worked fine but I stomped on it on the return road and it started squelling. Brought it home pulled the pan and its full of shavings that look to be aluminum because they are not stuck to the magnet in the pan. Tranny guy says must be the converter. Pulled the tranny and drained the converter and the fluid out of it was really clean no shavings at all. The fluid doesnt smell burnt at all. Its a brand new coan 8" with a super sprag, I am going to send it in to have it checked out and cleaned and have the tranny checked out. The shavings in the pan are very shiny. Does this sound like the converter?
Posted By: Genuinejed
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/10/10 03:04 PM
Doesn't sound like converter to me, especially if the fluid from the converter is clean. What valve body are you running? I suspect something in the low/reverse drum or sprag? Slipping in low would have to be rear band, sprag, direct clutch.... Good luck!
Posted By: dragram440
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/10/10 03:28 PM
The valve body is a turbo action reverse manual. When I went to load it on the trailerr to go home reverse wouldnt work so I towed it backward then drove it on, Got home reverse worked backed it of the trailer put it in the garage and ran it on the jack and all gears seemed to work including reverse. I dont think It is the converter either. So should I still send the converter in to have it cleaned out or does the tranny filter catch all the shaving?
Posted By: dragram440
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/10/10 03:30 PM
My tranny guy said there is nothing in the tranny that would come apart that woudnt stick to the magnet in the pan. I dont know much about tranny's
Posted By: ademon
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/10/10 03:39 PM
Isn't the case itself aluminum? i don't think your trans guy is right what in the converter is aluminum ?
Posted By: SD800
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/10/10 03:46 PM
I had a 727 that I put over $2000.00 into, It lasted about 8 passes, It was full of metal shaving. had a brand new turbo action trans brake in it, it was leaking internally. Cost me another $500.0 to have the tranny fixed and Turbo ation replaced the valve body.
I now run powerglides in my race cars.
Posted By: dragram440
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/10/10 03:46 PM
Is the sprag in the converter aluminum. He thought it might be the sprag in the converter.
You said yourself that it was slipping and whining. Doesn't sound like converter, but...????.
Posted By: dragram440
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/10/10 04:14 PM
will a basically stock 727 hold up to around 650 hp or do I need to completly upgrade.It has a turbo action valve body and the tranny guy said he put a 5.0 shift lever or arm in it. and a tci rebuild kit, whatever that consists of.
Posted By: 440Jim
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/10/10 04:31 PM
It doesn't take much for a 727 to hold a 650 hp motor (typical), but basically stock is marginal.
The only real way to know is pull the transmission apart. My guess is something in the trans, but converters can break in strage ways with various results. If you had lots of metal in the pan, having the converter cut open and cleaned/inspected is insurance. Same with the cooler and lines (flush).
The planetary bodies in the trans are aluminum. The servos are aluminum, the valve body is aluminum, etc.
Posted By: 52savoy
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/10/10 04:35 PM
Time to start building your own. They aren't that complicated and at least you know what you've got.
Many books are available to get you started.."HP Books 727" for one.
http://www.amazon.com/Books-HP1399-Torqueflite-272-Transmission/dp/B000PI5QPQ
Posted By: 67dodge67
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/10/10 04:43 PM
Quote:
will a basically stock 727 hold up to around 650 hp or do I need to completly upgrade.It has a turbo action valve body and the tranny guy said he put a 5.0 shift lever or arm in it. and a tci rebuild kit, whatever that consists of.
Give John Cope a call at CRT (Cope Racing Trans). He's a member on here too. I may not have one of his top-notch 727's built by him, but I have A LOT of his top-notch advice, input, and parts in my 727. 
Posted By: Cab_Burge
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/10/10 05:27 PM
I had the same thing happen recently, the thrust bearing in the converter broke and ate up the sprague, it ruined the converter beyond repair
send yours in now
I thought it was the trans also
I ended up taking the trans apart and treid cleaning it up some before putting it back together, it is now acting up going into reverse so I will have to clean the reverse servo and the valve body, which I didn't do to start with
Don't forget to flush the cooler if you run one
The aluminum from the converter went everywhere and was in all the passages
Posted By: We The People
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/10/10 05:29 PM
I agree with building your own...I've done one 727 for a friend in a street driven coronet, that seems to work well. and built my own 727, its stood up to 650hp, with a good hand full of A&A parts... only 12 runs so far we'll see how I did this spring.
I bought the "#1205 Chrysler 727 Technical Video"
1-800-785-2604. its pretty old now but I liked it, good clear directions and good video. the guy in it is named Paul Zank. if you can build an engine, measure clearances, and follow directions it aint too bad.
Posted By: @#$%&*!
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/10/10 05:55 PM
Quote:
... Brought it home pulled the pan and its full of shavings that look to be aluminum because they are not stuck to the magnet in the pan....
You might have spun the sprag race in the case. Whatever the cause, you should pull it apart yourself, it's easy.
Posted By: racerx
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/11/10 04:01 AM
Quote:
Time to start building your own. They aren't that complicated and at least you know what you've got.
Many books are available to get you started.."HP Books 727" for one.
http://www.amazon.com/Books-HP1399-Torqueflite-272-Transmission/dp/B000PI5QPQ
Good INFO IN THERE..very helpful along with part form A&A i have a few trans under my Belt 
Posted By: dragram440
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/11/10 02:31 PM
I have built a few engines and I built the whole car in one winter so I dont think I am dumb but just havent ever done a auto trans and really dont know much about them. I do have all winter now to do it if I wanted.
Posted By: MR_P_BODY
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/11/10 02:54 PM
Quote:
I have built a few engines and I built the whole car in one winter so I dont think I am dumb but just havent ever done a auto trans and really dont know much about them. I do have all winter now to do it if I wanted.
I'm like you I build most everything but I'm not big
on the trans... yes I have been in them but I always
had buddies that worked in the trans lab at Chrysler
so I let them do it... while I watched... a case of
beer inst bad but now I want to pull it and check it
out over the winter
Posted By: dartman366
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/11/10 02:56 PM
Quote:
I have built a few engines and I built the whole car in one winter so I dont think I am dumb but just havent ever done a auto trans and really dont know much about them. I do have all winter now to do it if I wanted.
they really aren't bad to work on, I started doing my own a few years ago after a local tranny shop screwed me over on a 904 race tranny they supposedly built up for me.. long story short is buy the book's and get an old core tranny from the junk yard and tear into it and pay attention to the details,,you should be fine.
Posted By: Cab_Burge
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/11/10 05:23 PM
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:long story short is buy the book's and get an old core tranny from the junk yard and tear into it and pay attention to the details,,you should be fine.
I have done them myself and I do have Dave Smith at Pro Trans (661-940-7400) do mine now, sometimes it pays to have a pro do them
Posted By: Bigbeep
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/11/10 09:21 PM
Quote:
My tranny guy said there is nothing in the tranny that would come apart that woudnt stick to the magnet in the pan. I dont know much about tranny's
No one else said it, so I will. You need a new tranny man.
I would suggest as others have. Get the books, a core trans, and a clean bench. Go slow and pay attention to detail. They are not difficult at all. If you like building engines, you will probably enjoy building transmissions.
Posted By: dOc !
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/11/10 09:27 PM
Quote:
You need a new tranny man.
Mega DITTOS to that
Posted By: dartman366
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/12/10 12:14 AM
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My tranny guy said there is nothing in the tranny that would come apart that woudnt stick to the magnet in the pan. I dont know much about tranny's
If you like building engines, you will probably enjoy building transmissions.
but your tranny guy is flatly wrong, there are other materials other than ferrous metals in a transmission. 
Posted By: polkat
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/12/10 05:15 AM
Get Carl Munroe's Torqueflight book. It is excellent! Between that book, and some excellent advice from a few members here, I've learned that automatic transmissions are NOT the black magic that many back yard mechanics think they are. I've rebuilt 3 727's since I joined Moparts, all of them quite successful. Doesn't take too long to learn enough to do it yourself and not only save bucks, but do the work it really needs!
Posted By: J_BODY
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 09/12/10 05:37 AM
http://www.lofgrenauto.com/While I have no doubt that CRT could hook you up with a top notch trans.... this one is driving distance from you. Chuck builds a dang good torqueflight.
Posted By: dragram440
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 11/29/10 06:25 PM
Well I finally got my tranny back to the tranny guy and he said it broke the rear bolt in sprag and wrecked the case. He said it could possibly be from driver error even though I drove the car just as he told me to.
Posted By: 71440dart
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 11/29/10 07:20 PM
Quote:
Well I finally got my tranny back to the tranny guy and he said it broke the rear bolt in sprag and wrecked the case. He said it could possibly be from driver error even though I drove the car just as he told me to.
i had the same thing happen with that valve body, mine was from driver error, but i didnt tear up the case, it did tear up the bolt in sprag, i thought thats what the bolt in sprag was for, to save the case?
Posted By: JohnRR
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 11/29/10 07:39 PM
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Well I finally got my tranny back to the tranny guy and he said it broke the rear bolt in sprag and wrecked the case. He said it could possibly be from driver error even though I drove the car just as he told me to.
i had the same thing happen with that valve body, mine was from driver error, but i didnt tear up the case, it did tear up the bolt in sprag, i thought thats what the bolt in sprag was for, to save the case?
No, the bolt in sprag is to REPAIR a case that has had the outer race spin but not enough to ruin the case. Unless you buy the A+A or Coan Super/Ultimate sprags, they have more rollers and make it virtually impossible to have a sprag failure, you can still lay the rollers over in a bolt in. All the bolts do is stop the outer race from spinning in the case.
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 11/29/10 07:47 PM
Quote:
will a basically stock 727 hold up to around 650 hp or do I need to completly upgrade.It has a turbo action valve body and the tranny guy said he put a 5.0 shift lever or arm in it. and a tci rebuild kit, whatever that consists of.
Sorry to hear this although I`m hearing it more often. My trans guy is one of the best ANYWHERE and for $680.00(my price) he rebuilt mine 7 years ago and rollerized it and put in a bolt in sprag. Don`t know what your problem is and not exactly sure of my hp in terms of durability but a basic build SHOULD live if the builder knows what the hell he`s doing.
Posted By: Mike Swann
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 11/29/10 08:45 PM
9 out of 10 Coan converters require a bell housing spacer. Did you install one if required?
Posted By: dragram440
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 11/29/10 09:23 PM
No spacers in it. It looked to me you only needed them if you were running a mid plate or if the converter was to far back. Would that cause the rear sprag to go south.
Posted By: fishy340
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 11/29/10 11:11 PM
turbo action valve body? thats the problem my friend just went through that w his 727
Posted By: 572stealth
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 11/30/10 01:08 AM
What's your burnout procedure?
Posted By: The Shadow
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 11/30/10 02:23 AM
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Well I finally got my tranny back to the tranny guy and he said it broke the rear bolt in sprag and wrecked the case. He said it could possibly be from driver error even though I drove the car just as he told me to.
i had the same thing happen with that valve body, mine was from driver error, but i didnt tear up the case, it did tear up the bolt in sprag, i thought thats what the bolt in sprag was for, to save the case?
No, the bolt in sprag is to REPAIR a case that has had the outer race spin but not enough to ruin the case. Unless you buy the A+A or Coan Super/Ultimate sprags, they have more rollers and make it virtually impossible to have a sprag failure, you can still lay the rollers over in a bolt in. All the bolts do is stop the outer race from spinning in the case.
The case can still get broken with a bolt in sprag. The rollers can get jammed so hard that they spread the outer race of the sprag, expand it and crack the case. Don't ask me how I know 
Posted By: CHAPPER
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 11/30/10 03:02 AM
Quote:
Well I finally got my tranny back to the tranny guy and he said it broke the rear bolt in sprag and wrecked the case. He said it could possibly be from driver error even though I drove the car just as he told me to.
Just what "error" is he referring to?? 
Posted By: Labratt
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 11/30/10 03:25 AM
Posted By: '72CudaRacer
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 11/30/10 03:43 AM
I build my own 727's, but not too often. The one in the car now was run for 2 years, freshened up and then sat for 13 years before I disassemblled it, checked every thing and reassembled it (only new parts on the freshen up were seals, and clutches). The transmission was then installed and I have run it for 3 seasons (300 plus passes per season). It will be freshened up this winter. My car car is a foot brake car that leaves with the front tires in the air every pass. 60' 1.37, 1/8 6.53/105, 1/4 10.38/127.
Don't let anyone tell you that a Turbo Action RMVB won't work, I've had mine for 25 years. The convertor is a Turbo Action 17509J. It has been repaired 3 times in 10 racing seasons.
I agree with others, you need a new trans guy. That guy can be you.
Brian Dunnigan
Too bad you are that far away. Curtis SR. who runs Turbo Torque out of Brooklyn, NY builds some of the simplest and reliable 904's and 27's on the market. His transmissions hang out in the 600-800 HP range with no sweat.
He has tricks and knowledge that even Chrysler has faulted on.
In the case,(917) 602-4239 Curtis Sr. 65 years old and still cranking them out.
Posted By: FastmOp
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 11/30/10 04:51 AM
I agree on doing it your self. I built mine several years ago. Get a book and a Mancini overhaul kit and have at it, it's not that bad.
Not sure if I'm qualified to post in this forum............haven't raced in a few years.
But, I have rebuilt a 727 lately and I also recommend doing it yourself. The only "special tools" you'll need is an inch-pounds torque wrench, some snap-ring pliers, dial-indicator & stand/clamp, feeler gauges and a makeshift workbench with a hole in it to load the tailshaft/low-rev drum into the case.
The recommended book by Munro and a FSM will cover nearly every question stock or modified.
What isn't clear you can ask about it here.
The 727/904 is a VERY basic planetary-style transmission.
Posted By: dragram440
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 11/30/10 03:02 PM
All 8 passes I drove the car the same and here is my procedure.
Warm car up good. Start burnout in secound gear rev up to about 6000-6500 til they start to smoke slowely let off brake and spin the tires until they sqeak a little. Put tranny in neutral rev up once or twice to be sure engine is not loaded up. Put in 1st pull up to the staging lights. Get the bulbs lit up. Pull the rpms up to 1300-1500 on brakes that dont hold very good. roll onto gas fastly so car isnt launching to hard. The last pass when the tranny broke I didnt roll on it I stomped on it harder. shift from 1-2nd @ 6500 and 2-3 @ 6500 and go through the end @ 6500-6600. Let off the gas leave it in 3rd coast to the return road pull it into secound befor I turn in drive back in secound to the pits. ?????????????
See any error there?
Posted By: dartman366
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 11/30/10 03:57 PM
Quote:
All 8 passes I drove the car the same and here is my procedure.
Warm car up good. Start burnout in secound gear rev up to about 6000-6500 til they start to smoke slowely let off brake and spin the tires until they sqeak a little. Put tranny in neutral rev up once or twice to be sure engine is not loaded up. Put in 1st pull up to the staging lights. Get the bulbs lit up. Pull the rpms up to 1300-1500 on brakes that dont hold very good. roll onto gas fastly so car isnt launching to hard. The last pass when the tranny broke I didnt roll on it I stomped on it harder. shift from 1-2nd @ 6500 and 2-3 @ 6500 and go through the end @ 6500-6600. Let off the gas leave it in 3rd coast to the return road pull it into secound befor I turn in drive back in secound to the pits. ?????????????
See any error there?
only thing I do different is to start my burnout in second and go right to high as soon as the tires get spinning good,,,other than that..... but I also run a 904, but the procedure is the same, I don't believe you did anything wrong,and your tranny guy may not of done anything wrong,,,just one of those unfortunate deal's,,,,I started doing my own after my tranny guy started to let one of his apes start doing mine and they went down hill from there,, 35 passes on a fresh build and toast in the middle of elimination's at Norwalk was the last straw. 
Posted By: lowbudget
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 11/30/10 04:15 PM
So just to clairify, you do not shift from second to third when doing a burnout?
Posted By: dragram440
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 11/30/10 04:50 PM
I just leave it in secound on my burnout. Is it better to shift to 3rd?
Posted By: dartman366
Re: 727 lasted 8 passes - 11/30/10 06:33 PM
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I just leave it in secound on my burnout. Is it better to shift to 3rd?
I don't know if it's better on the trans or not(the tranny guru's can answer that), but I have always clicked third gear and every body I have been associated with does it that way, I even think it is in the Turbo Action instruction's to do it that way,wheel speed is the main reason with out excessive engine rpm, I have even seen some guy's start out in high gear.
