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64 Dodge went to the track last night

Posted By: sjs64polara

64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 12:10 PM

Last night was the 1st time down the track for me so I was kinda lost but still had fun.


My 64 Dodge Polara has been updated and now has 590-600hp at 5400 rpm and 650 ft torque at 2900 rpm. It weighs 3840 lbs without me, I’m a 238 lbs so total is a light 4078 lbs I’m running 3.91 gears with Hoosier 28x10 DOT drag radials. I couldn’t launch very hard because I kept spinning the tires. I dropped the tire psi 18 lbs but I was still spinning. It pulled very hard half track. Next time I’ll play with the front shock settings. Can I drop tire psi below 18? Besides my driving skills, what other tuning can I do to make it run better? Please keep in mind I street drive the car weekly.

After learning how the track works, I ran 12.5 to 12.6 at 108 mph all night.
Here is one of my slip numbers
R/T .319
60’ 1.79
¼ 12.591
Mph 108.7

Attached picture 5383092-Polara11.jpg
Posted By: sjs64polara

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 03:14 PM

Here are some pictures

Attached picture 5383375-burnout.jpg
Posted By: sjs64polara

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 03:15 PM

one more.......

Attached picture 5383378-takeoff.jpg
Posted By: Mac's Hemi 64

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 03:37 PM

Awesome looking ride. Done anything to the rear suspension?
Posted By: sjs64polara

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 04:31 PM

Quote:

Awesome looking ride. Done anything to the rear suspension?



Just super Stock Springs and stock shocks.

Could a pinion snubber help?

I was shifting at 5500
As I said before, I'm new to this
Posted By: 11secondC

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 04:44 PM

Good looking ride Did you try shifting it any higher?
Posted By: Dodgem

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 05:02 PM

pinion snubber will help as will higher shifts less air.
4 speed or auto?
Cool shots
Posted By: sjs64polara

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 05:44 PM

Didnt shift higher then 5500.
A&A 727 trans w/ 9.5" 3500 Dynamic converter

Shouldnt the car be around 115 MPH. only about 15-20 cars were at track and it got damp out last night. Maybe I just had too much tire slip?
Posted By: Bob_Coomer

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 05:55 PM

Quote:

Didnt shift higher then 5500.
A&A 727 trans w/ 9.5" 3500 Dynamic converter

Shouldnt the car be around 115 MPH. only about 15-20 cars were at track and it got damp out last night. Maybe I just had too much tire slip?



NO
For a 115MPH your car would need to be a full second faster.
Posted By: Jeremiah

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 06:01 PM

Totally cool. I used to live eight miles from Union Grove.

What RPM are you launching the car at?

Jeremiah
Posted By: Triple Threat

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 06:04 PM

Was the Engine Dynod or are the power numbers just an estimate?. You can run drag radials as low as about 15#'s experiment with them between there and about 20 for best traction.
Posted By: sjs64polara

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 06:34 PM

Yes it was on a dyno. My last dyno #s were 550 hp at 5300 and 650 torque at 2900. I've made updates since that is why I said 590-600 hp

I was launching at 1700-2000 It breaks loose stagging at 2200-2400

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Posted By: Barnstorm

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 06:56 PM

Neat car. I have buddy with a basic stock MW 64 car and 3.91. He runs 12.00 with 1.55 60's. He doesn't want to cut the car, thus no roll bar. you would probably et similar if you could 60 a little better. Good luck!

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Posted By: Anonymous

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 07:23 PM

Quote:

Didnt shift higher then 5500.
A&A 727 trans w/ 9.5" 3500 Dynamic converter

Shouldnt the car be around 115 MPH. only about 15-20 cars were at track and it got damp out last night. Maybe I just had too much tire slip?



shifting your car any higher really wont help you.
i think if you go down the track some3 more you will find that everything will pick up.
its called seat time.

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Posted By: Anonymous

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 07:25 PM

i ran a car very similar to yours as i found that a 4000-4200 stall 9.5 worked great. i got 1.52 60 foots with SS springs.

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Posted By: TonyS451

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 07:30 PM

Very cool car! Don't see many early B bodies at DaGrove, thats for sure. I agree w/Superstock, you will surely pick up some et and speed with more seat time. However, I'm curious to know about the engine combo. Also, was the engine dynoed with the exhaust manifolds? Again, I love the car!!!
Posted By: sjs64polara

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 07:52 PM

Dyno'd with manifolds and switched to 2" TTI's becasue of heat issues.

I agree, I need seat time, practice with burn outs and launches

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Posted By: Dodgem

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 07:57 PM

I'll bet it will like 6300 to 6600 shifts. You always go past peak hp to hit the sweet spot and if you have more cam now that will move things up!
Trials are the only true tests!
Posted By: Anonymous

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 07:58 PM

Quote:

Dyno'd with manifolds and switched to 2" TTI's becasue of heat issues.

I agree, I need seat time, practice with burn outs and launches



if you switched to TTI's after the dyno session, i would definitely shift the car around 5800-6000 and i bet you see a slight pickup of about 5 hundredths.to probably a .1
i did with almost the same combo.
also change out that converter to at least a 4000-4500 stall.

Attached picture 5383942-63PLYMOUTH65DODGEA99068HEMIROADRUNNER030.JPG
Posted By: sjs64polara

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 08:03 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Dyno'd with manifolds and switched to 2" TTI's becasue of heat issues.

I agree, I need seat time, practice with burn outs and launches



if you switched to TTI's after the dyno session, i would definitely shift the car around 5800-6000 and i bet you see a slight pickup of about 5 hundredths.to probably a .1
i did with almost the same combo.
also change out that converter to at least a 4000-4500 stall.



Change stall even with with max torque at 2900 (650 ft lbs)

Attached picture 5383955-Polara13.jpg
Posted By: old_racer

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 08:08 PM

Hi
my street piece runs 12.30s @107 with stock manifolds threw the cutouts, with some small slicks, and my motor isn't as good as yours so you have a lot left to be sure, practice getting it to hook up and you will be suprised! that thing will run high 11's with headers I would think.
Russ

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Posted By: Anonymous

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 08:10 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Dyno'd with manifolds and switched to 2" TTI's becasue of heat issues.

I agree, I need seat time, practice with burn outs and launches



if you switched to TTI's after the dyno session, i would definitely shift the car around 5800-6000 and i bet you see a slight pickup of about 5 hundredths.to probably a .1
i did with almost the same combo.
also change out that converter to at least a 4000-4500 stall.



Change stall even with with max torque at 2900 (650 ft lbs)



your max torque was with exhaust manifolds that choke the performance of your motor,
did you have mufflers on the car when you dynoed the motor, if so were the dumps uncorked. i have been racing max wedge cars for a very long time and i know how to get almost every possible amount of HP out of them.
when you went to TTI's i bet your peak torque is probably at 3400 rpms now from my experience.
also peak torque really drops off with a OE crossram.

also what is your jetting on your crossram, there is a specific jet staggering that is required to get the maximum hp out of the the motor.

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Posted By: BradH

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 08:24 PM

Quote:

Yes it was on a dyno. My last dyno #s were 550 hp at 5300 and 650 torque at 2900. I've made updates since that is why I said 590-600 hp


Your dyno #s and your weight / MPH don't add up. Whether its the result of subsequent parts changes, current state of tune, converter issues (excessive slippage), etc., you're way down on MPH from what 550 HP "should" show in MPH, even at almost 4100#.
Posted By: B1Fish540

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/29/09 09:29 PM

Quote:

Didnt shift higher then 5500.
A&A 727 trans w/ 9.5" 3500 Dynamic converter

Shouldnt the car be around 115 MPH. only about 15-20 cars were at track and it got damp out last night. Maybe I just had too much tire slip?



I believe you should be running around 115 with that much HP. Dont know what cam you have but shiting at 5500 seems kinda low. I had to baby my Challenger off the line and ran 115 at 12.3 and I had less hp. trap speed is a sign of HP..but your trap speed does match your ET pretty good, imho.

BTW, I love your car!
Posted By: sjs64polara

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/30/09 03:25 AM



I believe you should be running around 115 with that much HP. Dont know what cam you have but shiting at 5500 seems kinda low. I had to baby my Challenger off the line and ran 115 at 12.3 and I had less hp. trap speed is a sign of HP..but your trap speed does match your ET pretty good, imho.

BTW, I love your car!




Here is my engine................

505 cubic inches
Heads: 906- valves, exhaust 1.810, intake 2.140 -ported & polished
Compression: 10.5:1
Intake Manifold: Rick Allison Cross Ram
Carbs: (2) Edelbrock 600cfm (stock)
Exhaust: 2” TTI headers w/ 3” TTI exhaust
Cam: Bullet- Hydraulic roller p/n CRB 298/303-12HR
Duration at .050: intake .240 exhaust .246
Gross lift : intake .567 exhaust .567
Cam in at 106 deg
Ignition: Mopar distributor w/ MSD 6AL2

If it would help the Dyno graph is on web page. The dyno #’s are with manifolds not the TTI’s

A&A Transmission 727 , stall converter Dynamic 9 ½ 3500 stall
8 ¾ with 3.91 and 28x10 Hoosier DOT drag radials

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Posted By: sjs64polara

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/30/09 03:35 AM

I thought I'd add some more fun pictures from last night. My budddy is a photo freak

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Posted By: sjs64polara

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/30/09 03:36 AM

1 more...........

Attached picture 5385046-motor.jpg
Posted By: 383man

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/30/09 05:41 AM

That is one very sweet Mopar. And of course I love the early B's. You did fine for the first time out. But I agree your car should be able to run 11's with ease when you get everything in tune. My 63 's 440 makes about 500 flywheel hp and at 3700 lbs has hit 11.50's @ 116 and I think we can help you go faster then me. I use 906 heads I ported and have the MP solid .557 cam. I usually shift about 6200 by my tach but to be honest I shift by the feel of the eng and it is about 6200 when it feels like it's time to shift. I trap about 6300 to 6400 using 4.30's with 30 x 9 Hoosier radial slicks. My best 60 this year has been a 1.59 and I usually 60 in the low 1.60's. I feel your car should be in the 1.60's with no trouble for the 60's. I just use SS springs and long shocks in the rear with stock front suspension and I just added the Comp 90/10 shocks a few weeks ago. I believe your eng and combo should go 115. The mph is a could figure of power it is making and at 108 you wont go 11's but with good hook low 12's can be had at 108. So we need to see where your loosing some power and get the hook working as it should hook hard. I use a Dynamic 9.5 that flashes about 4200 and on a good track it will hook like glue. Dont worry you will get it and you still ran very good for the first outing in that sweet 64. Ron

Posted By: Kevins493

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/30/09 06:16 AM

What Ron and SSR said...it has more in it, just have to find it. I ran 11.70s with my old 64 plymouth on radials and SS springs with a 1.61-1.65 60' depending on the track.
Nice '64!
Posted By: sjs64polara

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/30/09 05:39 PM

Thanks to all for the input

I'm sure I'll have more questions after my next outing.

I need seat time, try different shift points, etc......... AND yes I know only change 1 thing at a time otherwise

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Posted By: Cudahlr

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/30/09 10:06 PM

Spence, you need to borrow my 9x28 slicks that will help!

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Posted By: 383man

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/30/09 10:08 PM

I am curious of where you have your total timing set ? Ron
Posted By: sjs64polara

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/31/09 12:51 AM

Quote:

I am curious of where you have your total timing set ? Ron




Dyno loved 36 deg so I nevered changed it

Here is an odd thing, trap rpm was well over 5700. that doesnt add up with my gear and tire diameter That rpm should have been over 117mph. Tire slip + newbee driver

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Posted By: maxi426

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/31/09 11:36 AM

Are the head and intake manifold ports Max Wedge size, or std..
Posted By: sjs64polara

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/31/09 01:28 PM

Standard port, 906 heads with Rick Allison intake

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Posted By: Dodgem

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/31/09 01:44 PM

Sometimes the dyno gives biggest hp number back a few degrees but best ET may be 38 to 40.
Posted By: Kevins493

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/31/09 04:24 PM

Quote:

Quote:

I am curious of where you have your total timing set ? Ron




Dyno loved 36 deg so I nevered changed it

Here is an odd thing, trap rpm was well over 5700. that doesnt add up with my gear and tire diameter That rpm should have been over 117mph. Tire slip + newbee driver


Not tire slip..converter slip.
Posted By: 10 o to go

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 07/31/09 11:36 PM

nice car .heres my buddys 65 electric windows
500 inch 9.68s WON MMW last year in pro
don

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Posted By: dvw

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 08/01/09 12:54 AM

I agree,it should go faster. Tire slipis not the only problem. MPH is low. Were you running with the air claeners in place? That could be a big chunk of it. Beware of 40 degrees timing . It may be quicker but I've seen a few torched decks. For what its worth back in the day my Roadrunner would run 13.60@107 on 255 60 15 T/As. The very first pass with slicks was 12.32@114. Your combo will improve. My buddys 65 belvedere with a low rise dual 4,906 heads,557 Mopar cam runs 11.50 @115 all the time. I'll bet yours will be quicker.
Doug
Posted By: B1Fish540

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 08/01/09 01:12 AM

Quote:

Standard port, 906 heads with Rick Allison intake



Do you know how the heads flowed? I know its hard to get them much over 250-265 CFM with out making them crack. My point is, you may not be making as much HP as you think simply because the heads wont support it. Your cam should work good with those heads, but being only in the .540 lift area would also limit HP. But that said, I too think you should run mid 11s easy...like was mentioned with all that TQ you may need a tighter convertor.
Posted By: old_racer

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 08/01/09 01:47 AM

Hi
do you plan on bringing it to the nats? , stop by us in the pits and we'll help you tune or what ever you need.
Russ

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Posted By: sjs64polara

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 08/01/09 02:40 AM

Quote:

Hi
do you plan on bringing it to the nats? , stop by us in the pits and we'll help you tune or what ever you need.
Russ



Yes we are going.....
I appreciate the gesture, I may take you up on that.
I have a lot of learning to do

Attached picture 5389618-Polara13.jpg
Posted By: sjs64polara

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 08/01/09 02:51 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Standard port, 906 heads with Rick Allison intake



Do you know how the heads flowed? I know its hard to get them much over 250-265 CFM with out making them crack. My point is, you may not be making as much HP as you think simply because the heads wont support it. Your cam should work good with those heads, but being only in the .540 lift area would also limit HP. But that said, I too think you should run mid 11s easy...like was mentioned with all that TQ you may need a tighter convertor.



No I dont know how the heads flowed but I do have a lot of dyno data.

Dynamic just told me how to check the flash so I'll check that out over the next few days. A&A had them set for 3400 so I'll see how close it is

Ya think my burn out is a little much for Hoosier DOT drag radials I kinda thought I was John Force for a few seconds

Attached picture 5389667-5383375-burnout.jpg
Posted By: sjs64polara

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 08/02/09 03:10 PM

Dynamic just told me how to check the flash so I'll check that out over the next few days. A&A had them set for 3400 so I'll see how close it is


Just checked the flash on my 9 1/2 " Dynamic..... I put it in 3rd, rolled about 5 mph and gunned it. The tach went to 3000rpm. I did it a few times, the rpms dropped a little every time Then rechecked it by puttingg it in 3rd, stopped the car, held the brake then quick punched it, about 3000 again.

So with that said, what should I leave the line at? When I try and leave at 2200-2300 RPM, the tires spin before the light even goes green and then I look like a DA

Attached picture 5392271-takeoff.jpg
Posted By: B1Fish540

Re: 64 Dodge went to the track last night - 08/02/09 03:42 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Dyno'd with manifolds and switched to 2" TTI's becasue of heat issues.

I agree, I need seat time, practice with burn outs and launches



if you switched to TTI's after the dyno session, i would definitely shift the car around 5800-6000 and i bet you see a slight pickup of about 5 hundredths.to probably a .1
i did with almost the same combo.
also change out that converter to at least a 4000-4500 stall.



I mis read your cam lift..i see its over .560 so maybe you dont have enough stall..i would say 4000 or 4500 would be closer like SS says. Not being able to hold the car sounds familiar, my challenger did the same thing until I went to a Coan. You might consider trying a different convertor, I had a 3000 stall J.W. that felt just like stock. Went to the 3500 Coan and could hold the car at 3000 rpm with my stock drum brakes.
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