Power Port 240 TF porting results Flow Tech 2

352/231 @700
Std Port


https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=1216531095146063&id=503146179817895

[img:center]https://www.dropbox.com/s/ymv1bcro6yie4rf/Photo%20Jan%2010%2C%206%2043%2044%20PM.jpg?dl=0[/img]


Not sure whats going on but I can’t seem to add pics any more.
Hmmmmmm

Those numbers look good
Similar to a set of Indy SR M.W heads that I had, not as good as the CNC ported 440-1 I've had

It says standard port.
Are the TFs raised port but still can use stock type intakes and Ex. manifolds.

If I was Todd Marsh I would be getting some cnc files saved of Larrys work before he can’t do it any more.

Either that or learning every trick of the trade this guy has to offer over the next X # of years.

I believe he's using checking springs that are too soft for flow bench testing. That would explain the pattern I've seen where all his posted flow tests have abnormally high low-lift intake #s.

If that's the case, yes that would back up that opinion.

Did you use an Apple device to upload the pics?

The springs shown in the pic of the head on the flow bench are not stiff enough to hold the valve in the set position at low lifts. If they weren't stiff enough on my low-power bench, they're definitely not stiff enough for the bench pictured.

Yes, Iphone 7+

Could not agree more. One glance at the low lift numbers and...

J.Rob

I've said it once and I will say it again. Without before and after numbers on the same flowbench there's always that BIG question mark at the end. I understand time is money and BIG numbers gets you more work but I like to do the math myself to judge whether the numbers TRULY stack up. Especially if the head porters bench is still from the "purple shaft age" with liquid manometers. You wouldn't believe how numbers could swing on my old flowbench during an 8 hour day.

That is like the flow that Koffels got from my std port but I have to ask does the gasket match on the corners of the port on yours?
PS:My mistake I have Victors,DUH!SORRY!

You know there's a problem when the discharge coeffienct is over 100%.

I asked the question you guys presented as it got me curious.

“I post your pics and results sometimes on Moparts or other forums.
Most say your low lift #’s are too high and the consensus between keyboard warriors is your checking springs are too weak to hold the valve at low lift.
Any truth to this?
Thanks” (Pro)

I got an answer;

“Floating the valves on the flow bench lol, I use the same checking springs for last 30 years, I check for vacuum leaks when I flow test, I got flow sheets for 36 years I had high numbers then, porting heads for round track engines you learn where to keep the flow up for torque, if I where to post my p7 and p8 heads for the dodge NASCAR engine they think they where hemi heads, those heads spoke for theirself making 950 plus HP and hold it up to 10,000 RPM, I'm fooling myself to post unreal numbers”
(Flow tech 2)

https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=1218287181637121&id=503146179817895

Classic response.

If you really want to know what is going on with those heads you'll have to send them to Dwayne and have him flow them on his bench. Then you'll have numbers that you can use for comparison.

ask him what the out of the box numbers were?

Still doesn't explain how you end up with c/d numbers over 100%(and to get 100% efficiency it's air flowing through a perfectly straight unrestricted piece of tubing. Not air making turns around guides and valves and through valve seats).

It can't be better than 100%.

Most heads with 45deg seats, with a valve job and throat diameter/shape designed to provide good low lift flow will have c/d numbers from .100-.300 lift in the 70-75% range.

That head might very well flow 352@.700 lift.

It doesn't flow 104@.100 lift.

The thing to keep in mind with flow results are, the head flows what it flows.
If you have it tested on 10 benches and get 10 different results, the fact is...... The head still actually flows the same on every bench(if the same test pressure is used).

However, Some of the results will be more accurate than others.

I'd happily flow one of those heads from Larry for free...... Just pay the shipping.
Preferably one that was already flowed and you had numbers on it.

Moparts does not play nice with Iphones... Problem with UBB Threads.

Exhausting..

You already flowed one and your numbers were better than his. Go look at the BB Sidewinder data. Your low lift numbers were better than his. His bigger numbers were better. IN BOTH OF YOUR defense that was your first crack at them and BOTH of you were trying things out for the first time. I bought the Superflow 1080 bench from Larry Wallace racing where Larry used to work. Hope to have it operational very soon. In the paper work when I got it there were notebooks full of THOUSANDS of P7 head tests they did for the top team in NASCAR. Reading through them is staggering. They spent MILLIONS getting all this data. Larry was the Head porter. Roger Penske could afford any body he wanted and he picked Larry. I have had Larry do hundreds of heads and I can say his only mistake is usually doing more work than was required and that takes time that he does not get paid for.
Todd

That's all fine......... But it can't exceed 100% c/d.
It's that simple.

If you have a c/d number over 100%, there's a calibration issue or a leak. End of story.

I have a 100cfm calibrated test plate, so I could take the calibration of my bench right out of the equation to see if that head flows 104cfm@.100 or not.

It either flows more than the 100cfm test plate, or it doesn't.
I'm saying it will probably be +/- 20% less than that plate.

The reason for the focus on the .100 flow is, it's so easy to spot when it's that far off(20-25%).
Then, once you know that number is wrong, the rest of the numbers are called into question.

If that head flowed 104@.100 lift on my bench I'd be the first one to take my hat off to Larry on a job well done and eat my words on calling into question the validity of his numbers.

Could not agree more. One glance at the low lift numbers and...

J.Rob [/quote]

Why is there not a LIKE button on Moparts?

:-)

If there was maybe the newer apple devices would be able to upload pictures that you could see ...........

There is, kind of.

What is a "like" button

Soft springs, calibration, leakage... for whatever the reason, this is the point I was trying to make.

Not questioning the work, only the data provided.

For all I know, that head could flow 360+@.700 on my bench.

And It's certainly likely, given his history, that he's a more knowledgable and skilled head porter than I am.

However, flow at .100 lift has almost nothing to do with how the head is "ported".
At those low lifts, it's mostly about area and angles.

Right I think this point is key. His good reputation 'qualifies' his work. So, if there is a 'suspect' value at .100" that shouldn't put into question his skilled execution. Conversely, in my experience, typically a head with 'strong' high-lift numbers (which I would classify this particular head) has 'compromised' low-lift numbers.

I know Larry, and he my friends is the real deal beyond dispute. He is also quite humble and very approachable. I guess I know "a little", but I'm sure Larry has probably forgotten more than I ever dreamed of knowing about motors, he's one of the coolest dudes you'll ever meet.

If the .100 numbers are off it's probably only because his 'ol checking springs are worn out from the thousands of hours and 100's of heads he's ported, they probably have no seat/low scale pressure left and they're pulling open on the bench! LOL.

I enjoy following Larrys posts on Facebook and he does some beautiful work, and lots of it. Just curious but how old is he? Guys like this are really going to be missed

Doesn’t look that old to me but bad health can strike anyone.
I noticed he was in the hospital over the holidays.
All those years of eating Mommas home cooking/baking adds up.
Either that or a fast food lifestyle.

I always look at it like this.

Imagine living on a mountain or in the jungle.
Ain’t nobody gonna get fat (sick) eating those foods.
Pretty sure we’d get ripped n shredded too. Abs anyone?

Safest bet for us is to stay on the outside perimeter of the grocery store and we’ll be just fine. Those are the perishable (REAL) foods.
No processed refined high carb crap like on the center isles.