Moparts

Convertor bolts with lock tight?

Posted By: fullmetaljacket

Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 04:29 AM

Are you guys using thread locker on your convertor to flexplate bolts?

Posted By: 70AARcuda

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 04:34 AM

yes

Posted By: proshiftcharger

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 04:35 AM

yes and check them periodically too.

Posted By: BDS871Cuda

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 09:53 AM

Quote:

Are you guys using thread locker on your convertor to flexplate bolts?

That is (removeable thread locker) so you can
get the bolts out some day.
They do make a thread locker that takes a torch
to undo them. Watch what you buy.

Posted By: therocks

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 11:39 AM

Blue locktite is what you want.Rocky

Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 12:53 PM

Quote:

Blue locktite is what you want.Rocky

negative on that.
RED is the only thing to use on converter
bolts, once you have one back out, you'll never use anything else.after ytou bsnug up make sure some is holding the front crank bolt 1-1/8 and tighten more, i use a hammer on the wrench to keep them snugged very tight.
just ask ACTIONANGE.

Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 12:54 PM

I use the red locktite and I can get my impact on them
(in the starter area without the starter in) and get
them good and tight. Same thing when I take them out

Posted By: mopar dave

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 01:00 PM

i use the blue without issue. if i used red i would never get them back out. before i started using thread locker, the bolts would contantly loosen.

Posted By: WILD BILL

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 01:09 PM

I use red and tighten to 30 Ft Lbs. Haven't had one come loose since I started doing it this way.

Posted By: Quicktree

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 01:14 PM

I have always used blue. never had one back out.

Posted By: dvw

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 01:18 PM

I've used both. Red is diffucult to remove. A few thoughts. The torque applied with a impact gun to a 3/8" bolt would probably be excessive. Why don't converter bolts come loose on a high milage street car without locktite? I locktite mine and have over torqued them also. Just wondering why they tend to come loose in a drag racing application.
Doug

Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 01:27 PM

Quote:

I've used both. Red is diffucult to remove. A few thoughts. The torque applied with a impact gun to a 3/8" bolt would probably be excessive. Why don't converter bolts come loose on a high milage street car without locktite? I locktite mine and have over torqued them also. Just wondering why they tend to come loose in a drag racing application.
Doug

I dont use the full power of the impact, just a couple
of short hits... i would guess 40 ft lbs. All the
converter bolts I've seen come with locktite(blue)
on them. In racing we put all the fasteners in
greater stress than any streetcar.
With the red locktite the impact pops them free real
easy(the shock breaks the bond)

Posted By: HPMike

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 02:07 PM

I don't know where people got the idea that a bolt with red Loctite would "never come loose". Maybe it's material for a future Mythbuster episode. They always come out, sometimes if they are a little stubborn, all it takes is a little heat(nothing exotic-I just use a mini torch at the shop) and they back right out.

Always use red loctite on TC bolts. Actually, it's a good idea to loctite just about everything on a drag car. Bolts like starter bolts, trans to bell bolts, motor mounts, pulleys, driveshafts etc, etc. Many guys are still using 40 year old blocks and trans cases and the threased holes have been compromised over the years. One would be surprised at how many bolts are loctited by the factory on your daily driver. The reason for going overboard on a race car is the parts are under stress constantly and the violent shock of launching the car can lead to fastener loosening and subsequent component failure.

Posted By: redex79

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 02:18 PM

Posted By: 65dragnet

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 02:29 PM

red and my convertor bolts are 7/16

Posted By: dusturbd340W5

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 02:41 PM

Quote:

I use the red locktite and I can get my impact on them
(in the starter area without the starter in) and get
them good and tight. Same thing when I take them out

I do the same thing and start pulling the trans out of some of these newer cars and you will be surprised at what has lock tight on it.

Posted By: fullmetaljacket

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 02:51 PM

Okay, Okay! I'm using the RED and the BLUE at the same time so that every body is happy. How's that? LOL

Thanks a lot guys. I've used Locltite before on them, but just forgot which one with all the stuff I have in mind these days.

Posted By: emarine01

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 03:03 PM

We use red loc tite on everything on diesels, never had any problems pullin the bolts with a long wrench and a bump with the palm, I use the blue on stuff like toilet seats and fords

Oops, only kiddin, We dont use anything on fords

Posted By: chargermop

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 03:14 PM

go red

Posted By: WILD BILL

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 03:24 PM

Quote:

I use the blue on stuff like toilet seats and fords

Aren't those the same things

Posted By: hemi_doug

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 03:27 PM

Quote:

I use the red locktite and I can get my impact on them
(in the starter area without the starter in) and get
them good and tight. Same thing when I take them out

I thought there was a torque limit on the bolts....you don't want to tighten them to the point of stretch....you will weaken them....I would think the locktite and proper torque would be OK....

Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 03:38 PM

i really couldnt see how to use a torque wrench on converter bolts, its tough enough getting a open end in there. i notched the bottom of my trans. case to get a better angle and placement on the bolts.

Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 04:00 PM

Quote:

Quote:

I use the red locktite and I can get my impact on them
(in the starter area without the starter in) and get
them good and tight. Same thing when I take them out

I thought there was a torque limit on the bolts....you don't want to tighten them to the point of stretch....you will weaken them....I would think the locktite and proper torque would be OK....

Its the way I do it, 7/16 fine thread bolt has a
pretty good torque to it and I'm sure I dont get near
stretching it.... never had any come loose doing it
this way

Posted By: emarine01

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 05:06 PM

Man stretch a converter bolt , those pups are about as thick as long and hard as hell, you can stretch one without stripin it

Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 05:38 PM

Quote:

Man stretch a converter bolt , those pups are about as thick as long and hard as hell, you can stretch one without stripin it

Exactly

Posted By: fullmetaljacket

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 05:57 PM

Okay, so whats the torque rating on the bolts? Last I believe it calls for 35 foot pounds or some thing like that.

Posted By: cudabin

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 06:02 PM

I have used both Blue and Red at different times.

I still have "check Converter bolts" on my check sheet as even with the Red they can come loose.

http://www.loctiteproducts.com/products/subcategory.asp?CatID=10&SubID=48

Use either, but check regularily...

Cheers,

Arnie

Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 06:03 PM

Quote:

Okay, so whats the torque rating on the bolts? Last I believe it calls for 35 foot pounds or some thing like that.

270 in lbs... converter to flex plate

Posted By: justinp61

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 06:09 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Okay, so whats the torque rating on the bolts? Last I believe it calls for 35 foot pounds or some thing like that.

270 in lbs... converter to flex plate

270 in lbs = 22.5 ft lbs. Is that 7/16" or 5/16" bolts?

Posted By: markz528

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 06:09 PM

Quote:

i really couldnt see how to use a torque wrench on converter bolts, its tough enough getting a open end in there. i notched the bottom of my trans. case to get a better angle and placement on the bolts.

Shorten a 3/8 socket and you can use a 3/8 torque wrench. That is how I do it.

I have loosened the bolts a couple of times. Once I started using blue Loctite and torquing to 50 ft/lb, no issues.

Factory spec is 55 ft/lb, but I am not sure on the friction modifier. Don't know if that is a dry or wet torque, so I am kind of guessing on what the torque should actually be.

BTW - - I use ARP bolts.

Posted By: ITSDUSTA416

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 06:23 PM

I use red loctite & to take them out I heat the bolt a little with a torch and they come out like there not even tight. Never had one back out with RED LOCTITE 271.MY

Posted By: MR_P_BODY

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 06:58 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Okay, so whats the torque rating on the bolts? Last I believe it calls for 35 foot pounds or some thing like that.

270 in lbs... converter to flex plate

270 in lbs = 22.5 ft lbs. Is that 7/16" or 5/16" bolts?

Production bolts (spec is from Munroe's 727 trans handbook)

Posted By: hemidup

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 07:05 PM

Quote:

I use red loctite & to take them out I heat the bolt a little with a torch and they come out like there not even tight. Never had one back out with RED LOCTITE 271.MY

I use red Loctite. Thanks for the tip about using a torch for removal.

I just entered that one in my hair covered computer.

Posted By: lowell66dart

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 07:17 PM

I use a long handle 3/8 rachet. I rotate the bolt up to the area where the oil pan meets the block on the oposite side of the starter. Plenty of room to work.

Posted By: bobby66

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/14/09 07:57 PM

Too bad you cant get a shake proof washer in there. Red Locktite on mine.

Posted By: markz528

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/15/09 03:01 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Okay, so whats the torque rating on the bolts? Last I believe it calls for 35 foot pounds or some thing like that.

270 in lbs... converter to flex plate

270 in lbs = 22.5 ft lbs. Is that 7/16" or 5/16" bolts?

Production bolts (spec is from Munroe's 727 trans handbook)

270 in/lb is for the 5/16 bolts. 55 ft/lb is the factory spec for 7/16 bolts.

Posted By: bill_greenwood

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/15/09 03:08 AM

Now, I've got some perspective on this as I just grenaded another flex plate. When this problem first cropped up, I tried all the colors of Loc-Tite to no avail. Finally, I tried an old trick I learned a long time ago from a millwright and wrapped the bolts in Teflon tape. I checked the bolts frequently after that, and found them to be holding perfectly, and eventually left them be. I did a cursory check this spring and found to be apparently okay, so I didn't check them again after the first outing. Sure enough, yesterday morning I put down an 11.45 on the footbrake, and an hour later pulled in for my first t-brake launch. I detected a funny clatter when I fired it up in the lanes, and made a mental note to crawl underneath and check things out after this pass. Sure enough, foot to the floor, tree coming down, and all of a sudden she hits the rev limiter. Scratch one flex plate. I'll crawl under it later this week and see if I've wounded a convertor. If I have, it might be a season fore me, if I need a new convertor, as I've just recently become self-employed. Oh, well. That's racing.

Posted By: Moparnut426

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/15/09 03:11 AM

Quote:

I've used both. Red is diffucult to remove. A few thoughts. The torque applied with a impact gun to a 3/8" bolt would probably be excessive. Why don't converter bolts come loose on a high milage street car without locktite? I locktite mine and have over torqued them also. Just wondering why they tend to come loose in a drag racing application.
Doug

Almost all the "factory" bolts that go in the minivans, trucks, cars, mopar instructors tell us to put either blue, or red. I use red on everything either 727, 904, or 545RFE.

I have never had any issues with red. I did run out of red once and all I had was the gree penetrating stuff. This was in a buddies 4x4,,, Well when it came time to get them back out they were very tough, I had to heat with a propain torch.

kasey

Posted By: 493_DART

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/15/09 03:16 AM

i use the blue or red . Mine dont come loose anymore . The teflon tape trick did NOT work on my car .

Posted By: fullmetaljacket

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/15/09 04:08 AM

While we're on this, what pounds do you guys set the flexplate to crank bolts? They are also 7/16 in size.

Posted By: dOrk !

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/15/09 04:19 AM

Honestly ...all I have ever done on ALL these FP bolts is use "red" and snugged-'em-down-good.

Posted By: Anonymous

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/15/09 11:34 AM

Quote:

Quote:

I've used both. Red is diffucult to remove. A few thoughts. The torque applied with a impact gun to a 3/8" bolt would probably be excessive. Why don't converter bolts come loose on a high milage street car without locktite? I locktite mine and have over torqued them also. Just wondering why they tend to come loose in a drag racing application.
Doug

im curious when you say tough to get out using the green loc tite, how tough was it?
i was tempted to try the green last year.

Almost all the "factory" bolts that go in the minivans, trucks, cars, mopar instructors tell us to put either blue, or red. I use red on everything either 727, 904, or 545RFE.

I have never had any issues with red. I did run out of red once and all I had was the gree penetrating stuff. This was in a buddies 4x4,,, Well when it came time to get them back out they were very tough, I had to heat with a propain torch.

kasey

Posted By: an8sec70cuda

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/15/09 11:51 AM

Red loctite and as tight as I can get em with a box end wrench. Surprised you fellas can't loosen bolts that have had red loctite on em, just a quick hit w/ your hand on the wrench and they start to move for me...although they are stubborn. CHIP

Posted By: pittsburghracer

Re: Convertor bolts with lock tight? - 06/15/09 12:36 PM

We had a loctite rep come in to talk to us about there products and he said proper prep befor using there product was to remove all grease and oils,if possible wire wheel bolts,again spray with an oil free spray cleaner,apply loctite,and install. After everything is properly tightened never re torque. Loctite is a plastic type of thread sealer and re torquing breaks the seal. I have used red loctite (271) on almost all race car applications with no problems.