Electric Water Pump 35gph to 55gph?

Anybody switch from the 35 to the 55? Now that our warmer weather is here, my engine temp is climbing....I have a good rad. Its also the biggest rad that would fit. Never had a cooling issue. But idling around she is starting to get up there. When I called Meizere, they told me it should work. Trying to keep it under 200, but its not possible anymore. Must be making too much power.

When I had a 35 on my car it wouldn't stay cool on the highway (2600 for about 45 minutes). Put an older mechanical pump on with 1 to 1 pulleys and presto got the temps back down to 190 from 220 on extended runs. I didn't try a 55 but there are guys out there that run an electric on the road but I just chose to good old pulleys

Gus

I am debating doing that. I recently switched out an OEM mechanical pump on my drag car for a FlowKooler mechanical. Drops right into the OEM housing.....I may call them tomorrow and get their opinion.

And man that unit works well on my drag car until I go to back up and then she will climb maybe 10....But from the launch at 180, down the track at 180, and all the way back, 180...Go to reverse and park 190....And that car has a small rad and two crappy electric fans. Not really optimized like my Hemi street car. The drag car used to get to 195 during the run and then 200 all the way back.

I would have to buy everything, a housing, the FlowKooler pump, and a full set of pulleys and no one makes a kit for a Mopar with a cheppy alt, water neck, and probably a different alternator and belt. The pulley that is on the current one is ON there!

I have a 55 on a a 414 with hard block and 12.5 comp and some big fans. It doesn't matter how hot it gets stays nice and cool.

What are you using for fan and shroud? High temps when slow moving and idling around is often a fan issue.

I sent my 35gph pump back to mezeire and had it upgraded to the HD unit which i believe is 42gph, it seemed to help quite a bit driving around on the street.
It was fairly cheap too, around $150 i think.

My combo is 496 at 12.3 - 1 compression, will ride around on the street at around 195 or so once its fully warm.

I've always run the 42 GPM Meziere that drops into the stock housing. It does pretty good, but I'd like it to be better.
I can't fit the big 55 GPM Meziere pump due to my fan and I'm not willing to change that, so my only option is the CVR 55 GPM pump that also drops into the stock housing.

I have dual Flex-a-Lite fans with built in shroud stuck right to the rad....But that also might have to be improved....Since I bought those, I see they are making better fans....The rad is 19x31 and supports a pretty good sized fan setup. The BeCool rad is rated to 1000hp.....and I have it sealed to the front opening of the car. Almost all the frontal air has to go thru it. I think the fans were rated at 2500cfm back in the 90's when I bought them. With a core of 27x18, I could switch to the newer S-blade style and pick up 500cfm.

Ignore the injection...I took that off some years ago.

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/flx-490/overview/

My guess is that you will find( like i have) that your water pump is pumping plenty of water. My issue was not enough fan. That completely eliminated my street driving issues.
I assume you arent running without an obstruction to slow flow down( hogged out stat works good) running with nothing in the way doesn't work. Fan(s) that way wont have time to cool the water. It needs slowed down. so you can actually cool the water while its in the radiator.
When looking at fans i have found the cfm ratings very inaccurate, all over the place. If they aren't drawing a lot of amps, the motor isnt up to snufg. I have seen stuff they say is 3000 cfm and draws 7 amps. And a fan that draws 20 amps and is rated at 2500 cfm cools WAY better. More amps, more likelyhood the fan will cool well. More amps, better motor, better cooling, more money.
I like Derale stuff. US made, excellent motors. They make a dual fan 4000 cfm unit that is heavy duty

Well, I run with a 160 stat that has a couple of 1/8th holes in it. Talked with Meizere and they said run without the stat....But as you said I thought the water needed time to loose the heat in the radiator....I am confused....

I just tear the center guts out to slow the water down

Well, I did notice my fans are not pulling as much amperage as I thought. They are the older dual 12" straight blade ones and are rated at 2500cfm total.....Newer S-blade style pull a lot more I see....



Does this work on the street?

Yes. Have done it on high horsepower and low horsepower driver cars( 9 sec and 11 sec)

No shroud or thermostat.

So I hollowed out the thermostat today and will try that....What a PITA ....First attempt the o-ring on the housing leaked....2md attempt after cleaning off ALL the old sealer and putting a very light coat of sealer on, leaks......3rd attempt, still leaked....So now tear the whole thing apart, wire wheel all gasket surfaces, and put a ton of damn sealer on.....No leaks, but I hit nicked the mechanical temp sensor line...Guess what, now no gauge.....Go to two stores, buy a new gauge, finally install that....No leaks and finally a temp reading.

So I will try this out without a stat....I can tell you I could not get the car to full temp idling in the garage like I usually do....What it does down the road, I am not sure.

I run the Meziere HD 42gph in my 440rwhp 440cui block with two spal fans (16" and 12") with a 31" triple pass Radiator.
No issues even at 100F. Outside Temperatur does not matter or how fast I drive. It will be, after a while, locked between 200F and 210F (gauge is ok :-) )
Without a T-Stat! If I use one, it overheats. In my opinion the water can go only to slow. It is a closed System. The faster the water flows, the more often it sees the Radiator.

AGREED!!! The whole "Gut the Thermostat or run a restrictor" is BS!!

Yes mine dropped dramatically without anykind of restrictions.

FWIW...I run no thermostat or restrictor per Meziere's instructions. I have wanted to try a restrictor just to see, but never have.

What kind of reasoning says to get a water pump with higher flow, and then make sure you use a restrictor to slow down the flow?

The water doesn't stay in the radiator longer when you have a restriction. There is always water in the radiator! It's all about the flow. A thermostat slows down the flow to make the motor run hotter. That's the only purpose for it. You only run a restriction if you want the motor to run hotter.

Joel I agree , tstat is to get up to temp quicker , can also maintain more constant . Some motors will overheat without , some with a tstat/restrictor
I don't run a tstat , not keen on getting into waterbox with it closed due to cold/cool motor . Though I drove 12 hours home one winter and never saw it go to 130
My new World block is running around 15 deg warmer than both stock blocks so am following this . I have just modded a mechanical pump with plate , now to fit it .
Flowcooler looks nice - but pricey . Cheaper than Edelbrock though

Tex

FWIW, when I set mine up for pump gas a few years back I could not get it to run under 205-210 on hot days. I already had the big mezier water pump and an alum becool radiator with dual fans. I did nothing but order a custom Ron Davis radiator with a built in shroud and dual SPAL fans. The hottest the motor would get even on the hottest days was 185 after the radiator swap. There is a BIG difference in aluminum radiators, you get what you pay for.

First pic is what was in it. Worked fine when it only saw track duty. Looks very similar to yours. Second pic was the new one. It was very heavy, they use many more fins per inch than the cheap radiators.

Finally got a chance to take it for a 18 mile quick cruise at 8pm tonight...So nice and cool out 70 degrees , suns going down, motoring down the road at 2800rpm.....Runs about the same. Got to 190 and pretty much goes to +200 at stop signs and maybe back down to 190-195 cruising.....Basically no change, maybe worse. Left the housing from the stat in there...Should have opened up the flow a lot, but......

So I would expect it to be worse when its 87 and sunny out. Maybe find out tomorrow for cruise night if its not raining....

In my case 30 degrees water temp was worth about 10-15 PSI of oil pressure at idle. Alum block, alum rods, pressure would drop at idle if hot. Big pump and it would climb right back up with some RPM but that would make it hotter. Buy a good radiator. Back in 2013 the one I picked was for a Cuda. I changed bottom tank some and inlets and outlets to suit my car. Back then with some mods it was around $1600 but for 30 degree drop, it was worth it.

My 528 aluminum Hemi has the Meziere 42gph pump, aluminum radiator and twin fans. 185-190 degrees is the highest it ever goes.
The fans are set to kick on at 180 degrees. I have antifreeze and distilled water in the radiator.

Yeah, my aluminum Hemi never went over 190 with the system I have.....Change to Cast Iron, and presto, problemo....

Heating up at stoplights your fan(s) aren't cutting the mustard.

Oh ok. Like these guys have mentioned, it seems that you need more fan action. Good luck with it.

A gutted out tstat like i have always run isnt much of a restriction..... at all. Its always worked excellent for me and i drive my cars
But that isnt his problem, like i said in my first post in this thread. His fans aren't up to snuff. He just reported it heats up at stoplights, classic symptom of not enough cooling fan..... or low amount of water in the system which i doubt the OP hasnt looked at.
I ran with no tstat years ago, i like and prefer the very small restriction the gutted deal gives me. Car gets away from being cold a little quicker. Real cold isnt real good. Not a big difference, but there is some. Have tried normal tstat( 160 and 180) normal tstat with couple of small holes drilled. None.... and gutted
I like how i currently have it. Closest to the best for both street and strip

That is what this little experiment seems to be telling me. But I want to try one more thing first. So the weather is not cooperating, as it is cold and rainy here, and looks likely to be right thru till Sunday, I guess we will see.

So my next step is to take the hollowed out t-stat out, and go on a similar 10-20 mile cruise with no restrictor at all and see if the results are the same....Data says very likely, and I need to replace my 1995 dual 12" 2500cfm Flex-a-lite fans with a set of BeCool fans. I run a BeCool 62087 rad and its been great....But I seem to have hit a point where I am having trouble.

I was originally thinking I needed to go with a bigger water pump, but removing all that restriction seems to be sending me in the other direction. l called BeCool just the other day, and they seem to agree, the fans are the issue and recommended their 75638 .. 3560cfm 13" dual fan unit.

Not sure what that be cool fan setup costs
But before you pull the trigger on that take a look at the 4000cfm Derale dual fan setup.
They are American made and work impressively. The rep at Motor state i buy my stuff from went to the Derale factory. He prefers them over any other fan out there. They move air

If you are really wanting to spend some money on fans look at Delta Pag. Lightweight, variable speed, high volume. The price considering it comes with a controller isn't so horrible. There is several drag week guys who run them including the last two years winners. They seem to be able to cool 6 second cars OK.

University of Minnesota has been leading the way in heat transfer studies since 1880's. More flow equals more cooling .ie. no restriction. They could be wrong.

So I took a 22 mile drive this morning down to the shop with an outside temp of 67 and nice and sunny out. Took a long while to get to 190, but eventually it did, and would go to 195 at stop signs and cool down to 190 cruising.....Was at the shop most of the day and on the drive home, 74 out and still sunny got to 190 and stayed there till I had to stop and then would get to 195 almost 200 but come back down to about 190 cruising....So it looks like it needs a little of both maybe.

Maybe spring for the 42gph motor and the 3500cfm fans. I need it to work on a hot day...

What kind of rpm did you run steady state and did you get on it at all?

Cruising with 4.10 gear was between 2500-2900.....And got on it just once. I generally shift between 3-4k so you know its coming down the road.

Do you think taking some fuel out or adding timing would help?Will you try it eventually?

GO LEANER? ....That would be no. Its at 14.0-15.0 cruising depending on current conditions. Today she was at 14.2 while cruising and 13.0-13.5 at idle.

Timing...Well big motors do not like a lot of timing, and I tried this two ways. One with an MSD distributor setup the way we race with about 15-18 timing at idle and 31-32 total. Same results...

Then I went back to my Firecore with the mechanical closed down a bunch....This runs with 22-23 idle timing and 31-32 total....Car idles a whole lot better with this setup....So this is what I am using. I could go to 34 as it really seems to like that for street...But didn't try it up that high.

I did back to back runs of the same trip with each distrubutor, and I had the same results....For racing we set the timing down to 29-30.....

Thanks for the info so I could see where you are at.