Moparts
SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way..............
Posted By: Ron Silva
SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/25/09 07:23 PM
Well, a lot of Guys are asking about this so I thought I would show the specs of my Engine build. My last engine was kind of extreme and I did all the research networking and design by myself, so it was such a pleasure to do this one with RYAN J. He knows so much right off the top of his head it is amazing and we do think alike in many respects. I told him my objectives and he is helping me get there and he is NOT trying to manipulate or change that in any way. A huge asset in my opinion. RYAN is supplying the machine work and most of the parts and is setting up the heads and porting the intake etc. He is also going to do some mock-up to verify a few things and then ship me all the parts in a crate. One thing that planted the seeds for this engine was when I talked to Russ from Indy at MATS. I found out they had a 48 deg option for the 360-1 heads and that I could run a hydraulic roller. I will do all the final assymbly paint etc....
My objectives with this motor are :
Have fun building it.
Have something different and unique but simple.
Run 10.00 in Silvaliant in the summer heat.
Dead reliable valvetrain / low maintinance.
Reasonable driveability for the street.
Mopar R3 48 deg tall deck siamese block.
Bore 4.21, MAX CNC lightened by Ryan
Bryant max lightened 4.500 stroke crank. 340 mains chevy 2.00 pins.
R&R 4340 billet A-Beam connecting rods 6.300 X 2" X .866 small end. Super high end 3/8 bolts.
Indy 360-1 245RP CNC heads w/48deg option and finish ported VV job and assy by Ryan. 1.60 X 2.15 vvs. 360-3 Intake manfold ported by Ryan. T&D Rockers 1.70 ratio.
Custom CP Pistons Mirror dish 11:1 comp, X-Style strutted skirt design forging, lateral gas ports, max lighten pkg.
Custom Bullet Hydraulic Roller steel billet 48 deg cam.
Intake: 264 @ .050", 180 @ .200", .385" lobe, .654" lift with 1.70 Rocker
Exhaust: 268 @ .050", 179 @ .200", .365" lobe, .620" lift with 1.70 Rocker
109 LSA installed @ 105.
I have no idea on HP. But the car has run 11.08 with the 406 crate that is rated at 435 HP. So I am thinking I will make my goal. This car is 200 pounds lighter than my Demon was too, so I will not need as much power. Believe it or not that cam spec above is bigger than the solid roller I had in the demon.
Posted By: LAR_414
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/25/09 07:31 PM
Woah!
Posted By: RemCharger
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/25/09 08:25 PM
Awesome project!
I wonder how long till it gets a bit more cam *cough, cough* ?
Posted By: Hot 340
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/25/09 08:37 PM
Ron, wouldnt going to a bigger main diameter give you a little more overlap with the crank? NOt sure if thats a possibility, not sure if the r3's caps would allow much more to make it worthwhile. Betcha it's alot faster than 10.00
.. btw, how are those r3's from indy? Need alot of correcting or no?
Posted By: PUNK
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/25/09 08:53 PM
I think the journal overlap was a variable that was thought about, so they simply let Sonny Bryant Crankshafts make the call. Sounds like they felt it was a non-issue for this application.
I thought they were going to go 1.88 Rod journal, but maybe that was pushing it abit too far.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/25/09 08:57 PM
Quote:
Ron, wouldnt going to a bigger main diameter give you a little more overlap with the crank? NOt sure if thats a possibility, not sure if the r3's caps would allow much more to make it worthwhile. Betcha it's alot faster than 10.00 .. btw, how are those r3's from indy? Need alot of correcting or no?
I don't think crank strength will be a problem. I offered to pay extra for a 300M billet and also to leave the center counterweights on. Bryant declined to do either. Said it will not be an issue for this engine.
Are you talking about the 48Deg option? They leave about 1/2" more material/metal on the Intake side of the head and then it is like a W-Seires 48 deg Mopar head at that point. As a side note: This actually corrects problems with the intake manifold fitting/port alignment with the RP version of the 360-1 heads.
Posted By: B3422W5
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/25/09 09:00 PM
Posted By: Hot 340
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/25/09 09:03 PM
Quote:
Are you talking about the 48Deg option? They leave about 1/2" more material/metal on the Intake side of the head and then it is like a W-Seires 48 deg Mopar head at that point. As a side note: This actually corrects problems with the intake manifold fitting/port alignment with the RP version of the 360-1 heads.
I was talking about the r3 blocks that were coming from Indy..it's my understanding that they were machining them there now..
Posted By: Chris2581
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/25/09 09:06 PM
I think you'll go faster than 10.00...
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/25/09 09:14 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Are you talking about the 48Deg option? They leave about 1/2" more material/metal on the Intake side of the head and then it is like a W-Seires 48 deg Mopar head at that point. As a side note: This actually corrects problems with the intake manifold fitting/port alignment with the RP version of the 360-1 heads.
I was talking about the r3 blocks that were coming from Indy..it's my understanding that they were machining them there now..
You would have to ask Ryan. I know he is going to line hone the mains regardless to get the main clearance right and paralell deck it to bluprint the deck height (allowed us to order all the parts without having the block) and surface finish, and he is going to take about 40-45 pounds out of it with the CNC. Plus bore and deckplate hone to 4.21.
Posted By: 68Fastback
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/25/09 09:28 PM
So at 501 has anyone built one this big besides your 474.
Posted By: Triple Threat
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/25/09 09:31 PM
Killer, A 500 + inch small block mopar street car that will run hard. You sir are my hero.
Please keep the updates coming as the build progresses.
Posted By: FASTFISH420
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/25/09 09:35 PM
Do you still have the Demon??
I love the valiants and yours is killer looking
Posted By: mshred
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/25/09 10:00 PM
That sounds like one KILLER setup man! i think you'll be in the 10's easy with that light valiant, maybe even faster! Have fun with it!
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/25/09 10:03 PM
Good luck w/that Ron and like everything else you put together, it will haul a$$ and look great doing it!
Posted By: G_bob
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/25/09 10:05 PM
Quote:
Good luck w/that Ron and like everything else you put together, it will haul a$$ and look great doing it!
That, is the understatement of the year.
Posted By: gregsdart
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/25/09 10:18 PM
Good luck with this project. Sounds like it will be a real stump puller! How good do those heads flow? Looking for 650 or more HP?
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/25/09 11:24 PM
Quote:
So at 501 has anyone built one this big besides your 474.
Ryan said it is the biggest he has heard of. But a while back a Guy posted on here that he had 4.500 or something like 4.540 stroke and everybody kind of blew him off. I believed him soley based on my experiend with my 474.
Right now with this engine we are at the limits as to what is possibe considering things like rod length to get the piston to clear the counterweights at BDC, and piston length to keep the piston from hitting counterweights AND from coming out of the bore at BDC. He even went with a smaller wrist pin so we could have 3 rings on the piston and keep the wrist pin from going THROUGH the oil ring groove and still have a rod this long.
Posted By: Moparnut426
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/25/09 11:31 PM
I wanna see the rods, and crank, Ill bet they are PIRTY!!!
Posted By: 65signet
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/25/09 11:37 PM
Thats sound awesome keep us updated, love those small blocks
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/26/09 12:09 AM
Quote:
I wanna see the rods, and crank, Ill bet they are PIRTY!!!
here is the Rods. Scroll down and there is a better picture.
R&R Pro A-Beam Connecting Rod and it will have a CUSTOM AGE 625 PLUS SuperAlloy 3/8" bolt.
http://www.rrconnectingrods.com/steelrods.htm
Posted By: J_BODY
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/26/09 12:26 AM
Hmmmm..... I swore Ryan specialized in small blocks
.
Definately keep us up with the tech side of things Ron. Always interesting to see one of your builds.
Posted By: 9 Sec Phill
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/26/09 12:53 AM
I think your going to have to add a few bars to the valiant Ron.
Your vehicles make me all warm and fuzzy inside.
.....Phill
Posted By: B1Fish540
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/26/09 03:46 AM
i would never have thought it possible to go that big in a small block. You said it had a tall deck...how much taller is it than a stock block? anyhow, thats an amazing motor you have!! I would be tempted to put 273 valve covers and air cleaner on it and drive it down to the cruise with 3 inch flowmasters or something..hehe
Posted By: RobX4406
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/26/09 03:59 AM
I'm thinking speedworld might have an issue with you... AGAIN!
Sounds like a killer.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/26/09 05:10 AM
Quote:
I'm thinking speedworld might have an issue with you... AGAIN!
Sounds like a killer.
Yes, my best uncorrected time in the Demon was at Speedword. And, NO they did not like it.
The deck height is stock. 9.56" It's just not a short deck like some of the others.
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/26/09 01:23 PM
I don't think it will need any more cam to run the #'s Ron wants. It's not a race motor... I did'nt really want to do the 1.7's, was going to do 1.65's but it's tough to get decent lift with hyd roller lobes. Also the more RR will help pull pushrods back closer to pivot point to help out with pushrod clearance, although in this case it really does'nt matter with 48 option on heads & Ron wants the pushrod area of heads fully opened up for weight reasons.
Talking with Joe @ Bryant, with the low RPM of the hyd roller cam & the low(er) power level around 650 he felt journal overlap would'nt be an issue. Crank will be neat, it's getting every option Bryant offers for lightening, largest rifle drill they offer on the 340 main, Star flange, Aero Wing counterweights etc.
Pistons will be 1.01" CH, & even with the .866 pin it still has to have oil rail spacers, because the dish is pushing the rings down. Compression is little up in the air, will be somewhere between 11.0-11.2:1 Depending on what CP gets out of the dish, Ed thinks a -22 will be biggest possible just doing some rough math on it. He said for sure they can get -20, so will be somewhere between -20 & -22 & then I can manipulate chamber volume some to try to get it where we need. Should be LIGHT... Doing Forged Side reliefs & max lightening package. Doing a Trend H13 tool steel pin....
Total seal is making me a custom 4.21" .043/.043/3MM ring pack
We wanted to do Titanium rods, but alot of companies who used to offer them have stopped doing them due to material costs etc. Crower could do them but time frame was no good..... Was going to do a 300M Lentz, but they did'nt want to do a single set in the 2.0" Journal in a reasonable timeframe. If we did 2 sets, would have been quicker... So Ended up going with R&R out of Illinois, all their rods are custom billets, they don't really do off shelf stuff. Mike, the owner was real easy to deal with, & is doing a 6.30" X 2.0" X .866 with 3/8 ARP Custom Age 365 bolt, in an A beam design, he said it should end up in the 540-560 gram range, which is what we were looking for. Also he is going to make the big end as compact as possible as Ron wants to use an internal oil pickup tube, which should be entertaining.
The Heads will be the 48 degree -1 INDY's with the Raised Port 245 CNC intake, & Small CNC exhaust port. I'll re-work the intake ports for little more cross section, should flow in the 360 range with the 2.15 valve. Ron wants heads & INDY intake max lightened, so will spend "few" hours on Bridgeport wacking misc bosses off.
I started working on intake yesterday & getting enough plenum volume in it while retaining a 4150 flange is an issue.
It's definitely an interesting project.... & I've gotten used to telling companies I'm talking to about parts for it "I know it's extremely unusual, but that's what I want" LOL
Posted By: B1KILLER
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 08/26/09 01:50 PM
NICE
Posted By: ScottSmith_Harms
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/26/09 02:30 PM
That sure is a cool sounding combo you guys are building!
Posted By: Streetwize
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/26/09 10:38 PM
What's the height of a Tall deck R3?
Ryan said a 6.300 rod and a 1.01 CH with 1/2 of a 4.5 stroke comes up to 9.56"...~ Standard 'blueprint' mopar height.
i was thinking the tall deck was 9.8 or so...no?
I'm just asking....Are you going BIG for the sake of going BIG, I think with a 1.4 rod ratio and nearly 4900 fps of piston speed at 6500 I don't know if the VE would be as good as the same rod with maybe a 4.25 stroke spun a teeny bit higher.
David Vizard made a 440 cube SBC several years ago fir Super Stock Magazine....it didn't really live up to its "on Paper" potential...I happen to know both David and the guy who bought the motor. Don't get me wrong, it runs great now but maybe not in terms of HP per cube. Of course a Mopar should be better on general principal!!
I think the specs are dead on but I'd try to get at least 270cc of intake port on it....what will be the final port cross section, I figure you'd want about 3.25 sq inches?
Cool project...It'll be a milestone small block (V10 Viper size V8) for sure!!
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/26/09 11:26 PM
Quote:
What's the height of a Tall deck R3?
Ryan said a 6.300 rod and a 1.01 CH with 1/2 of a 4.5 stroke comes up to 9.56"...~ Standard 'blueprint' mopar height.
i was thinking the tall deck was 9.8 or so...no?
I'm just asking....Are you going BIG for the sake of going BIG, I think with a 1.4 rod ratio and nearly 4900 fps of piston speed at 6500 I don't know if the VE would be as good as the same rod with maybe a 4.25 stroke spun a teeny bit higher.
David Vizard made a 440 cube SBC several years ago fir Super Stock Magazine....it didn't really live up to its "on Paper" potential...I happen to know both David and the guy who bought the motor. Don't get me wrong, it runs great now but maybe not in terms of HP per cube. Of course a Mopar should be better on general principal!!
I think the specs are dead on but I'd try to get at least 270cc of intake port on it....what will be the final port cross section, I figure you'd want about 3.25 sq inches?
Cool project...It'll be a milestone small block (V10 Viper size V8) for sure!!
R3 tall deck "blueprint" deck height is 9.560". Factory 340/360 etc "blueprint" is 9.60"
This is worst RS ratio motor I've ever worked on. Previous champ was a 4.0" crank with 5.7 rod. We've turned that one 7800 RPM, no problem.
Ron I think wants to go BIG to have a unique motor that anyone who ever sees his car will remember.... his car is a piece of artwork & should have a motor unique enough to match, besides it will have alot of TQ, & it will make it at a very street friendly RPM.
The intake port will be right around 262 CC based on other sets I've done like them. ~2.95" Min CSA.
A P/S Truck CFE (biggest SB Wedge head) W8 has 3.25" of CSA, not really possible to get that big of a port in an INDY head..
Posted By: bad360rt
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/26/09 11:44 PM
That's just wild, 500+ci smallblock, makes my 425 seem small
Good stuff
Posted By: Streetwize
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/27/09 12:05 AM
Ryan,
Thanks for the info! I was thinking a W8 might be the "optimum" head for that combo but the Indy should work just fine. The deck height confused me I didn't know if they made a tall deck stroker block or not....maybe they should with 4.5 cranks out there!
Sounds like a killer motor and the cam specs (also a Bullet HR) are what I run in my 517 with the Chapman max wedge head....to me it's been the perfect cam for a 500" motor (regardless of block size!!), nasty thump and wall to wall torque and pulls even faster way upstairs (mine has pulled 6800....real quick-like)
I'm sold on Bullet's grinds.
Can't wait till you fire that bad boy up and that A body post is what I was what I had in mind when I first conceived of this motor...I'm jealous!!
Posted By: RemCharger
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 08/27/09 12:10 AM
So you're sticking around the tens for the rollbar deal?
Thats a wild motor. The biggest I've seen was a 462 from alberta.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 08/27/09 12:29 AM
Yes, I only plan on running 10:00
W-Series Heads were out. I wanted a normal intake manifold with normal water routing, thermostat housing etc. Just bolt it on and go. I had to fabriacte many of the fittings AND the thermostat housing on my W-9 motor and I decided not to endure that again. Most of that stuff was not readily available when I built that motor.
Posted By: jyrki
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 08/27/09 06:06 AM
Just a thought, would using head spacers help? that way you could possibly use slightly taller pistons/rods as far as the top ring stays in the actual bore? When does cam clearance become a problem?
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 08/27/09 03:03 PM
Head spacers is a good idea. But Head spacers will add complexity and possible reliability issues, so I won't use them. Since we are milling the manifold for a custom fit anyways we could have done that I guess. But I think we will be fine with what we have. I want a simple, reliable, low maintinance Engine with some balls so I can run the number at the track. No power adder and nothing too exotic. Sure some of the parts we are using are considered exotic like the pistons and crank and rods, but thats because I want light weight stuff and I want the best quality I can get. The crank had to be a billet just from the fact that there are no forgings that could be used. I have no problem with a forging and I would use that 4.25 callies crank in one of my motors. But with this one I wanted to go BIG! When you open the hood you will see a normal small block in there with big block displacement and TQ. I am not as concerned about rod ratio and Ryan is. Someone just posted about building a 4.25 X 6" rod motor and that is about the same.
Cam clearance in a Mopar Small Block is not an issue.
Posted By: OldHippie
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 08/27/09 03:18 PM
Ron.....
What rear gear for this car?
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 08/27/09 03:35 PM
I put a 4.10 gears in it, because it was the most universal I could think of. The car has 28" tall tires now and does not look that bad, but will need taller tires with the new Motor. More traction and gear ratio. I set the car up to accept a 30" tall tire.
Posted By: Dragula
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 08/27/09 03:46 PM
That's just sick! I had no idea you could build that many cubes into a Mopar SB....Can't wait to see/hear it run.
Posted By: HotRodDave
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 08/28/09 03:32 AM
Are you going to have it dynoed before installing it?
Posted By: Comp Chassis 2
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 08/28/09 06:07 AM
That thing should be a MONSTER. And i thought the 408,s & 410,s were great combos.Pump gas and 10.00 is the way fly!
Posted By: LA360
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 08/28/09 06:28 AM
Mountain Motors usually have rod ratio's in the 1.4 range, lower in some cases.
Sounds like an interesting project Ron, I hope you have fun with it
AL....
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 08/28/09 09:04 PM
Quote:
Are you going to have it dynoed before installing it?
I would never rely on a Dyno to get my HP. I have only one way of doing it. Vehicle weight VS MPH. I have never dynoed an Engine and I probably never will.
Of course you might want to look at 60 ft to see if chassis efficiency is there etc. But that will not affect MPH much so you can pretty much use MPH. What I am saying is, in a properly set up car the MPH VS Weight will tell you.
I would only use a SINGLE dyno, to compare two engines, or to compare different mods on a single engine.
Posted By: 68Fastback
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 08/28/09 11:51 PM
Would you do anything different if a aluminum block was available.
Posted By: 512 VALIANT
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 08/29/09 01:13 AM
Ron I met you @ the MATS event and thought your valiant was VERY clean and VERY nicely done. Now you are doing this!?! It is probably one of the cleanest Valiants I have ever seen and now you have even more ammo under the hood. Great car!
Posted By: Dragula
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 08/29/09 01:38 AM
Soooo, 500 cube small block Mopar is possible, and yet, I have never heard of anyone building one! Had I known this years ago, the engine in my Cuda would probably be different. Visions of P5 Hemi heads and 500 cubes come to mind....
My only question after seeing this post is why has nobody ever built one before now? Why is this all of a sudden common knowledge, yet I have never heard or seen anything even close to that in a sbm before now.
Posted By: Brian Hafliger
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 08/29/09 01:55 AM
Quote:
Soooo, 500 cube small block Mopar is possible, and yet, I have never heard of anyone building one! Had I known this years ago, the engine in my Cuda would probably be different. Visions of P5 Hemi heads and 500 cubes come to mind....
My only question after seeing this post is why has nobody ever built one before now? Why is this all of a sudden common knowledge, yet I have never heard or seen anything even close to that in a sbm before now.
My answer is: just how much is this 500" sbm going to cost???? That might be why nobody has done it yet?
Compare that to a 500" BBM and you can quickly see why.
I have to say though, it should be one very neat and original build that's for sure. I'm excited to see what happens...too bad you won't stick it on our dyno Ron, that would be neat to get Dulcich down for a day of pics and a nice Mag spread.
I'm going for a completely different approach with my new engine...it's a 360" W2 headed R1 block deal with 48° lifter bores.
I too hope to go 10.00's but I'll be using race gas. Just thought it would be neat to do 10 oh's in a street-like car and no stroker so I know what it's like to go against the grain 
Plus I just don't have that much $$$ to spend on an engine build LOL!!
Keep us updated, we're going to want lots of pics 
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 08/29/09 01:56 AM
Quote:
Soooo, 500 cube small block Mopar is possible, and yet, I have never heard of anyone building one!
My only question after seeing this post is why has nobody ever built one before now? Why is this all of a sudden common knowledge, yet I have never heard or seen anything even close to that in a sbm before now.
Ron's old motor was 474 inches..... INDY sells a 471" Kit now off shelf....
All it takes is a big crankshaft. Most guys doing SB Mopars are not willing to spend the $ to be honest.
However, a 4.5" crank in a SB package will not really be a great "race motor" combo (it's too much stroke IMO) That's really why no one has done one.... It's unusual to spend this kind of $ on a motor that will not be a max effort deal.
The 4.25" crank would be as big as I'd go for a race motor that needs to turn RPM & make big power.
The journal overlap on this 4.5" will be scary with 2.0" rods.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 08/29/09 09:35 PM
Quote:
Would you do anything different if a aluminum block was available.
That is a good question. As many of you may know I was in a waiting for an aluminum Block. One that would accept all the production components. Basically a Aluminum R3. But, I have not even heard a peep out of anybody for ages. And I predict it is possible it will NEVER happen the way things are going. So I give up hope.
Yes, I probably would have gone with the callies 4.25 stroke forged Crank with all the lightweight machining and then maybe a solid roller to make up the power difference. But the rods would have been the same (except a .927 pin) and pretty much everything else. No CNC Block lightening would have been necessary (or wanted).
I am very weight conscious and have gone to great lengths to lighten the front of my car. So with this Motor I probably spent about $4000-5000 just to lighten the block (full CNC lighten program), crank, rods, pistons/Pins and he is even doing a bunch of milling on the heads AND Manifold for weight reduction. I think Ryan said the Crank might end up less than #40 pounds. I don't think the average person realizes how much weight reduction in the crank alone can be achieved. A 4.500" stroke crank for this engine without any weight reduction could weigh #70 pounds. That is 30 pounds and it is right in the front of the car and it will help with power slightly as well. There is a lot of "bad" weight in a crankshaft just riding around doing nothing. But I think the Callies 4.25" Crank stantard weight version costs around 1800 and my Crank is going to end up around 3500(balanced).
An aluminum Block probably would have saved me money in the long run. Or who knows I may have still gone for the Bryant Crank. But it would not have been as likely. Once we decided to do a billet the sky is the limit on stroke so we maxed it out. The cost is pretty much the same not matter what the stroke.
Posted By: Bad340fish
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 08/29/09 10:37 PM
Very cool build and a beautiful car as well.
What is journal overlap when talking crankshaft?
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 08/30/09 01:06 AM
Quote:
What is journal overlap when talking crankshaft?
Here you go:
http://victorylibrary.com/mopar/journal-c.htm
Posted By: sixpackgut
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 08/30/09 02:22 AM
i feel cubicly challenged
Posted By: wegner426
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 09/01/09 02:38 AM
Car looks great Ron!
Posted By: 65signet
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/02/09 01:08 AM
How much does that valiant weigh and what are you doing for a radiator and fan.
Thanks
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/02/09 03:59 AM
The Valiant weighs 2900 pounds without me in it and with the 406 iron headed crate motor. This new 501 engine should take at least 50 more pounds out of the car and from the front.
The radiator I have is from Ron Davis and is basically a standard radiator out of his catalog. But I ordered it with a STRAIGHT botom outlet. I am using a 20" engine driven HP flex fan from Permacool. They pull a lot of air. The shroud is off a ford Fairmont or Granada.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/02/09 04:00 AM
onemore
Posted By: 65signet
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/02/09 08:22 PM
Will you go to an electric fan with the new motor?
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/02/09 08:32 PM
Quote:
Will you go to an electric fan with the new motor?
No. Nothing in my cooling system will change except I will be running a Edelbrock water pump. I know there is better stuff out now, but I have never been able to make an electric fan cool in the summer heat. I like to go to Del Taco in the summer and go through the drive through. Or, god forbid, I go some some rounds in a race in the summer time.
Posted By: B3422W5
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/02/09 08:37 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Soooo, 500 cube small block Mopar is possible, and yet, I have never heard of anyone building one!
My only question after seeing this post is why has nobody ever built one before now? Why is this all of a sudden common knowledge, yet I have never heard or seen anything even close to that in a sbm before now.
Ron's old motor was 474 inches..... INDY sells a 471" Kit now off shelf....
All it takes is a big crankshaft. Most guys doing SB Mopars are not willing to spend the $ to be honest.
However, a 4.5" crank in a SB package will not really be a great "race motor" combo (it's too much stroke IMO) That's really why no one has done one.... It's unusual to spend this kind of $ on a motor that will not be a max effort deal.
The 4.25" crank would be as big as I'd go for a race motor that needs to turn RPM & make big power.
The journal overlap on this 4.5" will be scary with 2.0" rods.
Good points...
I know of a guy who went from roughly 400 inch smallblock to 450 inch smallblock, and because of the heads(230 indy)he has seem very little gain in performance, the car is just harder to hook because of the 4.25 inch crank instead of the 3.79 and 4 inch stuff he used to run.
The 500 inch smallblock is a cool deal, and as a "one off" piece its mighty intriging.
From a practical standpoint there are bunches of ways to get a smallblock to go 10 flat easily on pump gas with way less inches and cost, but Ron has the "cool factor" pretty much sewn up
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/02/09 11:08 PM
Ron's custom 48* INDY RP heads will be here Friday..... will be first set I've seen. I'll post some pics when I find time Saturday or Monday. Will be Racing Friday & Sunday. (hopefully)
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/02/09 11:33 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Soooo, 500 cube small block Mopar is possible, and yet, I have never heard of anyone building one!
My only question after seeing this post is why has nobody ever built one before now? Why is this all of a sudden common knowledge, yet I have never heard or seen anything even close to that in a sbm before now.
Ron's old motor was 474 inches..... INDY sells a 471" Kit now off shelf....
All it takes is a big crankshaft. Most guys doing SB Mopars are not willing to spend the $ to be honest.
However, a 4.5" crank in a SB package will not really be a great "race motor" combo (it's too much stroke IMO) That's really why no one has done one.... It's unusual to spend this kind of $ on a motor that will not be a max effort deal.
The 4.25" crank would be as big as I'd go for a race motor that needs to turn RPM & make big power.
The journal overlap on this 4.5" will be scary with 2.0" rods.
Good points...
I know of a guy who went from roughly 400 inch smallblock to 450 inch smallblock, and because of the heads(230 indy)he has seem very little gain in performance, the car is just harder to hook because of the 4.25 inch crank instead of the 3.79 and 4 inch stuff he used to run.
The 500 inch smallblock is a cool deal, and as a "one off" piece its mighty intriging.
From a practical standpoint there are bunches of ways to get a smallblock to go 10 flat easily on pump gas with way less inches and cost, but Ron has the "cool factor" pretty much sewn up
Even if a motor is head limited it will still build more torque with the added displacement. AND: if you can hook it up it will be faster. My car is going to have excellent weight bias so I think I can deal with the extra torque. I wanted a descent idle and to go 10.00 without straining. I may in fact go back to the 10" TA converter from the current ATI 8" when I put this motor in.
A good example was my 468 W-5 motor put out 435HP on the chassis dyno, but on that same pull it was 660 on tq and that was from the very bottom of the graph and heading down the whole way. In other words they could not measure the torque peak. It was too low. That motor drove bitchen on the street. It was like having a huge electric motor in the engine bay! LOL
Also, nobody said this motor was practical. I will admit it is not. I "did" research other motors before I called Ryan. I seriously thought about building an all aluminum 604 Big Block Wedge or even a HEMI. AND it probably would have cost about the same or even possible less. But I do not want to run 8's and if you do run a 10 flat and open the hood with that big HEMI in there, everybody will yawn. Of course you know even THIS motor could have had a much larger solid roller, big oil pan, vacuum pp, dominator carb and so on to make it even faster. I wanted something different and I wanted a simple unassuming look to the motor. Not sure if I will get that or not......
ALSO: If you do the math this crank is going to have NO OVERLAP. Unless I screwed up on my figures (in my head), this crank is going to be right at ZERO overlap 
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/02/09 11:40 PM
After lashing valves in my buddies Hemi Road Runner last night, you do NOT want a Hemi in that Valiant LOL I lashed valves on my Big Block this eve, I think it took about 1/4 the time it did on that Hemi. They are so big they are just a pain to work on.
Posted By: Dragula
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/02/09 11:47 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Soooo, 500 cube small block Mopar is possible, and yet, I have never heard of anyone building one!
My only question after seeing this post is why has nobody ever built one before now? Why is this all of a sudden common knowledge, yet I have never heard or seen anything even close to that in a sbm before now.
Ron's old motor was 474 inches..... INDY sells a 471" Kit now off shelf....
All it takes is a big crankshaft. Most guys doing SB Mopars are not willing to spend the $ to be honest.
However, a 4.5" crank in a SB package will not really be a great "race motor" combo (it's too much stroke IMO) That's really why no one has done one.... It's unusual to spend this kind of $ on a motor that will not be a max effort deal.
The 4.25" crank would be as big as I'd go for a race motor that needs to turn RPM & make big power.
The journal overlap on this 4.5" will be scary with 2.0" rods.
Good points...
I know of a guy who went from roughly 400 inch smallblock to 450 inch smallblock, and because of the heads(230 indy)he has seem very little gain in performance, the car is just harder to hook because of the 4.25 inch crank instead of the 3.79 and 4 inch stuff he used to run.
The 500 inch smallblock is a cool deal, and as a "one off" piece its mighty intriging.
From a practical standpoint there are bunches of ways to get a smallblock to go 10 flat easily on pump gas with way less inches and cost, but Ron has the "cool factor" pretty much sewn up
But what I don't understand is, 90% of us never knew this was possible. All the posts about how to get 600hp pump gas small block, and this 500 cube monster or the Indy 471 were never mentioned. I am still amazed its possible. And this post has been an education already.
If I were an engine builder, this would be an interesting area to grow the buisness if you could pull it off in a "kit" form at a better price, than a one time custom one. Its a shame because I just think its a little too late to get after market manufacturers excited about supporting it with products because I believe the market is shifting more toward the 3G hemi's now.
I certainly have a car that would hook it, and would have loved all the weight off the front.
The down side, other than cost, is the heads available probably won't make the hp this should be capable of. I will be real curious to see how this comes along, and I am already
Posted By: dizuster
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/02/09 11:55 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Are you going to have it dynoed before installing it?
I would never rely on a Dyno to get my HP. I have only one way of doing it. Vehicle weight VS MPH. I have never dynoed an Engine and I probably never will.
Of course you might want to look at 60 ft to see if chassis efficiency is there etc. But that will not affect MPH much so you can pretty much use MPH. What I am saying is, in a properly set up car the MPH VS Weight will tell you.
I would only use a SINGLE dyno, to compare two engines, or to compare different mods on a single engine.
So if the car is slow, how will you know if it's the motor, or the trans, or the chassis, exhaust, etc...
I agree, the proof is in the pudding with the ET/MPH.
But if the car isn't fast, it sure is nice to know it's not the because motor...
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/03/09 12:20 AM
The INDY 471 SB (they call it a 472) kit/complete bracket motor has been listed in their catalog since at least January 2008, as it is listed in my 1/08 Price sheet. It uses a Callies 4.25 crank, Eagle H beams & custom Diamonds @ 4.20 bore.
Some of this stuff you just have to look for....
Posted By: HotRodDave
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/03/09 04:27 AM
I think the reason no one has done it is because every one thinks if the motor won't turn 7500 rpm then it ain't right and there ain't no heads out ther to support a 500 inch small block at high rpms so no one builds them.
Personaly I like the idea of makeing 600 hp at a very low streetable RPM. Just a little bark but a big bite
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/03/09 12:40 PM
Quote:
I think the reason no one has done it is because every one thinks if the motor won't turn 7500 rpm then it ain't right
This was 4.25" crank SB @ 450 inches with same basic prepped INDY heads Ron will have, it's still making VG power @ 7600, I could have turned this one 7800 with no issues.
Posted By: LA360
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/03/09 01:09 PM
Quote:
I think the reason no one has done it is because every one thinks if the motor won't turn 7500 rpm then it ain't right and there ain't no heads out ther to support a 500 inch small block at high rpms so no one builds them.
There are some W series heads and P7's that would do it no problem.
AL....
Posted By: HotRodDave
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/03/09 04:31 PM
A 450 running 7600 RPM is about the same as a 500 running 6800 RPM. I know it could be done but it would be very expensive. Think about the heads an average guy could afford to turn a 500 7500 rpm and still make power, not a bucks down guy, then what I said becomes very clear. Not a lot of cross section available with any readily available head that is even remotely afordable
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/03/09 05:23 PM
I can get 3" CSA out of an INDY head. Probably little more with welding.
Pro Stock/Comp CFE W8 is ~3.25"
Nascar Truck W8 ~ 2.75"
Posted By: SB449VALIANT
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/03/09 05:31 PM
Quote:
A 450 running 7600 RPM is about the same as a 500 running 6800 RPM. I know it could be done but it would be very expensive. Think about the heads an average guy could afford to turn a 500 7500 rpm and still make power, not a bucks down guy, then what I said becomes very clear. Not a lot of cross section available with any readily available head that is even remotely afordable
gilberto.
Posted By: 68Fastback
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/04/09 03:35 AM
Ryan what do you expect it to make power wise. I know Ron will not dyno the motor so it is kinda a moot point but just curious what you think.
Posted By: HotRodDave
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/04/09 04:23 AM
I am not saying a max effort W8 won't do the job but what would one of those pro stock truck heads cost complete and assembled with springs nessacary to handle the cam nessacary to turn a 500 inch motor effectively 7500 RPM? That is why no one builds 500 inch SBMs
Of course you have guys like me who would build one in a heart beat if the 500 inch kit was reasonably priced and put a stage 3 eddy on it and have a blast sounding very mild and running incredible times
I remember several years ago about Rons demon in a magazine and thinking that is almost exactly how I would aproach building a car if I had the $$$ and
and
skills but it would be a 68 dart
Posted By: LA360
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/04/09 05:02 AM
Quote:
I am not saying a max effort W8 won't do the job but what would one of those pro stock truck heads cost complete and assembled with springs nessacary to handle the cam nessacary to turn a 500 inch motor effectively 7500 RPM? That is why no one builds 500 inch SBMs
The average guy isn't going to spring the cash for a custom Bryant crank, so it's a moot point. I don't imagine kits like this appearing in anyone's catalogues anytime soon. JMO anyway
AL...
Posted By: MACDiesel
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/04/09 06:35 PM
With all this talk about price, I kinda think we're forgeting that this is a 500" SMALL BLOCK! I'm not sure the word mountain motor and accessable belong in the same sentance.
BTW- What your doing is amazing! I wish you would reconsider the dyno as this is a major milestone for all engine builders out there. IMHO What your doing and the way your doing it needs to be recorded. This is hot rodding history!
Posted By: B3422W5
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/04/09 07:06 PM
Quote:
With all this talk about price, I kinda think we're forgeting that this is a 500" SMALL BLOCK! I'm not sure the word mountain motor and accessable belong in the same sentance.
BTW- What your doing is amazing! I wish you would reconsider the dyno as this is a major milestone for all engine builders out there. IMHO What your doing and the way your doing it needs to be recorded. This is hot rodding history!
I think Ron is right about the dyno...One could say it made 900 horse, another could say it made 500..if the car runs in the high 9's at the weight he is at, it will be very easy to compare it to other motors on here, output wise, that have been dyno'ed and raced, and make a pretty close comparison, and save him some coin.
Posted By: Brian Hafliger
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/04/09 10:41 PM
Quote:
Quote:
With all this talk about price, I kinda think we're forgeting that this is a 500" SMALL BLOCK! I'm not sure the word mountain motor and accessable belong in the same sentance.
BTW- What your doing is amazing! I wish you would reconsider the dyno as this is a major milestone for all engine builders out there. IMHO What your doing and the way your doing it needs to be recorded. This is hot rodding history!
I think Ron is right about the dyno...One could say it made 900 horse, another could say it made 500..if the car runs in the high 9's at the weight he is at, it will be very easy to compare it to other motors on here, output wise, that have been dyno'ed and raced, and make a pretty close comparison, and save him some coin.
When you dyno an engine, it's not about 900 HP or 500 HP, and by the way there should not ever be that much difference between ANY dyno #'s no matter how many different dyno's are used!! I'm sure you were exaggerating but that was waaaaaay out there LOL!
I used to be on the anti-dyno band wagon, but I must say doing on a weekly basis, you really learn a TON about engines, oil leaks, tuning, and your able to apply that into the next build.
Most of the time, my engines leave with only minor tuning needed that would have taken alot of trips down the strip. Not to mention that if everthing goes well on the dyno, but not in the car, you can successfully determine what components were changed and usually find the problem very quickly and easily.
It's not for everyone, but I have yet to have ANY of my customers even think they might have wasted money on dyno time.
And I have a long list of very happy customers that will dyno their next build guarranteed!!
If it's in the budget, you simply cannot go wrong with dyno testing.
On a softer note....I'm looking forward to seeing Rons car in action at the track!
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/09/09 06:27 PM
Ron's 245RP 48 degree INDY heads...I had them put the small exhaust port in these heads as well to help with header fitment.
Basically they just leave extra material on intake face, they just surface intake face of casting just enough to get a sealing surface above the port, you can see raw casting left above port in several of following pics....
Taking some measurements it's aproximately .160" extra, & then they machine pushrod holes at different angle/depth than the 59 head.....
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/09/09 06:28 PM
48
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/09/09 06:29 PM
48D
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/09/09 06:30 PM
48 F
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/09/09 06:31 PM
RP
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/09/09 06:32 PM
245
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/09/09 06:33 PM
EX
Posted By: B3422W5
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/09/09 06:48 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
With all this talk about price, I kinda think we're forgeting that this is a 500" SMALL BLOCK! I'm not sure the word mountain motor and accessable belong in the same sentance.
BTW- What your doing is amazing! I wish you would reconsider the dyno as this is a major milestone for all engine builders out there. IMHO What your doing and the way your doing it needs to be recorded. This is hot rodding history!
I think Ron is right about the dyno...One could say it made 900 horse, another could say it made 500..if the car runs in the high 9's at the weight he is at, it will be very easy to compare it to other motors on here, output wise, that have been dyno'ed and raced, and make a pretty close comparison, and save him some coin.
When you dyno an engine, it's not about 900 HP or 500 HP, and by the way there should not ever be that much difference between ANY dyno #'s no matter how many different dyno's are used!! I'm sure you were exaggerating but that was waaaaaay out there LOL!
I used to be on the anti-dyno band wagon, but I must say doing on a weekly basis, you really learn a TON about engines, oil leaks, tuning, and your able to apply that into the next build.
Most of the time, my engines leave with only minor tuning needed that would have taken alot of trips down the strip. Not to mention that if everthing goes well on the dyno, but not in the car, you can successfully determine what components were changed and usually find the problem very quickly and easily.
It's not for everyone, but I have yet to have ANY of my customers even think they might have wasted money on dyno time.
And I have a long list of very happy customers that will dyno their next build guarranteed!!
If it's in the budget, you simply cannot go wrong with dyno testing.
On a softer note....I'm looking forward to seeing Rons car in action at the track!
Good points , and yes, i was kidding about the 500-900 horsepower deal.
regarding dyno's finding leaks and etc, if a motor is truly put together with attention to detail it shouldnt matter, or if it does, a leak should be a very out of the ordinary occurance.
I found that by being carefull about picking components, haveing excellent machine work and assembly done, you should have an EXCELLENT idea of what a car is going to run before it ever gets to the track...my car, on it first day at the track with a brand new motor, ran within a couple of hundredths of what it does to this day(allowing for a small weight change since that day), and that couple of hundreds i put on the motor getting "broken in" at the track..
Just what i have personally seen,
Posted By: 9 Sec Phill
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/09/09 07:56 PM
Ron, why didnt you go with 360-2 heads? or wernt they out yet?..Ryan, the heads look great to me
.Phill
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/09/09 08:22 PM
360-2's are Oval ports.... (smaller head) not exactly what we want for 500 inches.
Posted By: 9 Sec Phill
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/09/09 08:43 PM
Quote:
360-2's are Oval ports.... (smaller head) not exactly what we want for 500 inches.
Sorry, just wondering, thought they were a better head. How much money (you can pm me)will you have in this set of heads Ryan? Ask Ron first if its ok.
Ron, this is going to be hard to beat. Ive tried my best to race with the big dogs on a low income and buget. I hope to get back into racing some time in the future but it will be some time from now. So when your rippin in the valiant think of us guys that dont have a ride and give a smile when you get the win light.... ...Phill
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/10/09 01:01 PM
Quote:
Quote:
360-2's are Oval ports.... (smaller head) not exactly what we want for 500 inches.
Sorry, just wondering, thought they were a better head. How much money (you can pm me)will you have in this set of heads Ryan? Ask Ron first if its ok.
Ron, this is going to be hard to beat. Ive tried my best to race with the big dogs on a low income and buget. ...Phill
Phil, it was awesome meeting you at MATS.
Ryan does not need my permission to quote a price. He sells this stuff!
You "DID" run with the big Dogs dude! That Cuda was awesome!! I loved that car. I am sorry you don't have it anymore. Look at it this way. You made room for something better
Posted By: DakFink
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/15/09 07:08 PM
OK to answer the question OF why no one has built anything even close to this before.
It has been the lack of availability of parts. Especially BLOCKs. I knew several years ago you could build at least a 482cui SBM.
I even ordered a 48* Siamese Tall Deck block. After 8 months of waiting I canceled the order and bought one used.(Got lucky) Since then supposedly mopar has finally straightened their SmallBlock mess out BUT from what I hear they are still an order and wait item. The X-block I have no clue what ever became of that??
As far as Indy?? I thought they were using Mopar Blocks and if they weren't available how could they be building anything??
But the rest of the pieces have always been available. Just about any Crank, Rod,Piston company will make you whatever you want now-a-days.
Heads the W-9s are still available I thing BUT that are a bit pricey to get them completely set-up.
I have a set of W9-RP's I am going to use on a Turbo Motor and those were $4000 with just the valve springs and retainer/locks. Luckily it was all new stuff.
Most of the stuff I have, was from people finding me, NOT me finding the parts. I found the block, after that I had people calling me asking me if I was interested in XXX-Part cause they heard i was building XXX-engine.
There is just not enough sharing of good information and bad advertising.
Just like Indy; they have been advertising BIG cui small-blocks for a long time. How was anyone to know they could still build them when NO-ONE could get Mopar Blocks for almost 2 yrs. If they had a stash of them. They should have stated as such in their ads. I would have Bought one.
Definitely not as big a lack of Money issue, With the money I still see being spent on cars.
I have heard several people with money to spend say they wish that Mopar had more available for Small blocks. I tell them it's all there you just have to dig and ask questions to find it.
Posted By: PUNK
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/28/09 04:13 PM
Any updates???
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 09/28/09 04:28 PM
I'm hoping to have the pistons & rods this week..... I'll post pics when they arrive
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/05/09 02:58 PM
We have pistons........
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/05/09 02:59 PM
-22 CC dish
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/05/09 03:00 PM
3
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/05/09 03:01 PM
X
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/05/09 03:02 PM
That's an .866" pin BTW.... I don't think we could have done this deal with a .927
Posted By: HotRodDave
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/05/09 03:30 PM
BEAUTIFUL!
They look more like a motorcycle piston.
I still spy a few grams extra weight there but not much
Posted By: dodgeboy11
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/05/09 04:23 PM
A dyno is much more useful than just finding out how much HP it makes. Catch leaks, tune it, etc.
The cool thing about this engine is from the outside it doesn't look like anything but an R3 blocked, Indy headed motor.
Posted By: Moparnut426
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/05/09 04:40 PM
Those look like the YFZ 450 pistons used in the 4 wheelers. Really short,
NICE!!!
Kasey
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/05/09 05:20 PM
You can read most of the specs right off the spec sheet..... 1.01" CH, 443 grams.
They did lighten the skirts some internally, but they wanted to leave as much strength as possible since it hardly has any skirt length & a 1.40 R/S ratio. They could have been made little lighter, maybe into the high 420's but they'd be hand grenades.
We're using a 2.50" X .866" Tool steel pin, bobweight will be about lightest you could imagine for a 500 CID motor.
The rods just walked in the door on the UPS truck a few minutes ago. I'll have pics this evening of them, they are unreal.... the beam is scary looking.
Posted By: Rapid340
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/05/09 05:44 PM
Ryan,
Would you mind taking a rough measurement of the crown thickness (in the dish area) and let us know.
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/05/09 06:28 PM
Quote:
Ryan,
Would you mind taking a rough measurement of the crown thickness (in the dish area) and let us know.
~.195"
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/05/09 09:25 PM
Custom Billet R&R A beam Conn rods..... 6.30" With 2.0" SB GM big end & .866" pin end. I'll get them weighed tomorrow, but they are plenty light....
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/05/09 09:27 PM
Big End
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/05/09 09:27 PM
ARP 325 Plus cap screws.....
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/05/09 09:28 PM
Pin end
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/05/09 09:29 PM
1280
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/05/09 09:30 PM
Crank should be done in next few weeks....... I'll post pics when it arrives.
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/06/09 09:39 PM
Rods checked in @ 560 grams
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/06/09 10:14 PM
The Manley Pro series Tour Light Rods I had before in a 525 HP 4" stroke motor were 518 grams
They were the same length and were for a .927 pin and 2.100 large end with a 3/8" bolt. I am certain they were not as good materials as these and held up just fine. I am 100% cofident with this Rod in THIS motor.
Thanks for the pics Ryan!
Posted By: Moparnut426
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/07/09 12:02 AM
Sweeeeeeet rods!!!
I thought my CHilds track masters were nice. Those are VERY NICE, I have read really good things on the R&R rods. They build some awsome Diesel stuff.
kasey
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/08/09 04:19 PM
Got everything weighed out to give Bryant the Bobweight today.....
1639.2 Bobweight Not bad for Steel rod 500 Inch motor
Posted By: dizuster
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/08/09 07:05 PM
1640g?! WOW!
For you guys to compare, my 440" small block with Diamond Piston, Oliver Billet rods, and a Dragon slayer crank, has a bob weight of 1905g...
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 10/08/09 07:23 PM
Quote:
1640g?! WOW!
For you guys to compare, my 440" small block with Diamond Piston, Oliver Billet rods, and a Dragon slayer crank, has a bob weight of 1905g...
Yeah but these R&R rods would fold in half @ your power & RPM level. 
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 10:39 PM
We have a crank........
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 10:41 PM
BOBWEIGHT
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 10:42 PM
Double keyway
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 10:43 PM
1.25" Rifle drill on mains
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 10:46 PM
Even With ultra light bobweight, it took 9 slugs of mallory to balance
(6) 1/2" slugs in rear, (2) 1" slugs up front & another 1/2" up front.....
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 10:47 PM
Profiling
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 10:48 PM
Journal overlap....
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 10:49 PM
Bryant definitely makes a nice crank....
Posted By: Triple Threat
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 10:50 PM
That is a piece of ART!
Posted By: 9 Sec Phill
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 10:50 PM
Ryan, how many pounds?
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 10:52 PM
Crank ended up @ 43 lbs... that's as light as Bryant could make it & still be able to balance it W/1639 bobweight & 4.50" stroke. Still hard to wrap mind around fact this is over 500 inches with 43 lb crank & a 1640 bobweight... Try that with a Big Block....
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 10:52 PM
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 10:53 PM
Header flanges
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 10:54 PM
...
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 10:55 PM
Ron is obsessive about weight..... so heads went on a diet....
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 10:56 PM
XXXX
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 10:59 PM
Could'nt fully slot out everything around pushrods like Ron wanted, because had to leave SOME strength for the intake bolt holes which run between the pushrod slots...but got as much out as I felt safe with....note inner head bolt bosses now gone...
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 11:00 PM
No more 18 bolt heads....
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 11:01 PM
fun fun
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 11:01 PM
Z
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 11:04 PM
And if you have lightened heads & block.... must have matching lightened intake as well.... I still have some hand work to do on it, but here it is off the mill....
Posted By: maximum entropy
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 11:13 PM
dude, that is awesome. what a project. keep 'em coming! please?
Posted By: dizuster
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 11:16 PM
Quote:
Journal overlap....
Or lack there of...
Posted By: 9 Sec Phill
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 11:21 PM
How much do you think you shaved off the heads and intake? Are you going to heli coil the heads so you have no worries of striping any threads for the intake and rocker gear?
Posted By: dizuster
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 11:23 PM
Ryan you milled off the best part of the intake! LOL...
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 11:35 PM
Quote:
How much do you think you shaved off the heads and intake? Are you going to heli coil the heads so you have no worries of striping any threads for the intake and rocker gear?
I have weighed the heads, they were 2.5 lbs each... I hav'nt weighed the intake yet against a stock one since it is'nt finished yet.
The rockers are T&D's & they use ARP studs, so they won't be stripping. As long as the assembler does'nt cross thread the intake/header bolts or overtorque them, they won't strip... So no, I don't plan on helicoiling them unless Ron asked for it. It's not something I normally do when selling INDY heads....
Posted By: Bill_G
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/04/09 11:58 PM
Quote:
Header flanges
Ryan/Ron who made the flanges? Was it something off the shelf or a custom deal?
Bill
Posted By: cheapstreetdustr
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/05/09 02:26 AM
Quote:
Quote:
Header flanges
Ryan/Ron who made the flanges? Was it something off the shelf or a custom deal?
Bill
? ...x2
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/05/09 04:04 AM
He got the header flanges from Indy.
Posted By: dodgeboy11
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/05/09 05:35 AM
What kind of flow numbers did you get on your bench Ryan?
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/05/09 01:36 PM
Quote:
What kind of flow numbers did you get on your bench Ryan?
The ports are not done, have just done VJ on them so far. They will be in the 345-350 range @.700 with 2.15 valve.
Yes flanges are ICH
Posted By: Dave Watt
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/05/09 01:39 PM
Thanks guys for posting the engine progress, it's a very interesting read. Most guys wouldn't show the inner workings of a one-off engine, but we're glad you are.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/05/09 10:46 PM
The #1 Reason I come to this site is to learn.
I am grateful, so my #2 reason for coming on here is to share info with those who may need it to "pay back" what I owe.
I told Ryan at the beginning I have nothing to hide and he can share whatever info he wants on this project.
Posted By: mr. 63plymouth
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/08/09 06:31 AM
This engine should make at least 800LARGE for power, I have a 461smallblock(that earlier in the post the guy from sasktoon had heard of a 462 in alberta, this is me, but its 461)pump gas 750 single carb NATURALLY ASPIRATED with indy heads light bobweight, basically the same parts as this buildup and mine made 741hp and 638torque. This engine is in a 68 barracuda street car with full interior,exhaust,etc...Best et is
9.52@142.88mph with a 1.39 sixty ft. on a 10"tire with leaf springs and cal tracs No trans brake.
Posted By: SB449VALIANT
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 11/08/09 07:29 AM
Quote:
The #1 Reason I come to this site is to learn.
I am grateful, so my #2 reason for coming on here is to share info with those who may need it to "pay back" what I owe.
I told Ryan at the beginning I have nothing to hide and he can share whatever info he wants on this project.
................... gilberto
Posted By: 9 Sec Phill
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/02/09 03:16 PM
Any progress?
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/02/09 05:43 PM
I'm hoping to have the pallet of parts ready to ship to Ron next week or the following. I'll have some pics of the block lightening here early next week, been hunting too much this week to get much else done. I'm supposed to go down & help finish up few little last lightening operations on block tomorrow afternoon that will be done by hand on the CNC (non CNC program items) & will pull it out of CNC & weigh it.
Finished the heads @ end of last week, just need to CC chambers now to verify CC's after their surface job & assemble them. Nothing too special going into heads, just set of Ferrea Comp Plus stainless valves, & using Comp Tool Steel retainers/Crower locks & a Comp 930 spring for the Hyd roller.
Posted By: 9 Sec Phill
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/02/09 10:31 PM
Are you going to use a index hardened spring seat (locator) to keep the bottom of the springs from moving around or are the heads spring seat step machined?
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/03/09 01:44 PM
Yes I use a cup or locator on just about everything... his ICH -1's have a Comp 4700-16 1.68" OD chrome moly seat cup.
I'm going to try to remember to take some pics of the block this afternoon when we finish lightening it. So MAYBE some pics tonight, depending on how busy I get.
Posted By: SuperStocker
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/03/09 05:48 PM
Thanks Ron, Ryan J., and the rest of you guys for these very informative posts on this one off build.
Posted By: Spode
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/09/09 04:18 PM
Very interesting thread
Im new here and this site really does it for me.
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/09/09 11:40 PM
Block pics....
We got 53.5 lbs out of this block..... it's now 178.5 lbs, lightest Tall deck R3 I have ever weighed. 16 hours in the CNC...
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/09/09 11:41 PM
Dr side
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/09/09 11:41 PM
Window mill Dr side
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/09/09 11:43 PM
Window mill pass side
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/09/09 11:43 PM
Lifter valley
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/09/09 11:44 PM
no more oil feeds to heads
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/09/09 11:45 PM
Dipstick boss
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/09/09 11:46 PM
inside pan rail webs/stroker clearance notch
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/09/09 11:47 PM
Contour freeze plugs
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/09/09 11:47 PM
lifter valley walls
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/09/09 11:48 PM
1486
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/09/09 11:49 PM
Last one....
Posted By: 65signet
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/09/09 11:53 PM
That is some serious work to lighten a block, but that is a lot weight taken off, looks nice
Posted By: cheapstreetdustr
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/10/09 12:11 AM
i guess no W series heads will bolt on now...?
that is alot of milling...
those bell house openings wont effect sfi...
as far as trans,flexplate,converter?
I realise it will let heat out..but if there is a trans failure..it migh fubar the block...?
(mount hole pads..)
did you do the lifer bores /* ..or where they already done...?
cheaspt.
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/10/09 12:42 AM
Quote:
i guess no W series heads will bolt on now...?
that is alot of milling...
those bell house openings wont effect sfi...
as far as trans,flexplate,converter?
I realise it will let heat out..but if there is a trans failure..it migh fubar the block...?
(mount hole pads..)
did you do the lifer bores /* ..or where they already done...?
cheaspt.
There are pics of the 10 bolt INDY heads on page 5....
This was a tall deck "673" 48 degree block, so the lifter bores were already machined if that is what you are asking, although I do have capability to put lifter bores in a blank bore block, in fact I just did one for a dirt track racer last month.
I've done the window milling on the bellhousing to alot of blocks, in fact some of the 9" deck Nascar R3 blocks came W/ window mills from MP & were ran in Nascar competition like that. Have never heard anyone question their safety.
Posted By: CRE2004
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/10/09 12:44 AM
Quote:
Block pics....
We got 53.5 lbs out of this block..... it's now 178.5 lbs, lightest Tall deck R3 I have ever weighed. 16 hours in the CNC...
That's alot of recovery time for Ron's wallet. Kudo's Ron for doing your part to stimulate the economy Great job on the build as usual Ryan
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/10/09 01:56 AM
That's alot of recovery time for Ron's wallet. Kudo's Ron for doing your part to stimulate the economy
Great job on the build as usual Ryan
I have been doing everything I can to help the economy. But I do not really have that much money and my savings is just about tapped out. Seriously.
I have bought 4 cars since Dec 3rd last year.
09 SRT8 Challenger (that I have since sold).
09 2500 MegaCab Cummins ( $56,400 window sticker!)
09 Toyota Yaris (my son's HS graduation present).
10 Camaro SS (replaced the Challenger)
And now this Engine is well over 20K. Hopefully it will be a good engine and last me a while.
Posted By: HotRodDave
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/10/09 02:13 AM
Awesome! and it still has the stock motor mounts
I bet Ron gets after it and takes off another pound or 3
Posted By: SB449VALIANT
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/10/09 04:17 AM
Thank god im not alone....lol
this one was well over 25k...
Great work R/J...
Posted By: FASTFISH420
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/10/09 05:53 PM
Quote:
That's alot of recovery time for Ron's wallet. Kudo's Ron for doing your part to stimulate the economy Great job on the build as usual Ryan
I have been doing everything I can to help the economy. But I do not really have that much money and my savings is just about tapped out. Seriously.
Why did you get rid of the Challenger and get a Camaro 
I have bought 4 cars since Dec 3rd last year.
09 SRT8 Challenger (that I have since sold).
09 2500 MegaCab Cummins ( $56,400 window sticker!)
09 Toyota Yaris (my son's HS graduation present).
10 Camaro SS (replaced the Challenger)
And now this Engine is well over 20K. Hopefully it will be a good engine and last me a while.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/10/09 06:08 PM
Why did you get rid of the Challenger and get a Camaro
https://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/show...part=1&vc=1
Posted By: 65signet
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/10/09 09:36 PM
I have been doing everything I can to help the economy. But I do not really have that much money and my savings is just about tapped out. Seriously.
I have bought 4 cars since Dec 3rd last year.
09 SRT8 Challenger (that I have since sold).
09 2500 MegaCab Cummins ( $56,400 window sticker!)
09 Toyota Yaris (my son's HS graduation present).
10 Camaro SS (replaced the Challenger)
Are going to race the Camaro at the MATS in the late model shoot out?
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/10/09 10:16 PM
I will be running a Mopar at MATS. Probably the Valiant. The big question is, will it have 406 ci or 501 ci. If the Valiant can't make it I will race the truck. Of course, since I have been known to win money with my Truck. With that turbodiesel I leave from a dead idle on the SECOND amber of a full sportsman tree and I do very good.
Posted By: Troy
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/11/09 12:56 AM
.......Why do I have a vision of Ron going to this block and chauffeuring all the sharp edges to remove another 1.25 lbs.
At first I did not think that you would EVER out do your Demon but this car is going to be just plain NUTS!!!!!! Keep up the good work!!
Posted By: cheapstreetdustr
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/11/09 01:12 AM
Quote:
Quote:
i guess no W series heads will bolt on now...?
that is alot of milling...
those bell house openings wont effect sfi...
as far as trans,flexplate,converter?
I realise it will let heat out..but if there is a trans failure..it migh fubar the block...?
(mount hole pads..)
did you do the lifer bores /* ..or where they already done...?
cheaspt.
There are pics of the 10 bolt INDY heads on page 5....
This was a tall deck "673" 48 degree block, so the lifter bores were already machined if that is what you are asking, although I do have capability to put lifter bores in a blank bore block, in fact I just did one for a dirt track racer last month.
I've done the window milling on the bellhousing to alot of blocks, in fact some of the 9" deck Nascar R3 blocks came W/ window mills from MP & were ran in Nascar competition like that. Have never heard anyone question their safety.
Cooll thanks for the reply..
Ryan ..those lifter bores are in pretty good position when shipped,?
you dont have to address anything there?
i was just wondering on the windows..not bashing..just ...i am used to carnage from time to time. lol.....wonder it that might factor..?
so i guess your putting in a pool at the house after all this ?
just having fun..
keep up the good work...
cheapst.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/11/09 03:26 PM
I am not worried about those windows in the back of the block in any respect. Not torsional strength or bridge strength. If you really think about it you will realize this is not an issue.
I plan on polishing/cleaning the areas around the openings and putting some of that HVAC metal (aluminum) tape over them and then painting right over them for a stealth look. You will not even know they are there.
Posted By: FASTFISH420
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/12/09 12:51 AM
Sorry I missed that post..
I wondered because I work on them from time to time..and as we speak I am doing a engine upgrade on one with 1200 miles right now..
but you are right..not one runs the same..it is the same with vipers also..I was told by a chrysler engineer that vipers will vary by 50hp...
sorry to hijack the thread...
Posted By: DakFink
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/12/09 08:16 AM
Quote:
Quote:
i guess no W series heads will bolt on now...?
that is alot of milling...
those bell house openings wont effect sfi...
as far as trans,flexplate,converter?
I realise it will let heat out..but if there is a trans failure..it migh fubar the block...?
(mount hole pads..)
did you do the lifer bores /* ..or where they already done...?
cheaspt.
There are pics of the 10 bolt INDY heads on page 5....
This was a tall deck "673" 48 degree block, so the lifter bores were already machined if that is what you are asking, although I do have capability to put lifter bores in a blank bore block, in fact I just did one for a dirt track racer last month.
I've done the window milling on the bellhousing to alot of blocks, in fact some of the 9" deck Nascar R3 blocks came W/ window mills from MP & were ran in Nascar competition like that. Have never heard anyone question their safety.
Ryan,
I tried to e-mail twice BUT it got kicked back both times. Used the RyanJ and info@ adresses. I would call but I am in Iraq.
I was wondering how much it would be for the lightening program (I have a TallDeck Siamesed R-3) and also do you have anything for lightening the W9-RP heads any more than they are.
Do you think there as any questionable areas that might need to be addressed in the lightening of a Block that is going to be used with twin-turbos. Probably 25-30psi boost?
If you like e-mail me at dakfink@hotmail.com
Thanks,
Kenny
Posted By: DaKuda
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/12/09 01:31 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
i guess no W series heads will bolt on now...?
that is alot of milling...
those bell house openings wont effect sfi...
as far as trans,flexplate,converter?
I realise it will let heat out..but if there is a trans failure..it migh fubar the block...?
(mount hole pads..)
did you do the lifer bores /* ..or where they already done...?
cheaspt.
There are pics of the 10 bolt INDY heads on page 5....
This was a tall deck "673" 48 degree block, so the lifter bores were already machined if that is what you are asking, although I do have capability to put lifter bores in a blank bore block, in fact I just did one for a dirt track racer last month.
I've done the window milling on the bellhousing to alot of blocks, in fact some of the 9" deck Nascar R3 blocks came W/ window mills from MP & were ran in Nascar competition like that. Have never heard anyone question their safety.
Ryan,
I tried to e-mail twice BUT it got kicked back both times. Used the RyanJ and info@ adresses. I would call but I am in Iraq.
I was wondering how much it would be for the lightening program (I have a TallDeck Siamesed R-3) and also do you have anything for lightening the W9-RP heads any more than they are.
Do you think there as any questionable areas that might need to be addressed in the lightening of a Block that is going to be used with twin-turbos. Probably 25-30psi boost?
If you like e-mail me at dakfink@hotmail.com
Thanks,
Kenny
Hey Kenny,
Thanks for what you do for this country. My brother is there with you.
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/12/09 04:44 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
i guess no W series heads will bolt on now...?
that is alot of milling...
those bell house openings wont effect sfi...
as far as trans,flexplate,converter?
I realise it will let heat out..but if there is a trans failure..it migh fubar the block...?
(mount hole pads..)
did you do the lifer bores /* ..or where they already done...?
cheaspt.
There are pics of the 10 bolt INDY heads on page 5....
This was a tall deck "673" 48 degree block, so the lifter bores were already machined if that is what you are asking, although I do have capability to put lifter bores in a blank bore block, in fact I just did one for a dirt track racer last month.
I've done the window milling on the bellhousing to alot of blocks, in fact some of the 9" deck Nascar R3 blocks came W/ window mills from MP & were ran in Nascar competition like that. Have never heard anyone question their safety.
Ryan,
I tried to e-mail twice BUT it got kicked back both times. Used the RyanJ and info@ adresses. I would call but I am in Iraq.
I was wondering how much it would be for the lightening program (I have a TallDeck Siamesed R-3) and also do you have anything for lightening the W9-RP heads any more than they are.
Do you think there as any questionable areas that might need to be addressed in the lightening of a Block that is going to be used with twin-turbos. Probably 25-30psi boost?
If you like e-mail me at dakfink@hotmail.com
Thanks,
Kenny
I'll email you some pricing on lightening an R3.... it's probably not as expensive as some may think... We are just bit more than what Dart gets to do their Little M blocks & we get almost double the weight out they do (granted the MP blocks have alot more excess metal to move than the Dart blocks but, $ per lb we are way cheaper)
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/12/09 06:33 PM
Ryan, I know you already told me in a PM "Took us 16 hours on the CNC but we managed to take your block from 232 lbs down to 178.5 lbs. Keep in mind a stock 340 is around 162-165 lbs.... this is by far the lightest Tall deck R3 I've seen." But how much of that record lightness is from the large bore size? In other words if this was 4.00" bore what do think it would weigh?
Also, if you decked this block to minimum deck, which I think is 9.200" how much do you think it would take off? I was told you can take off #40 by max decking a block like this, but I am thinking more like #25. Maybe if it was cast for a 9.00 deck and machined to that height it would be #40 lighter than a tall deck.
Ron.
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/13/09 04:58 PM
Quote:
Ryan, I know you already told me in a PM "Took us 16 hours on the CNC but we managed to take your block from 232 lbs down to 178.5 lbs. Keep in mind a stock 340 is around 162-165 lbs.... this is by far the lightest Tall deck R3 I've seen." But how much of that record lightness is from the large bore size? In other words if this was 4.00" bore what do think it would weigh?
Also, if you decked this block to minimum deck, which I think is 9.200" how much do you think it would take off? I was told you can take off #40 by max decking a block like this, but I am thinking more like #25. Maybe if it was cast for a 9.00 deck and machined to that height it would be #40 lighter than a tall deck.
Ron.
9.20's & 9.0 R3's used a seperate Casting from MP.
It's been a long time since I decked an R3 hard, I know we did one maybe 3 years ago & took around .300" for some reason, don't remember what it was for. Do remember we used a large shell mill on the CNC to knock the first .250" off & did the rest with the surfacing head to cut down time. You try to take .250" + off an iron block in an old Vulcan block surfacer & you can spend 2+ days doing one. CNC did it in hour & half? I have never really spent alot of time checking weight differences on decked blocks, but do recall doing a semi lighten job on a 9.0 block one time & it was around 185 lbs. Again, the deck on a 9.0 block is not much thinner than a 9.56 block since it is a dedicated casting..... Deck on a 9.56 is around .800" thick. You could deck one down around 9.20 no issues... & certainly that would remove good chunk of weight. You get into the shorter deck stuff & intake manifold availability is biggest issue for non W7/8/9 heads.
As for your bore question, 4.0" bore is pretty darn small, not many run that small, particularly in a Siamese block because cyl walls are so thick they can retain a ton of heat @ small bore. Most Siamese bores are ran @ 4.155" or bigger....however to answer your question.... Cylinder bores are 6" long on a tall deck SB Chrysler, & you'd be removing .105" all way around to take 4.0 to 4.21 like yours..... So that is basically very similar dimensionally to a cylinder bore sleeve... To be honest I have never weighed one, as I've never had a reason to?, but out of curiosity I will weigh a Melling sleeve this week & see what it weighs. That will be quick easy way to tell how much weight is removed in going from something in the "normal" 4.0-4.07 range up to 4.20+ bore.
Posted By: MattW
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/13/09 05:10 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Ryan, I know you already told me in a PM "Took us 16 hours on the CNC but we managed to take your block from 232 lbs down to 178.5 lbs. Keep in mind a stock 340 is around 162-165 lbs.... this is by far the lightest Tall deck R3 I've seen." But how much of that record lightness is from the large bore size? In other words if this was 4.00" bore what do think it would weigh?
Also, if you decked this block to minimum deck, which I think is 9.200" how much do you think it would take off? I was told you can take off #40 by max decking a block like this, but I am thinking more like #25. Maybe if it was cast for a 9.00 deck and machined to that height it would be #40 lighter than a tall deck.
Ron.
9.20's & 9.0 R3's used a seperate Casting from MP.
It's been a long time since I decked an R3 hard, I know we did one maybe 3 years ago & took around .300" for some reason, don't remember what it was for. Do remember we used a large shell mill on the CNC to knock the first .250" off & did the rest with the surfacing head to cut down time. You try to take .250" + off an iron block in an old Vulcan block surfacer & you can spend 2+ days doing one. CNC did it in hour & half? I have never really spent alot of time checking weight differences on decked blocks, but do recall doing a semi lighten job on a 9.0 block one time & it was around 185 lbs. Again, the deck on a 9.0 block is not much thinner than a 9.56 block since it is a dedicated casting..... Deck on a 9.56 is around .800" thick. You could deck one down around 9.20 no issues... & certainly that would remove good chunk of weight. You get into the shorter deck stuff & intake manifold availability is biggest issue for non W7/8/9 heads.
As for your bore question, 4.0" bore is pretty darn small, not many run that small, particularly in a Siamese block because cyl walls are so thick they can retain a ton of heat @ small bore. Most Siamese bores are ran @ 4.155" or bigger....however to answer your question.... Cylinder bores are 6" long on a tall deck SB Chrysler, & you'd be removing .105" all way around to take 4.0 to 4.21 like yours..... So that is basically very similar dimensionally to a cylinder bore sleeve... To be honest I have never weighed one, as I've never had a reason to?, but out of curiosity I will weigh a Melling sleeve this week & see what it weighs. That will be quick easy way to tell how much weight is removed in going from something in the "normal" 4.0-4.07 range up to 4.20+ bore.
Soo I have a question? When you remove all this extra casting do you induce stress into the block?
I know that some boring machines, when taking large amounts of metal, will do this Matt
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/13/09 05:19 PM
Induce stress? not really. Are we taking some overall strength away? We have to be.... obviously the more material there is the stronger it will be.... but especially for a motor like this that will not really be making a ton of power, it's not an issue.
Reason you want a race block is because 1st & foremost they have very thick cyl walls... so we're not affecting that.
2nd reason, very thick decks, again no affect to that...
3rd fully filled in pan rails & main webbing. We just kiss the inside of pan rails a bit....
4th Race blocks, much higher nickle content block, if you ever hone a factory block & then hone an R3, will see drastic difference.
5th true 4 bolt main cap capability & again not affecting that at all.
6th, 48 degree lifter bore bank angle.... not affected.
We're just taking all the crap off these blocks that does not need to be there.... extra head bolt bosses, magnum motor mounts, Magnum crank sensor boss, fully filled in lifter valley, 59* lifter bosses etc.
Posted By: Streetwize
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/13/09 05:42 PM
Ron, Ryan, That is one Badazz project
It'll be tough to top Ron's old Demon, but i think you've done it! I remember that Blue car well. I met Ron the day he sold it at the Mopar Nats back in '05 IIRC.
Great info, guys!!
Posted By: Leon441
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/14/09 01:44 AM
When will you guys be finished? It started in August right?
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/14/09 04:05 AM
The check I sent Ryan was dated 8-3-2009 and I overnighted it to him. I think it took about another week before he ordered the crank and that was the longest part to get. And that is the fastest billet crank I have ever heard of as far as time. The Crank took a little over 8 weeks plus a week to ship back to him. I think he is getting ready to ship my parts to me any day now. It would be a week minimum to get here and could easily be 2 or 3 weeks. Depending on who he uses.
My 474 R3 W9 Motor I built for the Demon took 9 months and I worked on it all the time (unless I was waiting for parts, that crank took 4 months).
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/14/09 01:32 PM
I have the shortblock mocked up right now, I am going to have to hand grind some rod notches in the bottom of bores, the CNC stroker clearance notches don't quite clear 4.50" LOL That should be all that is left for the block, clearance it, wash it, cam bearing it....
Bearinsg have all been hand selected, the mains are a mix of H's & HXs to get clearances where I want. Off top of my head mains came out ~ .0028"-.003" Rods are in the .0022" range which is fine for a 2.0" steel rod journal.
Waiting on Custom Damper W/ integrated trigger wheel from ATI.... Hoping to have everything strapped to pallet & shipped next week. Truck freight will take about 1 week to CA. He should have it by new Years
Posted By: SB449VALIANT
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/14/09 11:58 PM
Quote:
When will you guys be finished? It started in August right?
what??? it's that a new record Ryan?
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/15/09 12:14 AM
Quote:
Quote:
When will you guys be finished? It started in August right?
what??? it's that a new record Ryan?
That's because I'm not assembling it..... LOL
Posted By: SB449VALIANT
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/15/09 12:21 AM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
When will you guys be finished? It started in August right?
what??? it's that a new record Ryan?
That's because I'm not assembling it..... LOL
Posted By: SB449VALIANT
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.......... - 12/15/09 12:23 AM
BTW flanges are here....
thanks!!!!
Posted By: Ron Silva
UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 01/08/10 09:28 PM
I guess I have to stop acting like a Movie Director and stop giving orders.........."" MILL, DRILL.....NO!! CUT!!""
The rest is up to me..........wish me luck.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 01/08/10 09:29 PM
2
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 01/08/10 09:29 PM
3
Posted By: 9 Sec Phill
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 01/08/10 09:59 PM
Wish I had the funds to come out and visit Ron, I would love to help you out on this monster...Good luck and enjoy.....Phill
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 01/08/10 10:29 PM
Glad it arrived in 1 piece
Don't mind the burnt plywood on the sides, you would'nt want me to build your house I can tell you that LOL. Cutting plywood on the table saw is definitely not my day job...
Posted By: cheapstreetdustr
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 01/08/10 11:04 PM
Quote:
Glad it arrived in 1 piece
Don't mind the burnt plywood on the sides, you would'nt want me to build your house I can tell you that LOL. Cutting plywood on the table saw is definitely not my day job...
how many of those crates would i have to build for you..for say.....???
a 421" 59* smallblock..?
Posted By: MattW
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 01/08/10 11:24 PM
Quote:
Glad it arrived in 1 piece
Don't mind the burnt plywood on the sides, you would'nt want me to build your house I can tell you that LOL. Cutting plywood on the table saw is definitely not my day job...
You TOLD me that you could not nail two boards together? 
You did a good job but forgot the spray foam,glue and paint.
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 01/08/10 11:29 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Glad it arrived in 1 piece
Don't mind the burnt plywood on the sides, you would'nt want me to build your house I can tell you that LOL. Cutting plywood on the table saw is definitely not my day job...
You TOLD me that you could not nail two boards together?
You did a good job but forgot the spray foam,glue and paint.
There is not a SINGLE nail in that crate........ lot's of SCREWS...but no nails LOL
Posted By: SB449VALIANT
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 01/09/10 12:52 AM
Quote:
Quote:
Glad it arrived in 1 piece
Don't mind the burnt plywood on the sides, you would'nt want me to build your house I can tell you that LOL. Cutting plywood on the table saw is definitely not my day job...
how many of those crates would i have to build for you..for say.....???
a 421" 59* smallblock..?
you do the math...lol
CRATING ENGINE FOR SHIPPING:………………………………………$175.00..
Posted By: cheapstreetdustr
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 01/09/10 02:29 AM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Glad it arrived in 1 piece
Don't mind the burnt plywood on the sides, you would'nt want me to build your house I can tell you that LOL. Cutting plywood on the table saw is definitely not my day job...
how many of those crates would i have to build for you..for say.....???
a 421" 59* smallblock..?
you do the math...lol
CRATING ENGINE FOR SHIPPING:………………………………………$175.00..
So Ryan..you got room around there for a hundred of these?
lol
cheapst.
Posted By: HardcoreB
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 01/09/10 12:02 PM
Quote:
Don't mind the burnt plywood on the sides,...
That is not burned...it is surface hardened from heat treating. (deliberately done IMO) Nice work on the details of this build, thanks for sharing. Can't wait for the results.
Posted By: Devilbrad
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 01/09/10 09:04 PM
Subscribed! Wow.
Posted By: DavidDean
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 01/09/10 10:36 PM
Wow! lots of nice photos and tech,better keep it.Thanks!
Posted By: RawnDart
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 01/09/10 11:13 PM
Quote:
Subscribed! Wow.
Are you going to slap one of those into your '67 now?
Nice build, and tech info here, guys!
Posted By: Devilbrad
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 01/10/10 03:48 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Subscribed! Wow.
Are you going to slap one of those into your '67 now?
Nice build, and tech info here, guys!
Um, no. LOL
Posted By: POS Dakota
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 01/17/10 03:24 PM
Any updates?
Timeline? Anything?
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 01/17/10 04:24 PM
Well, I am working on it! LOL
Car Craft took pics of all the parts right after I got them and they might want to dyno the engine. So, that might upset my ultimate plan. I was hoping to have it in the car for MATS, but I do not think that is likely since I have to build the headers for the car and that is 3 weeks minimum. Usually about 4-6 weeks will do it. I want to race the Valiant at MATS so I am pretty sure it will be with the current Mopar 406 crate motor just to be on the safe side.
So far I have finished hand lightening/blending all the CNC work on the block and I just mocked up the heads and intake on the block to get a dimension for end spacers to go on the china walls. Ryan measured the mains but I still have to mock up and verify 7 of the rods clearances. I have been spending a lot of time gathering misc parts that are not included with a build from scratch engine and getting misc gaskets etc... Like the plate/fitting/gasket that the oil filter mounts on and the dip stick. This block is not taking a standard dip stick and is even different from the last R3 Block I had of the same configuration. I finally figured out a production Magnum DipStick will work (with mods).
Right now I want to get to the point where I can give the block it's final wash and start assymbling the short block.
I hate to say I work slow and I am checking and rechecking everything and dealing with all the details. It would be stupid to be careless and needlessly blow up a motor that costs this much. As with my last good engine, I want it to be right and then go out and beat on it and not worry. I have the parts that are up to the task. I just need to make sure everything goes together without any issues.
Posted By: Devilbrad
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 01/17/10 04:49 PM
I'm sure you're aware of the billet aluminum oil filter plate CV Products makes for the R3 blocks? Its o-ring sealed.
http://www.cvproducts.com/Products.aspx?Search=cv783
Posted By: MattW
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 01/17/10 05:40 PM
Quote:
Well, I am working on it! LOL
Car Craft took pics of all the parts right after I got them and they might want to dyno the engine. So, that might upset my ultimate plan. I was hoping to have it in the car for MATS, but I do not think that is likely since I have to build the headers for the car and that is 3 weeks minimum. Usually about 4-6 weeks will do it. I want to race the Valiant at MATS so I am pretty sure it will be with the current Mopar 406 crate motor just to be on the safe side.
So far I have finished hand lightening/blending all the CNC work on the block and I just mocked up the heads and intake on the block to get a dimension for end spacers to go on the china walls. Ryan measured the mains but I still have to mock up and verify 7 of the rods clearances. I have been spending a lot of time gathering misc parts that are not included with a build from scratch engine and getting misc gaskets etc... Like the plate/fitting/gasket that the oil filter mounts on and the dip stick. This block is not taking a standard dip stick and is even different from the last R3 Block I had of the same configuration. I finally figured out a production Magnum DipStick will work (with mods).
Right now I want to get to the point where I can give the block it's final wash and start assymbling the short block.
I hate to say I work slow and I am checking and rechecking everything and dealing with all the details. It would be stupid to be careless and needlessly blow up a motor that costs this much. As with my last good engine, I want it to be right and then go out and beat on it and not worry. I have the parts that are up to the task. I just need to make sure everything goes together without any issues.
So Ron , What R U doing with the lifter vallee? R U going to close it up or leave it open.
I hear alot of info about oil dropping into that area and creating windage.
Matt
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 01/17/10 10:27 PM
Quote:
I'm sure you're aware of the billet aluminum oil filter plate CV Products makes for the R3 blocks? Its o-ring sealed. http://www.cvproducts.com/Products.aspx?Search=cv783
devilbrad , I did not know about that. Thanks, that will give me another option when it comes down to it. I ended up ordering all the stock stuff and I ordered a Billet Plate from Canton (seals with an "O"-ring). The Canton one uses the stock fitting and the production piece is very good nowadays. Better than the older stuff by far.
Matt, I am leaving the valley open. In fact we cut that all out to save weight. It was originally all closed up. If you look close you can see the holes we drilled to return oil to the bottom in the stock area as well as cutting out the center. I like the oil splashing all over and lubricating everything per factory design. I even drilled the holes in the front China Wall to splash lube the timing chain that were not there.
Nowadays the trend is to put oil squirters to spray oil on the bottom of the piston. So if my crank is slinging oil up there I think that would be benificial to a point.
I am not planning on running a windage tray of any sort either. Just a deep Milodon pan with baffles.
You have to remember this is a 6500 RPM motor and the HP loss from Windage will not be that great.
Posted By: Devilbrad
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 01/17/10 10:43 PM
Quote:
Quote:
I'm sure you're aware of the billet aluminum oil filter plate CV Products makes for the R3 blocks? Its o-ring sealed. http://www.cvproducts.com/Products.aspx?Search=cv783
devilbrad , I did not know about that. Thanks, that will give me another option when it comes down to it. I ended up ordering all the stock stuff and I ordered a Billet Plate from Canton (seals with an "O"-ring). The Canton one uses the stock fitting and the production piece is very good nowadays. Better than the older stuff by far.
The fitting is also o-ring sealed. Nice stuff.
Posted By: POS Dakota
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 01/21/10 10:35 AM
I agree totally on checking, checking again, and re-checking. I'm that way myself. I always feel there is something else I should check, even when I am about to turn the key. It's definitely tough to be a perfectionist. Especially one with a lot invested in a project like this.
Thanks for the update.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/01/10 12:21 AM
Finally got all the fussing over the block done and washed it and got the crank in. As usual I was totally stressing over the rear main seal and trying to prevent oil leaks.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/01/10 12:23 AM
Again, since I hate oil leaks I made manifold end spacers so I can just use a little silicone and have really good squeezage.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/01/10 12:24 AM
other one.....hope the distributor fits!
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/01/10 12:25 AM
Back of the crank takes a 1-1/2" freeze plug with a snap ring to seal the big hole.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/01/10 12:26 AM
gun drill is 1-1/4"
Posted By: B1KILLER
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/01/10 01:02 AM
Damm
Sure looks good
Posted By: Troy
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/01/10 05:12 AM
Quote:
gun drill is 1-1/4"
My jaw just hit the floor...
Ron, words don't describe how nuts you are.
Long time no talk, hope all is well.
Posted By: POS Dakota
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/04/10 10:19 AM
Great Job on the end rail spacers. They're perfect!
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/05/10 04:37 PM
Another nice thing when you buy custom Rods is even though we are using a Small Block Chevy 2.00" rod journal, they ended up offsetting the beam so that the small end is centered in the piston. You would take the cylinder block/bore offset and divide by 2 and then the beam center needs to be that far from the non chamfered edge of the rod.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/05/10 04:41 PM
The radius on the front of the crank would not let the lower timing chain gear go all the way on. I am glad I found this and so I put a larger chamfer on the gear with my Dremmel.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/18/10 09:08 PM
Well, I thought I would post an update since it's been a while. I was happy to post 2 days ago that I had a "shortblock". Because I finished meticulously installing all 8 pistons and rods. It takes me a while to do all the checking and lubing, torqueing of the rod bolts etc.
But I ran into a problem. Ryan never caught it, and I do not expect him to, and I did not catch it. Both of us mocked up before final assembly and checked deck height at ZERO right where we wanted.
BUT, after final assembly the rings are all on and rod bolts tightened to final torque etc. and when I was checking the deck height I was getting really goofy readings. They were literally all over the place?? So after refining my measuring and writing the findings on the top of the pistons a PATTERN evolved and became apparent. Every piston on the odd side was +.007 at the front (towards the front of the block right above the wrist pin CL) and -.007 at the back. On the other side of the motor every piston was the exact opposite. So after a teardown and more measuring I have discovered that these high dollar rods were machined with the wrist pin bore crooked. A reality I had to face and so the rods all have to come out and be sent back. A huge amount of tedious work and no telling how long to get them back. A HUGE pain and loss of my time.
No amount of stressing or crying will fix this. I considered running it like that but in the end I know it is not right. Only hard work and time will fix it. As well as a little more money for shipping, misc etc.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/18/10 09:09 PM
Hey! Where'd that piston go? Way down there with 4.5" stroke.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/18/10 09:10 PM
It was together. But no more..........
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/18/10 09:15 PM
one more
Posted By: Quicktree
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/18/10 09:44 PM
that sucks but glad you caught it. I think they should be paying the shipping charge and the labor involved....
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/19/10 01:15 AM
It`s your attention to detail and skills that make your cars look and run the way they do. Sorry to hear this but I`d do the same thing and get it perfect.
Can`t wait to hear the track results w/that beast.
Posted By: Bill_G
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/19/10 09:44 PM
Wow, good catch!
Bill
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/21/10 12:23 AM
Well, I am finishing taking the motor apart today.
So, what is wrong with this picture?? And NO, it is not trick photography.
Makes me mad as a hornet. I paid $2500 for these rods and this is what I get. The length is varied by .0025" and I have only measured 4 so far. I think something like .0005 would be more like it. Maybe I am wrong.
Posted By: Moparnut426
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/21/10 12:37 AM
Quote:
Well, I am finishing taking the motor apart today.
So, what is wrong with this picture?? And NO, it is not trick photography.
Makes me mad as a hornet. I paid $2500 for these rods and this is what I get. The length is varied by .0025" and I have only measured 4 so far. I think something like .0005 would be more like it. Maybe I am wrong.
WOW, you can accually see the bronze bushing thicker in the picture top right, and thinner bottom left. Thats crazy and Id be pissed too. Thats a perfect example of double checking everything a number of times even with 2500 dollar parts, they still had an issue. Glad ya got it figured out before putting power to it. Being the way they are could have caused some piston wear, and possible block problems too.
Sorry to hear the problems, but Im sure you are glad you found the problem before hand.
Kasey
Nice eyes.
Posted By: Leigh
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/21/10 02:27 AM
This should be on every builders check list. Sorry to hear, glad you found it, demand your money back. It's absurd. What other shortcuts do they have in their Q.C.?
Posted By: jamesc
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/21/10 03:09 AM
Quote:
The length is varied by .0025" and I have only measured 4 so far.
after finding the pin bores cocked that's four more than i would have measured. for that kind of coin i'd be smoking mad and personally don't think i'd want to use their products period...that's ridiculous. doesn't oliver have anything that will fit in there? curious why you have bolts in the mains instead of studs?
Posted By: MattW
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/21/10 03:22 PM
Quote:
Well, I am finishing taking the motor apart today.
So, what is wrong with this picture?? And NO, it is not trick photography.
Makes me mad as a hornet. I paid $2500 for these rods and this is what I get. The length is varied by .0025" and I have only measured 4 so far. I think something like .0005 would be more like it. Maybe I am wrong.
So Ron, is it the rod that is off or the bushing was machined wrong? If it is the bushing then is it a simple fix?
For that kind of money I would be making them eat the shipping and your time.
I don't know how warranty works for race part but if they had to replace your engine do to this they would be paying alot more
Good luck and be patient you will get it done Matt
Posted By: 440Jim
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/21/10 04:25 PM
Quote:
So after a teardown and more measuring I have discovered that these high dollar rods were machined with the wrist pin bore crooked.
Oh-no, bummer.
I am curious, what was the crank counterweight diameter Bryant used? I read all the pages of this post today, and didn't see it. I am a big block guy, so I didn't read this last fall.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/21/10 04:47 PM
Quote:
This should be on every builders check list. Sorry to hear, glad you found it, demand your money back. It's absurd. What other shortcuts do they have in their Q.C.?
Yes, I know. But I am used to using $1200 Manley Rods and they were always PERFECT. So, after 2 mockups and the deck height seemed to be ok, I put it together. Without the rings on, that deck height does not repeat very well, but if you measure in the center of the piston it is close. Of course a quick measuring of the rod would have easily found this. With a 6" dial caliper I have one that is .0035 diff from side to side. The one that is pictured. On that one the whole offset is on the one side so you can see it with the naked eye. On most of the others it is a little on each side so it's not so obvious.
Well, it is costing me $70 to ship the rods back UPS 3 Day select. $22 of that is insurance (for ($2500) and I had to pay extra $5 for a UPS pickup since they will not let me drop them off locally with that much insurance. The UPS Employee driver has to verify they are packaged properly etc and sign for the package in case I need to make a claim.
These Guys are in the buisness of taking money in. Nobody has offered to return any money to compensate me. If I had anything to do with making these rods I would be ashamed. They could have very easily blown up my motor (25K) and who knows how many other rods they sent out like this. I think I was told they do stuff for NASCAR. I doubt that now. I would expect they would be black listed. Word would get around.
I would 100% ask for my money back and get different rods. Crower has some that would be a close replacement as far as weight and strength. But they are impossible to deal with. So, I am stuck. ANY different rod will require the crank to be rebalanced and may not clear the block and require more clearancing etc. There will be way too much rework if you think about it. All 8 Rods hit the oil pan and required clearance notches and I had to notch the crap out of the oil pump pickup but did get it to clear etc... With new rods much of this may be a no-go. These rods were in fact custom built with a very compact big end to help out with all of that.
I will let them fix them and will see what we get. I am hoping they tighten up the OAL variance a bit. I ended up with a length variance of .004 and that is no good. I am hoping that the pin fit screwed that up and if they redo them that will be good.
Posted By: b1dartsport
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/21/10 05:07 PM
Quote:
Well, I am finishing taking the motor apart today.
So, what is wrong with this picture?? And NO, it is not trick photography.
Makes me mad as a hornet. I paid $2500 for these rods and this is what I get. The length is varied by .0025" and I have only measured 4 so far. I think something like .0005 would be more like it. Maybe I am wrong.
If it were me,I would send them back & ask for a full refund. That is absurd. I have not been involved in a huge amount of builds but I have never seen new rods that bad. At the price you paid, I would think its time to look elsewhere.
Posted By: b1dartsport
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/21/10 05:16 PM
Sorry,did not see final posts,before my reply. I truly feel sorry for you. I know what its like to spend top buck & feel confident you did the right thing & get screwed. I think everyone here would like to see if they make it right.
Posted By: 1Fast340
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/21/10 05:37 PM
man this sucks, hope they do you right on this..
if i would go for some real highend custom rods i would have a look at these
http://www.autoverdi.com/rods.htmlbut i understand they are on the wrong side of a quite big puddle of water from you
Posted By: Leigh
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/21/10 05:55 PM
Ron, I meant that the checking procedure you used, should be included in any builders checklist.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/21/10 06:03 PM
Jim, Ryan decided to use bolts in the mains. Or maybe I did not tell him I wanted studs? LOL I can't remember. But I am OK with Bolts. I do not see a huge advantage with studs. If I was on a tight budget I would run it with the original bolts, no problem. These are really nice ARP bolts and I like them. One benifit is they clear the OIL PP without any mods.
Matt, Ryan saw the pic I posted and told me he thinks the pin fit is what screwed the rods up. So they were probably perfect until the setup for the pin fit got jacked up (the pin fit guy should be fired). They just need new bushings and a pin fit. The only question is will the new bushings fit as nice as the originals or do they go for oversize bushings and a new bushing fit. I already made it clear I do not want ANY compromises at this point. I believe Ryan is looking out for me and is planning on making sure everything works out. I have not talked to R&R myself. Ryan is handling everything for me.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/21/10 06:17 PM
Quote:
Ron, I meant that the checking procedure you used, should be included in any builders checklist.
Leigh, I agree with you. As well, I made some assumptions and so did others right down to the Guy who screwed up the rods and the Guy who shipped them and the owner of the company. But you are never too old to learn. I learned that it would not hurt to measure a few basic things and maybe to only use well established scources with a good reputation for the important stuff.
Like the Bryant Crank. The rod journals vary no more than .0002 from one to another or in any other dimention. And that could easily be microscopic crap on the micrometer anvils.
Posted By: 1_WILD_RT
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/21/10 06:18 PM
A test I use to check rods is to bolt two onto a rod journal then pass a piston pin through the small end.. If there is any twist/lenght variance/pin hole anglularity the pin won't pass through both rods at the same time.. I was taught this while working on large Diesels & in that case there is a large end pin tool that is the diameter of the rod big end with no bearing so you don't need to bolt them to a journal just pass both pins through the rods.. You can check a full set of rods in five minutes easily..
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/21/10 07:28 PM
I believe the bushings were honed on a Diamond hone & it was a setup error & hopefully it will just require a re-bush on the rods. We'll know as soon as rods get back to R&R & they get to measure them. I only removed one from a box to use to mock up for block clearancing, & did a quick deck height measurement W/ no rings on & did not notice the issue.
I've never seen a set of rods off like that, but if it's made by man it can be screwed up LOL.
Ron you will get compensated for the shipping, either by R&R or me, if they won't. Until they have rods back in hand to measure/look @ I don't have alot of room to argue with them about anything yet. You & I know stuff is screwed up, but until they see it, it's just hearsay to them. But I'm sure Mike will take care of it.... Otherwise he can look forward to some nasty press in the Car Craft Article I'm sure LOL
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/27/10 02:36 AM
Well, I was hoping to keep it simple and use a normal internal oil pump and pickup. That was one reason to use a 2" journal rod with a compact BE and 3/8 bolts.
And I just made it. I can't believe this did not brake through. I also checked to make sure it is not paper thin by firmly pushing a small screwdriver into the area of concern.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/27/10 02:37 AM
Had some heavy wall cromoly tube laying around......
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/27/10 02:38 AM
Ready to go.
Posted By: 65signet
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 02/27/10 08:50 PM
Posted By: POS Dakota
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 03/11/10 12:27 PM
Hear anything about the rods yet?
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 03/11/10 06:32 PM
The Rods are fixed. They are just waiting on new Bolts. I was being a butt head and insisted on new Bolts. They are going to ship them directly back to me and Ryan is shipping me new Rod Bearings and new wire locks.
If they did what they said, then they were fixed the right way. They rebored and honed the steel and then made a custom bushing and installed and pinfitted. Should be good as new
Posted By: POS Dakota
Re: UH-Oh LOOK WHAT HAPPENED.......... - 03/11/10 10:09 PM
Quote:
The Rods are fixed. They are just waiting on new Bolts. I was being a butt head and insisted on new Bolts. They are going to ship them directly back to me and Ryan is shipping me new Rod Bearings and new wire locks.
If they did what they said, then they were fixed the right way. They rebored and honed the steel and then made a custom bushing and installed and pinfitted. Should be good as new
Buttheads are almost always products of their environment. At least that's my excuse.
Glad to see you'll soon be back on track.
Oh, and LOL at the little lightened gusset on the oil pickup. Classic.
Posted By: Ron Silva
ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/24/10 12:34 AM
Well, It absolutely KILLS me to say this.
But, we got the rods back and after some careful measureing and subsequent detailed mockup in the motor, these R&R connecting rods are junk!
I took the worst rod and mocked it up in the motor and still had .010 slope from front to back.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/24/10 12:35 AM
Then I turned the rod around and left the piston facing the same way.
Posted By: Moparnut426
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/24/10 12:42 AM
MAN ID BE FREEKIN PIZZED!!!!!!
I Whats the deal?? Maybee you can get a refund and buy tome custom Oliver, or Crower stuff? I hate to see ya have such problems.
Hope ya get her fixed up.
Kasey
Posted By: MattW
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/24/10 01:31 AM
Quote:
Well, It absolutely KILLS me to say this.
But, we got the rods back and after some careful measureing and subsequent detailed mockup in the motor, these R&R connecting rods are junk!
I took the worst rod and mocked it up in the motor and still had .010 slope from front to back.
Get your money back an order the Manley rods Matt
Posted By: Devilbrad
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/24/10 01:59 AM
How far off were they before? Possible the big end is bad also? What about bearings, have you double checked the bearing thickness across it's surface?
Posted By: b1dartsport
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/24/10 02:24 AM
Man I really feel sorry for you! I know by watching your build that you are a perfectionist. What really burns me is that after the "mistake" on the original machining of these rods,they have the seeds to send them to you like this the 2nd time. Did they even check them in the fixture? That sucks
Posted By: Moparnut426
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/24/10 02:37 AM
I know, Wouldnt that make ya crazy mad Randy..
My engine is nothing compaired to this monster, but Im checkin, and recheckin everything to make sure nothing is like his, man its sad to see his troubles.
Posted By: PUNK
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/24/10 04:38 AM
THOSE RODS SUUUUUUUCKKKKK!!!!!!!!!!!! Words cannot even describe how ticked off I would be. For the money spent on those rods, there is no reason that these rods should have this problem. I understand minor machining flaws and a company making good on the problems, but this is ridiculous!! I have found many components having small issues from some very reputable companies but I catch the problem, notify the manufacturer and they have always addressed my issues. To this day I have not had the unfortunate opportunity to have what happened to Ron, happen to me. I really hope that after a failed attempt at trying to repair a poorly manufactured component, that the company will refund the money. Im ticked off and Im not the one that has spent the dough and time putting this engine together.
Posted By: 9 Sec Phill
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/24/10 06:11 AM
Sorry to hear Ron, Im sure you will get it figured out.....Phill PS, good luck at MATS
Posted By: POS Dakota
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/24/10 03:05 PM
So they corrected your incorrect rods even more incorrectly?
I'm sorry man. I would have to go with another rod at this point, while going after them with a vengeance.
That's just crap no one spending this amount of money should be subjected to.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/24/10 03:40 PM
If you think about it NOBODY wants to rework their product. These rods clearly show this. They just thrashed them out and sent them back to me with little care or attention to detail. They even dropped one of the rods and did not even bother to deburr it where they dinged it and they did a really terrible job of packaging them and I don't think they even insured them.
In fact, when they came back, they were better but no where near what would be acceptable. Before, most if not all were +.007 on the one side (chamfer) and -.007 on the other side for a slope of .014 .....Now, the worst one is shown above, .010 slope. The next best one would probably be about .005 slope (based on my measurments,still not good enough) and the 2 best ones would probably be within .001 slope with a few in between. So I could probably use 2 of them after they were supposedly fixed.
Yes, these Rods from R&R Racing Products will never go in my Motor. Now I have to do a complete teardown to the bare block and rebalance the crank, AS WELL AS wait 6-8 weeks for a new set of rods (if I am lucky).
NEVER use these Guys : R&R Racing Products or R & R Connecting Rods
http://www.rrconnectingrods.com/
Posted By: patrick
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/24/10 04:09 PM
what about HRC (Howards Racing Components)? they offer reasonable price billet rods, I haven't heard anything bad about their quality control...
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/24/10 05:27 PM
I'm ordering Carillo A beams for it.... & crank will go back to Bryant for re-balance, but I'm going to try to get Carrillo to get the Big End/Small End weights as close as possible to the R&R's
Real shame, those R&R's look like a very nice piece, but seems they can't hold a tolerance to save their lives. It's funny because they actually sent the rods out the second time to have ANOTHER shop "try" to straighten out the pin ends... & apparently second shop could'nt get them correct either.
I hav'nt had rods back in my hands since I first shipped them to Ron, but will put them on the Sunnen when they get back here for some measurements before I send them back to R&R for a refund.
Posted By: MIKES_DUSTER
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/24/10 05:36 PM
Ryan,
WILL R&R refund Rons money in FULL??
Posted By: Moparnut426
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/24/10 05:37 PM
i WOULD HOPE SO!!!
Posted By: Gavin
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/24/10 05:51 PM
Awesome build, can't wait to see it finished, but I feel your pain on the rods. It's bad enough buyer cheaper parts and them not being right but top dollar rods should be PERFECT every time, no question. And on top of that, you would think that if they did screw up they would move mountains to make it right and compensate you to boot.
I hope they see this thread cos it doesn't sound like they will be getting any more Mopar business - shame on them.
Only consolation I can say is that when you finally have the motor together right this will fade away somewhat and be replaced by the big SMILE on your face!!
Posted By: Joshs68
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/24/10 06:01 PM
it's always very frustrating dealing with issues in life like this. may not always be a connecting rod but its still the same game.I will never understand how some companies/people can push off B/S and think others should just take it.
Ron, I hope you have better luck with your build from here on out. It sure looks like Ryan is the type of guy that goes the extra mile, always allot better when you have somebody like that on your side.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/24/10 06:51 PM
Quote:
It sure looks like Ryan is the type of guy that goes the extra mile, always allot better when you have somebody like that on your side.
Also , "" And on top of that, you would think that if they did screw up they would move mountains to make it right and compensate you to boot.""
This is to enlighten you on how humble Ryan is.....I had a hard time stretching the rod bolts to .006-.0064 thousands because I stretch EVERY bolt one at a time with the stretch gauge installed. Those custom age 625+ bolts are monsters. I had to weld extra metal on my special tool I fabbed up TWICE because it kept bending. This is a 7/16".
Anyhow I asked that the bolts be replaced because I was a very small amount uncertain whether I got some too close to the yeild point with all the struggling trying to keep the motor from moving and the stretch gauge moving around and so on.
That's all I asked for and R&R Refused. So Ryan paid for them and never even told me. I found a reciept for $417.00 in with the rods that they had the balls to charge. That is lower than whale DoDo.
I had the motor together and I was happy with it and it was completely their fault that it had to come apart. The LEAST they could do is start me out with like new parts. Instead I get rods that were obviously not well cared for and Ryan had to PAY for new bolts.
Thanks Ryan.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/24/10 06:52 PM
Another
Posted By: justinp61
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/24/10 07:11 PM
Isn't there going to be a magazine article on this engine? You'd think R&R would do their best to avoid any bad publicity.
Posted By: QuickBpBp
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/24/10 10:45 PM
Quote:
Isn't there going to be a magazine article on this engine? You'd think R&R would do their best to avoid any bad publicity.
You might get all the money back if that's the case...sending a link to THIS thread would probably help...
Sorry to see all the problems..
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/24/10 11:24 PM
Quote:
Ryan,
WILL R&R refund Rons money in FULL??
Well, I sure hope so.... all I can tell you is the new Carrillo's won't cost Ron a cent... but sometimes it's not all about $ & cents... this whole ordeal has cost him lots of down time & wasted labor etc. But I think in end it will be a much nicer/safer motor with a set of Carrillo's in it. I was worried about those R&R's from day I pulled them out of boxes, they looked a bit "spindly" in the beam area from a side view... I think they would have lived, but would always be in back of my mind, & now the machining errors just threw their use completely out window.
Posted By: Pale_Roader
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/25/10 01:20 PM
WOW. I've read good novels that weren't the page-turners this thread was...
That is absolutely crazy about those rods. I read that, and then i read the even sadder follow-up, and all i can think about is that other thread (and many others like it) where guys are complaining that they shouldn't have to do basic checks on a new set ov $1000 Chinese aluminum heads before bolting them on...
I'm a details kind ov guy, i can go crazy over the details, but reading this stuff i think i'd be far too paranoid to be an engine-builder.
Also, i read about the miniscule rod length variances on those RR's, and i'm reminded ov the last set ov LY rods i measured where the longest in one engine was 5/16" longer than the shortest...
Maybe its just me... but has anyone else reading this had a passing thought ov painting this thing orange, putting on some stock VC's, maybe a super-creative intake and putting this in a F.A.S.T. car...??? I'm sure the judges wouldn't notice... . . .
Posted By: Dave Watt
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/25/10 01:30 PM
Very interesting thread. Being a machinist by trade, all I can think is that they are honing the rods by hand rather than in a fixture on a machine which would make the big and little end bores perpendicular to the rest of the rod. Honing by hand would be OK for a daily driver but not for a high horspower, close tolerance engine.
Posted By: Moparnut426
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/25/10 01:33 PM
Quote:
WOW. I've read good novels that weren't the page-turners this thread was...
That is absolutely crazy about those rods. I read that, and then i read the even sadder follow-up, and all i can think about is that other thread (and many others like it) where guys are complaining that they shouldn't have to do basic checks on a new set ov $1000 Chinese aluminum heads before bolting them on...
He couldnt, the block has been heavily modified externally for weight savings, and its not stock appearing.
Otherwise a good idea!!
I'm a details kind ov guy, i can go crazy over the details, but reading this stuff i think i'd be far too paranoid to be an engine-builder.
Also, i read about the miniscule rod length variances on those RR's, and i'm reminded ov the last set ov LY rods i measured where the longest in one engine was 5/16" longer than the shortest...
Maybe its just me... but has anyone else reading this had a passing thought ov painting this thing orange, putting on some stock VC's, maybe a super-creative intake and putting this in a F.A.S.T. car...??? I'm sure the judges wouldn't notice... . . .
the block isnt stock appearing, but its a good idea.
I dont think a "stock" block will fit those guts.
Kasey
Posted By: Pale_Roader
Re: ANOTHER SETBACK . - 03/25/10 02:22 PM
Quote:
Quote:
WOW. I've read good novels that weren't the page-turners this thread was...
That is absolutely crazy about those rods. I read that, and then i read the even sadder follow-up, and all i can think about is that other thread (and many others like it) where guys are complaining that they shouldn't have to do basic checks on a new set ov $1000 Chinese aluminum heads before bolting them on...
He couldnt, the block has been heavily modified externally for weight savings, and its not stock appearing.
Otherwise a good idea!!
I'm a details kind ov guy, i can go crazy over the details, but reading this stuff i think i'd be far too paranoid to be an engine-builder.
Also, i read about the miniscule rod length variances on those RR's, and i'm reminded ov the last set ov LY rods i measured where the longest in one engine was 5/16" longer than the shortest...
Maybe its just me... but has anyone else reading this had a passing thought ov painting this thing orange, putting on some stock VC's, maybe a super-creative intake and putting this in a F.A.S.T. car...??? I'm sure the judges wouldn't notice... . . .
the block isnt stock appearing, but its a good idea.
I dont think a "stock" block will fit those guts.
Kasey
Oh i fully realize this, but the mind gets to thinkin'...
Man, how much fun i could have if i was rich...
Posted By: Ron Silva
It's FINISHED! - 07/03/10 11:57 PM
I finished the 501 today. It took almost exactly 11 months!
Who wants to put it on the dyno??
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/04/10 12:02 AM
Quote:
I finished the 501 today. It took almost exactly 11 months!
Who wants to put it on the dyno??
Damn, it`s about time.......looks great and I have a ROLLING dyno we can use.
what did you use for lifters ?????????
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/04/10 01:15 AM
We finally got the lifters that were promised to us, something like 8 months ago, from the people that took over Crane Cams (Ryan, correct me if I am wrong).
They are a little unconventional in that they do not have all that shrouding over over the lifter wheel. I think the OEM's and aftermarket want that depending on the Block. Depending on how big the oil gallery feed/intersection is. With the R3 48 Deg block the lifter is dry or the machinest puts the oil feed in and it is precise and controlled and usually a lot smaller. So there are no issues uncovering the oil gallery. Also the semi edge orfice/oil feed is on the side, away from the block oil feed so it will never intersect and overfeed the pushrod.
These are a short travel lifter with race valving. The plunger only has .050 travel and they want them preloaded .012 to .025. I am at .025 because I ordered my Pushrods slightly too long.
This is basically a race hydraulic roller mopar lifter with a straight Small block Chevy link bar. C/C is 1.56, same as Small Block Chevy.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/04/10 01:17 AM
These also use a spiral lock and washer to retain the plunger. Looks really strong.
Posted By: fishy340
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/04/10 01:48 AM
one of the nicest lookin a body's out there..still have the magazine w ur valiant...good luck
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/04/10 03:13 AM
Quote:
We finally got the lifters that were promised to us, something like 8 months ago, from the people that took over Crane Cams (Ryan, correct me if I am wrong).
They are a little unconventional in that they do not have all that shrouding over over the lifter wheel. I think the OEM's and aftermarket want that depending on the Block. Depending on how big the oil gallery feed/intersection is. With the R3 48 Deg block the lifter is dry or the machinest puts the oil feed in and it is precise and controlled and usually a lot smaller. So there are no issues uncovering the oil gallery. Also the semi edge orfice/oil feed is on the side, away from the block oil feed so it will never intersect and overfeed the pushrod.
These are a short travel lifter with race valving. The plunger only has .050 travel and they want them preloaded .012 to .025. I am at .025 because I ordered my Pushrods slightly too long.
Ron you did'nt measure the pushrods so that the lifter would be pre-loaded with adjuster all way backed off did you? T&D actually wants the adjuster down about 1- 1 1/4 turn from backed all way back out.... If you had them right length in that 1 1/4 turn range, you could easily knock .013" out of your preload... (then they might be about 1 tune from all way backed out) But probabbly won't be big deal.... sometimes on those hyd rollers they just sound little quieter with more or less pre-load so it's nice to be able to have free range of adjustment for that reason.
Yes those are new GS Products Crane Ultra Pros with restricted plunger travel, he also has more street friendly/lower RPM ones with more plunger travel if needed.... & I think you are right we waited about 8 months to get them made. But my opinion is, they are the best Hyd roller lifter body on the planet (& only 48* Mopar out there)
Quote:
I finished the 501 today. It took almost exactly 11 months!
Who wants to put it on the dyno??
You know we're available!! Who is doing the article?
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/04/10 06:32 AM
Quote:
Quote:
I finished the 501 today. It took almost exactly 11 months!
Who wants to put it on the dyno??
You know we're available!! Who is doing the article?
John McGann of Car Craft Magazine was supposed to do a big stroker small block shootout between Ford/Mopar/Chevy. But last time I E-Mailed him he did not respond. Plus I do not think he wanted to dyno it anyways. Just pics and specs.
I figure if you or Steve wanted to dyno it I may let it happen. I do not have headers or a redundant ignition or carburator (yet), but could come up with plug wires if needed.
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I finished the 501 today. It took almost exactly 11 months!
Who wants to put it on the dyno??
You know we're available!! Who is doing the article?
John McGann of Car Craft Magazine was supposed to do a big stroker small block shootout between Ford/Mopar/Chevy. But last time I E-Mailed him he did not respond. Plus I do not think he wanted to dyno it anyways. Just pics and specs.
I figure if you or Steve wanted to dyno it I may let it happen. I do not have headers or a redundant ignition or carburator (yet), but could come up with plug wires if needed.
We have an MSD digital 6/HVC coil and good wires. Also have TTI 1 7/8 headers, and some others.
You'll get better #'s from Westech I guarantee that!!
I just calibrated our dyno and it was spot on with what DTS outlines.
We're doing another build with John, but he's been out of town on assignments alot so he's very busy and has to basicly list things of importance and go from there. Plus, he's not in total control of what he gets to do.
But he's a very nice guy and easy to deal with. I'm sure if you document everything well and take good pics he'll find a way to run the story.
He uses alot of my pics.
I know Steve is probably closer to you Ron, so I understand if you take it there. Just thought I'd pimp us a little
Posted By: PUNK
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/04/10 08:00 PM
I have a brand new 950hp that was custom built from PC Carb for Dougs new engine. That should do the job if you need a starter carb! Its got the billet metering block and all the bells and whistles. Lets make a trip to Indio Ron!!!
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/05/10 04:05 AM
I am sorry, but I probably will not dyno the motor. I thought about it but I do not have anything pressing me to do it. I would rather take my time and put the motor in the Valiant and build the headers and get it running.
One other thing that happened resently I want to touch on. There is NOTHING I like more than taking a fully assymbled motor and having to GRIND on something inside it.
It seems Indy's Crap Machine Work got me too. The #2/7 cylinder Exhaust PR hole is out of place on these heads. Indy 360-1 245RP CNC heads. I was adjusting the lifter preload and thought something felt funny when I depressed the rocker and compressed the lifter plunger and moving the Pushrod. Felt kind of scrunchy. After careful examination I discovered the PR hole is offset toards the center of the motor and the pushrod is hitting. ALL others are centered and I had already checked this and everything seemed good. I had already mocked up TWICE and everything looked good and I know Ryan already did it once too as he remarked about the PR clearance. I was going to live with it because it did not seem that bad,,,,,,,but I then realised that the interfearence was actually pushing the whole rocker over and that would have been a disaster if I had run it. SO..........out comes the die grinder with a 4" long alumimum cutter after careful Prep with rags and so on and using the shop vac to catch as much as possible. Of course you cannot get it all and had to clean up what I could and hope the oil filter gets the rest..................Oh well. Live and learn. That is a good head but somehow they cannot get everything right no matter what! #@$%&@#
Posted By: TiMopar
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/05/10 11:31 AM
If that engine runs a good as it looks, you will be well happy!
Posted By: POS Dakota
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/05/10 04:43 PM
Quote:
I am sorry, but I probably will not dyno the motor. I thought about it but I do not have anything pressing me to do it. I would rather take my time and put the motor in the Valiant and build the headers and get it running.
One other thing that happened resently I want to touch on. There is NOTHING I like more than taking a fully assymbled motor and having to GRIND on something inside it.
It seems Indy's Crap Machine Work got me too. The #2/7 cylinder Exhaust PR hole is out of place on these heads. Indy 360-1 245RP CNC heads. I was adjusting the lifter preload and thought something felt funny when I depressed the rocker and compressed the lifter plunger and moving the Pushrod. Felt kind of scrunchy. After careful examination I discovered the PR hole is offset toards the center of the motor and the pushrod is hitting. ALL others are centered and I had already checked this and everything seemed good. I had already mocked up TWICE and everything looked good and I know Ryan already did it once too as he remarked about the PR clearance. I was going to live with it because it did not seem that bad,,,,,,,but I then realised that the interfearence was actually pushing the whole rocker over and that would have been a disaster if I had run it. SO..........out comes the die grinder with a 4" long alumimum cutter after careful Prep with rags and so on and using the shop vac to catch as much as possible. Of course you cannot get it all and had to clean up what I could and hope the oil filter gets the rest..................Oh well. Live and learn. That is a good head but somehow they cannot get everything right no matter what! #@$%&@#
Man...the problem with any metal in there is that if it makes it through the engine it's probably going to sit right at the hole to every journal and scrape things up until it's small enough to make it in and scratch the hell out of stuff.
Thw pictured bearings were out of my 360.
A frew magnum rocker bearings ate themselves for some reason and then caused the roller tips to cut into the shoulder seizing them. All this metal had no problem travelling through the oil and making me rather sad on the next oil change. scratched up the crank pretty good and the bearings speak for themselves. The result was that the oil pressure was randomly dropping to nothing at a 750 rpm idle with anything thinner than 20w50. lol
I'm not telling you anything you dont already know, but I'm just sayin!
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/06/10 01:00 AM
Took a couple more pics. Here you go.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/06/10 01:01 AM
one more
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/06/10 01:01 AM
last w/Vacuum PP hose.
Posted By: 63CandyMatic
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/06/10 02:31 AM
Great looking motor, and nice pics to boot!! Those are nicer than our family portraits!
Posted By: Troy
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/06/10 06:20 AM
Hi Ron, looks like all is well with you.
I work with a friend of mine Ford engine (before anybody starts bashing, 1225HP and that is motor only,
) we have played with push rods the entire life of this combo. We run a tapered 7/16 to 3/8 push rod. What we started to do was painted the push rods with diecome (sp?) where they pass through the heads. We will run .030 clearance all the way around the rod and only after some hard pulls, we would see where the push rods were rubbing the heads (the joys of 1000lbs open pressure) The point I'm trying to make is, and I know you know this, it is a heck of a lot easier to figure out small problems on a dyno than in a car. Dyno the motor Ron!!
Posted By: cogen80
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/06/10 01:20 PM
Quote:
Of course you cannot get it all and had to clean up what I could and hope the oil filter gets the rest....
for real? all that time and money and your gonna HOPE the oil filter gets it ? oh man thats just crazy if you ask me.
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/06/10 03:16 PM
That Jones Drive mandrel pulley stuff looks like it ended up pretty nice
I just used one of those E brock Water pumps recently for 1st time as well & they are by far nicest mechanical out there, now that the MP Nascar unit is gone. Looks good.....
Any debris left in engine has to go through filter to get to bearings. & Knowing Ron, I highly doubt there really was any debris he missed, I think he just said that in case there was one tiny little sliver etc that somehow escaped his eyesight. I've done the grind for P rod clearance with head on motor before in a bind time wise etc before & never had it be an issue, with proper care/cleanliness when grinding.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/06/10 05:36 PM
Quote:
Any debris left in engine has to go through filter to get to bearings. & Knowing Ron, I highly doubt there really was any debris he missed, I think he just said that in case there was one tiny little sliver etc that somehow escaped his eyesight. I've done the grind for P rod clearance with head on motor before in a bind time wise etc before & never had it be an issue, with proper care/cleanliness when grinding.
EXACTLY!
Posted By: MIKES_DUSTER
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/06/10 05:58 PM
Hey Ron...Motor looks GREAT!!!! Just curious what it weighs...Will you weigh it??
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/06/10 06:46 PM
Quote:
Hey Ron...Motor looks GREAT!!!! Just curious what it weighs...Will you weigh it??
That is a good question. Because I have done a lot to reduce weight. I used all the titanium Bolts I have been hoarding on this project. And, I have bought a few more. For instance the 6-1/2" Underhead length bolts on the Pass side of the water pump cost $27 each. But when you pick up and hold a bolt like that in Titanium, it is freaky light. Almost seems like PLASTIC.
I have no good way to weigh the engine. My best guess is I will be losing about 60 pounds changing engines. My car was 3115 with me in it at Vegas and resently it showed 3160 with me in it at Fontana. But is Vegas it was out of gas! LOL. The fuel pump fell silent in the shutdown area! Doh!
I will tell you this, I have no problem grabbing the bar that turns the engine on the stand (with 2 hands)and lifting that end of the engine to move it over when I am trying to position it in the garage.
I will post what I believe the weight reduction to be when I re-weigh the car in the future. With this new Engine, now I can start pigging out. Where's them RIBS!
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/06/10 06:52 PM
Ron, just curious, is there any particular reason you ran the vacuum pump line all way over to pass side of motor? (just would have looked alot cleaner over on drivers side)
I'm already making plans to come out to Vegas for the MATS race next year for 1st time, so hopefully I can see that beauty & meet you in person.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/06/10 07:04 PM
You are not going to believe this. But I sat the Valve cover on the bench and got distracted and then ended up cutting the hole in the WRONG END! So, the only way would be to plug it or have it at the back of the drivers side or the front of the pass side. I agree with you 100%, but it would have required tighter bends in the fittings. As it is I think the gentle bends and ease of installation are slightly better. But look like crap. But if you think about it, when it's installed in the car it will not be as big an issue with the bathtub for the air cleaner etc.
I put a full size baffle under that breather and it has 2 layers of the stringy material inside as well. I hope to provide the "dry air" to the vacuum pump as required.
Below is a pic of the current setp to compare.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/06/10 07:42 PM
inside
Posted By: 69B3GT
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/06/10 07:42 PM
Isnt fontana doing night races on the 17th?
Thats one bad motor to go with a really clean car
Posted By: 65signet
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/06/10 08:18 PM
Are you still planning on coming to Sacramento in Sept for the Mopar race?, looking forward to seeing the car again and hearing that motor run.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/06/10 08:54 PM
I really want to make that race. So, when I get home from Woodburn I will thrash and try to get the new engine in and the headers built and get it running. I think I will probably not make it, but you never know. I am going to try. That is one of my favorite races.
I even prefabbed the upper radiator hookup to save time. The upper is going to be different. I hope it works. It should be close enough.
I have tomorrow and the next day off and I am actually thinking of doing some prefab work on the headers.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/06/10 08:56 PM
Quote:
Are you still planning on coming to Sacramento in Sept for the Mopar race?, looking forward to seeing the car again and hearing that motor run.
PS: I noticed in ND , your Daughter won some races. Mental note to self. "Do NOT" line up next to the Pink Valiant................
Posted By: 65signet
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/06/10 09:17 PM
She will be racing this year in the ET finals at Sacramento in the Sportsman Class
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: It's FINISHED! - 07/06/10 09:25 PM
Quote:
She will be racing this year in the ET finals at Sacramento in the Sportsman Class
SWEET! I only talked to her for 2 minutes last year and I am proud of her. I am sure you are too!
Posted By: Ron Silva
I THOUGHT THIS DAY WOULD NEVER COME ! - 07/23/10 05:37 PM
I got home from Woodburn on Tuesday and.............I dropped the 501 in the Valiant yesterday evening. I will now build headers (about 3 weeks) and then see if she blows up! LOL
Posted By: Randy..
Re: I THOUGHT THIS DAY WOULD NEVER COME ! - 07/23/10 05:46 PM
Posted By: 65signet
Re: I THOUGHT THIS DAY WOULD NEVER COME ! - 07/23/10 06:10 PM
Are you building those out of stainless?
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: I THOUGHT THIS DAY WOULD NEVER COME ! - 07/23/10 11:36 PM
I am making my headers out of Mild steel. Stainless is a pain in the butt. You either have to back purge the tubes with argon when you weld them or apply flux to the inside of the tubes before you weld. Plus it is harder on all your tools etc. I guess if you work with it a lot, it is not so bad.
These are going to be 1-7/8 X 2 X 2-1/8 with merged collectors.
Posted By: Ron Silva
ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/05/10 03:35 AM
.....
Posted By: MIKES_DUSTER
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/05/10 03:39 AM
Quote:
.....
Can ya make some for me???? 
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/05/10 04:03 AM
Quote:
Can ya make some for me????
When I retire I will make you some.
It took 10 minutes to install after I got done taking that pic.
Of course the car was already up on jack stands
Posted By: 9 Sec Phill
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/05/10 04:45 AM
Ron,
You couldnt buy a set of headers for your car?....Phill
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/05/10 05:53 AM
The only headers I had any experience with are the TTI's. W2/W5 X 1-7/8 But they would cover part of the center ports. I actually used the TTI flanges but had to completely rework the center ports and all the bolt holes were oversize, so I had to rework that too. Plus most one piece headers are a PITA to install. So, in the long run it's better for me to make my own.
Posted By: topbrent
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/05/10 09:48 AM
Ron,
Looking good!
What are the tube lengths on your headers?
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/05/10 02:57 PM
Quote:
Ron,
Looking good!
What are the tube lengths on your headers?
Long, and F-ing long! LOL Well, I shoot for the shortest tube to be no shorter than 34" (since I have an automatic trans). On that header above, the #8 cyl would be the shortest and I measured it at roughly 40", so I am good. The ones that go through the K-Member are 50+ inches, probably something like 55"
There is another reason I built these headers. I welded the V-Band rings to the collectors and assymbled them to the secondary exhaust system in the exact same place as the crate motor collectors were. That way the headers and engines will directly interchange with no secondary exhaust mods. It also gives me a solid, repeatable location to build each tube to. That is extremely important when building headers.
There is a method to my madness 
Posted By: 9 Sec Phill
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/05/10 05:49 PM
They just look so close to the inner apron that when you power on it might hit it...The front tube on the old cuda hit the apron and dented the tube in two places, one for on motor and one a little farther back and a harder dent from use with the NOS. Just would hate to see you scrathin up the paint. I know your not new at this. Cant wait to see what this thing lays down for a #...Im saying 9.2X's all over the track......Phill
Posted By: 1Fast340
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/05/10 10:27 PM
Quote:
Quote:
.....
Can ya make some for me????
i gues that design pictured could easily be reverseenginered for production with a basic mandrelbending machine, wouldnt need to be a cnc or/and boostassisted bender or anyting special, just a good mandrelbender with the right equipment for making a program for it and opereted buy someone who is good at it, there could be some money in that just a few trial and error tubes to get the settup right
looks real good,cant wait to here a testdrive report on this beast
Posted By: 65signet
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/05/10 11:40 PM
Looking good!
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/11/10 04:34 PM
Finished the other header last night and reinstalled it on the car. Now I have all day today to let it eat.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/11/10 04:36 PM
2
Posted By: Moparnut426
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/11/10 04:55 PM
Whats it look like in the car? The front 2 tubes must go under the K member? Hows the starter clearance, Do ya have to remove any tubes to get it out?
Kasey
Posted By: 1Fast340
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/11/10 08:47 PM
thats some nice headerwork
very nice quality work going on there. what brand of vacuum pump is that?
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/12/10 02:08 AM
Engine was born at 4:30 PM California time today.
Posted By: Moparnut426
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/12/10 03:21 AM
Quote:
Engine was born at 4:30 PM California time today.
Congrats, Is it a boy or a Girl?
Did it scream right away or did the little guy have to get stretched out and awake first.
Kasey
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/12/10 04:23 AM
Definately a Girl.
Funny thing, I have static timed 1000 engines and when I got this engine running it was REALLY acting up. It wanted start hard and did not want to idle, but would run OK and rev OK and all that. I had a hard time because it would not idle. When I FINALLY was able to get the timing light on it, it was at something like 130 deg advanced. [Edited by Moparts - Family Friendly Site - Keep it clean]?? Every time I tried to back the timing down it would stall and backfire out the carb??? Totally perplexed I decided to start from scratch and static time it once again............WELL, I THEN discovered that I had two plug wires crossed, AND they happened to be the #1 and the #3....Doh! So I was timing off #3. What are the odds.
Now she just PURRS!
Posted By: all spooled up
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/12/10 04:28 AM
Posted By: GregCon
Re: It's FINISHED! - 08/12/10 04:53 AM
I haven't read all the posts, and it's not my place, but aren't those headers very, very small in terms of collector diameter and length?
Posted By: GregCon
Re: It's FINISHED! - 08/12/10 05:15 AM
I have torqued lots of rod bolts and I think you are doing it the hard way.
Here's my routine, if you want it, keep reading!
1)Lube liberally all surfaces that touch any other surfaces, not just the threads, with ARP lube. It makes a difference in both torque and stretch stability values.
2) Use your dial gauge to measure length with no torque.
3) Remove the gauge, set it aside carefully.
4) Torque the bolts up to about 70 lbs in 10 lbs increments, swapping sides each time. Use a high quality 1/2 drive torque wrench.
5) Recheck length with gauge and then remove, etc, increasing torque until you get to the desired stretch.
Leaving the gauge in place and using a 2 ft long wrench is asking for misery. It's also fairly dangerous.
I know what you'll say - taking the gauge off is inviting inaccuracy. But, once you do it a few times you'll realize the gauge is stable enough it is staying accurate.
I also don't agree that you need or want previously un-stretched bolts....if you torque and loosen those bolts five times you'll find they take a 'set' and eventually settle down to a repeatable stretch. That tells me their initial stretch, if that's all you do, is going to relax after a while.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: It's FINISHED! - 08/12/10 07:57 AM
Quote:
I have torqued lots of rod bolts and I think you are doing it the hard way.
Here's my routine, if you want it, keep reading!
1)Lube liberally all surfaces that touch any other surfaces, not just the threads, with ARP lube. It makes a difference in both torque and stretch stability values.
2) Use your dial gauge to measure length with no torque.
3) Remove the gauge, set it aside carefully.
4) Torque the bolts up to about 70 lbs in 10 lbs increments, swapping sides each time. Use a high quality 1/2 drive torque wrench.
5) Recheck length with gauge and then remove, etc, increasing torque until you get to the desired stretch.
Leaving the gauge in place and using a 2 ft long wrench is asking for misery. It's also fairly dangerous.
I know what you'll say - taking the gauge off is inviting inaccuracy. But, once you do it a few times you'll realize the gauge is stable enough it is staying accurate.
I also don't agree that you need or want previously un-stretched bolts....if you torque and loosen those bolts five times you'll find they take a 'set' and eventually settle down to a repeatable stretch. That tells me their initial stretch, if that's all you do, is going to relax after a while.
I 100% agree with you as long as you measure EACH bolt as you go. I in fact did a variation of what you say on a couple of mine. Two or 3 times I got just shy of the desired .006-.0064 and to get a small movement and get another .0002 or .0003 is extremely hard with my makeshift wrench. So I would remove the gauge and use a long breaker bar with a socket to turn the bolt another couple degrees and then remeasure.
I have no problem removing and reinstalling the gauge once or several times. It does repeat with very good results.
The PROBLEM I have is some Guys say they did one bolt your way and found that it took THAT BOLT 67 foot pounds to get the desired stretch, so they torqued them all to 67 foot pounds. There are so many variables that would not be the ideal way to do it.
To tell you the truth, all the methods above would "probably" not result in a failed fastener that often , if ever.
I only wanted new Bolts because of what was told to me by Ryan about those specific type bolts.
PS: I do not mind working hard and doing it the hard way if I feel it is the most accurate. That is why I do it the way I do. I watch every bolt stretch as it is happening and it is a struggle, but eliminates all the variables.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: It's FINISHED! - 08/12/10 08:28 AM
Quote:
I haven't read all the posts, and it's not my place, but aren't those headers very, very small in terms of collector diameter and length?
Those are merged collectors and you typically want a lesser difference between the primary tube size and the collector outlet or what is called the pinch. After the pinch you will have a megaphone or a tapered cone up to a normal bigger size. Those headers are 2-1/8" primaries (at the collector) and the pinch is 2-1/2 or 2-3/4" and then it goes back up to 3" and then it goes up to 3-1/2" right after the V-Band ring (in the secondary exhaust). Since this is an A-Body and I have 2-1/8" primaries the collector placement was very critical just to get them to fit and give me any kind of ground clearance. I ended up adding a couple inches of 3" just to get the pinch to align with the crossmember. As it is , it turned out very well.
Here is a pic of the smaller header collectors that were on the Crate motor I just took out of the car. You can see the pinch and then the cone bringing it back up to 3-1/2" just past the V-Band clamp. Those headers have a 1-7/8" primary at the collector. You can see how tight everything is and keep in mind the primaries on the 501 headers are a Quarter inch bigger X 4!
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: It's FINISHED! - 08/12/10 08:28 AM
2
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/12/10 08:39 AM
Quote:
Whats it look like in the car? The front 2 tubes must go under the K member? Hows the starter clearance, Do ya have to remove any tubes to get it out?
Kasey
Kasey, I will try to eventually get you a pic of the headers in the car. Maybe after they are coated. I did not look specifically with starter removal in mind at that header. I did decide to keep the tubes farther away from the starter than last time so I think it might be possible to remove the starter. Maybe you might have to remove just one top tube section or possibly drop the lower section and leave the top tubes. To tell you the truth, it was never a concern of mine because I can remove the header in about 20 minutes and that includes jacking the car up in the air a couple feet and placing it on Jack stands.
Yes, BOTH sides, 2 tubes go through the K-Member. Those headers are pretty much a copy of the Crate motor headers. Here is a pic of the crate motor headers. Sorry it is not that good..
Posted By: GregCon
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/12/10 12:11 PM
OK,thanks for clarifying the headers.
Yes, I use the method I described on each bolt.
Posted By: blown572dart
Re: It's FINISHED! - 08/12/10 01:42 PM
Nice
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: It's FINISHED! - 08/12/10 03:14 PM
I wanted to give my first impressions of the new motor. One of the reasons I did not realize I had the #1 and #3 plug wires crossed is because it started right up and I EXPECTED a radical idle based on the cam specs. I was a little peeved when I first saw the cam specs because I did not really want a radical idle. Now I am glad I did not say anything, so I did not have to eat any crow.
Well, this motor is quieter AND smoother than the 406 crate motor. The carb is all messed up because I had the plug wires crossed and was cranking on it to get it to idle. But once I get it dialed, I expect this engine to idle surprisingly smooth. Once I static timed it the second time , it ended up being dead nuts on 35 deg timing so I left it there, but once I switch it to the crank trigger I will probably set it at 32 and call it good. LOL
The valvetrain is quiet and I am pretty happy about that. Can you say 9.90's with a hydraulic cam! Woohoo!
I only drove it over to Sloan's house yesterday (about 1 mile) and then about 5 more miles and I was taking it easy. The Rod bearing clearances were just a hair tighter than I like so I did not want to stand on it right away even though I know it is probably better for the rings. It drives quite a bit like the crate motor (which is also a hydraulic roller cam), moves away from a light a little easier, seems to really want to wake up if you goose the throttle. Right now I have the Race Demon RS Carb on it straight off the crate motor, BUT I have a brand new Quick Fuel Technology, Race Q 950 to go on it when I get around to it. I also have to make a new set of plug wires because of the taller Valve Covers. I was not expecting that and a couple of those wires are TIGHT going over the VV covers.
ALSO, UGH, I have to change the trans before I race it. Dave did not have any billet input shafts when he built this trans for me and so I will have to do something about that before I hit the track. He has my spare right now and I am going to light a fire under him to get it back. It's just as well, because I will be pulling the headers to get them coated and can do it then.
Posted By: justinp61
Re: It's FINISHED! - 08/12/10 03:26 PM
Ron, I have to give you credit, everything you do is first class
.
Posted By: tboomer
Re: It's FINISHED! - 08/12/10 03:28 PM
Looks great!! Very nice work and it paid off!
Posted By: RyanJ
Re: It's FINISHED! - 08/12/10 04:26 PM
Quote:
I wanted to give my first impressions of the new motor. One of the reasons I did not realize I had the #1 and #3 plug wires crossed is because it started right up and I EXPECTED a radical idle based on the cam specs. I was a little peeved when I first saw the cam specs because I did not really want a radical idle. Now I am glad I did not say anything, so I did not have to eat any crow.
Well, this motor is quieter AND smoother than the 406 crate motor.
LOL it's FIVE HUNDRED inches... what may look like a radical cam in a 340/360 or even a 416 4" crank motor is tame in a 500. I'm glad the lifters are not too noisy... I've had hyd rollers before that can be obnoxious, looks like Glenn got them right.
Posted By: Spode
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/12/10 05:53 PM
Quote:
Engine was born at 4:30 PM California time today.
I think I heard the fire up all the way at my house
Congrats great project and thanks for the detailed thread.
Posted By: 65signet
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/12/10 06:33 PM
Get the new trans in and bring the car to Sacramento next month, i will take some pics with the wheels in the air.
Posted By: 1Fast340
Re: It's FINISHED! - 08/12/10 06:56 PM
congrats!
Posted By: Joesixpack
Re: It's FINISHED! - 08/12/10 08:20 PM
Looks great! Went back and read every single post, the thought process,innovation,preperation&execution involved
in this 500 cube engine sorta reminded me of NHRA Pro Stockers evolution from small cubic inch engines to 500, and there progression since...It looks like many things that you guys did mirror what the Pro Stock set live by...i bet that thing will have a monster torque curve,pretty flat...pretty tight...and not much drop off during the 1-2 and 2-3 shift....very impressive..
Posted By: W5Duster436
Re: It's FINISHED! - 08/12/10 08:28 PM
Quote:
Ron, I have to give you credit, everything you do is first class .
Ditto!
once again that is totally awesome. 501 cid small block. can hardly wait to see some vids of it running and to hear it. still would like to know what brand vacuum pump that is.
Posted By: Moparnut426
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/12/10 10:20 PM
Did ya get a picture of the Carillo rods you put in it, Or did ya end up using the other ones?
Just curious, didnt get a chance to rear all 600 pages of this post yet, but Im still diggin.
Kasey
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: It's FINISHED! - 08/13/10 02:21 AM
That is a Star Vacuum PP. It's the Mini Pump.
http://www.starvacuumpumps.com/
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/13/10 02:24 AM
Quote:
Did ya get a picture of the Carillo rods you put in it, Or did ya end up using the other ones?
Just curious, didnt get a chance to rear all 600 pages of this post yet, but Im still diggin.
Kasey
We had Crower fix the original R&R Rods. They still aren't perfect by my crude measurment methods, but they were use-able. They looked way better.
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/13/10 02:59 AM
Good to hear Ron and like all of your work, looks GREAT!!!! So, are you going to do some shake down runs at Irwidale soon or hit a 1/4 mile track?
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/13/10 08:32 AM
I am going to try and change the trans before I run it at the track.
Drove it today for about 30 minutes and so far, so good. I just can't get over how quiet and smooth this motor is. This is one of those cars that is decieving
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/15/10 02:20 AM
Kasey, here is a pic in the chassis.
I put about 30 minutes drive two times and still have not stood on it. I have probably been 1/2 throttle and 4000 RPM and it feels good/promising. Next time out I will stand on it and then change the oil after that to see what is going on. No strange noises and oil pressure is good except at idle it is kind of low. 18-20 PSI. It has Comp Cams Break in oil 10W30 right now.
Posted By: gg408
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/15/10 05:05 AM
Very nice looking setup.
If I could ask were did you get your alternator and brakets from?
Cheers
g408
Posted By: LA360
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/15/10 07:08 AM
It looks like a Jones Racing Products kit to me George
AL....
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/15/10 03:51 PM
Quote:
Very nice looking setup.
If I could ask were did you get your alternator and brakets from?
Cheers
g408
I ordered that bracket from KRC Power. I am not using it as designed though. It is designed to have the alternator on the front side of the bracket to lineup with a "drive pulley" that would be FRONT of the water pump shaft.
So, I did modify it and if you look close you can see what I did. Copy and paste the pics on your PC and then you can zoom in. The lower front side is MILLED to clear the fan belt, the front side right where the water pump pully is had to be milled slightly to clear the water pump pulley. I just plunge cut with an end mill in a drill press a bunch of times until the metal I need is all removed.
There is about a .250 spacer behind the bracket for alignment purposes. The water pump pulley is a mid to late sixties small block single groove pulley and I think if you took the spacer out it may align with the early 70's small block water pump pulley.
Here is a link and a pic from another angle so you can see what is going on.
Ron.
http://www.krcpower.com/catalog_i6511685.html?catId=353136
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/15/10 03:57 PM
Quote:
Very nice looking setup.
If I could ask were did you get your alternator and brakets from?
Cheers
g408
Alternator is a 93MM Denso that is sold by Powermaster and Summit carries them. Don't let the 93 MM confuse you. The Mounting bracket is made for this alternator that has 138MM center to center measurment on the mounting lugs (you can see this on the link provided). 93MM is the case size.
http://www.powermastermotorsports.com/denso_alternators.html
Mine is the 8162.
Ron.
Posted By: Devilbrad
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/15/10 04:05 PM
Looking at your crank trigger...did you just put magnets in the ATI damper instead of using a separate trigger wheel?
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/15/10 04:12 PM
Quote:
Looking at your crank trigger...did you just put magnets in the ATI damper instead of using a separate trigger wheel?
Yes. That is an option that ATI offers. But I am pretty sure the balancer outer ring is different so the magnets can be installed. So, you can't just add them to any balancer without changing the outer ring. This is something that Ryan suggested we do to simplify things and I like it.
Posted By: 340Cuda
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/15/10 04:58 PM
"Trailering's TOO much WORK!"
This is funny because the one thing you are not afraid of is work!
I have enjoyed watching your craftsmanship, thanks for taking us along for the ride.
Bill
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/16/10 03:25 AM
Well, I finally punched it this afternoon. Lets say I am very happy. You can never really tell (without going to the track), but I would say I will meet my performance goal. It feels faster than the Demon was.
I went to about 2500 rpm rolling in first gear and then hammered down. I am pretty sure the shift light (6000RPM) was on before I even got the throttle all the way open. Of course I had to do it a second time. That kind of power is intoxicating
Posted By: all spooled up
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/16/10 03:46 AM
Posted By: greendart408
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/16/10 03:49 AM
Good to hear Ron
Just curious is your vac pump staying dry???
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/16/10 04:04 AM
Quote:
Good to hear Ron Just curious is your vac pump staying dry???
I think it's too early to tell. So far I have about an hour+ of easy street driving and 2 quick squirts through 1rst 2nd and into 3rd at full throttle. Plus I adjusted the regulator twice. But all is well so far. I will let you know if I find oil. That breather has 2 perforated screens and some coalescing material in it and I doubt much oil will pass through it.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/16/10 04:06 AM
sec
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/16/10 04:06 AM
3rd
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/16/10 04:07 AM
I am getting real good vacuum with that pump. I actually backed the regulator down for now so I only have 7-8" crusing around at low speed. It was 12-13. Not sure what it is when I stand on it.
Posted By: AndyF
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/16/10 04:49 AM
Front of the motor looks like a nice layout. Do you remember what dipstick set up you have on there? Looks like a late model design, maybe Lexus or something like that?
Is that one of my aluminum alternator pullies? Looks like my part but I can't tell for sure.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/16/10 05:14 AM
Quote:
Front of the motor looks like a nice layout. Do you remember what dipstick set up you have on there? Looks like a late model design, maybe Lexus or something like that?
Is that one of my aluminum alternator pullies? Looks like my part but I can't tell for sure.
The dip stick is from a Dodge Truck with a Magnum engine. I got it at Glendora Dodge. I figured if the oil filter plate etc was Magnum production parts it would work. It fits the hole in the block really well and the dip stick seals real well to the tube etc. I shortned it something like 12" though and re-worked the mounting tab. But it is solid and well worth the effort.
Alt pulley was from Powermaster.
Posted By: greendart408
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/16/10 05:22 AM
Quote:
Quote:
Good to hear Ron Just curious is your vac pump staying dry???
I think it's too early to tell. So far I have about an hour+ of easy street driving and 2 quick squirts through 1rst 2nd and into 3rd at full throttle. Plus I adjusted the regulator twice. But all is well so far. I will let you know if I find oil. That breather has 2 perforated screens and some coalescing material in it and I doubt much oil will pass through it.
Ok and thanks for the pics.
Posted By: zhandfull
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/18/10 08:33 PM
Hey Ron you came by my house a couple years ago and looked at my 68 Dart I was selling. It's nice to see the progess you made on the Valiant since then. The car and the motor looks outstanding! I always look forward to your small block A body smoking the race cars at the track. As much as I love the write up on the motor. It sure could of been fun just opening the hood and not talking cubic inch after those 10 flat passes with the brakes on at the finish line.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/19/10 04:43 PM
Quote:
It sure could of been fun just opening the hood and not talking cubic inch after those 10 flat passes with the brakes on at the finish line.
LOL, I can still do that!
I wanted that Dart and I put a bid in for it, but I got outbid and decided to let someone else have it. I enjoyed seeing you drive it around Alta Loma.
Well, the Valiant is ready to make some passes, but I am having a hard time getting ahold of Dave at Pro Trans. So, as usual I am hung out again. Paid $2500 for a complete spare trans and I still get shish-kabobbed. I really do think this motor will break the input shaft of the current 904.
The car is completely out of control on the street and I need to take it to the track.
Ron.
Posted By: 1Fast340
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/19/10 04:54 PM
Quote:
I really do think this motor will break the input shaft of the current 904.
The car is completely out of control on the street and I need to take it to the track.
Ron.
what kind of torque do you think a stock inputhsaft in a 904 will be able to take,just trying to learn alitle here 
the last part means you got just about enough power
very cool build please keep the uptades coming
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/19/10 04:55 PM
Quote:
Quote:
It sure could of been fun just opening the hood and not talking cubic inch after those 10 flat passes with the brakes on at the finish line.
LOL, I can still do that!
I wanted that Dart and I put a bid in for it, but I got outbid and decided to let someone else have it. I enjoyed seeing you drive it around Alta Loma.
Well, the Valiant is ready to make some passes, but I am having a hard time getting ahold of Dave at Pro Trans. So, as usual I am hung out again. Paid $2500 for a complete spare trans and I still get shish-kabobbed. I really do think this motor will break the input shaft of the current 904.
The car is completely out of control on the street and I need to take it to the track.
Ron.
Hey Ron, why not have Darrell Parks take care of the trans for ya.........I can get his number if u need it.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/19/10 05:05 PM
Well, my 474 in the Demon broke the output shaft once. And, they have had billet input shafts for a long time. So, I am assuming the input shaft is toast if I hook this thing up at the track. Remember, I have 4.500" stroke, smallish heads for the CI and I have LONG header primaries.
Please shoot me the info for Darryl, as I am not going to wait forever. I am actually kind of afraid Pro Trans went out of buisness, because I have literally been trying to get ahold of them for a few weeks now. It's that bad. Kind of scary since he has my Trans.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/19/10 05:13 PM
I just got ahold of Dave, so I am golden. He is going to bring my trans down to Fontana this weekend because they are racing there and I will get it from him then.
It will save me 3 hours of driving
Posted By: 1Fast340
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/19/10 05:17 PM
Quote:
Well, my 474 in the Demon broke the output shaft once. And, they have had billet input shafts for a long time. So, I am assuming the input shaft is toast if I hook this thing up at the track. Remember, I have 4.500" stroke, smallish heads for the CI and I have LONG header primaries.
Please shoot me the info for Darryl, as I am not going to wait forever. I am actually kind of afraid Pro Trans went out of buisness, because I have literally been trying to get ahold of them for a few weeks now. It's that bad. Kind of scary since he has my Trans.
thanks, what got me thinking was just that you have something that should make a ton of torque,and im kind of in the same boat i think with a much shorter stroke but with a twinscrewblower that may create alitle more torque than most smallblocks make and im going to try to make my 904 live also,dont think i will have as much torque as you have but alot more than most
Posted By: Devilbrad
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/19/10 05:18 PM
Ron, do I need to drive down from San Francisco to get video of this beast or are you gonna provide some soon?
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/19/10 05:20 PM
Quote:
Get the new trans in and bring the car to Sacramento next month, i will take some pics with the wheels in the air.
I have that race in my sights. I am going to try and make it!
Will probably hit Irwindale Thursday T&T beforehand if possible. I will post up if I do.......
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/19/10 05:51 PM
I called Al and asked him to shoot me his number or he`ll pm u directly.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/22/10 07:32 PM
I wanted to post because I am always bragging about this and I finally had an oppertunity to time it. I removed the headers I just made to have them coated.
10 minutes to raise the car and put it on jack stands.
33 more minutes to completely remove the headers.
They do not require ANY other components to be removed or touched. So, I could start the car and drive it away, to headers laying on ground : 43 minutes.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/22/10 07:33 PM
center port window.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/22/10 07:36 PM
So, headers are being coated and should be back by next friday. I got the good trans back from Dave as planned yesterday and installed it with the 8" ATI converter. It's all buttoned up and ready to go. Just a few more honey doos and I will be ready to rock. I am thinking I should make the Sacramento Mopar day with ease. SWEET!
Posted By: Al_Alguire
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/22/10 07:38 PM
Looking good. Now lets hope there are some Mopars at the Mopar race next month
BTW the treack is awesome since they ground it, just dont get to excited over the MPH...
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/22/10 07:41 PM
Quote:
just dont get to excited over the MPH...
Oh Yeah! I ran almost 121MPH last year with a completely stock 406 Mopar Crate motor! SHAZAM!
Posted By: Devilbrad
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/22/10 07:44 PM
I'll bring my video camera, what day is the Mopar event again?
Posted By: 65signet
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/23/10 10:11 PM
Quote:
So, headers are being coated and should be back by next friday. I got the good trans back from Dave as planned yesterday and installed it with the 8" ATI converter. It's all buttoned up and ready to go. Just a few more honey doos and I will be ready to rock. I am thinking I should make the Sacramento Mopar day with ease. SWEET!
Looking forward to seeing the car run and meeting you, we will be there with the Pink Scamp!
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/24/10 06:40 PM
Well the last of the things I wanted to do before making passes is done. I made a safety strap in case that Schumacher Motor Mount comes apart.
I already changed the oil once, but put Comp Cams 10W30 break in oil back in it for now. I am going to cruze it around and put some more miles on it and maybe even leave that oil in it to go to Irwindale and make a few shake down runs, plus the freeway driving. Then I will put Valvoline 20W50 Racing Synthetic in it for Sacramento.
The Sacramento Race is September 12th!
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/24/10 06:41 PM
Two
Posted By: Moparnut426
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/24/10 06:46 PM
So ya think it gonna make some torque or what?? Its only 501 ci....
Kasey
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/30/10 01:07 AM
Well, I should be going to Irwindale Thursday for some shakedown passes. I do have some bad news though and it means a lot of work for me. It seems I am driving through the converter. "Thanks Ryan", for building me too much power for this 8" converter. Me and Sloan were talking and we think if I raise the RPM and shift light it won't seem that bad. So I will be trying that. Shift light was set at 6000 for break in, but pretty much does not go off when I am standing on it and going through the gears. So, I raised the shift light to 6400 and set the max RPM limit at 6900 in the MSD.
If it does not work ok like that, I will be removing the headers and trans and changing to the 10" TA Converter I have and then see if ATI might work with me on a larger converter. The TA converter is a "good one" I saved from the Demon. I bought a spare and it was in the car when I sold it, but I liked this one better. This 8" is as tight as they can make it, they told me when I bought it.
I am VERY happy with the motor so far. I finally transfered the ignition to the Crank Trigger and she drives great, idles so nice at stop lights and no leaks of trans/ engine or cooling system. I have zero issues driving it to Irwindale, laying down some passes and then driving home.
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/30/10 01:43 AM
You da man Ron, I`ll be there supporting you......
Posted By: PUNK
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/30/10 04:11 AM
Well, it will be interesting to say the least as to the outcome of how the converter is going to handle this power and RPM range. Im thinking that you will end up with a 10" deal. Im thinking that the RPM range that your dealing with (sub 7000), in conjunction with the big torque of that engine, that a 8" converter just might not have the holding power. If your engine was a 8000 RPM shifter, I think it might be different. I plan on going to Irwindale as well on Thursday.
Oh by the way, when Ron drove off from my house, he blipped the throttle just a little and the engine blew the tires off and flashed to 6k+ in a matter of a tenth of a second. I would have thought he grabbed a unit when he did that. CRAZY!!
Posted By: all spooled up
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/30/10 01:43 PM
have fun at the track. ps what tires are on the back
Posted By: fishy340
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/30/10 02:22 PM
very talented man..now lets us know what that sob does when u go to the track
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/30/10 04:06 PM
Quote:
have fun at the track. ps what tires are on the back
I have these now. But most of the pics I have posted are with the smaller tires.
HOOSIER DOT DRAG RADIAL 17319 P315/60R15 E 11.1" 29.7" 93.5" 9-11" 9.5" 12.8" 30
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/30/10 04:28 PM
I just talked to ATI and he thinks I would need 1000 HP to blow through the converter I have and we all know I don't have that much HP. He says I am on the right track raising the operating rpm and he would like to see a little more gear in the car, but those 4.10's are never going to change. So, we will see how it does on Thursday.
Posted By: MIKES_DUSTER
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/30/10 04:33 PM
Hey Ron.....How do you like the Hoosier Radials compared to the QTP's?? I need to buy some new/used tires for my duster and Ive had great success with the QTP's but would consider the radials if their any good.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/30/10 04:53 PM
I love those tires. I will never run aything else. You just have to get the pressure right. I heard they need more pressure than the bias ply's and so I started out at 20 PSI. Car launched real well on the hit and then just spun and squealed real loud! But I was comparing to what the stockers run for Pressure, but that is a smaller tire. Bigger tires do not usually run as much pressure. So I went down to 17, then it dead hooked. I usually run 16-17 psi. Medium to light burnout. If these were bias ply's I would be at 11 psi. so they do require a lot more pressure. They ride better on the street and better stability at the track. It's all good.
Keep in mind this was all with the crate motor. No telling what it will do now. I have changed the car to be all pinned down right now to prevent a big wheelstand, so it may not hook. I plan on getting more agressive if needed, but for now I want to keep the front end LOW! Don't want to smash those headers any time soon.
Posted By: MIKES_DUSTER
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/30/10 05:05 PM
Thanks for your responce....My little 368" is no where near the hp of your 501" so I wont have any problem hooking with them.
So,you like them better than the QTP's??
Posted By: jinxy
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/30/10 06:00 PM
What is pinned down? Less front end travel? Car looks awesome as always.
Best of luck
Jeff
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/30/10 07:19 PM
Yes I like the Hoosier DOT Radials over the Quick Time Pro's and I like the QTP's over the MT ET Streets. I have never tried the MT ET Street radials but I do not consider that tire a good choice for a track that does not have excellent prep.
I consider the Hoosier DOT Radials to be basically a Drag Radial slick with a couple Grooves in it. Just like the QTP's are.
Pinned down: I put the rear segment clamps back on the Tri City Launchers and I cranked up the front Shock rebound damping setting. If that does not do it I will install bigger upper control arm bumpers to limit front end travel/rise.
Posted By: MIKES_DUSTER
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/30/10 11:33 PM
Thanks Ron!!!!!
Posted By: MIKES_DUSTER
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/31/10 09:34 PM
Hey Ron...sorry for ANOTHER question....How do the Hoosier Drag Radials hook on the street?? I KNOW the QTP's hook EXTREMELY well on the street but would consider the radials if they hook on the street.
Posted By: ProSport
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/31/10 10:00 PM
Ron, run the car on a good 1/4 mile track to get good data before worrying about the converter. The 1st time I went out with my car I went to an 1/8 mile track with crappy tires. My shift light never went off and I came right home and made a thread on Moparts about my converter. Everyone suggested a good 1/4 mile test, I bought new tires and went to a 1/4 mile track and all was fine, only about 5% slip.
It's also hard to judge anything on the street, I know my car is an absolute handfull on the street, cannot even try to use 1st gear.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 08/31/10 10:38 PM
With the crate motor the new radial tires would spin some but the car would move out real well. It would actually strain my neck. If I was in a street race from a dead stop with the crate motor I would just stab the throttle.
With the new motor the car is like it is on nitrous. Completely out of control. I hit it once in my neighborhood from about a 10mph roll and the car was spinning but moving so fast in such a short time with the shift light on and going sideways and I hit second to try and calm it down and it was going to go around so I got out of it. All the stuff came off the back seat and so on. But it was moving and tracking real fast. It's amazing how fast things can happen with this power. I went back a couple times and there were no marks on the street. None. So the car was moving and tracking.
Bob, that is good advice. Thanks. I am hoping my car will be about as fast as yours. I was ready to change the converter but calmed down after I talked to ATI.
Posted By: MIKES_DUSTER
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/01/10 04:19 AM
Thanks for the info Ron.
Posted By: Stroker Scamp
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/08/10 04:07 AM
Quote:
I just talked to ATI and he thinks I would need 1000 HP to blow through the converter I have and we all know I don't have that much HP. He says I am on the right track raising the operating rpm and he would like to see a little more gear in the car, but those 4.10's are never going to change. So, we will see how it does on Thursday.
well? 
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/08/10 04:14 AM
That`s what I was thinking...............and what`s with this john doe crap.....did it run so bad that you had to change your name?
Posted By: gg408
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/08/10 12:20 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Very nice looking setup.
If I could ask were did you get your alternator and brakets from?
Cheers
g408
Alternator is a 93MM Denso that is sold by Powermaster and Summit carries them. Don't let the 93 MM confuse you. The Mounting bracket is made for this alternator that has 138MM center to center measurment on the mounting lugs (you can see this on the link provided). 93MM is the case size.
http://www.powermastermotorsports.com/denso_alternators.html
Mine is the 8162.
Ron.
Thanks Ron for the info has been very helpfull.
Cheers
gg408
Posted By: PUNK
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/08/10 07:58 PM
Rons Valiant ran so good that he damaged the oil pan and headers. The car dead hooked, and pitch rotated so fast in the wheelie that it went to the rear bumper, came down somewhat gentle, then stood straight back up again on the bumper. At that second wheelie is when the car came down and did a number on 4 header tubes and the new oil pan. At that point he just drove it home because he was late to work. He only made 3 passes, 2 of them easy passes and the one that it went on the bumper TWICE. It MPH'd better than his Demon and the weather was HOT and HUMID. I think Rn is happy with the performance.
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/08/10 08:36 PM
Sorry to hear about the damage after all of that work he went through but, it sounds like it`s making some SERIOUS steam........
I`d say it`s time to ether limit the ft. end or get some wheelie bars.
Posted By: 9 Sec Phill
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/08/10 10:32 PM
Come on Ron, spill the beans,,,,,we want some bumper pics....Phill
PS, sorry to hear about the damage but glad it was still able to get you home. Did you have to rake out your shorts?
Posted By: Randy..
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/14/11 06:35 AM
just re read all 11 pages of Rons build, would love to see some more of the Valiant, car is outstanding! don't know what set him off, maybe Ron will post again on his projects.
Posted By: topbrent
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/14/11 07:04 AM
Don't think Ron will be coming back around here...which is a big loss to the community at large.
Posted By: MIKES_DUSTER
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/14/11 02:05 PM
Theres ALOT of GOOD people that have left!!!!!
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/14/11 05:26 PM
I talked to Ron after the facts and he`s just a real smart intense guy and felt really insulted by some peoples comments and had no time or desire to be insulted. That`s the basic version as I remember........lots of "experts" rambling stuff they had no clue about.
Posted By: MIKES_DUSTER
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/14/11 06:07 PM
Quote:
I talked to Ron after the facts and he`s just a real smart intense guy and felt really insulted by some peoples comments and had no time or desire to be insulted. That`s the basic version as I remember........lots of "experts" rambling stuff they had no clue about.
Posted By: Randy..
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/14/11 09:38 PM
kinda thought that, seen a few posts that I felt was questioning his intellect, and i know from his old demon< and his line of work> he is a very smart guy.
Posted By: 69B3GT
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/14/11 10:09 PM
Quote:
I talked to Ron after the facts and he`s just a real smart intense guy and felt really insulted by some peoples comments and had no time or desire to be insulted. That`s the basic version as I remember........lots of "experts" rambling stuff they had no clue about.
Yep, same thing he told me when I talked to him at irwindale awhile back. I still cant get over how clean that car is
Posted By: Moparnut426
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/14/11 10:24 PM
We are friends on facebook. He said he sold the silver car. is hunting for something different for the 501.
Someone got a SWEET car.
Kasey
Posted By: J_BODY
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/15/11 02:33 AM
I still prefered the Demon..... It looked and probably sounded like your car Kasey. Sporting that mild resto look, putting by in pit area you'd think "hey there's a nice 13 sec Demon".....until it ripped a 9 second pass. He puts together some pretty nice mopars.
Posted By: 9 Sec Phill
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/15/11 02:42 AM
Ron is top notch.
Posted By: MIKES_DUSTER
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/15/11 02:45 AM
Quote:
Ron is top notch.
Quote:
I talked to Ron after the facts and he`s just a real smart intense guy and felt really insulted by some peoples comments and had no time or desire to be insulted. That`s the basic version as I remember........lots of "experts" rambling stuff they had no clue about.
Actually.. Look at his last post..
He said something not real smart and Dan called him on it..
As Dan always does..
Chris..
Posted By: fishy340
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/15/11 08:26 PM
Quote:
Theres ALOT of GOOD people that have left!!!!!
sensorship
Posted By: StrkrDart69
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/16/11 03:26 AM
Quote:
Quote:
I talked to Ron after the facts and he`s just a real smart intense guy and felt really insulted by some peoples comments and had no time or desire to be insulted. That`s the basic version as I remember........lots of "experts" rambling stuff they had no clue about.
Yep, same thing he told me when I talked to him at irwindale awhile back. I still cant get over how clean that car is
You are one of the idiots that throw insults.
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/16/11 06:01 AM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I talked to Ron after the facts and he`s just a real smart intense guy and felt really insulted by some peoples comments and had no time or desire to be insulted. That`s the basic version as I remember........lots of "experts" rambling stuff they had no clue about.
Yep, same thing he told me when I talked to him at irwindale awhile back. I still cant get over how clean that car is
You are one of the idiots that throw insults.
Are you refering to me as an idiot?
Posted By: Moparnut426
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/16/11 01:53 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I talked to Ron after the facts and he`s just a real smart intense guy and felt really insulted by some peoples comments and had no time or desire to be insulted. That`s the basic version as I remember........lots of "experts" rambling stuff they had no clue about.
Yep, same thing he told me when I talked to him at irwindale awhile back. I still cant get over how clean that car is
You are one of the idiots that throw insults.
Pot calling kettle black
Kasey
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! *DELETED* - 09/16/11 04:25 PM
Post deleted by Thumperdart
Posted By: Randy..
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/16/11 04:53 PM
is Ron on any other car sites/boards?
Posted By: 65signet
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/16/11 06:15 PM
Quote:
is Ron on any other car sites/boards?
Posted By: Moparnut426
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/16/11 07:10 PM
Facebook,
Posted By: Randy..
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/16/11 11:20 PM
shame, i don't Facebook.
Posted By: AndyF
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 09/16/11 11:23 PM
I've seen a couple of Ron's cars and that guy can build. I'm not sure where he gets all the energy. Those cars take a ton of time to get that clean. His stuff is about the nicest I've ever seen.
Posted By: keefe
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/18/11 01:01 AM
Anyone have any up dates on Rons new build....
Posted By: Randy..
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/21/11 04:25 PM
come on Ron, we need you on here.
Posted By: RobX4406
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/21/11 11:04 PM
Quote:
Anyone have any up dates on Rons new build....
I know he sold the Valiant.
I sent him some leads on a few cars that he might be interested in. No idea what he's going to build next.
My guess is he's still not coming back.
Posted By: 70AARcuda
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/21/11 11:49 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Anyone have any up dates on Rons new build....
I know he sold the Valiant.
I sent him some leads on a few cars that he might be interested in. No idea what he's going to build next.
My guess is he's still not coming back.
Rob...I will check with my daughter and see what she knows..LOL
Posted By: Deepockets
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/22/11 12:00 AM
i talked to the guy (jim) that bought his car last night at irwindale speedway. it has the crate motor in in still, and said that he was going to get the 500 ci from ron also. jim said he my bring it to the mopar nats in vegas.
i hear he don't like us no more.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/24/12 08:27 PM
This engine is for sale.
silvaliant@charter.net
Posted By: MattW
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/24/12 08:50 PM
Ron I hope you are back.
Don't care what happened just stay awhile. I always learn something from your builds. If you are doing another build and not staying let me know where I can get info of your progress. Matt
Posted By: J_BODY
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/24/12 08:57 PM
wish I could pull the trigger being we scattered our 340 at speedworld a few weeks back.
Posted By: keefe
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/24/12 11:11 PM
Quote:
Ron I hope you are back.
Don't care what happened just stay awhile. I always learn something from your builds. If you are doing another build and not staying let me know where I can get info of your progress. Matt
Posted By: 65signet
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/24/12 11:24 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Ron I hope you are back.
Don't care what happened just stay awhile. I always learn something from your builds. If you are doing another build and not staying let me know where I can get info of your progress. Matt
Quote:
This engine is for sale.
Work of art! How much? Are you building a different even more hostile one? (gulp! )
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/25/12 06:36 PM
Quote:
Quote:
This engine is for sale.
Work of art! How much? Are you building a different even more hostile one? (gulp! )
As I understand it from my boss George, Ron sold the Valiant to his friend w/the 408 in it and that the motor was hurt but maybe he fixed it...........
Posted By: justinp61
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/25/12 11:01 PM
This is what I got from Ron. I have nothing to do with this engine or anything else of Rons
.
Yes the 501 is for sale. It was in the Valiant for about 8 months and probably has about 20 passes on it. Plus about 300 street miles. But, it was hurt when I took it out. It had dropped a Valve/broke a retainer. So, I pulled the one head and the piston was ok and I had the guide replaced and replaced the VVs in that cylinder etc and put the head back on.
The thing is, the machine shop showed me where the valve seats were crumbling. Indy had put some cheap valve seats in these heads. I sent pics to RyanJ and he said to just run it. It also had some cylinder scuffing from the pistons rocking at TDC. (short piston with 4.5” stroke) He also said that would not be an issue. He said he rebuilt motors that had scuffing like that and they did not pick up much if at all and that I was probably not losing any ET to speak of. The day the car dropped the Valve it turned 1.34 60 foot time and would have probably run high 9 seconds but there were Santa Ana Winds so I was not making full passes. At Fontana.
So, I reinstalled the head and I was replacing the retainers on the OTHER head. RyanJ/CompCams sent me new ones. I put air on the cylinders to hold the valves closed. Well, the air leaked so bad out the intake ports it sounded like a Jet Plane. So I knew right then that the valve seats were not going to cut it. I pulled the heads off the motor and spent $5000 fixing them the right way.
The heads now have all new Xceldyne copper beryllium valve seats all blended in with a race valve job. All new Xceldyne bronze guides. New Titanium intake valves, new special alloy hollow stem exhaust valves, new Titanium retainers, machined locks and seals. The Valve springs are a Manley NexTec double spring. The heads were surfaced and installed exactly how I did the first time with Cometic MLS gaskets. The motor is all back together now and ready to go. I also put new pushrods in it because they had contacted the steel shim in the VV cover gasket and believe it or not that galled some of them so bad I was afraid of failure. It also allowed me to refine the length to get the adjuster screws in a more ideal place. I also put air on all the cylinders since reinstalling the heads and there is no noticeable air leaking any more. So I do believe the scuffing will not be an issue. I can give a lot more details if someone is serious and wants to call me. I have had the pan off to repair it after I smashed it doing wheelies (twice), so I inspected a few bearings and they were ok etc. I replaced the oil pump because the pressure gauge was acting a little weird, but that seems to have fixed that etc. I 100% planned on keeping the motor and running it in another car including a driver, but a lot of the cars I am looking at buying already have good motors. So I decided to try and sell it and see what happens. I think it would cost about $28,000 to build this motor now with the upgraded heads/vvs/seats etc.
I also have custom Headers I built for this motor that I have put a LOT of work in them to get the ports/flanges to match properly and they are ceramic coated. I have over $1200 in materials/coating! They were smashed but have been fixed/recoated.
The motor will come with the Vacuum pump and a one wire alternator with the mandrel drive as pictured. Everything else in the short block is per that thread on Moparts.
Posted By: MattW
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 04/23/12 01:30 PM
Quote:
This is what I got from Ron. I have nothing to do with this engine or anything else of Rons .
Yes the 501 is for sale. It was in the Valiant for about 8 months and probably has about 20 passes on it. Plus about 300 street miles. But, it was hurt when I took it out. It had dropped a Valve/broke a retainer. So, I pulled the one head and the piston was ok and I had the guide replaced and replaced the VVs in that cylinder etc and put the head back on.
The thing is, the machine shop showed me where the valve seats were crumbling. Indy had put some cheap valve seats in these heads. I sent pics to RyanJ and he said to just run it. It also had some cylinder scuffing from the pistons rocking at TDC. (short piston with 4.5” stroke) He also said that would not be an issue. He said he rebuilt motors that had scuffing like that and they did not pick up much if at all and that I was probably not losing any ET to speak of. The day the car dropped the Valve it turned 1.34 60 foot time and would have probably run high 9 seconds but there were Santa Ana Winds so I was not making full passes. At Fontana.
So, I reinstalled the head and I was replacing the retainers on the OTHER head. RyanJ/CompCams sent me new ones. I put air on the cylinders to hold the valves closed. Well, the air leaked so bad out the intake ports it sounded like a Jet Plane. So I knew right then that the valve seats were not going to cut it. I pulled the heads off the motor and spent $5000 fixing them the right way.
The heads now have all new Xceldyne copper beryllium valve seats all blended in with a race valve job. All new Xceldyne bronze guides. New Titanium intake valves, new special alloy hollow stem exhaust valves, new Titanium retainers, machined locks and seals. The Valve springs are a Manley NexTec double spring. The heads were surfaced and installed exactly how I did the first time with Cometic MLS gaskets. The motor is all back together now and ready to go. I also put new pushrods in it because they had contacted the steel shim in the VV cover gasket and believe it or not that galled some of them so bad I was afraid of failure. It also allowed me to refine the length to get the adjuster screws in a more ideal place. I also put air on all the cylinders since reinstalling the heads and there is no noticeable air leaking any more. So I do believe the scuffing will not be an issue. I can give a lot more details if someone is serious and wants to call me. I have had the pan off to repair it after I smashed it doing wheelies (twice), so I inspected a few bearings and they were ok etc. I replaced the oil pump because the pressure gauge was acting a little weird, but that seems to have fixed that etc. I 100% planned on keeping the motor and running it in another car including a driver, but a lot of the cars I am looking at buying already have good motors. So I decided to try and sell it and see what happens. I think it would cost about $28,000 to build this motor now with the upgraded heads/vvs/seats etc.
I also have custom Headers I built for this motor that I have put a LOT of work in them to get the ports/flanges to match properly and they are ceramic coated. I have over $1200 in materials/coating! They were smashed but have been fixed/recoated.
The motor will come with the Vacuum pump and a one wire alternator with the mandrel drive as pictured. Everything else in the short block is per that thread on Moparts.
Posted By: Al_Alguire
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 04/23/12 03:47 PM
Ron was at the MATS in his Challenger. I did not get a chance to talk to him however. Also the Valiant was out there. I did see a female driving it though. He is a great guy to bad we dont see him around here anymore but I understand his reasons.
Posted By: RobX4406
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 04/23/12 03:57 PM
Quote:
Ron was at the MATS in his Challenger. I did not get a chance to talk to him however. Also the Valiant was out there. I did see a female driving it though. He is a great guy to bad we dont see him around here anymore but I understand his reasons.
Yes, Ron is a good guy. Walked around the swap and spoke with him for about 45 minutes on Saturday at Spring Fling.
He's looking for a survivor type 70-71 Duster/Demon, non ac car. If anybody knows where one is, let him know.
Posted By: MIKES_DUSTER
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 04/23/12 05:48 PM
Wonder what he wants for it?? Is it all back together or in pieces??
Posted By: Darryls-Demon
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 04/23/12 07:40 PM
I talked to Ron last week end at the Sring Fling car show and he does still have it.
Posted By: Darryls-Demon
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 04/23/12 07:44 PM
I talked to Ron last weekend at the Spring Fling car show and he does still have it.
Posted By: SB449VALIANT
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 04/27/12 05:49 AM
Quote:
come on Ron, we need you on here.
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 06/10/12 04:57 PM
Quote:
Wonder what he wants for it?? Is it all back together or in pieces??
S O L D
Posted By: 65signet
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 06/10/12 07:32 PM
I have seen that motor run in person, one bad azz small block.
Posted By: SB449VALIANT
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 06/10/12 08:18 PM
Quote:
I have seen that motor run in person, one bad azz small block.
Agree... i wish i had the money,owner is Indeed a man with an oustanding dedication/skills....
Posted By: MattW
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/17/13 03:57 PM
Quote:
Quote:
I have seen that motor run in person, one bad azz small block.
Agree... i wish i had the money,owner is Indeed a man with an oustanding dedication/skills....
OK what is Ron up to now?
Does anyone know of any web site he now ventures to?
I miss his posts. Matt
Posted By: Quicktree
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/17/13 04:36 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I have seen that motor run in person, one bad azz small block.
Agree... i wish i had the money,owner is Indeed a man with an oustanding dedication/skills....
OK what is Ron up to now?
Does anyone know of any web site he now ventures to?
I miss his posts. Matt
same here, you need thick skin around here. a shame he holds grudges and can't let it go. everyone needs time to cool down sometimes but life is to short to hold grudges no matter what happened.
Posted By: FastmOp
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/17/13 05:21 PM
You guys that wish he was back seem to be the same group that ran him off lol
Posted By: RobX4406
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/17/13 05:24 PM
Quote:
You guys that wish he was back seem to be the same group that ran him off lol
BAZINGA!!!
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/17/13 05:27 PM
I`ve talked to Ron and even raced w/him at the track and agree about the thick skin but sometimes things are said that can really piss ya off and must admit that I considered a plane ticket to meet the "mouths" in person to square things up. That was then and time CAN heal for some and others like Ron, well they just move on knowing their skills and knowledge are greater than the idiots slingin mudd.................
Posted By: MattW
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/17/13 07:19 PM
Quote:
I`ve talked to Ron and even raced w/him at the track and agree about the thick skin but sometimes things are said that can really piss ya off and must admit that I considered a plane ticket to meet the "mouths" in person to square things up. That was then and time CAN heal for some and others like Ron, well they just move on knowing their skills and knowledge are greater than the idiots slingin mudd.................
So is he hanging out somewhere else?
Posted By: Quicktree
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/17/13 07:24 PM
Quote:
You guys that wish he was back seem to be the same group that ran him off lol
explain how you can run someone off?
Posted By: G_bob
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/17/13 08:46 PM
Quote:
Quote:
You guys that wish he was back seem to be the same group that ran him off lol
explain how you can run someone off?
Start talking about pinion angles....
Posted By: Quicktree
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/17/13 08:51 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
You guys that wish he was back seem to be the same group that ran him off lol
explain how you can run someone off?
Start talking about pinion angles....
thats fun,how could that run you off
Posted By: sixpackgut
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/17/13 08:59 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
You guys that wish he was back seem to be the same group that ran him off lol
explain how you can run someone off?
Start talking about pinion angles....
i have a video for that
i miss Ron too
Posted By: emarine01
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/17/13 11:04 PM
winter is almost over, you two cant get get into the pinion angle thing now
Posted By: Quicktree
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/17/13 11:59 PM
Quote:
winter is almost over, you two cant get get into the pinion angle thing now
why bother he will never learn 
Posted By: sixpackgut
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/18/13 12:02 AM
Quote:
Quote:
winter is almost over, you two cant get get into the pinion angle thing now
why bother he will never learn
lol
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/18/13 04:31 PM
Quote:
Quote:
I`ve talked to Ron and even raced w/him at the track and agree about the thick skin but sometimes things are said that can really piss ya off and must admit that I considered a plane ticket to meet the "mouths" in person to square things up. That was then and time CAN heal for some and others like Ron, well they just move on knowing their skills and knowledge are greater than the idiots slingin mudd.................
So is he hanging out somewhere else?
Don`t know I just call him and we chat every now and then but I`ll ask him........
Posted By: MattW
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/18/13 05:32 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I`ve talked to Ron and even raced w/him at the track and agree about the thick skin but sometimes things are said that can really piss ya off and must admit that I considered a plane ticket to meet the "mouths" in person to square things up. That was then and time CAN heal for some and others like Ron, well they just move on knowing their skills and knowledge are greater than the idiots slingin mudd.................
So is he hanging out somewhere else?
Don`t know I just call him and we chat every now and then but I`ll ask him........
Thanks
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/18/13 05:34 PM
No problem..............
Posted By: Quicktree
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/18/13 09:17 PM
Quote:
No problem..............
tell him to grow a set and get back here
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/18/13 10:49 PM
Quote:
Quote:
No problem..............
tell him to grow a set and get back here
I`ll tell him................
Posted By: RobX4406
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/19/13 04:38 AM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
No problem..............
tell him to grow a set and get back here
I`ll tell him................
I can only guess what the response will be...
Nah!!!
Posted By: Al_Alguire
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/19/13 04:46 AM
He has been at the Mopars at the Strip event the last couple of years. Last year his daughter was driving the Valiant. If I see him I will let him know he is still loved here
Great car with AWESOME mad skills...
Posted By: RobX4406
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/19/13 04:57 AM
Al, I believe that was the new owners daughter wheeling the valiant.
Hope to see him Friday if he's around. He's a kick to talk with. I can just hear him saying, Nah...
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 04/15/13 08:00 PM
Quote:
Al, I believe that was the new owners daughter wheeling the valiant.
Hope to see him Friday if he's around. He's a kick to talk with. I can just hear him saying, Nah...
Just talked to Ron and said to tell you guys he`s doin fine and has zero grudges or bad feelings towards anyone and he`s working on a new car but not as radical as the last.
Posted By: MattW
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 04/15/13 08:13 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Al, I believe that was the new owners daughter wheeling the valiant.
Hope to see him Friday if he's around. He's a kick to talk with. I can just hear him saying, Nah...
Just talked to Ron and said to tell you guys he`s doin fine and has zero grudges or bad feelings towards anyone and he`s working on a new car but not as radical as the last.
Ok what is the new build. Is he posting somewhere else?
Tell him to start a new post here.
Thx for finding out.
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 04/15/13 08:28 PM
Didn`t say if he was on other sites and said the new car will be an a-body and would be a dual purpose built car for driving to Vegas for example, running the auto cross then drag race and drive home. Maybe a stock block 340-360 w/good heads and a hydro roller w/a low 1st geared 904 and 276`s................That`s about all I know...........
Posted By: MattW
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 04/15/13 09:33 PM
See if you can convince him to do a G3.
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 04/15/13 10:01 PM
Doubt it based on his goals and "budget" is the name of this build apparently.............
Posted By: Randy..
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/21/14 06:32 AM
any news on the "BUDGET" build?
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/21/14 06:44 AM
We havn`t talked in months but when we did he wanted a car he could drive to Vegas, drag race, auto cross and drive home..........I`ll hit him up soon.
Posted By: Randy..
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/21/14 01:20 PM
Cool, Ron say what it was going to be?
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/21/14 06:16 PM
Don`t remember if he did but an a-body more than likely.........
Posted By: MattW
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 03/22/14 01:50 AM
Posted By: MattW
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/26/14 06:36 PM
What's he up to?
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/27/14 05:56 PM
Quote:
What's he up to?
We havn`t talked in a while but I met the new owners of the Vailant and the daughter driver a few weeks ago. Good people and they said he`s focusing on an "All purpose" street machine he can drive anywhere which is what he told me last time we talked. As far as being back on here? Doubtfull............Too many people thinking they were smarter than him and their insults led him away.
Posted By: MattW
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/27/14 07:29 PM
Quote:
Quote:
What's he up to?
We havn`t talked in a while but I met the new owners of the Vailant and the daughter driver a few weeks ago. Good people and they said he`s focusing on an "All purpose" street machine he can drive anywhere which is what he told me last time we talked. As far as being back on here? Doubtfull............Too many people thinking they were smarter than him and their insults led him away.
Time to turn the page.
Need his tech support to return.
Matt
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/27/14 07:51 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
What's he up to?
We havn`t talked in a while but I met the new owners of the Vailant and the daughter driver a few weeks ago. Good people and they said he`s focusing on an "All purpose" street machine he can drive anywhere which is what he told me last time we talked. As far as being back on here? Doubtfull............Too many people thinking they were smarter than him and their insults led him away.
Time to turn the page.
Need his tech support to return.
Matt
We talked about that and he didn`t seem interested but I fully agree. I`ll call him............ 
Posted By: Al_Alguire
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/27/14 08:00 PM
Ron is having fun with his new Challenger. Auto crossing and hitting the strip occasionally with it. Great guy who builds really cool cars. I am sure we will see another one eventually.
Posted By: SB449VALIANT
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/27/14 10:45 PM
2014 Dodge Challenger R/T Shaker.... ü
Posted By: J_BODY
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/28/14 04:17 AM
he had mentioned getting rid of the Mustang and going back to a Challenger. Said the stang was fun....just not so fun going down the freeway. Was looking forward to the ride of the Challenger. Tony and I bumped into him at the autocross track.
Posted By: MattW
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/28/14 01:44 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
What's he up to?
We havn`t talked in a while but I met the new owners of the Vailant and the daughter driver a few weeks ago. Good people and they said he`s focusing on an "All purpose" street machine he can drive anywhere which is what he told me last time we talked. As far as being back on here? Doubtfull............Too many people thinking they were smarter than him and their insults led him away.
Time to turn the page.
Need his tech support to return.
Matt
We talked about that and he didn`t seem interested but I fully agree. I`ll call him............
Everybody has gone through this from this site. It's about "Character" and how you chose to deal with it.
Like you and I could get into a disagreement and let it get personal and I know you could care less what I think and Visa Versa. We move on.
Opinions are like A$$ HOLES everybody has them.
Ron has Talent and Experience. Do I hang on every word he says. No, but his work says it all. He's good at what he does.
Matt
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/28/14 04:14 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
What's he up to?
We havn`t talked in a while but I met the new owners of the Vailant and the daughter driver a few weeks ago. Good people and they said he`s focusing on an "All purpose" street machine he can drive anywhere which is what he told me last time we talked. As far as being back on here? Doubtfull............Too many people thinking they were smarter than him and their insults led him away.
Time to turn the page.
Need his tech support to return.
Matt
We talked about that and he didn`t seem interested but I fully agree. I`ll call him............
Everybody has gone through this from this site. It's about "Character" and how you chose to deal with it.
Like you and I could get into a disagreement and let it get personal and I know you could care less what I think and Visa Versa. We move on.
Opinions are like A$$ HOLES everybody has them.
Ron has Talent and Experience. Do I hang on every word he says. No, but his work says it all. He's good at what he does.
Matt
I hear ya but some of the more intellegent "mellow" people are who they are and confrontation is not their thing nor will it be...........me, I don`t get shook up much anymore but he and I are two totally different people like so many on here. More tech less talk makes sense to me these days and he may or may not show but I`m not holding my breath.
Posted By: MattW
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/28/14 04:37 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
What's he up to?
We havn`t talked in a while but I met the new owners of the Vailant and the daughter driver a few weeks ago. Good people and they said he`s focusing on an "All purpose" street machine he can drive anywhere which is what he told me last time we talked. As far as being back on here? Doubtfull............Too many people thinking they were smarter than him and their insults led him away.
Time to turn the page.
Need his tech support to return.
Matt
We talked about that and he didn`t seem interested but I fully agree. I`ll call him............
Everybody has gone through this from this site. It's about "Character" and how you chose to deal with it.
Like you and I could get into a disagreement and let it get personal and I know you could care less what I think and Visa Versa. We move on.
Opinions are like A$$ HOLES everybody has them.
Ron has Talent and Experience. Do I hang on every word he says. No, but his work says it all. He's good at what he does.
Matt
I hear ya but some of the more intellegent "mellow" people are who they are and confrontation is not their thing nor will it be...........me, I don`t get shook up much anymore but he and I are two totally different people like so many on here. More tech less talk makes sense to me these days and he may or may not show but I`m not holding my breath.
Bully him then!
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/28/14 04:43 PM
Naw, I really like Ron a lot..............I will call him in a few since I didn`t yesturday.
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/28/14 05:43 PM
We talked for a few but lost signal so I`ll keep ya posted on what he says.
Posted By: MattW
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/28/14 05:46 PM
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/29/14 08:21 PM
Quote:
Had a great talk w/Ron today and you just may see him back.................. 
I told him he was missed and highly respected and would be received well by most and to ignore the others.
Posted By: clonestocker
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/29/14 09:30 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Had a great talk w/Ron today and you just may see him back.................. I told him he was missed and highly respected and would be received well by most and to ignore the others.
Dom a Big to you. It would be great to have Ron back !
Posted By: 1967dartgt
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/29/14 09:54 PM
Would like to see him back and see his new build.
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/29/14 10:02 PM
Time will tell..................
Posted By: Troy
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/29/14 10:54 PM
....Ron is a good guy. He thinks "outside of the box" and then he puts it to the test. Hope to see him back.
Hi Ron, I know your reading this and all I have to say is
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/29/14 11:43 PM
Quote:
....Ron is a good guy. He thinks "outside of the box" and then he puts it to the test. Hope to see him back.
Hi Ron, I know your reading this and all I have to say is
Agreed.................. I think he`ll be back cos he misses us too..................
Posted By: b1dartsport
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/30/14 12:08 AM
Quote:
....Ron is a good guy. He thinks "outside of the box" and then he puts it to the test. Hope to see him back.
Hi Ron, I know your reading this and all I have to say is
Good going Thump, I miss Ron's posts he is one in a million.
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/30/14 12:10 AM
Posted By: MattW
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/30/14 01:38 PM
Posted By: Quicktree
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/30/14 05:16 PM
I hope he comes back, love his car. like i Have said before. you need thick skin around here. some will like you some wont. just the way it is.
Posted By: MattW
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 10/31/14 10:44 PM
1
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 07/01/15 09:07 PM
1<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbs.gif" alt="" />
Well, I sold my house in Rancho Cucamonga, so I do not have a Shop any more. Sloan is guarding (wearing out) all my shop tools
I now live in an apartment in Pasadena and walk to work every day. Still into Racing at Irwindale and have made a few trips up to Fomoso. I finally have a "worthy" SRT Challenger and a pretty darn fast HEMI Truck (13.98 pure stock) both 15's. Just playing with these for the time being.
I do have a long term plan to buy a house again someday after I retire and I am hoping to set aside 50 G's for another build at that time. I will be building cars in my dreams the last night that I go to sleep. It's just how I am.
Ron.
Posted By: justinp61
Re: SILVALIANT 501 CI Small Block Under way.............. - 07/01/15 09:11 PM
Ron it's good to hear you're doing well.
Posted By: AndyF
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 07/01/15 09:44 PM
I saw your car at Woodburn one year and it was fantastic. Incredible build quality. You could make some serious money building cars for the high buck crowd. Your stuff was just as nice as any of the guys who build magazine cars.
Posted By: WHITEDART
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 07/01/15 11:15 PM
Hey Ron it's Shiloh here good to see you back
Posted By: 340Cuda
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 07/01/15 11:19 PM
Good to see you back, thanks for the update.
Bill
Posted By: clonestocker
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 07/02/15 12:13 AM
Ron, Thanks for the update. Until the next build. Enjoy
matt
Posted By: johnnycuda
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 07/02/15 12:15 AM
Glad you're back, that car was badazz!
I just started on a '69 Valiant myself, 408 SBM, RHS heads, 8.75 rear, Calvert Suspension, have most of the mechanical parts already, you're welcome to turn a wrench on this one if you miss yours!
Posted By: J_BODY
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 07/02/15 03:33 AM
that car wasn't badazz.... the DEMON was the chit!!
Posted By: Al_Alguire
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 07/02/15 03:53 AM
The Demon was the bomb with the Valiant a very close second. Glad to hear you are still plugging away missed seeing you and shoting the bull at the MATS this last year. Take care.
Posted By: Randy..
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 07/02/15 03:55 AM
Glad to see you back Ron.
Posted By: MattW
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 07/02/15 04:49 AM
Glad your back.
Hope everything is well!
Matt
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 01/06/16 10:31 PM
My latest ride. 2016 Cat. I flew out to Texas and drove it home 1365 miles. It felt like the Demon pulling at 130 MPH in 35 deg air back there. That SC loves the cold air. It was 26 deg when I got in it the first morning to head back. Car was covered in ice.
Of course it won't 60 foot like the Demon did.
You can drive this car all day long and never know it was fast.
Already added a nice set of Forgeline wheels and MT ET Street S/S Drag Radials.
Have not run it yet. Wish me luck.
Ron
.
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 01/06/16 10:36 PM
My latest ride. 2016 Cat. I flew out to Texas and drove it home 1365 miles. It felt like the Demon pulling at 130 MPH in 35 deg air back there. That SC loves the cold air. It was 26 deg when I got in it the first morning to head back. Car was covered in ice.
Of course it won't 60 foot like the Demon did.
You can drive this car all day long and never know it was fast.
Already added a nice set of Forgeline wheels and MT ET Street S/S Drag Radials.
Have not run it yet. Wish me luck.
Ron
Welcome back Ron...........NICE CAR MAN...........
.
Posted By: crackedback
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 01/06/16 10:58 PM
Good to see you floating around Ron.
Cool car and hope to see you out at an event.
Posted By: clonestocker
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 01/07/16 12:06 AM
My latest ride. 2016 Cat. I flew out to Texas and drove it home 1365 miles. It felt like the Demon pulling at 130 MPH in 35 deg air back there. That SC loves the cold air. It was 26 deg when I got in it the first morning to head back. Car was covered in ice.
Of course it won't 60 foot like the Demon did.
You can drive this car all day long and never know it was fast.
Already added a nice set of Forgeline wheels and MT ET Street S/S Drag Radials.
Have not run it yet. Wish me luck.
Ron
.
Nice ride Ron. Welcome back. My youngest is waiting for his ScatPack to show up any day now. It's not a Hellcat though.
Posted By: J_BODY
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 01/07/16 12:09 AM
Last year at Mats anyone with a HC got in free...... Maybe they'll do it again!
Posted By: justinp61
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 01/07/16 12:25 AM
Very nice ride, stop in more often Ron.
Posted By: Al_Alguire
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 01/07/16 04:06 AM
Very nice Ron. Hope to see you at the MATS this year.
Posted By: Cab_Burge
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 01/07/16 04:27 AM
Dude, your addicted worst than I am
Are you still working Ron? Will you be at the MATS race this year? I'm sort of planning on being there racing this year, if all goes well between now and then
Posted By: '68cuda416
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 01/07/16 04:59 AM
Hi Ron, this is off topic but I have been hoping to get in touch with you as I lost your number. I bought the backup 904 transmission for the valiant from you a little over a year ago and have finally got the car moving under its own power. I seem to be having an issue with the transmission, it drips while running slowly and then after shutting it off will leave a small puddle under the car. I did already pull the trams back out and replaced the front seal to no change. It also seems to be making some metal when you inspect the fluid. I am not sure what direction to take with this problem as I thought it was a fresh rebuild from Dave. Any help trying to figure it out or suggestions would be greatly appreciated, thanks Mike.
Posted By: Troy
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 01/07/16 07:06 AM
Hi Ron!! Sounds like all is well. Try and make it out to Spring Fling this year.....end of April. I would love to see you and chat.
Troy
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 01/07/16 06:18 PM
Mike, sent you a PM with info and my number.
Cab I am planning on going to MATS. Just not sure if I want to drive over there on the Drag Radials or switch to the stock tires/wheels.
Troy I will definitely be at the Spring Fling if it falls on my day off. I work most weekends and save all my Vacation days for RACING!
I rarely come on here so I want to say good luck to all.
Posted By: Al_Alguire
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 01/07/16 06:43 PM
Ron, More than welcome to keep your stuff, tires, wheels etc in my pit space as well as use whatever tools you need.
Posted By: '68cuda416
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 01/08/16 02:15 AM
Thank you Ron for the help and suggestions, enjoyed talking to you on the phone.
Posted By: 340Cuda
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 01/08/16 04:56 AM
A very cool car Ron, good luck with it.
Bill Lamb
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 05/29/16 01:24 AM
My latest ride. 2016 Cat. I flew out to Texas and drove it home 1365 miles. It felt like the Demon pulling at 130 MPH in 35 deg air back there. That SC loves the cold air. It was 26 deg when I got in it the first morning to head back. Car was covered in ice.
Of course it won't 60 foot like the Demon did.
You can drive this car all day long and never know it was fast.
Already added a nice set of Forgeline wheels and MT ET Street S/S Drag Radials.
Have not run it yet. Wish me luck.
Ron
.
Nice ride Ron. Welcome back. My youngest is waiting for his ScatPack to show up any day now. It's not a Hellcat though.
.
Matt, this post is for you. I did not want to Hijack Dom's thread and I am not really going to start posting in here much if at all. But I did not want to be an A-Hole and ignore you.
I still remember being flamed over my embarrassingly slow 2009 SRT Challenger. Even though I have proved to myself and others over and over that car had issues. Not me.
This Hellcat is everything you would imagine it is and can be, as long as you are realistic. For instance some think it is going to have hand buffed show car paint because it costs $70,000.....No, it has the same paint as a V6.
It runs exactly what it should. My best Quarter mile was at Famoso with 1125 Ft DA : 10.906 @ 128.54 with a 1.604 sixty foot. But at Irwindale it has ran 6.916 @ 101.05 with a 1.549 sixty foot at 850 DA. That run at Famoso was a 6.993 @ 100.91 MPH. So based on all my time slips I estimate it could run 10.78-10.82 @ 129.5-130 at 0 DA.
The best credible stock time that I know of was run in -1000 ft DA and that was at 41 deg ambient. 10.620 @ 130.96 He had an aluminum Driveshaft and 10X28 Bias Ply Hoosier Slicks on a 17" rim (pretty light). He runs added air in the front tires and VP MS109 and his track is open 6 days a week so he can easily chase good DA. Stock gears but a shorter tire. Not sure if I could match this Guy at the same DA but it would be close. I know my car would literally haul at 41 deg.
My car ran all those times on nothing special 91 octane right from the Pump. My Motor is 100% stock. I still have the stock Driveshaft. I put the Scat Pack Differential in my car which changes the Ratio from 2.62 to 3.09. The BEST thing you could do to one of these cars. I run the ET Street "R" 305/45R18 Drag Radials.
My car has about 2700 miles on it with not one problem so far. It has 105 Passes on it and the oil level is exactly the same as when I got it. Amazing. It has a really bad AZZ stereo, comfy Black Laguna Leather, Nav etc. I have had 7 late model Challengers and I think I finally have one I can keep. I don't have any choice because I suddenly retired on a whim Feb 11th of this year (quit my Job).
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 05/29/16 04:24 AM
Hopefully you`ll change your mind about not posting much cos others and myself really respect your skills and perfection level a bunch...........was great seeing ya again Ron................
Posted By: MattW
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 05/29/16 01:19 PM
Nice to see you posting again and I do hope you change your mind and post more often.
Really disappointed that you bought a hellcat. Lol Was hoping you were going to build something with a G3 in it.
Oh well you took the easy route and BOUGHT a package car.
Shame on you! Lol
Nice car and hope to see more of you on here.
Matt
Posted By: 1964superstock
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 05/29/16 06:47 PM
Hi Ron, good to see some posts from you. I spoke with you at the MATS a few times when you were auto crossing your orange 5.7 Challenger R/T, and later a white 5.0 Mustang. How does the R/T Challenger and 5.0 Mustang compare to your new Hellcat Challenger overall? Bang for the buck who wins? Which have you enjoyed driving the most?
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 05/29/16 08:50 PM
Hi Ron, good to see some posts from you. I spoke with you at the MATS a few times when you were auto crossing your orange 5.7 Challenger R/T, and later a white 5.0 Mustang. How does the R/T Challenger and 5.0 Mustang compare to your new Hellcat Challenger overall? Bang for the buck who wins? Which have you enjoyed driving the most?
Well, all my Challengers up to last year when I bought a 2015 SRT 392 were Manuals. The 2010 SS Camaro and 2014 5.0 Mustang were Manuals. For driving around daily I really really love a Manual trans. But if you want to lay down a pass in one you better be willing to spend some money and time trying a lot of different things. I chose the easy way out when I moved to Pasadena and started going to Irwindale every week. "A8".
Probably one of the best deals out there is a Base Challenger 5.7 with the Super Track Pack. Base cars actually have some really good features. I am not sure what it would cost today with the other required options, but I would not buy another 5.7 without the STP. When I ran that Orange one on the Autocross it was 2 seconds slower than me driving my Buddies pure stock STP car of the same year. 2 Seconds. If you OWN a 5.7 I think you would like driving it and be happy with it. I always thought they were fun and it seems like there are some pretty fast stock ones out there.
I really liked the Camaro and the Mustang. The engines in ALL 3 are amazing. Seriously. The Mustang was pretty fast. 13.26 at Fontana. Camaro did a 13.66 there. Every one of the four 5.7's I had would do 13.9-14.1 there (STP was the slowest = bigger wheels/tires). And of course there is the 09 SRT that did 14.5 there and then promptly got banished from my life! LOL.
I put a MGW shifter in the Mustang and that was badd azz. They all are really cool in their own way I guess. But the #1 reason I always end up with a Challenger is the size and comfort of the interior and the STYLE. When I see a Camaro or a Mustang drive by I might not even notice.......M A Y B E if it is a special model. But if a V6 Challenger drives by I spin around on my heels to check it out.
Do I think the Hellcat is worth the money? Well, I would DEFINITELY buy one over modding/supercharging a 5.7 or 6.4. It was a lot of money and it does live up to it's name. Most of them will run the number in the right hands. But it "is" just a Car. I put it in the realm of a 1970 HEMI CUDA. I had the money and paid cash for mine ($77.500 out the door) and I was NOT going to miss out on this. I was too young to buy a Hemi Cuda. Oh, and I do think you could take this to the dealer if it does not run, because the expected performance is posted right on the SRT web site.
I spent $60,000 on the initial build of the Valiant with the crate motor and then another $25,000 on the 501. For comparison.
I am hopelessly in love with Cars so I guess I can sleep in this thing if I run out of Money. I thought about selling it when I quit my Job in Feb, . . . . . for about 1 day! Then I said no.
How does it compare to those other Cars I have had? HMMmm. Well it is a really nice car. So there is that. But it is really cool driving in something that you know can own it if you want. Something really fast with decent handling and amazing brakes. One thing I noticed driving back from Texas when I bought it, was it seems to be set on Kill. Just short half throttle blasts passing Trucks would get you 120. When you nail this thing at speed it KNOWS exactly where to be and there is no hesitation. But on the other hand you can drive it all day long dropping off Kids at school or taking your Mother to the Grocery store. You would NOT know this car is fast unless you throttle it.
Posted By: J_BODY
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 05/30/16 12:35 AM
I seem to remember a "mustang on freeway will beat the ever loving s##t out of you!" story as I was sitting there at MaTS when Tony was chatting with you a few years back. It's cool you've been able to "taste all the flavors" so to speak.... it's great that the automakers are even allowed to make cool shi7 like that!!!
(ok.... I was going to say "[censored] yourself out to the first "fast" car that comes along"... but I didn't want to ruffle any feathers...
the lil dealer I work at has sold 6 Hellcats and presently have three on the lot. Such cool cars!!!!
Posted By: Rapid340
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 05/30/16 12:59 PM
Is it me or am I really seeing alot of guys selling their old musclecars and buying new Challengers (and other brands). This could effect the musclecar market if true. Would have never guessed Ron would buy a 4400lb car. I did sit in a hellcat at local dealer, felt nice, it was nice looking inside and out.
Posted By: fast68plymouth
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 05/30/16 05:34 PM
I know it's sort of ancient history at this point, since it seems the big 501 was sold like 4 years ago, but I'm curious as to where that thing ended up.
Anyone know what it got stuffed into and how it went?
Posted By: Thumperdart
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 05/30/16 06:07 PM
George Koopal who I used to work for apparently went through it and believe it was going into a friends of his car for his daughter.........same guy who bought Ron`s car............
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 05/30/16 06:30 PM
I know it's sort of ancient history at this point, since it seems the big 501 was sold like 4 years ago, but I'm curious as to where that thing ended up.
Anyone know what it got stuffed into and how it went?
I know who has the Valiant. I was actually sitting with Him (a Friend) at the Spring Fling for a couple hours talking, WITH the Valiant sitting right beside us. I got to drive the car across the park and load it onto the trailer. Wow, I would love to have that car back.........
Posted By: Ron Silva
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 05/30/16 06:44 PM
Is it me or am I really seeing alot of guys selling their old musclecars and buying new Challengers (and other brands). This could effect the musclecar market if true. Would have never guessed Ron would buy a 4400lb car. I did sit in a hellcat at local dealer, felt nice, it was nice looking inside and out.
I only have a late model car to race because I do not have a shop/house right now. I live in an apartment. Thank God it has an attached Garage to keep the Hellcat in. When I get a House I will most likely be building something else. Maybe a 70-71 Duster or Demon. But don't get all excited. It will be an 11.50 car built on a budget. Maybe even a TIGHT budget.
Either way I was always going to have something nice to drive as well as a Hot Rod. This is the last Car I had just before buying an Automatic Challenger.
Another reason we are buying late model cars is we are getting OLD. I am 56 now and semi-retired (unemployed). I am not sure I want to build another car. I know I sound flaky but I am in Limbo right now. I will get it figured out......
Posted By: WO23Coronet
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 05/30/16 07:24 PM
Your old Valiant with a HellCat engine would be a nice combo
Posted By: deaks
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO ! - 05/30/16 08:27 PM
Sorry to hear about your predicament, i'm sure you'll get your mojo back at some stage, hopefully with the money to build or run something else.
Mick
