How fast do you need to be to be competitive in S/ST?

I not even thinking national event here. Out of my league. Don't have the income for it. This will be a long ways out to even get this car to go 9's. The friends I hang out with are usually doing a couple of divisionals per year and 1 or 2 nationals. (Brainerd and Topeka). I just thought it might be fun to run a divisional once a year?There is also a Super class series that they run at Oahe where they throw S/C, S/G, and S/ST all together and you run your respective index. Usually it's an adjusted index like an 11.03 for S/ST. I thought that if a car ran high 9's at 130 or so, it might be competitive at an 11.03 index?

IF your car will go red on a Pro tree and run 10:90X, you will be competitive.

The faster cars are harder for you to judge at the stripe, but slower cars are not easy for them to judge either.

If your car runs the number and you treed your opponent you will win, no matter what your speed is.

Racers tend to be like lemmings. One guy runs 160 and the rest think they have to.

Give it a try and report back to us !

Have fun too, thats all that matters

WHO was the guy who has a jammer-gun that will really fudge-UP that 160 mph S/ST car ?

With his "E" all messed-up ... he won't know "where" he is !!

Super classes are usually dominated by light tube chassis cars that have massive tires and are throttle stopped to death. They leave go out 150' pause and then MPH you to death...Most are deadly consistent with .00 trees and dead on the number plus a thousandth or two...Anyone can have a good day but you will not win alot with a car that is on 10" tires and ladder bars against these type of cars..

I had to lean on a 906 440 motor to run 10:70's I won some rounds. Just remember you leave at the same time. I think the slower car is a better weapon than the 9-0 car. I got my fill of NHRA 10:90 racing in a hurry.

Rick.

Ok, Ok. I'll get the idea out of my head. Can't blame a guy for dreaming though!

From what I have seen lately the majority are like my car, capable of running mid to high nines and 10.90's at 135-140 will put you in the middle of the pack. IMO this is where I want to be anyhow. Being way faster than your opponent makes the finish line racing much harder in a tight starting line race. Not to mention almost every car will bag .02-.04 which is a serious downfall to a car running 160 at the stripe vs a 135 MPH car with similar reaction times and both similar at the stripe.

If you can get your car to run 10.90 on the throttle stop and cut a light on a .500 pro tree, go to a divisional race and give it a shot. You might get your head handed to you or you might do well and have a great time.

I waffled for a long time about racing an NMCA event. I finally towed down to Memphis for the world finals in '06 and went to the semi-finals in open comp. (lost by .01) Went to their Chicago event in '07 and went 3 rounds before I ran into a problem and couldn't make the next round.

Went to Memphis again in '07 and beat the reigning NMCA champ, a couple top ten guys, Don Bowles (of Jack Rousch racing), the new NMCA champ in the semi's, and finally lost to the former NMCA champ Jamie Rickman in the final round.

Point is none of those NMCA guys ever heard of me before I took a few shots. Now they ALL know who I am.

Who's to say you won't have similar results............go for it!

Well if someone is moving 150' before going on the stop something is wrong or they aint trying to kill much. For instance the Hemi in the Cuda we were on the stop at .10, then back to WOT at around 4.1+-, the new engine on at .10 off at about 5.4+-. As for light, S/ST has a minimum of 2800lbs, my car is 2860, light is S/G and even more so S/C.

like I said before there is no perfect speed or competitve speed. You have to be abke to hit the tree and run the number period. most as stated set up for an 88 or so, but not all. If you know your car and combination you know where you can let off and run .90 on the nose. FWIW I know the Veags national event has been won by a car using a mechanical stop that couold barely run the number at 119ish. It's debateable who has the advantage, the fast or slow car, just like any other bracket racing. I find running my car all out I do much better chasing being the faster car and I see 25+ differences all the time.

My car should weigh about 2900 with me in it when I'm done. It weighs about 3050 now, with the leaf springs and stock front suspension. It's not going to be a leaf spring 10" tired car. 4 link, 14X32's, tubular front suspension, are all in the plans. Thanks for all the info guys. Now I know how fast these cars are. Maybe someday I'll give it a try.

There is no magic in any bracket race, the racers who cuts the best light and runs closest to his dial without breaking out wins All the index races are bracket races that someone else sets the dial, the best drivers wins, absolutely no magic If you have the itch you should go to the races that you can scratch it at Let us know how you do

My buddy runs S/ST with his 68 Cuda you see here. He had a 906 headed 440 with a roller setup. The car ran a best of 10.40 like that and he said in hot weather on slow tracks he was only running 10.80's flat out. He ran like that for a few years but he did say the faster cars seem to have a slight advantage as it is easier to judge a car running him down and then pace him. But he changed the heads to Indy SR's and went to a Glide to calm down the launch and get more consistent 60's. He has run 10.01 best now and has won 2 divisional S/ST races. In fact he won the Dutch Classics at Maple Grove in PA last year. He feels it is easier going faster now to win. But that dont mean a car that only slows down a tenth can't win. This is just what he has told me. I do know in bracket racing I like chasing the other car down better then getting set out. Ron

I believe it's personal prefrence. I've been both the slow car and the fast car. I don't mind looking over my shoulder. I'm used to it. Being the fast car is nice but it's hard to be in some divsions. 10.90 @ 135 is perfect to me.

Dustyhof,
I've raced S/ST for 10 years, over 40 NHRA Divisionals, and 12 or so Nationals. I'm not one of the best, but I know all the best racers, and I know what it takes to win.

The car you use to compete in the class is not important. Knowing how to use the car you have in the class..that's the key!!!

Truthfully, a guy in a 10.80-120 all out car, who's using weight to adjust his ET, and is running at his home town track that he knows well...That guy scares the heck out of the 142+ crowd!!!

The reason Big MPH is an advantage, is that with all the variables that come with trying to hit a set index when you're only getting 2 runs a day, it ends up being a top-end game of trying to take the stripe or give it up. The guy with the most MPH ultimately gets to make the Decision, and impose his will on the other racer. Problem with that is, is the guy with the big MPH smart enough to make the right decision, and is he good enough to execute the manuever once he makes the decision??? Sometimes ignorance is bliss!!!


Now let's get to the nuts and bolts of the situation:

If your car runs between 119-124 (10.90-10.60) it's really not fast enough to consistantly use an air or electric t-stop, so you need a manual stop, and weight.

If your car runs between 124-135 (10.60-9.90) you can run a single action air linkage style stop, or electric under carb stop, and be extremely successfull.

If your car runs between 135-145 (9.90-9.00) First, you have to have a chassis cert, neck collar, gloves, full suit, engine diaper. Then you need a dual action air cylinder linkage style stop, with adjustable bleeders, or an adjustable air under carb stop. The single action slam closed, slam open stuff won't work if you plan to get close to the number.

If your car runs between 145-168 (9.00-8.00) You need everything the above group needed, PLUS, usually dual stops, AND, the innate ability to know to lift 3,4,5, or 6 car lengths BEFORE you catch your opponent!!!

I've help set-up, and dial-in just about every combo there is, and trust me they are all different. If I can help you get a few legs up on the learning curve, I'd be glad to.

Good info MoparBilly!

I have a 10.50 car mechanical stopped ( and on DOT tires)to run 11.50s in another class. I am having a blast its nice being the faster car. When I ran the other class ( Pro 9.00 to 15.99) I was in the middle of the pack. My buddy runs a big Chevy Biscayne in Pro it runs mid 15s, the 9 second cars hate him,they can`t judge him at the stripe.

I did it for a number of years, tried a few different ways to run .90 with a .60 car. The most success I had was when I shifted into 3rd, I watched the tach and when it got close to 5500, I slowly lifted my foot to hold it there through the traps. The MPH would usually be 112-116.

My friend Frank Luckey won several NHRA events doing something similar, he would set his shift light around 5000, when the light came on in 2nd gear (powerglide), he would take his foot completely off the throttle and coast across at around 100 MPH. He had to quit doing that when some officials said that other racers were complaining of cheating.

These techniques probably sound goofy, but they go to show that you don't need to run big MPH if you know and trust your car, and practice, practice, practice.

One last comment, I went back to brackets for the reasons stated above by Bigdad, a whole weekend used for one shot at the tree on Sunday started to get ridiculous. I always liked the format, though.